Harry Reid and Barack Obama want a government shutdown.

[4est_4est_Gump]

Would you like me to start a poll where everyone gets to pick which party you give them the impression of supporting the most?


The vote might take you by surprise.

 

[landslider2000]

Piecemeal CRs -- for which there is ample precedent -- are the only "clean" approach.

Re previous conditions, that is about the only aspect of Obamacare on which most would concur.

The other often cited, kids on parental insurance until 26, is more dubious in terms of responsibility.

 

[RobDownSouth]

I've thought about writing a book about a cruise boat loaded with these people that sinks, and they have to cope on an uncharted island. It would be fun to watch them come to grips with reality.

Beat you to it.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

Sure. The Crisis fixes everything, and few change till The Crisis forces it.

There is a reason that the Press and Pols which to make us believe that we are careening from crises to crises and they are the only ones who can save us. All we have to do is listen to them and forego all the nonsensical ideas of Libertarians now immortalized as Teabagging...

Note how careful kbate is to make sure that on all of the Social issues, she fully supports the Progressive efforts and rails loudly against any "Republican" (her black and white thinking) opposition, not as principled, but hateful and based on solely the twin ideas that OBAMABAD and Democrats are Marxists.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

There is a reason that the Press and Pols which to make us believe that we are careening from crises to crises and they are the only ones who can save us. All we have to do is listen to them and forego all the nonsensical ideas of Libertarians now immortalized as Teabagging...

Note how careful kbate is to make sure that on all of the Social issues, she fully supports the Progressive efforts and rails loudly against any "Republican" (her black and white thinking) opposition, not as principled, but hateful and based on solely the twin ideas that OBAMABAD and Democrats are Marxists.

I know. In Kbate world robbery is legitimate economic activity, or gassing Jews to get their rings and bridgework.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

Piecemeal CRs -- for which there is ample precedent -- are the only "clean" approach.

Re previous conditions, that is about the only aspect of Obamacare on which most would concur.

The other often cited, kids on parental insurance until 26, is more dubious in terms of responsibility.

On #2, how to get there? The Republicans offered ideas on high-risk pools but that was dismissed by "We won." No compromise.

Ever. If the other side compromises, then you negotiate and demand more.

Very few of the uninsured are going to go get insured. They'll pay the fine which will be offset by earned tax-income credits, if they even bother to file...

They will still show up in the Emergency Room.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

I know. In Kbate world robbery is legitimate economic activity, or gassing Jews to get their rings and bridgework.

That is because she belongs to several of the groups crying for more social justice.

 

[zipman]

When reality doesn't suit you:
1) make up a different narrative
2) repeat until you believe it
3) ensure you maintain appropriate levels of confirmation bias to deepen belief
4) ignore everyone else
5) rinse and repeat

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

That is because she belongs to several of the groups crying for more social justice.

Social Justice always leads to death camps.

 

[RobDownSouth]

Social Justice always leads to death camps.

I don't recall any "Death Camps" poppin' up when women and coloreds go the right to vote here in Murica.

 

[Ulaven_Demorte]

The Senate seems to have hammered out a bipartisan solution to the shutdown that should be sent to the House today.

Will the House stick to the rule change they made that allows ONLY the House Majority Leader or his designate to call a vote on bills returning from the Senate? I'm guessing they will and the newly appointed Dictator of the House will not allow a vote because he knows that it would pass handily.

 

[RobDownSouth]

Piecemeal CRs -- for which there is ample precedent -- are the only "clean" approach.

Re previous conditions, that is about the only aspect of Obamacare on which most would concur.

The other often cited, kids on parental insurance until 26, is more dubious in terms of responsibility.

Yes, "previous conditions" is very, very popular.

How can you cover these without breaking the bank?

You have to broaden the insurance pool...it's the only way.

To do that, you need the "Individual Mandate", where everyone is responsible for their own health care insurance and that of their family.

The conservative talking counterpoint: "Extend insurance across state lines" would only increase insurance company profits.

In a perfect world, we'd have single payer. Until we get there, though, Obamacare is still light years better than the existing system.

 

[landslider2000]

Yep, given that conceptual scheme, indiv mandate was needed. But the scheme was conceptually doomed. Federal imposition will prove unavailing for many reasons, not the least of which will be continual pressure to raise the subsidy for the poor. There will be enormous compliance costs via IRS, and the legislation foments a part-time economy.

In a Leibnitzian best of all possible worlds, market-based solutions would prevail.

Single payer worsens the present lack of market pressure. What does an electroencephalogram cost? What does computer assisted tomography cost? Nobody knows; there's no market.

 

[unregistered]

 

[RjThoughts]

1961: Ronald Reagan called Medicare "Socialized Medicine that will ruin America"

1987: He expanded it.

Sounds like GOP and Conservatives do NOT know what's best, do they?

 

[jeninflorida]

Will the cuckold obana once again prove to america why obama a complete fuck up pile of cow shit

 

[RobDownSouth]

Yep, given that conceptual scheme, indiv mandate was needed. But the scheme was conceptually doomed. Federal imposition will prove unavailing for many reasons, not the least of which will be continual pressure to raise the subsidy for the poor. There will be enormous compliance costs via IRS, and the legislation foments a part-time economy.

Presumptive and speculative.

In a Leibnitzian best of all possible worlds, market-based solutions would prevail.

Market-based solutions have been tried for the better part of the past 50 years. They have been found ineffective, as evidenced by the volume of "uninsurable at any price" folks.

Single payer worsens the present lack of market pressure. What does an electroencephalogram cost? What does computer assisted tomography cost? Nobody knows; there's no market.

Market price is irrelevant in a single-payer system...just like Medicare. The government pays a set price, by geographic area. Private pay patients can pay market price. It's not unlike secondary schooling in the USA: a one size fits all public option, and if you have the funds, you can go to private school.

 

[landslider2000]

To the extent the whole ploy wasn't Fabian socialism, the claim was that Obamacare would be "affordable."

The opposite is already happening, and that will continue because market forces are ignored.

What does an electrocardiogram really cost? Nobody knows because there is no true marketplace, and medical inflation will continue to exceed general inflation.

 

[Ulaven_Demorte]

Hahahahaha...it's exactly what Nancy Pelosi would do to prevent Pubs bringing an amendment or a bill to the floor. Get real, hypocrite.

Presumptive, and never actually happened, until the House GOP did it.

but I suppose you're cool with one person holding the legislative process hostage just like you're cool with a very small minority of the GOP holding the economy hostage.

Fascist.

 

[unregistered]

 

[RobDownSouth]

To the extent the whole ploy wasn't Fabian socialism, the claim was that Obamacare would be "affordable."

The opposite is already happening, and that will continue because market forces are ignored.

What does an electrocardiogram really cost? Nobody knows because there is no true marketplace, and medical inflation will continue to exceed general inflation.

"The opposite is already happening" is demonstrably false...simply look at the negotiated prices that insurance companies have with various doctors and hospitals vs. the "list price" paid by the uninsured.

The price of my last EKG was $175 according to my insurance bill. The list price was $1250.

 

[RobDownSouth]

I remember LBJ reporting the cost of Medicare would only be 15 billion.

That was back in 1965.

Tell us how much money you made back in 1965, if you weren't unemployed that is.

 

[landslider2000]

The lack of a true marketplace will tell also in service. Or lack thereof.

All speculative at this juncture, but signs don't look good.

This is what happens when 1/6 of the economy is transformed on a purely partisan basis with a massive, unread bill only now emerging via NPRM.

 

[RjThoughts]

The lack of a true marketplace will tell also in service. Or lack thereof.

All speculative at this juncture, but signs don't look good.

This is what happens when 1/6 of the economy is transformed on a purely partisan basis with a massive, unread bill only now emerging via NPRM.

Such a lie!

Free market healthcare? SMH

You have no clue.

I bet you're against mandatory coverage of children as well!

 

[Ulaven_Demorte]

The lack of a true marketplace will tell also in service. Or lack thereof.

All speculative at this juncture, but signs don't look good.

This is what happens when 1/6 of the economy is transformed on a purely partisan basis with a massive, unread bill only now emerging via NPRM.

So many lies in one post it's hard to pick which to point to.
So I'll pick this one:
The Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act was read, repeatedly. The quote you're referring to was regarding having not read the revisions coming back from the House when the Act was being batted back and forth before it was passed.