Harry Reid and Barack Obama want a government shutdown.

[jeninflorida]

But if you booked air travel and haven't gotten a passport yet......

Did you have a good cry?

 

[jeninflorida]

But if you booked air travel and haven't gotten a passport yet......

I hope that you are not hurt too badly. I really want you to become a man and enter the work force. hopefully you can become a productive member of society

 

[RobDownSouth]

News doesn't become "faux" to the extent that one does not concur with its ideological tilt. Walter Lippmann, certainly liberal in the best sense, spoke of the import of legitimacy -- the need to have the will of the governed behind a bill. The Sup Ct's disposition of Obamacare was a joke. Obamacare was not a tax; Obama went around the country angrily denying it was a tax. The morning after Roberts made a fool of himself, the W House again denied Obamacare was a tax. Obama knew very well that Obamacare negotiations should be conducted on C-Span, and he promised that eight times on video. But didn't do it. The present controversy is what happens when a bill is rammed through without the support of the people. Only a child views this as a "We sure beat you!" moment and doesn't care about the views of at least 1/2 the country.

For an "Airborne Ranger", you certainly do whine a lot.

So the Supreme Court ruled the individual mandate was technically a tax and not a penalty.

So
Fucking
What?

Does that invalidate the law in any way, shape or form?

Here's a clue, since you seem unwilling or unable to accept reality:
It Does Not.


Let's review here:

• Passed Congress.
• Signed into Law by the President.
• Passed Constitutional Muster with the Supreme Court.
• Survived a presidential challenge from a candidate who made repeal the centerpiece of his campaign

How many more "do-overs" are you going to want?

We beat your fucking asses at every step of the way.
I urge you, like I've urged your buddies here, to accept your loss.
Be a man.

 

[jeninflorida]

and what are you? never in the military but always a bitch baby

I feel bad for you

someone as passionate about obama care, clearly highlights your dependence on government entitlement programs

For an "Airborne Ranger", you certainly do whine a lot.

So the Supreme Court ruled the individual mandate was technically a tax and not a penalty.

So
Fucking
What?

Does that invalidate the law in any way, shape or form?

Here's a clue, since you seem unwilling or unable to accept reality:
It Does Not.


Let's review here:

• Passed Congress.
• Signed into Law by the President.
• Passed Constitutional Muster with the Supreme Court.
• Survived a presidential challenge from a candidate who made repeal the centerpiece of his campaign

How many more "do-overs" are you going to want?

We beat your fucking asses at every step of the way.
I urge you, like I've urged your buddies here, to accept your loss.
Be a man.

 

[landslider2000]

It is a poor excuse for argument to say that contrary views are "whining."

They aren't.

They are contrary views.

The Sup Ct's disposition of Obamacare was a joke. Obamacare was not a tax; Obama went around the country angrily denying it was a tax. The morning after Roberts made a fool of himself, the W House again denied Obamacare was a tax.

Obama knew that Obamacare negotiations should be conducted on C-Span, and he promised that eight times on video. But didn't do it.

The present controversy is what happens when a bill is rammed through without the support of the people.

Only a child views this as a "We sure beat you!" moment and doesn't care about the views of at least 1/2 the country.

 

[SgtSpiderMan]

It is a poor excuse for argument to say that contrary views are "whining."

They aren't.

They are contrary views.

The Sup Ct's disposition of Obamacare was a joke. Obamacare was not a tax; Obama went around the country angrily denying it was a tax. The morning after Roberts made a fool of himself, the W House again denied Obamacare was a tax.

Obama knew that Obamacare negotiations should be conducted on C-Span, and he promised that eight times on video. But didn't do it.

The present controversy is what happens when a bill is rammed through without the support of the people.

Only a child views this as a "We sure beat you!" moment and doesn't care about the views of at least 1/2 the country.

So is saying the majority decision of the 9 finest legal minds in the country & the document all of government is based on is a joke.

We had a vote on it. More than half the people in the country voted for the ACA. If people didn't want the ACA there would be enough votes to remove it.

 

[RobDownSouth]

It is a poor excuse for argument to say that contrary views are "whining." They aren't. They are contrary views. The Sup Ct's disposition of Obamacare was a joke. Obamacare was not a tax; Obama went around the country angrily denying it was a tax. The morning after Roberts made a fool of himself, the W House again denied Obamacare was a tax. Obama knew that Obamacare negotiations should be conducted on C-Span, and he promised that eight times on video. But didn't do it. The present controversy is what happens when a bill is rammed through without the support of the people.
Only a child views this as a "We sure beat you!" moment and doesn't care about the views of at least 1/2 the country.

Still more sour grapes and whining. Very unbecoming of you.

And I noticed you lacked the intestinal fortitude to answer the key question in my post:

How many "do-overs" will you need to admit that you were beaten?

The fact that the Supreme Court ruling was a "joke" in your opinion is irrelevant. They had the final say in the constitutional question, and they ruled against you.

The fact that Obama didn't have negotiations on C-Span like he promised is irrelevant as well.

Your Side Lost. Plain and simple. Deal with it. Seek grief counseling or something.

Obamacare is not going away, no matter how badly you really Really REALLY want it to

 

[landslider2000]

Political discussion isn't Person A versus Person B.

Contrary views are not "whining"; they are contrary views.

The Sup Ct's disposition of Obamacare was a joke.

Obamacare was not a tax; Obama went around the country angrily denying it was a tax.

The morning after Roberts made a fool of himself, the W House again denied Obamacare was a tax.

Obama knew that Obamacare negotiations should be conducted on C-Span, and he promised that at least eight times on video. But didn't do it.

The present controversy is what happens when a bill is rammed through without the support of the people.

Only a child views this as a "We sure beat you!" moment and doesn't care about the views of at least 1/2 the country.

 

[FistedSister]

Political discussion isn't Person A versus Person B.

Contrary views are not "whining"; they are contrary views.

The Sup Ct's disposition of Obamacare was a joke.

Obamacare was not a tax; Obama went around the country angrily denying it was a tax.

The morning after Roberts made a fool of himself, the W House again denied Obamacare was a tax.

Obama knew that Obamacare negotiations should be conducted on C-Span, and he promised that at least eight times on video. But didn't do it.

The present controversy is what happens when a bill is rammed through without the support of the people.

Only a child views this as a "We sure beat you!" moment and doesn't care about the views of at least 1/2 the country.

Except the American people do support it. And Robert's made a fool of himself? You must be one very, very lonely person. Don't do anything rash now.

 

[RobDownSouth]

How many "do-overs" will you need to admit that you were beaten?

Someday, perhaps you'll be man enough to answer that simple question.

Today is obviously not that day.

 

[lilsarah91]

someone as passionate about obama care, clearly highlights your dependence on government entitlement programs

Just from that comment, it's clear you're talking out of your ass and you actually, honesty have no clue what you're trying talking about. You have absolutely no idea what Obamacare does and does not do. Why don't you actually go read up on THE LAW and stop listening and reciting flat out lies, making yourself look like even more of a moron.

HAHA, I feel sorry for your Jenny, I really do. You're nothing more than a parrot, you only say what you're told without thinking.

 

[Phelia]

The people who support the House Republicans should volunteer to strike in solidarity with the government workers whom they're forcing to do the same. You're so convinced you deserve victory that you want to shut 'er down? Okay. Let's see you shut 'er down.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

The people who support the House Republicans should volunteer to strike in solidarity with the government workers whom they're forcing to do the same. You're so convinced you deserve victory that you want to shut 'er down? Okay. Let's see you shut 'er down.

Actually, I have already seen quite a lot of Democrat celebration in other threads, in the favorite formula of "we kicked your ass!" over the shut down which really proves my point that this was orchestrated by the Democrats because they believed it would score political points. They do not give a shit about the Middle Class, only the next election.

If I join in the strike, when it is over, my employer will not give me all of my back pay like the government will do with all of its employees.

Now tell us how the strike is going to make one little bit of difference in your life (the old Gay Marriage Challenge the Democrats so love to employ).

 

[zipman]

Actually, I have already seen quite a lot of Democrat celebration in other threads, in the favorite formula of "we kicked your ass!" over the shut down which really proves my point that this was orchestrated by the Democrats because they believed it would score political points. They do not give a shit about the Middle Class, only the next election.

If I join in the strike, when it is over, my employer will not give me all of my back pay like the government will do with all of its employees.

Now tell us how the strike is going to make one little bit of difference in your life (the old Gay Marriage Challenge the Democrats so love to employ).

So, because a few people on a porn board are happy that means that it was "orchestrated by democrats?"

LMAO!!!

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

I knew zip would be here, flush with victory.

His return yesterday was clearly anticipatory and he was having trouble keeping his powder dry.

Just like FistedSister, a troll from the past who has gone crazy in the last 24 hours, the Democrats have been waiting for this for several years now; they just love shutting the government down. It is what they deem proper negotiation...

This is their America:

"Ostensibly, de facto zero interest rates are used as a stimulus for a moribund economy that so far seems oblivious to all the traditional liberal priming tools of massive borrowing, growth in federal spending, and more entitlements and public hiring. Yet almost nonexistent interest rates have sharpened the class divide. The very wealthy have benefited enormously as capital streamed into the stock market in desperate search of almost any return. The very poor do not depend on interest on savings as a hedge against inflation or as central to retirement.

"That leaves the middle class, who so far have not felt the upside of zero interest rates — the interest on their credit-card debt remains sky-high, their student loans are steep, and their mortgage interest for the most part is not all that low. The banks loan at high interest and pay almost nothing on deposits; Wall Street welcomes in cash without much worry about competition to produce returns; and the poor are the beneficiaries of the vast federal borrowing that goes some way toward explaining why interest rates cannot climb, given that servicing the ever-rising federal debt would become almost unsustainable."
Victor Davis Hanson, NRO

Now the Middle Class is the cash cow that pays for the health care of the poor too...

 

[zipman]

I knew zip would be here, flush with victory.

His return yesterday was clearly anticipatory and he was having trouble keeping his powder dry.

Just like FistedSister, a troll from the past who has gone crazy in the last 24 hours, the Democrats have been waiting for this for several years now; they just love shutting the government down. It is what they deem proper negotiation...

This is their America:

"Ostensibly, de facto zero interest rates are used as a stimulus for a moribund economy that so far seems oblivious to all the traditional liberal priming tools of massive borrowing, growth in federal spending, and more entitlements and public hiring. Yet almost nonexistent interest rates have sharpened the class divide. The very wealthy have benefited enormously as capital streamed into the stock market in desperate search of almost any return. The very poor do not depend on interest on savings as a hedge against inflation or as central to retirement.

"That leaves the middle class, who so far have not felt the upside of zero interest rates — the interest on their credit-card debt remains sky-high, their student loans are steep, and their mortgage interest for the most part is not all that low. The banks loan at high interest and pay almost nothing on deposits; Wall Street welcomes in cash without much worry about competition to produce returns; and the poor are the beneficiaries of the vast federal borrowing that goes some way toward explaining why interest rates cannot climb, given that servicing the ever-rising federal debt would become almost unsustainable."
Victor Davis Hanson, NRO

Now the Middle Class is the cash cow that pays for the health care of the poor too...

Actually reading posts works a lot better than imagining what they might say based on your own ridiculous personal bias.

Just sayin'

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

And, the Democrats are not going to stop...

The Coming Health-Care Battle
Republicans need to think of themselves as pro-consumer, not pro-business.
Mona Charen, NRO
OCTOBER 1, 2013

Want a glimpse of what the Obamacare battle will look like in 2015? Just glance at liberal websites. You’ll find a trove of insurance-company bashing. Are insurance premiums rising instead of falling by the $2,500 per family that Obama repeatedly promised in 2009? They are. If you consult ThinkProgess, Daily Kos, and Physicians for a National Health Program, you’ll learn that it’s the “greedy insurance companies” that are causing prices to rise, not the risibly titled Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act.

You can take this to the bank: In the run-up to the next presidential election, Democrats will be in thorough blame-shifting mode. It wasn’t the perverse incentives, byzantine complexity, new taxes, and layers of bureaucracy built into Obamacare, they’ll insist. It was heartless health insurers who were willing to let people die rather than accept a lower profit margin.

Obama has already shown the way. Stumping for Obamacare in 2010, he said “[They’ll] keep on doing this for as long as they can get away with it. This is no secret. They’re telling their investors this — ‘We are in the money. We are going to keep on making big profits even though a lot of folks are going to be put under hardship.’”

That’s just the way businessmen talk, isn’t it? Only in the imaginings of the anti-business Left. In any case, the other shoe to drop, after the demonization of the industry, will be the same solution Democrats propose for everything — more government. Obamacare will be said to have failed because private companies put profits ahead of people. The “solution” will be single-payer.

The President has said this on many occasions. When Fascism fails, Socialism will be the answer.

Let’s not weep for the health-insurance companies. They could have energetically opposed Obamacare and chose not to. As Timothy Carney of the Washington Examiner explained, it was in their interest to support a law that would 1) require everyone to purchase their product and 2) provide subsidies directly to insurance companies to help people pay for it. As Carney wrote, “would you be surprised to hear of corn farmers supporting ethanol subsidies?” There were aspects of the law the insurance industry protested, but for the most part they were content to be tamely transformed into a regulated public utility.

The health-care system that predated Obamacare was already so distorted by government subsidies, regulations, and tax incentives as to be quasi state-run. True reform would rip that government IV out of the nation’s arm altogether and encourage more competition, not less. True reform would remove the tax deductions handed to employers 60 years ago and give them to individuals instead. True reform would permit individuals to shop nationwide for the best plan and would permit companies to offer truly catastrophic plans for the young and healthy. True reform would create high-risk pools to provide for those with chronic conditions.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

This is what you wanted zip.

And shutting down the government is how the Democrats think they will get there.

“We are five days away from fundamentally transforming the United States of America.” — Barack Obama, October 30, 2008

“We are going to have to change our conversation; we’re going to have to change our traditions, our history; we’re going to have to move into a different place as a nation.” — Michelle Obama, May 14, 2008

“I happen to be a proponent of a single payer universal health care program.” (applause) “I see no reason why the United States of America, the wealthiest country in the history of the world, spending 14 percent of its Gross National Product on health care cannot provide basic health insurance to everybody. And that’s what Jim is talking about when he says everybody in, nobody out. A single payer health care plan, a universal health care plan. And that’s what I’d like to see. But as all of you know, we may not get there immediately. Because first we have to take back the White House, we have to take back the Senate, and we have to take back the House.”
Obama speaking to the Illinois AFL-CIO, June 30, 2003.

My commitment is to make sure that we've got universal health care for all Americans by the end of my first term as president. I would hope that we can set up a system that allows those who can go through their employer to access a federal system or a state pool of some sort. But I don't think we're gonna be able to eliminate employer coverage immediately. There's going to be potentially some transition process. I can envision a decade out or 15 years out or 20 years out.
Barack Obama, March 2007, SEIU Health Care Forum

And on Leadership:

The fact that we are here today to debate raising America’s debt limit is a sign of leadership failure. It is a sign that the U.S. Government can’t pay its own bills. It is a sign that we now depend on ongoing financial assistance from foreign countries to finance our Government’s reckless fiscal policies. … Increasing America’s debt weakens us domestically and internationally. Leadership means that ‘the buck stops here. Instead, Washington is shifting the burden of bad choices today onto the backs of our children and grandchildren. America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership. Americans deserve better.
Senator Barack Hussein Obama, 2006

Did we get "better?"

OR

Did we get nothing more than more debt?

The problem is, is that the way Bush has done it over the last eight years is to take out a credit card from the Bank of China in the name of our children, driving up our national debt from $5 trillion for the first 42 presidents - #43 added $4 trillion by his lonesome, so that we now have over $9 trillion of debt that we are going to have to pay back -- $30,000 for every man, woman and child. That's irresponsible. It's unpatriotic.
Barack Hussein Obama

To this, your President has added $7 trillion...

You got what you voted for. Transformative change with no opposition and should the American people offer up any opposition, your answer is shut down the government, hurt them, teach them a lesson, silence them so that they will never stand up to government again...

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

Another American Story from the Middle Class:

A One-Two Punch for the Self-Employed Baby-Boomer
B. Phillip Johnson, American Thinker
October 1, 2013

I got my letter yesterday.

I was self-employed for my business career. No retirement after 20 years and no pension. I was required to save for my retirement and rely on the expected historical yields that I have come to expect from my 60 years.

The major insurance company with which I have had my family health insurance for over 20 years said they are no longer offering the policy under which I am covered. It was a high deductible. In other words, I paid nearly all of my bills out of pocket. Didn't particularly like it, but settled for it. Now it is gone.

Ben Bernanke has removed any fair return on my savings. He has done all he can to keep rates at zero and push inflation to 2%. Over a five-year period, this in none other than a net accumulated tax of 10% on savers.

I have two major costs: health insurance and real estate taxes.

Despite my house falling in value, the real estate tax burden has been steady to higher over the past 6 years. I think this is determined by government.

My health care premiums are about to skyrocket. My policy -- the coverage I was promised to be able to keep -- is no longer available. I want to keep my doctor, and Obama guaranteed that I can, but my doctor doesn't want me. I think this is determined by government.

Perhaps this could have been revealed by an honest press conference, with honest questions. But the president doesn't lower himself to such cross examinations.

So return on savings goes to zero.

Health care plans are canceled, and people are forced to new products at higher costs and lower coverage. Real estate taxes are readjusted by "multiplier" magic to keep the money flowing to the municipality despite a lower evaluation of the real estate.

And the thievery that sank Detroit is being compensated with millions of taxpayer dollars. The thieves go unpunished.

It seems the self-reliant are being punished and made to provide compensation to others. And we all know what that's called.

These are the stories the American Press will not tell. The Middle Class is not a victim, they can afford it, they'll show you real victims, people who will get their back pay when this is all over, but will serve as useful tools in a political victory now.

The hell with economics.

Fairness...

The Middle Class must pay!

 

[zipman]

This is what you wanted zip.

blah, blah, blah.

You have no idea what I want or how I think.

You only have your paranoid delusions which this thread has put on display, yet again.

Have fun with that.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

Seems the Democrats are the only ones who see this as a win...

Government Shutdown: The Fight Is Win-Win for GOP
Ira Stoll, Reason.com
Sep. 30, 2013

For Republicans, the cliffhanger over a government shutdown is a win-win.

If they manage to extract a concession from Senate Democrats in exchange for voting to approve a continuing resolution to fund the government’s operations, then they’ve won. The House Republicans are asking for a repeal of Obamacare’s tax on medical devices and a one-year delay of the implementation of the health care law. If they get either one, they’ll have achieved something that they wouldn’t have achieved had they been as pliant as President Obama wanted.

And — here is the underappreciated point — if the Republicans fold and approve the spending bill without extracting any concessions from Democrats, then they’ve also won. Because in that case, Americans will actually get a chance to see for themselves what a train-wreck Obamacare is. If the law is really as bad as Republicans say it is, then as a political matter, what could be better for Republicans than voters finding out firsthand?

Polls have consistently shown the public’s attitude to Obamacare as skeptical verging on hostile. That’s based on opinion shaped in part by Republican descriptions of the law. If the real thing matches the scary scenario painted by Republican critics — or simply fails to live up to the utopia promised by President Obama and the Democrats — the politics of that should be great for the Republicans.

Democratic politicians dined out for years on anecdotal and sometimes even apocryphal health care horror stories — the woman whose coverage was dropped when she got cancer, the family that went bankrupt because of a child’s medical bills, the grandfather who had to choose between food and medicine. Once the health care law goes into effect, every problem with American health care — the medical errors, the inscrutable blizzards of bills and explanations of benefits, the wait to get an appointment with a specialist or even a highly regarded non-specialist, the high cost, the odd combination of high technology (MRIs, artificial hips) and low technology (you usually can’t email your doctor) — can be laid, as a political matter, directly at the feet of President Obama, Harry Reid, and Nancy Pelosi.

So Republicans hoping for a year’s delay in the implementation of the law may want to be careful what they wish for. And Democrats hoping against a delay should be careful what they wish for.

More: http://reason.com/archives/2013/09/30/government-shutdown-the-fight-is-win-win/print

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

Oh zip, I see this has really put the wind back into your sails!


You came here today to celebrate.


Happy, happy, happy...

 

[Weird Harold]

...my point that this was orchestrated by the Democrats because they believed it would score political points. ...

Who was it decided that a continuing resolution was the proper venue for de-funding ACA? It seems to me that the proper venue to deny funding for ACA would be in a permanent budget bill.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

Who was it decided that a continuing resolution was the proper venue for de-funding ACA? It seems to me that the proper venue to deny funding for ACA would be in a permanent budget bill.

That has been pointed out at numerous junctures this week in this thread and others as to why Harry Reid refuses to produce a budget after five years of total control of the Senate; that would show the American People the outlines of the economic train wreck. Therefore this remains the only avenue of opposition since Harry cannot let a Budget loose in the House where he cannot control it. Then Barry would have to veto it...

He wants and needs this shut down to shift blame off of his party.

So do Obama and Pelosi.

 

[Ramp1311]

How many "do-overs" will you need to admit that you were beaten?

Someday, perhaps you'll be man enough to answer that simple question.

Today is obviously not that day.

All I will say is there has never been a population in the history of the world that has had their life made better by big government in the long run.

Just because it has become a law, does not mean it is a good law. There have also been laws for slavery, women not voting, drinking, prostitution and drugs... some have been repealed, and guess why?

http://www.nytimes.com/1989/10/09/u...-medicare-law-fell.html?pagewanted=all&src=pm


From what I read on here, several of you that are saying "it is a law" pick and choose what law you want to follow......

There are good laws, that help the overall populous and there are bad laws that hurt the overall populous.....