Men and Women a philosophical nature

[fallenupright]

yes unfortunatly it doesnt seem to be liked much in essays! lol

I the dialectic approach... and I much prefer talking to typing when it comes to disscussing allot...

here *shrugs*...

thinking point for now:

If I say that there are only white swans because I have only ever seen white swans, and then someone shows me a black swan, should I then assume that there must be some grey swans and indeed some other coloured swans out there waiting for me to see them?

Of course not. You shouldn't assume anything. You don't even know that they exist. Besides, white, black, grey or pink... it's all relative. I mean, if you are colourblind, and I am not... you might see what I see as green as purple - and who is to say who is correct, or if any of us are. The object we see might not even be the object in itself. We all are looking at the world through our own eyes, and because of that, we won't ever know what is real.

Not to mention that is the same stupid example thing they gave us for argumentation in the dreaded "Critical Thinking" class I took in first year. All swans are white. X is a swan. Therfore X is white. ... argumentitive fallacy because The first premise is not true. o.0

AHH! You made me recall argumentation! How evil of you.

 

[RocknRoll]

you know fallenupright that is almost excatly the same argument that I gave when I did my Philsophy lessons on logical fallacys

but the argument does work for apori work... for example

all widows are women
jane is a widow
therefore jane is a woman

its also the logic that a level 5 programing languge works on!

 

[John Roberts]

I am a very lonely person

and I often find the best way to start a real debate/disscussion is to pick aparts anothers argument and point out flaws by asking questions. This starts the other person to think about their argument from an angle that they may have not considered before...

sorry that is just me... I find it to be a very useful technique in my debate rebutals when I have only 5 mins to cover a series of issues

I mis-interpreted, for that I am sorry. I understand loneliness too. I certainly have irritating traits which drive people away, drove my ex away...that one smarted as I cared for her deeply, when I was younger it was painful for the people I liked did not care for me. Grinning....it is one reason I took dance lessons to hone my social skills, I was terrified doing it, actually ending up a getting a first place at the Triple Crown Dancing Competition down in Boca Raton a few years back for my mambo routine..... of course it was in the open bronze category competing against a standard, I came in third in an actual competition against people......laughing...there were only two other couples...

 

[RocknRoll]

Nah its okay... Im often missinturpeted... maybe I need a 5 page explaination for everything I say...

and as for being lonely.. its more about scaring them off then not meeting people...


but just a thought Ive been having about Iraq...

Bin Laden did not like Ziwiai (sorry about spelling) as he killed other muslims and Laden beleives this is wrong and will alinate the mainstream
And a menber of Ziwia organiseation bumped him off...

do you think that the 2 may be connected?

 

[rab302]

It's all connected

I believe that it is all connected, but then again everything is at this point. In a religion that espouses original virture as put forth by Allah through Muhammed, Muslims see all world history and events as connected to their religion directly and proceeding by the will of Allah.

 

[John Roberts]

Nah its okay... Im often missinturpeted... maybe I need a 5 page explaination for everything I say...

and as for being lonely.. its more about scaring them off then not meeting people...


but just a thought Ive been having about Iraq...

Bin Laden did not like Ziwiai (sorry about spelling) as he killed other muslims and Laden beleives this is wrong and will alinate the mainstream
And a menber of Ziwia organiseation bumped him off...

do you think that the 2 may be connected?

Ahh then a strategy to not be lonely would be to.....appear more benign. But it is best to be yourself so when people meet you they learn to love you for who you are, not a fabrication of a false front. I know for most socializing in real life I am mostly myself, to be my true self would be to walk the road alone except for my very closest loved ones.

I tune out world events that are beyond my control mainly because of my own internal darkness. When I dwell on war, man's inhumanity to man, famine or disaster, simply speaking, I hurt. I help where I can by voting, writing my representitives and supporting what groups that are relevant to my life view.

Grinning, I guess I could have said I have no opinion.

JR

 

[John Roberts]

The tropical storm has our nearly end of the day gray.
Most decidedly my mood is not very gay
but if I was effeminate people would think me that way

Okay so I exaggerate my mood is not grim
but earlier in the day I wanted to tip someone's chin
and here I sit with a shiteating grin
My mind is blank, it is now the end.

 

[RocknRoll]

cool poem

much better than mine!

 

[John Roberts]

cool poem

much better than mine!

Thanks RocknRoll, grinning......you should have seen my first poems...ouch!
I hope your day has been good.

JR

 

[RocknRoll]

hi John

maybe I'll post one of my better poems here...

depends who wants to see! lol

My day hasnt been to bad, what about yours?

 

[asian_princess]

hi John

maybe I'll post one of my better poems here...

depends who wants to see! lol

My day hasnt been to bad, what about yours?

*settles onto my perch and waits for RnR's rhymes*

 

[RocknRoll]

*settles onto my perch and waits for RnR's rhymes*

a) are you stalking me?
b) my poetry is free verse!

 

[asian_princess]

a) are you stalking me?
b) my poetry is free verse!

1. didnt i make that obvious? i decided it was more fun than interrogating and ...
2. your poetry style is of no consequence when i am "alliterating"

 

[RocknRoll]

Legless and sitting in a rowing boat
Images passing of forgotten places
Just going with the current and under toe
There are no answers for I’ve stopped asking the questions

Life long agonising childbirth
Created this unholy son and daughter
Unforgiving parents have left us adrift
Floating legless in a rowing boat

Like a phoenix burnt into ashes
Like a phoenix born in new words

Oars are useless when arms are numb
The rudder is broken and spinning out of control
We’re just heading for the rocks
Atheist in a foxhole

Take your cake and eat it
Made your bed so sleep in it

Watching windows though empty eyes
The liquid it distorts the colours we see
There is no time for goodbyes
On this LSD trip without our acid

There’s no one here to tuck you in
Only you can stop the beg bugs biting

Roll over the side of the boat
Flop into the water
Undercurrent drags you beneath the surface
The kelp it binds you

Princes fishing by the lake
Talking of the leviathan
Do you think that they thought the impact that they would have?
But the questions no longer matter to me

Nailing flesh to wood
The blood it drips into the sea
Red clouds filter past the kelp
Awaiting the fns to pass by

Flowers blooming all around
Spring has return after bitter winter
Our discontent has been marred with passion
A lover’s touch can melt the ice

Dressed in black and morning a past life
Or shall I add this spiked colour to your ensemble?

Thoughts without words and words without action
Starving millions await a taste of your sulphur
Believers embrace your anti-Christ
You’ve always known to keep you enemies closer

Bring us our Rubicon and watch us as we part it
Save the millions from slavery
Structural violence is our paranoia
Explaining away our faults with the lies of the ‘other’

Seven plagues and three numbers
Where is my phoenix in my ashes of Eden?

Marching out the whore of Babylon to the noose motif
Ashes spill though my hands

Drop them into water and lambs with float
While the goats will sink with the undercurrent
The fruit bearing tree withers in the moonlight
I’m waiting for my phoenix

 

[~*sunkyssed_kym*~]

Hello SUNSHINE!

The tropical storm has our nearly end of the day gray.
Most decidedly my mood is not very gay
but if I was effeminate people would think me that way

Okay so I exaggerate my mood is not grim
but earlier in the day I wanted to tip someone's chin
and here I sit with a shiteating grin
My mind is blank, it is now the end.

M'dear friend, I pray those gray clouds have gone away
And a fresh new morning has dawned Today!
The morning sun keeping those dark thoughts at bay.

Exaggeration may not be far from truth
But I'm no Sherlocking sleuth
Just a Litizen sometimes long in the tooth!

Have a wonderful day m'dear!

~kym~ heh heh heh!

 

[John Roberts]

M'dear friend, I pray those gray clouds have gone away
And a fresh new morning has dawned Today!
The morning sun keeping those dark thoughts at bay.

Exaggeration may not be far from truth
But I'm no Sherlocking sleuth
Just a Litizen sometimes long in the tooth!

Have a wonderful day m'dear!

~kym~ heh heh heh!

kym!

It is still gray interspersed with light
tomorrows forecast brings some sunlight
some moods that are dark and some that are bright
sometimes the worst times come late at night
but with such grand company I always do smile
I certainly love it when you stop for a while!
with friends such as you I haven't a care
bright cheerful places, Yes! I want to go there!

I hope your day was/is wonderful too!

JR

 

[John Roberts]

*settles onto my perch and waits for RnR's rhymes*

Hi asian_princess. Welcome to the thread.

 

[John Roberts]

hi John

maybe I'll post one of my better poems here...

depends who wants to see! lol

My day hasnt been to bad, what about yours?

Yesterday was not bad as it is today by the time a read your post.....grinning today is not bad either.

 

[John Roberts]

Legless and sitting in a rowing boat
Images passing of forgotten places
Just going with the current and under toe
There are no answers for I’ve stopped asking the questions

Life long agonising childbirth
Created this unholy son and daughter
Unforgiving parents have left us adrift
Floating legless in a rowing boat

Like a phoenix burnt into ashes
Like a phoenix born in new words

Oars are useless when arms are numb
The rudder is broken and spinning out of control
We’re just heading for the rocks
Atheist in a foxhole

Take your cake and eat it
Made your bed so sleep in it

Watching windows though empty eyes
The liquid it distorts the colours we see
There is no time for goodbyes
On this LSD trip without our acid

There’s no one here to tuck you in
Only you can stop the beg bugs biting

Roll over the side of the boat
Flop into the water
Undercurrent drags you beneath the surface
The kelp it binds you

Princes fishing by the lake
Talking of the leviathan
Do you think that they thought the impact that they would have?
But the questions no longer matter to me

Nailing flesh to wood
The blood it drips into the sea
Red clouds filter past the kelp
Awaiting the fns to pass by

Flowers blooming all around
Spring has return after bitter winter
Our discontent has been marred with passion
A lover’s touch can melt the ice

Dressed in black and morning a past life
Or shall I add this spiked colour to your ensemble?

Thoughts without words and words without action
Starving millions await a taste of your sulphur
Believers embrace your anti-Christ
You’ve always known to keep you enemies closer

Bring us our Rubicon and watch us as we part it
Save the millions from slavery
Structural violence is our paranoia
Explaining away our faults with the lies of the ‘other’

Seven plagues and three numbers
Where is my phoenix in my ashes of Eden?

Marching out the whore of Babylon to the noose motif
Ashes spill though my hands

Drop them into water and lambs with float
While the goats will sink with the undercurrent
The fruit bearing tree withers in the moonlight
I’m waiting for my phoenix

Yikes! I am looking at my past! many of the things listed in your poem are things I agonized over. I like all the different metaphors. I found that I had to turn away to heal.......grinning..... my parents screwed it up too. My theory is that it is our attention that creates and sustains the world......if enough of us focus on the positive, we will have more balance and beauty in the world.......laughing..... don't worry the negative will always be there to offer contrast.

JR

 

[Gypsybyrd]

I came across a quote the other day & thought this thread seemed a good place to stick it ...

'The most unhappy of all men is he who believes himself to be so.' -- Hume

I'm not up on philosophy but thought I'd see what y'all have to say about it ... so what I want to know is if this is true does it stand to reason that if I believe myself happy I will be?

 

[RocknRoll]

This is quite a odd quote from Hume, being a very sceintific philosopher.

I would assume that he is coming from the school of thought that assumes that you are what you make of yourself (exestenalist) in its early forms, which some of my reading does surgest.

the problem is really is that the quote is out of context... like so many quotes they are cut and edited to suit the users need... so if you know where the ref came from so we can study the text in more detail

 

[Gypsybyrd]

Not a clue where the ref came from. Sure am glad I posted the disclaimer about me & philosophy though.

 

[John Roberts]

Not a clue where the ref came from. Sure am glad I posted the disclaimer about me & philosophy though.

laughing...Hi Gypsybyrd welcome. don't let him intimidate you, it means he likes you. No disclaimers needed.

I have not read Hume but it is true whatever you focus on is where you end up. I speak from personal experience. Much of my life has been spent on dark thoughts and.....I was unhappy. So yes, you can be happy if you think happy thoughts if you can convince your subconcious as well.

JR

 

[John Roberts]

Gentleness, how do we view it? I see it as a strength, it is holding back on a harsh word that might have been spoken. It is listening and non-judgement. It is a gift of love, reaching out to calm and soothe those caught in the tempest. It is generosity, giving while having nothing to give. It is acceptance. Laughing, I wish I could say I am gentle, I am certainly gentler than when I was younger, then I was harsh on myself and harsh on others.

JR

 

[John Roberts]

every now and then I bring up the subject of depression and I have posted earlier in the thread about it. If you are suffereing from severe depression you should seek professional help. Sometimes cost is an issue. Here are some survival tips for dealing with depression. Many are what a therapist would tell you.

Anti-depression tips.
Now something we all sometimes do not realize are dietary issues
one item is complex sugars........the body reacts the same way as the consumption of alcohol as the complex sugars act as a depressant. So when in a down state, alcohol and sugar are the last things you want in your body as they will feed and worsen your depression.
Another thing is hunger(low blood sugar) will affect your thought making it more likely to distort to the negative. So do not let yourself get too hungry when in a depressed state, your appetite may be non existent but you must force yourself to eat.
Vigorous exercise raises the endorphins in the brain helping to combat the depression.
Proper sleep- rest is important to the function of the brain.
If you are caught in a vicious negative thought loop, do something that distracts you, something that requires concentration. What worked for me was learning how to dance,
the concentration of learning the steps gave me a break from my obsessive thought and allowed sanity to creep in.
Staying busy can accomplish this.
Whenever you find yourself climbing on the pity potty throw yourself in another direction no matter what it takes.