The future is dense, walkable cities.

[Fuzzy1975]

I've been a firefighter/EMT my entire adult life and my first question is where is access for fire apparatus, including ladder trucks and ambulances? If there is no direct access then hoselines will have to be hand laid delaying firefighting activity. As close as these structures are together one on fire could mean losing 2 or more without rapid fire attack. Oh its very nice looking, but the devil is in the details. The way the narrator blithely dismisses access for emergency services is kind of terrifying for me as I know what delays in fire attack and delays in EMS care can bring.

Can you say building code? Fire-Stop? Buildings with common walls all have 45 min burn through protection.

You have automatic hose setting devices.......wow.

 

[AlexBailey]

Can you say building code? Fire-Stop? Buildings with common walls all have 45 min burn through protection.

You have automatic hose setting devices.......wow.

Right.

Fire Marshal Karen doesn’t seem to think a new development can have designs that would mitigate some of the dangers he’s worried about.

I live in an area where ALL new residential structures are required to have sprinklers. All are required to have hydrant access nearby. It’s logical good design for places with inherent dangers.

Fire Marshal Karen isn’t thinking about how emergency access doesn’t necessarily mean regular streets. He doesn’t see solutions to his own concerns. He isn’t even a nimby - he’s worried about what other people are doing in their own back yards.

 

[TrailerHitch]

A water tank on the roof would be convenient for firefighting, depending on the strength of the roof. Firefighters on neighboring roofs could use multiple tanks to spray down on a fire instead of trying to pump or carry water up. Free solar water heating can be done by painting the tank black. If that negates the only use of natgas, then that negates the risk of a natgas explosion.

Hm...Ever seen the Towering Inferno?

 

[Chernosoth]

Hm...Ever seen the Towering Inferno?

The fire chief told the architect about the impossibility of fighting fires past some number of floors. That stops being an issue as all the skyscrapers are demolished. Monuments to vanity are all they ever were.

 

[AlexBailey]

The fire chief told the architect about the impossibility of fighting fires past some number of floors. That stops being an issue as all the skyscrapers are demolished. Monuments to vanity are all they ever were.

Right. No responsible building department would ever allow a building taller than a ladder can reach.

I read about how in the early days of automobiles someone predicted they would never be able to go faster than thirty miles per hour simply because the human brain wouldn’t be able to process information fast enough.

 

[Chernosoth]

Apocalyptic hypotheticals shouldn’t be used to dismiss simple things we can do to improve urban transit and emergency vehicle response time right now.

The complete end of fossil fuel use in the US could be a century away. But there will definitely be much less at much higher prices in 20 years, a reasonable length of time to assume for any big infrastructural change. Anything we start building now must accommodate the conditions for decades ahead when we're done building it. A tremendous amount of infrastructure will be abandoned or salvaged because it doesn't work anymore.

Apocalypse originally meant revelation. We will be taking a long look at what our civilization has done with its resources.

 

[BrightShinyGirl]

The complete end of fossil fuel use in the US could be a century away. But there will definitely be much less at much higher prices in 20 years, a reasonable length of time to assume for any big infrastructural change. Anything we start building now must accommodate the conditions for decades ahead when we're done building it. A tremendous amount of infrastructure will be abandoned or salvaged because it doesn't work anymore.

Apocalypse originally meant revelation. We will be taking a long look at what our civilization has done with its resources.

Building trains and reducing dependence on private cars prepares us for a future where oil is scarce. We can still use gasoline-powered buses and fire engines long after it stops being a fuel for automobiles.

 

[AlexBailey]

Building trains and reducing dependence on private cars prepares us for a future where oil is scarce. We can still gasoline-powered buses and fire engines long after it stops being a fuel for automobiles.

As I pointed out before, we can get along without petroleum. The California Forever project will have all new infrastructure. Under CA laws for new buildings there will be no gas. The public transportation will undoubtedly be electric as would EMS vehicles.

Part of industrial and military equipment infrastructure includes the use of ‘fuel tenders’ - vehicles that carry fuel to equipment in the field. Electric battery tenders already exist. A two axel truck can carry enough battery storage to power a hospital or other emergency vehicles for several hours. It isn’t just theoretical.

 

[Chernosoth]

Building trains and reducing dependence on private cars prepares us for a future where oil is scarce. We can still use gasoline-powered buses and fire engines long after it stops being a fuel for automobiles.

If we have enough coal left to build more rail and trains, while still providing enough electricity and home heat. But gasoline engines big enough for buses and firetrucks would shake themselves to bits too fast to be worth installation. At that size, it's diesel or nothing. Diesel is becoming scarce faster than gasoline. There are some temporary workarounds, like pulling a little pump trailer with a gas engine car, as described in some WWII story by Oggbashan. The torquey and durable inline six in my truck would be good for that. Later, firetrucks could be horses and wagons again.

 

[Fuzzy1975]

. Diesel is becoming scarce faster than gasoline. There are some temporary workarounds, like pulling a little pump trailer with a gas engine car, as described in some WWII story by Oggbashan. The torquey and durable inline six in my truck would be good for that. Later, firetrucks could be horses and wagons again.

WTF are you talking about? The Diesel engine was designed to run on Peanut oil, you blabering idiot. You can use just about anything that burns in a Diesel engine. When ran on bio fuels, Diesels are pretty clean with the exception of NOX's.

 

[BrightShinyGirl]

If we have enough coal left to build more rail and trains, while still providing enough electricity and home heat. But gasoline engines big enough for buses and firetrucks would shake themselves to bits too fast to be worth installation. At that size, it's diesel or nothing. Diesel is becoming scarce faster than gasoline. There are some temporary workarounds, like pulling a little pump trailer with a gas engine car, as described in some WWII story by Oggbashan. The torquey and durable inline six in my truck would be good for that. Later, firetrucks could be horses and wagons again.

Pretending that a collapse to a pre-industrial society is inevitable is a way to avoid doing things right now to make modern life more sustainable and convenient.

 

[Chernosoth]

Pretending that a collapse to a pre-industrial society is inevitable is a way to avoid doing things right now to make modern life more sustainable and convenient.

Expecting our civilization to collapse at the rate that civilizations always do is a reason to start living more sustainably now.

 

[MajorRewrite]

Seaside was one of the earliest “new urbanist” developments and it attracted a lot of attention as an alternative to typical sprawl. Many interesting concepts in this video (I think it was a PBS show). The business incubator spaces are an excellent idea.

 

[BabyBoomer50s]

Seaside was one of the earliest “new urbanist” developments and it attracted a lot of attention as an alternative to typical sprawl. Many interesting concepts in this video (I think it was a PBS show). The business incubator spaces are an excellent idea.

Lots of great ideas here! In addition to the quality of life for its residents, it’s an attractive destination for residents of surrounding suburbs.

 

[Chernosoth]

Help and advice with parenting is one of the reasons we need walkable communities. Many suburban parents never learned the basics. We can see the results of suburban parenting here and everywhere on the internet, the immature shouters who can't disagree without launching an attack.

 

[MajorRewrite]

More die in crashes than by violent crime, but it’s rarely mentioned.

 

[TrailerHitch]

Help and advice with parenting is one of the reasons we need walkable communities. Many suburban parents never learned the basics. We can see the results of suburban parenting here and everywhere on the internet, the immature shouters who can't disagree without launching an attack.

Today's parents are lazy and use electronic devices, TV, Video Games, Cell Phones and computers to pacify their kids. It's easier than putting in the work to actually parent. Then in the end they are shocked when their kids are spoiled rotten brats with both discipline and socialization issues.

 

[TrailerHitch]

A water tank on the roof would be convenient for firefighting, depending on the strength of the roof. Firefighters on neighboring roofs could use multiple tanks to spray down on a fire instead of trying to pump or carry water up. Free solar water heating can be done by painting the tank black. If that negates the only use of natgas, then that negates the risk of a natgas explosion.

Fires in building are better put out by going inside the building and attacking the fire at it's base. Only spraying water from the outside is what is done when the fire is pretty much in control of the building and it's unsafe to enter.

 

[BrightShinyGirl]

More die in crashes than by violent crime, but it’s rarely mentioned.

Conservatives are convinced that cities are dangerous hives of violent crime, but the biggest danger of living in a city is not being attacked by a criminal, but being injured or killed by a driver.

 

[BrightShinyGirl]

Fires in building are better put out by going inside the building and attacking the fire at it's base. Only spraying water from the outside is what is done when the fire is pretty much in control of the building and it's unsafe to enter.

Allowing private cars to clog city streets makes it less likely that firefighters can get to a burning building in time to knock it down before it can spread.

 

[TrailerHitch]

Allowing private cars to clog city streets makes it less likely that firefighters can get to a burning building in time to knock it down before it can spread.

Yet we do it every day every where across America. Are there problems sometimes? Of course and that is why multiple apparatus respond from multiple stations.

 

[Fuzzy1975]

Yet we do it every day every where across America. Are there problems sometimes? Of course and that is why multiple apparatus respond from multiple stations.

everywhere everyday

sigh.....

 

[BrightShinyGirl]

Yet we do it every day every where across America. Are there problems sometimes? Of course and that is why multiple apparatus respond from multiple stations.

And there are lots of dense cities in Europe and Asia that have survived for years without burning down.

 

[JohnEngelman]

Many people would like to live in cities, but the housing costs are too high. Cities need lots and lots of affordable, high density housing within walking distances to public transportation hubs.

 

[Bray123]

Dense walkable cites are not the future, they are the past. It's what existed before transportation was available, when people had to walk to work. They also kept pigs and chickens in the yard and grew vegetables.

Then there were trains & busses and the commuter was born, living in the suburbs away from the stink of tanneries and breweries.

As soon as it was possible, people voted with their cars and shunned mass transportation. Strap-hanging crushed against a variety of sweaty armpits was no-one's aspiration. Asking people to go back to those days is a fine ideal but it's never going to happen. The future has been defined by Covid; working from home is what people want, fast & reliable internet has proved it can be done. It's been years since I went into a town center except for a very specialised purpose, there are no shops there worth the car parking fee. In fact, my local town looks derelict with all the boarded up shops.

If the planners reversed the policies of the last 50 years and banned out-of-town malls with their cheap rents and free car parks, to force people back to town it might have some effect but it'd be swimming against the tide.