the marks of a slave

[redslady]

Some of the posts in this thread make me really sad.

Me too. I'm just quietly shutting the door behind a 25 year marriage. When I think of all the ES and her Husband have weathered, it makes me sad that the man I thought loved me as much as I loved him couldn't handle my having cancer.

 

[eastern sun]

Me too. I'm just quietly shutting the door behind a 25 year marriage. When I think of all the ES and her Husband have weathered, it makes me sad that the man I thought loved me as much as I loved him couldn't handle my having cancer.

My heart is breaking.

Sometimes people are really, really frightened. and all they can do is run away.

My love to you, redslady. Your posts have always touched me deeply.

 

[eastern sun]

Some of the posts in this thread make me really sad.

Why, Bunny?

 

[eastern sun]

A woman I passed on the street just broke my heart.
Why? Because - with her smile - she loved me.

 

[eastern sun]

It is good to be a beginner again. It is always good to be a beginner.

 

[redslady]

It is good to be a beginner again. It is always good to be a beginner.

This is how I'm feeling right now, a beginner. I just bought a house on my own for the first time. A scary feeling not having that someone to fall back on if needed. In fact this has been the first time I've ever lived alone.

It wasn't the cancer so much he couldn't handle. All through the chemo he was great, held my hair back when I was sick, swept up my hair when it fell out. Help treat radiation burns, drove me everywhere I needed to go without complaint. After all we went through what he couldn't handle was when they decided treatment wasn't enough and I had to have a mastectomy. It seems that once I wasn't a "whole" woman it was too much for him.

 

[eastern sun]

This is how I'm feeling right now, a beginner. I just bought a house on my own for the first time. A scary feeling not having that someone to fall back on if needed. In fact this has been the first time I've ever lived alone.

Congratulations! I have never lived alone, and - honestly - it would fill me with both dread and giddy enthusiasm! I dream of being able to shape my own life - though I don't hope for it.

To new beginnings, redslady. . . . we can both walk into this unknown future with great confidence in our ability to handle adversity. Sometimes I'm glad to have known difficulty, because the sun shines so brightly now and the colors of the world are so vivid.

My to you.

 

[sweepthefloor]

A woman I passed on the street just broke my heart.
Why? Because - with her smile - she loved me.

It is good to be a beginner again. It is always good to be a beginner.

I am starting over again this summer. I have been putting it off, leaving myself in a 'do nothing' phase. I am selling my house. I am pitching everything into black-give-away bags.

My mind is clear. 'I tried this' it didn't work, 'I will try that.'

 

[sweepthefloor]

I love the picture with that ball in your mouth ES. Your mouth is beautiful.

My last lover took me to this place where rocks ring. You beat the rocks with a hammer and they ding. His hammer was this little car escape tool. It was plastic and bright orange. While I sat on the rocks being silly as is my want, he took pictures of me. In an effort to be outrageous I took the hammer and put it into my mouth as if it were a bone.

He said to me: What is that, your modified ball gag or something?
Shocked, my jaw dropped and the hammer fell to the ground.
I said: I would like to have one of those things in my mouth.

A few weeks later at his place he said he went to the store and bought something for me. It was a late night episode where we stayed up all night talking, in the dark laying on our backs. We were already giddy high from the lack of sleep.

Like a child on sugar, wasted on his love, I got on my hands and knees in the bed and demanded to know where is the gift? He pulled out a plastic bag and produced a red ball with leather straps attached to it. I couldn't believe my good fortune! We never had any serious discussion about sexuality, although I am sure I must have expressed my perversions in small pleasant ways passed off as jokes.

He said: I am going to put this in your mouth now to see what you look like.

I opened my mouth like an animal. It was all very funny to me. I couldn't stop laughing. He loved it, and he laughed too. It didn't turn into anything sexual in an obvious way. It wasn't like a sex fantasy coming true, but it was better than that.

With the ball in my mouth he said: try and talk. I said: Hi. I am in love with you. I will do anything to please you. How will I suck your cock with this in my mouth?

He didn't understand a word, my speech was worse than garbled. That was the best part.

He took the ball out of my mouth and I asked him if he understood anything I said. He said no and put it back in my mouth again. He never fastened it, he just held it with his hands and said: Say it again, then.

He took pictures with my phone and when I look at the pictures: I don't look sexy or beautiful like you do your picture. I look silly and exaggerated. You can see the laughter in my eyes, even without the flash and between the blurry-- my emotions are clear.
---

Unfortunately, the intensity spun out of control. He uses that phrase: spun out. "You got me spun out."

Damn! I never laid the man, but I finished him every time with my mouth. He was good to me. One night after finishing him, he was falling asleep. I tried to lay still and stuff my left over energy. It seemed as if he knew me well. He got up, and said: Get your shoes on, don't turn on the light because then you won't be able to see in the dark outside. With our shoes on we walked the woods around his house, holding hands.

We went back to bed and he said: You are calm now, good night. I fell to sleep.
---
There is no conclusion to this affair. We both ruined it.

 

[eastern sun]

It wasn't like a sex fantasy coming true, but it was better than that.

Yes. Yes.

You know, when my kids are about to go out and do something risky, I always tell them "you're not allowed to die today" and they give me this really serious look and say, "ok, mom."

So I'm saying to you, my sweet friend, because I really really want you to feel all that you're hoping to feel . . . .



"You're not allowed to ruin it."

 

[eastern sun]

I saw something tonight that filled me with shame for every non-consensual fantasy I've ever had. The exercise of sexual power and violence can be exceedingly cruel, and it horrifies me that I can masturbate to some of the thoughts and visions I've had.

But that happens. When I glimpse the contents of my mind from a slightly different angle. A kind of horrified shame comes over me, like I can't believe I've been spinning those webs.

Though brittle and callous and clumsy, the reality of my sexuality is steeped in love and respect. Thank god. I would not want to live the nightmare that my fantasies can spin.

 

[Bandit58]

Congratulations! I have never lived alone, and - honestly - it would fill me with both dread and giddy enthusiasm! I dream of being able to shape my own life - though I don't hope for it.

I spent nearly two years living alone between leaving my ex husband and moving in with Sir. That was my first experience of living alone, and I loved it. I had no one to answer to, I could have my music as loud as I wanted, watch what I wanted on TV, I could go out without having to ask permission.

The best thing about it though was discovering that, should I have to do it again, that I will cope. I had always dreaded being on my own....self esteem issues and having been put down for so long will do that to you

 

[rida]

*snip*
Though brittle and callous and clumsy, the reality of my sexuality is steeped in love and respect. Thank god. I would not want to live the nightmare that my fantasies can spin.

I believe that it is because the reality is love and respect that your fantasies can be made of nightmares and not destroy you.


*************:


My submission is broken.

I never liked pain. I always simply endured it for their pleasure. The Sadist never cared about my enjoyment. Hubby always expects it.

Without being allowed to just suffer through it, having to "enjoy" it (or pretend to) is proving to be too much, both on a mental and emotional level.

 

[eastern sun]

The best thing about it though was discovering that, should I have to do it again, that I will cope. I had always dreaded being on my own....self esteem issues and having been put down for so long will do that to you

Bandit, do you know how hard it is for me to imagine you with anything but a healthy dose of self-esteem? Not because I doubt your past, but because you are so clear and strong today.

I too know that I could cope if I were to live alone. Do you know what frightens me, though? The thought that I'll finally have a place of my own when I am far too old to want it.

My grandmother bought into one of the earliest retirement communities when she was in her sixties, and I remember my mother thinking what a crazy, and depressing, idea that was. But my grandmother lived a long, healthy life, alone for the last 20 years; and she felt both secure and independent until her last day.

I hope I am blessed with my grandmother's good sense when the time comes.

She always called her husband "daddy."

 

[eastern sun]

My submission is broken.

I never liked pain. I always simply endured it for their pleasure. The Sadist never cared about my enjoyment. Hubby always expects it.

Without being allowed to just suffer through it, having to "enjoy" it (or pretend to) is proving to be too much, both on a mental and emotional level.

rida, I feel like I just read "my spirit is broken." Is it true? Or am I projecting myself into your circumstances?

There must be so much going on right now. Having to "enjoy" (or pretend to) enjoy sexual pain would prove too much for me too. Even if, or maybe especially because, he would be finding release from his own feelings of discomfort in my enjoyment.

I would want - and have wanted - to fall instead into that state and place of endurance. A kind of comfortable place to be when I feel powerless to affect changes in troubling circumstances. In those moments, someone else's need for me to lift them with my joy or my pleasure is the most crushing pressure I have ever felt. All I want is to simply walk on. Just keep walking. Until I can find my own lightness of spirit again.

Please forgive me if I'm speaking out of line. I can only imagine what you've experienced.

 

[ownedsubgal]

My submission is broken.

I never liked pain. I always simply endured it for their pleasure. The Sadist never cared about my enjoyment. Hubby always expects it.

Without being allowed to just suffer through it, having to "enjoy" it (or pretend to) is proving to be too much, both on a mental and emotional level.

oh rida...(((hugs)))

surely they do not want you to pretend? even if someone has a preference (or higher comfort level) with a response to pain which is opposed to your natural response, i cannot imagine that they would be satisfied by mere roleplay, not to mention how emotionally trying that has to be for you.

like you i do not care for pain. however i recognize the need for it when necessary...whether because i have been the cause of anger or frustration or disappointment, or because my physical suffering is what will give my partner the greatest pleasure. but i do not understand the "hurts so good" concept. it would really and truly shame and hurt me if a regular partner suddenly wanted me to "enjoy" pain, rather than quietly bear and suffer through it.

 

[rida]

rida, I feel like I just read "my spirit is broken." Is it true? Or am I projecting myself into your circumstances?

There must be so much going on right now. Having to "enjoy" (or pretend to) enjoy sexual pain would prove too much for me too. Even if, or maybe especially because, he would be finding release from his own feelings of discomfort in my enjoyment.

I would want - and have wanted - to fall instead into that state and place of endurance. A kind of comfortable place to be when I feel powerless to affect changes in troubling circumstances. In those moments, someone else's need for me to lift them with my joy or my pleasure is the most crushing pressure I have ever felt. All I want is to simply walk on. Just keep walking. Until I can find my own lightness of spirit again.

Please forgive me if I'm speaking out of line. I can only imagine what you've experienced.

Thank you for your kind words. And hugs to you too.

No, my spirit is not broken. And the bolded part is indeed a big part of it.

I'm just dealing with too much at the moment, and a recent incident triggered further thinking and a little bit of whining

It is however true that, for some reason I'm not totally understanding, I cannot bring myself to submit properly to Hubby.

The above statement is actually only half true. I know where part of the problem comes from: I'm in a kind of suspended limbo when it comes to how things are with the Sadist. Mostly not because of me, nor because of him, but because of life circumstances that are beyond our control.

The incident is so small, it's almost ridiculous.
Pain is strongly associated with the Sadist, and during a recent intimate moment with Hubby, when he pinched my nipples, sexual pain that was actually very mild and at a level that I have long learned to let wash over to give Hubby the reaction he wants, I just had a breakdown and not only could not stop sobbing, I basically pushed him away.

Failing at such a minor task has been weighting heavily on me, and has been causing a whole new set of self questioning and doubts on the motive (and depth and breadth) of my submission.

oh rida...(((hugs)))

surely they do not want you to pretend? even if someone has a preference (or higher comfort level) with a response to pain which is opposed to your natural response, i cannot imagine that they would be satisfied by mere roleplay, not to mention how emotionally trying that has to be for you.

like you i do not care for pain. however i recognize the need for it when necessary...whether because i have been the cause of anger or frustration or disappointment, or because my physical suffering is what will give my partner the greatest pleasure. but i do not understand the "hurts so good" concept. it would really and truly shame and hurt me if a regular partner suddenly wanted me to "enjoy" pain, rather than quietly bear and suffer through it.

Thank you.

Role play is not my thing, but within limits, I can "play a role" if that is what my partner wants. I see it as part of providing them with their desires, a service I provide for them. And it would definetly not be the base of a long term relationship for me.

But what Hubby wants is more than role-play: he wants for me to really want what he wants, how he wants it and when he wants it. And when I'm running thin on my own energy, it is very very hard, if not impossible.

As for the "hurts so good" concept, it has been escaping me as well, and I'm just now starting to perhaps understand it in connection with pain due to rope bondage. I love to be tied in rope. And it can hurt quite a lot.
Yet I want the rope, I wish for it and look for and put myself in the experience. But still, I'm not looking for pain; pain is just the often inevitable price to pay for it.

 

[minx1]

I spent nearly two years living alone between leaving my ex husband and moving in with Sir. That was my first experience of living alone, and I loved it. I had no one to answer to, I could have my music as loud as I wanted, watch what I wanted on TV, I could go out without having to ask permission.

The best thing about it though was discovering that, should I have to do it again, that I will cope. I had always dreaded being on my own....self esteem issues and having been put down for so long will do that to you

Hello everyone!

Just came in on the end of this discussion and wanted to add that I love, LOVE living alone. It's strange, it used to scare me silly. When I was married, I would spend nights alone with a chair pressed up against the door and nearly every single light in the house on

My divorce forced me to endure it, then tolerate it and finally I learned to embrace and love it.

Right now, I am taking a break from men....Doms and vanilla alike and am enjoying being a lone in my own little domain. All is good.

 

[eastern sun]

All is good.

You know, we all sit and watch each other play ourselves on these forum boards.

And the more someone posts, the more opportunity we have to learn through their experience.

You have shared so much with us, minx. Your pain is our pain.

And your joy is our joy.

 

[eastern sun]

i do not understand the "hurts so good" concept. it would really and truly shame and hurt me if a regular partner suddenly wanted me to "enjoy" pain, rather than quietly bear and suffer through it.

As for the "hurts so good" concept, it has been escaping me as well, and I'm just now starting to perhaps understand it in connection with pain due to rope bondage. I love to be tied in rope. And it can hurt quite a lot.

Yet I want the rope, I wish for it and look for and put myself in the experience. But still, I'm not looking for pain; pain is just the often inevitable price to pay for it.

I have to say, for the record here, that I do understand the "hurts so good" concept. Certain pain - in my case, not, in fact, very painful pain, but the kind of pain that comes from smacks, paddles, pinches, bites, etc. - has become a sexual trigger for me. Unless I'm with a stranger, I do not become aroused without it.

This is the kind of pain that suddenly opens doors and makes me forget what I was doing. It causes me to drop whatever was in my plan for the next moment. I have a physical arousal response to it, and genuinely love it.

There's other kinds of pain - sexual, physical, emotional, mental - that doesn't hurt good at all. It takes all kinds of forms and triggers many different responses - from cringing withdrawal, to striking back, to resignation, to stoicism, to even a kind of spiritual embrace.

Sometimes, when I am experiencing that other kind of pain in areas of my life that may and may not be related to my sexuality, I experience the sexual pain that usually excites me as a shock to the system - opening doors again - but triggering not sexual arousal but the torrent of emotion that I've been holding in stoic reserve. That's when a pinch to the nipples will send me into tears that have nothing to do with sexual submission. And I will also be likely to push him away.

He has wrestled with me in those moments, and brought me back to a "hurts so good" place. I like it so much, I wish sometimes I never felt pain any other way.

 

[mitchell67]

re: happenstance

[...]
He has wrestled with me in those moments, and brought me back to a "hurts so good" place. I like it so much, I wish sometimes I never felt pain any other way.

Is there something inherent in the unpredictability of the presumed pain stimulus that leads to the heightened sense of pleasure and excitement? If you could anticipate accurately how every pinch, swat, or stroke of a cane might register as a sensation, would the pleasure be diminished or negated?

I do wonder, based in part on your quote, just how much of what we seek in altering our state of mind is the swings to and from both sides.

 

[eastern sun]

Is there something inherent in the unpredictability of the presumed pain stimulus that leads to the heightened sense of pleasure and excitement? If you could anticipate accurately how every pinch, swat, or stroke of a cane might register as a sensation, would the pleasure be diminished or negated?

I do wonder, based in part on your quote, just how much of what we seek in altering our state of mind is the swings to and from both sides.

Yes. Unpredictable pain is inherently exciting. But it's conditioning that makes it sexually pleasurable. The same unpredictable stimuli could be entirely unpleasant, for instance, if it was routinely followed by nonconsensual abuse or violence.

Predictable pain, on the other hand, - like the counting of the cane strikes - really hurts, not only because of its intensity, but because its intensity is amplified by anticipation. My fear of the pain gets added to the mix, and I have to actively fight against my impulses to move away.

That's when I have time to engage with the pain, feel its contours, its energetic nature, when I have narrative moments as "slave" - talking myself through the experience - reframing it in my mind as something I wanted, watching my mind and body work - so to speak - before the chemical cocktail gets shaken up and I'm riding the endorphin high.

But it still hurts. Any pleasure I feel then is due to satisfaction in my ability to take what I'm being given or a kind of detached fascination with what my body and mind is experiencing.

 

[Keroin]

Yes. Unpredictable pain is inherently exciting. But it's conditioning that makes it sexually pleasurable. The same unpredictable stimuli could be entirely unpleasant, for instance, if it was routinely followed by nonconsensual abuse or violence.

Predictable pain, on the other hand, - like the counting of the cane strikes - really hurts, not only because of its intensity, but because its intensity is amplified by anticipation. My fear of the pain gets added to the mix, and I have to actively fight against my impulses to move away.

That's when I have time to engage with the pain, feel its contours, its energetic nature, when I have narrative moments as "slave" - talking myself through the experience - reframing it in my mind as something I wanted, watching my mind and body work - so to speak - before the chemical cocktail gets shaken up and I'm riding the endorphin high.

But it still hurts. Any pleasure I feel then is due to satisfaction in my ability to take what I'm being given or a kind of detached fascination with what my body and mind is experiencing.

I enjoyed this very much.

I have spent the past few years digging into my relationship with pain - something I never gave much thought to in the past. As a general rule, I hate to over-analyze things but in this area I make an exception.

The part I bolded, I did because it resonates so strongly with me. I remember a gag I did once, nothing spectacular but it involved me hitting the pavement, hard, on an unpadded hip for well over 15 takes. After about the tenth take, my flesh on that spot had turned to mush. If I pressed my finger to it, the finger would sink in almost to the first knuckle. When I heard the camera marks being called, in prep for the next take, my heart would strike my chest like machine-gun fire.

It was coming, the pain, and I was going to make it happen. Me. Again.

Then: "Background action..."

It took everything to keep myself in position, to convince myself not to run away.

Then: "Action!"

I ran, my focus narrowed to a pinpoint before I hit my mark and dropped to the ground with a thud that jarred every bone in my body.

It was terrible and it was sublime. Every second of it. People always ask, "What's the most dangerous stunt you've ever done?" And I always give the kind of answer they expect. They never ask which stunt was the most memorable, and I'm glad because that night would be hard to explain to anyone who doesn't "get" pain.

 

[eastern sun]

I enjoyed this very much.

I have spent the past few years digging into my relationship with pain - something I never gave much thought to in the past. As a general rule, I hate to over-analyze things but in this area I make an exception.

The part I bolded, I did because it resonates so strongly with me. I remember a gag I did once, nothing spectacular but it involved me hitting the pavement, hard, on an unpadded hip for well over 15 takes. After about the tenth take, my flesh on that spot had turned to mush. If I pressed my finger to it, the finger would sink in almost to the first knuckle. When I heard the camera marks being called, in prep for the next take, my heart would strike my chest like machine-gun fire.

It was coming, the pain, and I was going to make it happen. Me. Again.

Then: "Background action..."

It took everything to keep myself in position, to convince myself not to run away.

Then: "Action!"

I ran, my focus narrowed to a pinpoint before I hit my mark and dropped to the ground with a thud that jarred every bone in my body.

It was terrible and it was sublime. Every second of it. People always ask, "What's the most dangerous stunt you've ever done?" And I always give the kind of answer they expect. They never ask which stunt was the most memorable, and I'm glad because that night would be hard to explain to anyone who doesn't "get" pain.

I think that's why I put the pain delivery in someone else's hands. On my own, I just can't imagine going back for the fifteenth take.

How did you do it? Did you love the pain? The infliction of injury? Is it that machismo thing we get into? Did you feel like you had to measure up to the guys? Or the other girls? Is it just not wanting to say you've had enough? Had you written into your contract any limits (i.e. x number of takes)? Did you have a safeword?

Do you think stuntworkers experience the same adrenalin/endorphin rush that we identify here as "sub-space"? Do they escalate their risk-taking, as they begin to tolerate greater levels of adrenalin and pain? Or is it wholly different?

Listen to me. I'm actually quite fascinated, and would love to hear your thoughts on all this.

 

[Keroin]

I think that's why I put the pain delivery in someone else's hands. On my own, I just can't imagine going back for the fifteenth take.

How did you do it? Did you love the pain? The infliction of injury? Is it that machismo thing we get into? Did you feel like you had to measure up to the guys? Or the other girls? Is it just not wanting to say you've had enough? Had you written into your contract any limits (i.e. x number of takes)? Did you have a safeword?

Do you think stuntworkers experience the same adrenalin/endorphin rush that we identify here as "sub-space"? Do they escalate their risk-taking, as they begin to tolerate greater levels of adrenalin and pain? Or is it wholly different?

Listen to me. I'm actually quite fascinated, and would love to hear your thoughts on all this.

Um...yes.

The answer to your question is kind of boring. Sorry. I could try to be poetic but the fact is that there was very little conscious thought about pain at that time. It was just part of the job and you did it and...yeah, that's it. To say, "No, I can't do another take", well, you had better be missing a limb or have blood geysering out of a gaping wound, or you would simply never be hired again.

And that happened. Some newbies just couldn't hack the pain and wussed out and dropped off the map. Evolutionary winnowing.

Side note: One of our inside jokes was that we used to tell people, "We have a 100% injury rate in our business."

The adrenalin/endorphin rush I got doing big/dangerous gags far surpasses any of my BDSM experiences. Not just because of the intensity of the action, but also because the stakes were so high. That is to say, you have a shitload of people watching you, a good performance can make your career a bad one could kill it...or you. Not to mention how expensive some of the gags are to set up.

I don't think all stunt people are masochists but they take a different view of pain than the average Joe. And yes, your pain tolerance/risk taking threshold goes up as time goes on.

Looking back, I can see how much I loved/hated those painful moments but at the time it was just what I did. Perhaps the key difference is now I get to bask in the afterglow, I don't have to be all John Wayne after a good pounding.

Not the most exciting answer. Sorry.