What if Diversity Trainings Are Doing More Harm Than Good? by Jesse Singal

[JohnEngelman]

If that really is what she's saying (and I have my doubts in light of your track record), then I disagree with her. But that is no excuse for your racism, John.

What you call my racism consists of my willingness to draw attention to unflattering facts about blacks. What have I ever said that is not true?

From the beginning of the Cold War to the Communist Tet Offensive in 1968 it was dangerous in the United States to criticize capitalism, advocate socialism, or to say anything good about any Communist country. These inhibitions got us into Vietnam and kept us there for ten years. Now it is dangerous to draw attention to the relationship between gene alleles, intelligence, crime and race.

I do not believe that there should be any inhibitions against the spread of facts and opinions. Name calling and insults are the lowest form of discourse. Let's deal with facts that can be documented, and leave the school yard taunts out of it.

 

[YDB95]

What have I ever said that is not true?

You should know my response to that one by heart by now. If you're not going to listen, I see no point in saying it again.

From the beginning of the Cold War to the Communist Tet Offensive in 1968 it was dangerous in the United States to criticize capitalism, advocate socialism, or to say anything good about any Communist country. These inhibitions got us into Vietnam and kept us there for ten years. Now it is dangerous to draw attention to the relationship between gene alleles, intelligence, crime and race.

That analogy makes no sense whatsoever.

I do not believe that there should be any inhibitions against the spread of facts and opinions.

No one here said there should be. That's not the point at all.

Name calling and insults are the lowest form of discourse. Let's deal with facts that can be documented, and leave the school yard taunts out of it.

What you are decrying here is effectively what you do every time you accuse others of only calling you a racist, when in almost every case we have provided a detailed explanation as to why that's what you are.

 

[Lazaran]

You should know my response to that one by heart by now. If you're not going to listen, I see no point in saying it again.

That analogy makes no sense whatsoever.

No one here said there should be. That's not the point at all.

What you are decrying here is effectively what you do every time you accuse others of only calling you a racist, when in almost every case we have provided a detailed explanation as to why that's what you are.

I’ve got an analogy for the “great” John E.

RACIST WHITE AMERICAN’S DENIAL OF THE HISTORICALLY PROVABLE WHITE RACISM CAUSATION / PERPETUATION ELEMENT of gross social and economic disparities, on average, between black Americans and white Americans is like this:

Racist white Americans, standing on a pier partially built by black American slaves, are using a long stick representing slavery, Jim Crow Laws, discrimination, and institutional / systemic racism to drown black Americans who are trying to get up on the pier, while simultaneously: Demanding they swim - Mocking them for failing to swim - Acting surprised that they can’t swim - Blaming them for drowning.

How’s that ^.

the “great” John E.

 

[JohnEngelman]

You should know my response to that one by heart by now. If you're not going to listen, I see no point in saying it again.

In other words, you do not like what I say, but you cannot refute it because it is true.

 

[JohnEngelman]

That analogy makes no sense whatsoever.

My analogy between cold war hysteria and political correctness explains why inhibitions against intellectual freedom lead to serious problems.

 

[JohnEngelman]

No one here said there should be. That's not the point at all.

I am frequently flamed for stating arguments that cannot be disproved dispassionately with calm, factual, and rational arguments. .

 

[JohnEngelman]

What you are decrying here is effectively what you do every time you accuse others of only calling you a racist, when in almost every case we have provided a detailed explanation as to why that's what you are.

Calling someone a racist does not advance the dialogue on race President Clinton called for, and which we need to have; it is an effort to suppress the dialogue.

 

[adrina]

The New York Times article I exerted from said that diversity training usually does more harm than good because it tells whites that we have an obligation to accept blacks who do not perform and behave well. It is unnecessary to tell us to accept Orientals. We call them "the model minority."

Orientals? What century are you in?

 

[ll74]

In other words, you do not like what I say, but you cannot refute it because it is true.

Demonstrating that you're not listening. Good job.

Again, you don't want discussion....you want agreement.

 

[JohnEngelman]

Orientals? What century are you in?

What I mean by Orientals are Chinese, and nations that learned civilization from China. These are Koreans, Japanese, and Vietnamese. "Asians" can be Arabs, Iranians, and Afghans. I could call Orientals "East Asians" but that feels like a concession to political correctness.

I have a high regard for Orientals. I always have.

 

[adrina]

Ironically, all the folks you classify as "Orientals" would not consider themselves so.

 

[ll74]

Ironically, all the folks you classify as "Orientals" would not consider themselves so.

He hasn't matured past the 1960s.

 

[Lazaran]

Orientals? What century are you in?

Most (all?) of what the “great” John E. posts is out of date / inaccurate.

And the out of touch racist spews so much nonsense that it’s an endless/ fruitless endeavor of debunking / disproving for anyone who really cares to engage with it.

The “great” John E. is a lot like the Politics Board’s RWCJ “members” in many ways.

*nods*

 

[JohnEngelman]

Most (all?) of what the “great” John E. posts is out of date / inaccurate.

And the out of touch racist spews so much nonsense that it’s an endless/ fruitless endeavor of debunking / disproving for anyone who really cares to engage with it.

The “great” John E. is a lot like the Politics Board’s RWCJ “members” in many ways.

*nods*

Once I asked on Quora if the use of the word "Oriental" is derogatory. None of the Orientals who responded thought it was. One Oriental was surprised by the question.

When I told an Oriental woman I was dating, "I prefer Oriental women," she did not get angry at me.

She smiled and said, "You think we are much more wonderful."

I learned that Oriental girls existed when I was six or seven. I remember thinking, "Some white girls are pretty. Some white girls are not pretty. All Oriental girls are pretty."

According to Professor J. Philippe Rushton Oriental women have less testosterone than white women, and much less than black women. That is why Oriental women are more feminine, and why I am attracted to them.

 

[ll74]

Once I asked on Quora if the use of the word "Oriental" is derogatory. None of the Orientals who responded thought it was. One Oriental was surprised by the question.

You're obviously a smart person

Quora is an authority on derogatory terms....

 

[JohnEngelman]

Most (all?) of what the “great” John E. posts is out of date / inaccurate.

And the out of touch racist spews so much nonsense that it’s an endless/ fruitless endeavor of debunking / disproving for anyone who really cares to engage with it.

The “great” John E. is a lot like the Politics Board’s RWCJ “members” in many ways.

*nods*

No one has ever explained how my posts are out of date. The truth remains true.

 

[JohnEngelman]

You're obviously a smart person

I have even been told that "Negro" has become derogatory. Martin Luther King, Jr. used that n word 15 times in his "I have a dream speech."

Now we are supposed to call those people "African Americans." I have never heard a Negro use the term "African American" unless he was on television. Negroes frequently use the n word that ends with r.

 

[ll74]

No one has ever explained how my posts are out of date. The truth remains true.

Everyone has explained how your data is over 20 years old. You're just a moron who ignores it be a use you don't care.

 

[ll74]

I have even been told that "Negro" has become derogatory. Martin Luther King, Jr. used that n word 15 times in his "I have a dream speech."

Now we are supposed to call those people "African Americans." I have never heard a Negro use the term "African American" unless he was on television. Negroes frequently use the n word that ends with r.

Maybe ask Quora about that one ...they are great information
Maybe Charles Murray will answer.

 

[JohnEngelman]

Everyone has explained how your data is over 20 years old. You're just a moron who ignores it be a use you don't care.

As soon as you post data from reliable sources that during the last 20 years Negroes have closed the race gaps in intelligence, and rates of crime and illegitimacy, I will admit my mistake.

 

[ll74]

As soon as you post data from reliable sources that during the last 20 years Negroes have closed the race gaps in intelligence, and rates of crime and illegitimacy, I will admit my mistake.

You're the one using outdated data to prove your point because you got the data from third parties.

Not my job to update your data for you and not my fault you're using it.

Whether you believe updated data still supports your argument is irrelevant to the fact that it's outdated.

 

[JohnEngelman]

Maybe ask Quora about that one ...they are great information
Maybe Charles Murray will answer.

Once Charles Murray responded to a letter to the editor I wrote about an article of his in Commentary, but I cannot find it on the internet.

 

[ll74]

Once Charles Murray responded to a letter to the editor I wrote about an article of his in Commentary, but I cannot find it on the internet.

I'm sure he did.

I bet you got a hard on from it.

 

[JohnEngelman]

You're the one using outdated data to prove your point because you got the data from third parties.

Not my job to update your data for you and not my fault you're using it.

Post the data that proves that you are right, and I am mistaken.

 

[JohnEngelman]

I'm sure he did.

I bet you got a hard on from it.

I'm not that way.