As North Korea have admitted to trying to build an atomic bomb...

[TheEarl]

I think he's trying to point out that the USA are no angels, so who are they to act the world policeman? Anyone know how WW2 started? Because of WW1. How did WW1 start? After a terrorist atrocity, a superpower overreacted and Britain acted the world's policeman, calling in all her allies to help the afflicted nation. Thus the greatest loss of life the world has ever seen.

Theoretically the USA should go into Iraq. Theoretically they should also go into N. Korea. Also they should go to Zimbabwe, China and Pakistan. What happens if someone bites back?

Pride comes before a fall. Briatin was proud. She fell in an attempt to police the world and in her falling caused the two worst wars history has ever seen. You cannot predict the future, you can only learn from history.

The USA actively supported the Taliban to prevent the USSR taking over Afghanistan. Then they abandoned Afghanistan to the fundamentalists until they needed a scapegoat for September 11th. It's short term planning and that's what worries me.

The Earl

 

[teddybear4play]

Bah... humanity on a whole has the collective IQ of mayonaise

I didn't agree with all of your arguments, but I'm stealing this line.

TB4p

 

[manofsteel52]

I do not think you are anti-american and I do not want a war with Iraq. Yes we developed the bomb and yes we are the only country to have used one.

However, you did not address the point of my post which was what is your alternative? I live in NYC and with the exception of Washington DC, is the most likely place for a dirty bomb to go off. I expect my government to protect me. What do you suggest we do? Wait until after one has been detonated? Or Chemical and biological weapons are given to terrorists to be used? Then it is too late.

We need to act before that happens. Personally, I wish that WMD had never been invented, but they have. The question is, do we just let countries (especially those with a crazy ruler and a recent history of armed aggression) develop them?

I say no.

What I'm saying is, show me the evidence.
I have absolutely no problem with the US defending itself within our borders.
Beyond that, I want some serious evidence before attacking another country.
Our government has not provided that evidence, in my opinion.
And, BTW, I'm in a situation very similar to your own. I live within about 60 miles of NYC, perhaps less, as the crow flies. Much of my family lives in the city.

When the government shows proof of specific information that we are at risk of being attacked (and it must be verifiable), I'll consider support for invasion.

 

[HeavyStick]

The US should not go into China. Just because they are the last Communist powerhouse is no reason to go in there.


Why Pakistan? If Pakistan then it should also be India. The US should not remove Nukes indisriminately. Iraq is a rogue nation with a very bad track record. N Korea's nukes are proof of lies. They signed a treaty saying they would not acquire these weapons.

For every step forward of stability that is created on the Korean Peninsula, N Korea takes two steps back. IMO the US should stop ALL (US supported) aid to N. Korea.

 

[HeavyStick]

I didn't agree with all of your arguments, but I'm stealing this line.

TB4p

Spelling buddy says edit it before you do.

 

[teddybear4play]

What I'm saying is, show me the evidence.
I have absolutely no problem with the US defending itself within our borders.
Beyond that, I want some serious evidence before attacking another country.
Our government has not provided that evidence, in my opinion.
And, BTW, I'm in a situation very similar to your own. I live within about 60 miles of NYC, perhaps less, as the crow flies. Much of my family lives in the city.

When the government shows proof of specific information that we are at risk of being attacked (and it must be verifiable), I'll consider support for invasion.

What more do you want?

Spelling buddy says edit it before you do.

I'm on top of it.

TB4p

 

[HeavyStick]

What more do you want?


TB4p

My guess is he wants Redwavetard level access. So what if GW labels his agenda of Iraq as a war on terrorism. GW is approaching the Iraqi situation in a manner no one can bitch about. He has shown that before he took office and since 1991 that Saddam has blatantly violated UN Resolutions. The UN is hardly a puppet of the US.

 

[manofsteel52]

The good ol' traitors gave US nuclear weapon secrets to the Russians, nearly bankrupting the Social Security Fund.

As far as developing and using the Bomb. what option would you suggest for dealing with Japan in WWII?



We are enforcing UN sanctions he voluntarily agreed to, and voluntarily violated.



Nuclear weapons of today and yesterday vary greatly. A 1945 nuclear weapon delivered via a propeller airplane and a 1995 nuclear weapon with ICBM capabilitiesand multiple warheads is very different.

Your argument is flawed in every aspect.

Flawed? Not hardly.
The only countries with ICBM capabilitiesand multiple warheads would be Russia or China at this point in time. They are not part of the current issue.

Going alone into Iraq with an invasion is not enforcing UN sanctions. Resuming U.N. weapons inspections and then cooperating with the U.N., which the US in a member of, like it or not is the correct way to deal with this.

As far as Japan during WWII is concerned, most all experts have said that we were winning the war with Japan and would have prevailed within months without using atomic bombs on Nagasaki and Hiroshima.

Your argument appears to be the one with the flaws.

 

[Frimost]

The USA actively supported the Taliban to prevent the USSR taking over Afghanistan. Then they abandoned Afghanistan to the fundamentalists until they needed a scapegoat for September 11th. It's short term planning and that's what worries me.

No we didn't, we supported the Mujahideen. The Taliban did not come about until around 1994 and did not take Kabul until 1996. The Taliban were an invention of Pakistan's ISI intelligence service, not the CIA.

USSR did take over Afghanistan too, it was with the help of us they were even able to resist enough to gain any ground to operate insurgent activities and have safe houses.

We would have enevr invaded in the first place had Mullah Omar simply handed over Bin Laden to US custody.

 

[Frimost]

The only countries with ICBM capabilitiesand multiple warheads would be Russia or China at this point in time.

The U.K. and France do, actually China dose NOT have miniaturization of warheads and the capability to launch them from one ICBM.

 

[HeavyStick]

Flawed? Not hardly.
The only countries with ICBM capabilitiesand multiple warheads would be Russia or China at this point in time. They are not part of the current issue.

Going alone into Iraq with an invasion is not enforcing UN sanctions. Resuming U.N. weapons inspections and then cooperating with the U.N., which the US in a member of, like it or not is the correct way to deal with this.

As far as Japan during WWII is concerned, most all experts have said that we were winning the war with Japan and would have prevailed within months without using atomic bombs on Nagasaki and Hiroshima.

Your argument appears to be the one with the flaws.

If you would have continued reading the expert opinion about the war on mainland Japan. You should have read the loss of live would have exceeded the life lost with both nukes. With 20/20 hindsight, it was better to drop them then, when nukes were in their infancy than with the ones developed in the 60's or seventies.

The US is not the only country going into Iraq.

Do you read every other line of your newspaper?

Even Australia is giving us support.

The US is one of the few countries that is actively concerned about Iraq.

ICBM's are a deterrent. China and the Soviets will only use them as a last effort.

 

[Don K Dyck]

Oz DOES NOT Support U$-Iraq OiL Reserves War

<Big Bit chopped out - see origina post>

The US is not the only country going into Iraq.

Do you read every other line of your newspaper?

Even Australia is giving us support.

The US is one of the few countries that is actively concerned about Iraq.

ICBM's are a deterrent. China and the Soviets will only use them as a last effort.

Uhm . . . Hi Stick . . . just to let you know diectly from the rolling hills of Oz that the Prim Monster, Little Honest Johnnie "Flakjacket" Howard is the only person in Oz who supports the U$-Iraq War for the Control of Undeveloped Middle East Oil Reserves . . .

Like his hero, "Pig-Iron" Bob Menzies, "Johnnie Flakjacket" has never served in the military and he holds delusions of grandeur about the Oz capacity for grandstanding on the international political stage. At present our navy of whale boats is sailing down to Hobart, Dubyah Shrub wants Oz SAS as point platoon in Iraq so that he can discount those casualties from the U$ war dead . . . <he freely concedes that OZ SAS are the best in the world as shown in Afghanistan> . . . Most of our air force is so old that they replace the rubber bands after every flight . . . and then most of the U$ armaments are proven unrelaible under battle conditions . . .

One megalomaniac does NOT a national opinion make.

The U$ oil corporations are only interested in the 3 billion barrels (20%) of undeveloped oil reserves available in the Middle East, and the other 16% of world gas and oil reserves in Central Asia. Ultimately, American students will be used to take possession of these natural resources owned by the Iraqis. The draft is coming.

 

[miles]

Ultimately, American students will be used to take possession of these natural resources owned by the Iraqis. The draft is coming.

That's totally absurd.

 

[HeavyStick]

Re: Oz DOES NOT Support U$-Iraq OiL Reserves War

One megalomaniac does NOT a national opinion make.

Stop talking like Yoda.



No country on the planet will ever have all of it's citizens agree with it's leader.

ever.

Australia may be looking at's responsibility to the international community with the UN.

I'm sure it'll be a bumpy road.

 

[WriterDom]

Re: Oz DOES NOT Support U$-Iraq OiL Reserves War

The draft is coming.

A stinky draft when a couple of hundred thousand Iraqis raise their arms in surrender. Again.

 

[Dantetier]

I have to go to work so i don't have time for a full post, so I'll just say this. Anyone who think's we're going to go into Iraq FOR THE OIL, is completely missing the point and is following the propaganda bullshit and has NO idea about the actual issues.

 

[teddybear4play]

I have to go to work so i don't have time for a full post, so I'll just say this. Anyone who think's we're going to go into Iraq FOR THE OIL, is completely missing the point and is following the propaganda bullshit and has NO idea about the actual issues.

Welcome to reality. Nice to have you here.

TB4p

 

[Don K Dyck]

Did You Miss the News Release??

I have to go to work so i don't have time for a full post, so I'll just say this. Anyone who think's we're going to go into Iraq FOR THE OIL, is completely missing the point and is following the propaganda bullshit and has NO idea about the actual issues.

Widen your reading, Dantetier . . . Dubyah Shrub has already admitted that the real reason for the U$-Iraq War for Control of Undeveloped Middle East Oil Reserves has little to do with limiting the spread of WMD and much to do with securing U$ oil reserves against the French and Russians particularly, who have already established claims to the oil reserves that can only be overturned by holding a nice prifitable war.

If Dubyah Shrub and his cronies were interested in limiting WMD then he would NOT have cut off the supply of oil to North Korea, causing the re-opening of the NK nuclear reactor. The rest of the world just CANNOT trust the Shrub Administration to work according to the agreements their government has reached.

The Shah of Iran was correct when he said, "it is difficult to be a friend of the United $tate$."

 

[Morwen]

...

 

[Don K Dyck]

Don K. Dyck uses so many non-conventional terms it's hard to even read his prose. Type in English if you want to communicate to people. Fall back on rhetorical jargon if you want to isolate yourself on an idealogical island, like some kind of Hollywood Scientologist. The English-speaking world I am sure would be interested in your ideas, if they could understand them.

Hi Morwen . . . let me guess which terms may be unconventional . . .

Dubyah Shrub - George Bush Senior is Bush so GW Bush is Shrub, a little Bush . . . the Dubyah part I think is self explanatory, but is a roughly phonetic spelling of his distinguishing middle initial . . . probably his only distinguishing mark . . .

WMD - Weapons of Mass Destruction.

U$ - United States, to distinguish the government from the American people, who are generally nice people. <pinched from elsewhere>.

The rest of the words have normal usage.

Hope this helps.

 

[HeavyStick]

Hope this helps.

I hope you suffocate when a kangaroo kicks you in the balls.

 

[teddybear4play]

Re: Did You Miss the News Release??

Widen your reading, Dantetier . . . Dubyah Shrub has already admitted that the real reason for the U$-Iraq War for Control of Undeveloped Middle East Oil Reserves has little to do with limiting the spread of WMD and much to do with securing U$ oil reserves against the French and Russians particularly, who have already established claims to the oil reserves that can only be overturned by holding a nice prifitable war.

When the hell did he do this?

TB4p

 

[SINthysist]

He$u$ fAwK DoN . . . h-h-hoW m-m-m-m-man-n-n-ny tI'me$ do WE HaVe tO A$k, bEg, p_p_lead wItH U 2 CLEAN UP your TyP!nG stYle?????? . . . You'RE FaWkiNg NEARly inDUBYAreheN$iBle . . .

 

[SINthysist]

Re: Re: Did You Miss the News Release??

When the hell did he do this?

TB4p

When he took back A WHOLE TANKER of OIL! By gawd, then you knew what the CIA-controlled $hrub was up to! . . . . A Bucky Hunt cornering of the OIL market and riche$ beyond expectation for the rapidly expanding Evil American Empire . . . Are you fawking $tupid????

 

[Morwen]

...