Beheading in Oklahoma

subdued_passion said:

Maybe because I belong to a minority group in my country I don't like the idea that I could be judged/condemned by fellow citizens based on the actions of other members of my group. I think that is also why I don't instantly think of genocide as the cure to any of my problems.

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First of all I agree with you that it's not fair, but 'fairness' is no reason for a nation to commit suicide. And if you don't want to be judged by the actions of a subset of your particular group that it is incumbent on you to actively denounce/eliminate that subset.

Further, we are not talking genocide here. Islam is NOT a race, or any particular culture for that matter. It is a religious belief system. In order for that belief system to change it has to be taken to the breaking point just as the Reformation broke the Roman Catholic monopoly on doctrine.

Ishmael

JAMESBJOHNSON said:

Ethnic cleansing works. Hitler did nothing every great culture hasn't done.

During our own Civil War, the South 95% Scottish, killed 300,000 English, Dutch, and German peoples of the North.

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You say this now but would you feel the same way if you belonged to the targeted group?

Would you just fall on the sword because the majority of your nation's population has decided that since all the majors wars in recent times seem to have been perpetrated by white men, they are the enemy and they should all be wiped out as a prevention measure?

Ishmael said:

First of all I agree with you that it's not fair, but 'fairness' is no reason for a nation to commit suicide. And if you don't want to be judged by the actions of a subset of your particular group that it is incumbent on you to actively denounce/eliminate that subset.

Further, we are not talking genocide here. Islam is NOT a race, or any particular culture for that matter. It is a religious belief system. In order for that belief system to change it has to be taken to the breaking point just as the Reformation broke the Roman Catholic monopoly on doctrine.

Ishmael

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Isn't right to practice your religion without fear of persecution one of your fundamental rights? It is one afforded to us by our constitution.

subdued_passion said:

You say this now but would you feel the same way if you belonged to the targeted group?

Would you just fall on the sword because the majority of your nation's population has decided that since all the majors wars in recent times seem to have been perpetrated by white men, they are the enemy and they should all be wiped out as a prevention measure?

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There are 1.6 BILLION Muslims out there...as a group they are one of the largest out there making up almost 1/4 of the planets total population.

How the fuck does anyone think they a minority??

They have more people that want to kill every American than there are Americans total.....

How the fuck are you thinking they are a minority??

Or have we just changed the whole minority definition to just mean 'not white' ?? is that it?

subdued_passion said:

You say this now but would you feel the same way if you belonged to the targeted group?

Would you just fall on the sword because the majority of your nation's population has decided that since all the majors wars in recent times seem to have been perpetrated by white men, they are the enemy and they should all be wiped out as a prevention measure?

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Many of the great Western states were created when ancestors of mine conquered the dominant society or crushed invaders. You assimilate or conquer.

subdued_passion said:

Isn't right to practice your religion without fear of persecution one of your fundamental rights? It is one afforded to us by our constitution.

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Not when that religion promotes or condones violence against your fellow citizen....there are limits to every freedom. When you and your crew become a threat to society it's society's responsibility to protect itself from that threat.

subdued_passion said:

Isn't right to practice your religion without fear of persecution one of your fundamental rights? It is one afforded to us by our constitution.

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Up until such time as your practices infringe on the rights of others to do the same. I'd say that beheading is an infringement of the rights of the person beheaded. And therein lies the problem with a large cross-section of Islam, they do NOT recognize the rights of others. Further they don't support the notion of secular law.

Ishmael

Ishmael said:

Further they don't support the notion of secular law.

Ishmael

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Not that that is any kind of problem in the US as long as you're Christian....


But then again Christians aren't running around cutting peoples heads off...so there is that.

BotanyBoy said:

There are 1.6 BILLION Muslims out there...as a group they are one of the largest out there making up almost 1/4 of the planets total population.

How the fuck does anyone think they a minority??

They have more people that want to kill every American than there are Americans total.....

How the fuck are you thinking they are a minority??

Or have we just changed the whole minority definition to just mean 'not white' ?? is that it?

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muslims/obama are terrorist

JAMESBJOHNSON said:

But he's your's and you make excuses for him. He'll cost you plenty before it's all over, like John Brown did before the Civil War.

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Mine? I have no knowledge of him other than what's in the news.
Where, exactly, have I made an excuse for him? Or even hinted at, suggested or implied an excuse. Quote it.

about_average said:

Mine? I have no knowledge of him other than what's in the news.
Where, exactly, have I made an excuse for him? Or even hinted at, suggested or implied an excuse. Quote it.

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Youre a liberal Democrat.

Not one of you has the stomach to board and bludgeon and make walk the plank one solitary black muslim. Its not what you like but it is what you want.

JAMESBJOHNSON said:

Many of the great Western states were created when ancestors of mine conquered the dominant society or crushed invaders. You assimilate or conquer.

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That is how you would deal with invaders not with your citizenry.

BotanyBoy said:

There are 1.6 BILLION Muslims out there...as a group they are one of the largest out there making up almost 1/4 of the planets total population.

How the fuck does anyone think they a minority??

They have more people that want to kill every American than there are Americans total.....

How the fuck are you thinking they are a minority??

Or have we just changed the whole minority definition to just mean 'not white' ?? is that it?

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Have I been mistaken in thinking that muslims are a minority group in the US? The discussion was about dealing with the issue in the US.

isil is not representative of islam

isil is an extremist group of terrorists

muslims the world over are staging rallies decrying the acts of the isil, declaring 'not in MY name'

to equate isil with all islamics is like stating the i.r.a represented all catholics

4est_4est_Gump said:

When they emigrate for greater opportunity, they tend not to assimilate, but to demand that their hosts tolerate their religion, their law, their no-go zones and the demands that wherever they go physically, all of society must accommodate their special religious needs, especially in the West which is undergoing a crises of confidence under the crushing burdens of moral relativism, tolerance and diversity. We have created a cultural vacuum in the West and they are filling it almost by default.

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In the US all religions pretty much "demand" all of that. Though the US doesn't recognize Sharia law for anything covered by local, state and federal laws. If it's not, then people are free to apply Sharia law, Jewish law, Christian law, Buddhist law or whatever they believe in.

The main 'moral' flaw to Islam is the total and complete linkage of church and state.

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That's the flaw of most religious people in the US.

subdued_passion said:

That is how you would deal with invaders not with your citizenry.



Have I been mistaken in thinking that muslims are a minority group in the US? The discussion was about dealing with the issue in the US.

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The issue is Muslims murdering innocents for ideology. Much of America believes it can appease Islam, like Britain appeased Hitler.

JAMESBJOHNSON said:

Youre a liberal Democrat.

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And you have no idea what the hell you're talking about.

Then again, you're commonly posting out of ignorance.

BotanyBoy said:

Not when that religion promotes or condones violence against your fellow citizen....there are limits to every freedom. When you and your crew become a threat to society it's society's responsibility to protect itself from that threat.

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Ishmael said:

Up until such time as your practices infringe on the rights of others to do the same. I'd say that beheading is an infringement of the rights of the person beheaded. And therein lies the problem with a large cross-section of Islam, they do NOT recognize the rights of others. Further they don't support the notion of secular law.

Ishmael

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If you claim to be a secular state you cannot target any one religion and exempt others. The rules need to be applied evenly to all or not at all.

The only way you can trump the 'freedom of conscience and religion' is if there is proof of conspiracy to commit treason against the state.

about_average said:

And you have no idea what the hell you're talking about.

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Sure I do. You stuck your paw up Islam's skirt, found something you didn't expect, then thought, IT COULD BE WORSE AND I'LL GROW TO LIKE IT.

subdued_passion said:

If you claim to be a secular state you cannot target any one religion and exempt others. The rules need to be applied evenly to all or not at all.

The only way you can trump the 'freedom of conscience and religion' is if there is proof of conspiracy to commit treason against the state.

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That's not how the game's played.

Towards the end of our Civil War, Lincoln, the Messiah of blacks, filled the army with black soldiers for the South to slaughter, and slaughtered they were. We failed to see what a friend he was of the South.

vetteman said:

My suggestion of a dialog about what's wrong with Islam is not a condemnation of all Muslims, it's a question about why, in the United States of America, we have people, many of them young, being radicalized into a 6th Century barbarous mentality bent on treason; they represent an enemy in our midst.

The holy Quran, unlike the Christian Bible, contains at least 109 open ended verses, not confined to historical context of the accompanying text, commanding followers to either make war on or slaughter non-believers. Followers who do not engage in the slaughter are threaten with Hell. It even threatens peaceful Muslims with a lesser level of respect from Allah.

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Islam is like Elderberries and Poke salad; parts of both are delectable and parts are toxic. You don't embrace them totally, the good must be severed from the bad

subdued_passion said:

That is how you would deal with invaders not with your citizenry.

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When a segment of the citizenry becomes a problem...be it religious zelots or a bunch of gun wielding 'patriots' wanting the south to rise again, it's the governments job to put that segment of the citizenry in it's fuckin' place.

subdued_passion said:

Have I been mistaken in thinking that muslims are a minority group in the US? The discussion was about dealing with the issue in the US.

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This is not a US issue sister, radical Muslims have made themselves a fucking problem on every god damn continent and most of the 1st world societies on this rock we call Earth. Wake the fuck up.

Eventually if they don't handle this problem then when push comes to shove America will......and it's going to be fuckin' uuuuuuuuugleeeeee.

butters said:

isil is not representative of islam

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Really? Then what group of people do they represent??

butters said:

isil is an extremist group of terrorists

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No..they are 20-25% of the Muslim population globally....that's not an extremist group that's a social trend.

butters said:

muslims the world over are staging rallies decrying the acts of the isil, declaring 'not in MY name'

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And they are the fucking MINORITY in the muslim community. The majority of them just turn a blind eye and scream racism when pressed.

butters said:

to equate isil with all islamics is like stating the i.r.a represented all catholics

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No, why you ask? Because there are not 500 million IRA members running around the globe trying to start WWIII while flying the IRA/Vatican flag while the other billion of them turn a blind eye and pretend nothing is happening.

subdued_passion said:

If you claim to be a secular state you cannot target any one religion and exempt others. The rules need to be applied evenly to all or not at all.

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Except when that religion becomes a threat to our society....then that religion and it's followers can very much be targeted, kicked out and or contained. Fuck we can even wage war on that segment of society right here on our own soil.

Threats foreign and domestic.....

subdued_passion said:

The only way you can trump the 'freedom of conscience and religion' is if there is proof of conspiracy to commit treason against the state.

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Is beheading your fellow American not treasonous?

These cock suckers want to come wage a holy war in my back yard and you expect me to just take it because freedom of religion?

LOL you've lost your fucking mind in liburhul loony land.