The everything about rape topic.

[JMohegan]

that's just in JMohegan...while of course i and pretty much anyone else outside of a prison has the legal right to say "no," legal right does not necessarily equate to ACTUAL right. i do not have the right to say no/refuse my Master, because that is a right i gave up when i became a slave. and trust me, there are times when i have wished that i had such a right! but i have as much right to say no to him as i have right to take a machete and start slicing him to bits in his sleep. and unlike some, if i ever were to lose what's left of my mind and refuse him anything, it would not terminate the relationship because i do not have the power to terminate the relationship. my "consent" cannot be taken back, period.

however, the issue of consent goes far beyond the right to say "no" or not. i know that you believe that anyone has the right to revoke consent at any time, however i disagree with this and especially so within the context of certain relationships such as Master and slave and Husband and wife. and because imo a wife or a slave cannot revoke consent, something like rape is not possible because consent to specific sexual activities is irrelevant on the part of the partner at the bottom of the power dynamic.

and yes, i am fully aware that my beliefs on topics such as this are very archaic, very non-PC, and seemingly not very compassionate, but eh what can ya do.

I am not, nor have I ever been, interested in a relationship with a woman who doesn't want to be there. Freely, voluntarily, actively committed in the present, not just bound by a commitment made in the past.

You and I see things differently on this issue. No problem.

 

[JMohegan]

I'm sorry JM. I'll fix that post of mine. I confused you with someone else.

No apology necessary. That type of thing happens all the time.

I would hope that the woman in KC's example does not feel less than submissive because she left a man who, when confronted with his wife's screams and her or their children's screams, continued right along without regard for any of them.

Deciding that the guy in question is no longer worthy of her personal commitment is not a negative reflection on the woman herself.

That statement would hold true, whether or not there were children involved.

 

[intothewoods]

No apology necessary. That type of thing happens all the time.

Deciding that the guy in question is no longer worthy of her personal commitment is not a negative reflection on the woman herself.

That statement would hold true, whether or not there were children involved.

I don't believe it to be a negative reflection either, but many slaves say they are there for life, regardless of what Master does. That's fine, but I'm just providing a different perspective. And I added the part about the kids to make clear what an asshole the guy was.

 

[JMohegan]

I don't believe it to be a negative reflection either, but many slaves say they are there for life, regardless of what Master does. That's fine, but I'm just providing a different perspective. And I added the part about the kids to make clear what an asshole the guy was.

I know, I was just adding on to what you wrote.

 

[intothewoods]

I know, I was just adding on to what you wrote.

Oh. Oops. Whatever, where are Netz's tits!?

 

[JMohegan]

Oh. Oops. Whatever, where are Netz's tits!?

I was just wondering the same thing!

 

[Kajira Callista]

Sadly the husband was never denied sex by his wife, she was not raised to deny her husband ever, and that just did not float his boat. It was actually a turn off that he didnt have to fight or force to get some or at least that is my opinion of the situation.
Roleplay rape etc. didnt do it either.
In my opinion, her willingness to please is what got her in that situation and not being all there physically and not remembering then finally thinking how bad that could have ended up scared her more then she cared to admit at the time. I think her children at the door and frightened and her inability to get up and go to them and calm them is when it became rape to her.

 

[CutieMouse]

her children at the door and frightened and her inability to get up and go to them and calm them is when it became rape to her.

That was the point at which the "consensual non consent" hooked left and went screaming down the roller coaster hill to rape when I read the account, as well.

 

[Netzach]

I'm still at a loss. Because I am a Dominant female, I can toy with his dick and have buttsex on demand, but if I were merely his vanilla spouse, I should have to expect the behavior KC was talking about as long as no children were traumatized?

I'm sorry, is this 1865? I can be beaten too by putting that ring on my finger?

I don't care what anyone wants to do in regard to her M/s or D/s thing, but this notion that marriage alone removes the sense of rapability, unilaterally of course, not bilaterally, is very fucking creepy. But I'm assuming that if someone desires and expects an egalitarian relationship she shouldn't have to contort herself into insanity.

It's perfectly fine not to want one, but imbuing marriage with your personal kink and orientation because you like it is about as ridiculous as me doing that.

 

[Netzach]

Oh. Oops. Whatever, where are Netz's tits!?

Ahem - I am not worming out of things, but on the good Sen. Elect's first day.

 

[nh23]

I don't think a wife should tell her husband no to sex. I don't think a slave should tell her Master no to sex. I don't expect everyone to be like that, it's just how I am.

I'm still at a loss. Because I am a Dominant female, I can toy with his dick and have buttsex on demand, but if I were merely his vanilla spouse, I should have to expect the behavior KC was talking about as long as no children were traumatized?

I'm sorry, is this 1865? I can be beaten too by putting that ring on my finger?

I don't care what anyone wants to do in regard to her M/s or D/s thing, but this notion that marriage alone removes the sense of rapability, unilaterally of course, not bilaterally, is very fucking creepy. But I'm assuming that if someone desires and expects an egalitarian relationship she shouldn't have to contort herself into insanity.

It's perfectly fine not to want one, but imbuing marriage with your personal kink and orientation because you like it is about as ridiculous as me doing that.

That's how I am in a relationship, by my choice. It's the way I think things should be for me. If Mrs. Vanilla down the road wants to live her life differently I have no objection to that. It's not my life.

I wasn't under the impression that the woman KC was talking about was in a vanilla marriage. I thought it was a marriage with PYL/pyl undertones.

 

[BiBunny]

Personally, I don't think a wife should refuse her husband. Conversely, neither do I think a husband should refuse his wife, either. This doesn't include when one of them is as sick as a dog or things of that nature. The other ought to be considerate enough not to ask under those circumstances. But I think that occasionally doing things you might not be crazy about doing because the other person wants them is good for any kind of relationship.

And I think it goes without saying that a slave probably shouldn't refuse his/her Master/Mistress.

 

[Netzach]

That's how I am in a relationship, by my choice. It's the way I think things should be for me. If Mrs. Vanilla down the road wants to live her life differently I have no objection to that. It's not my life.

I don't care if the couple down the street have decided they can only have sex while playing La Traviata loudly and wearing bunny costumes, my point is that there is a legal/ethical dimension to the question of marital rape and the pronouncement that because it doesn't exist for you it doesn't exist or shouldn't exist.

I know there are women who have been maritally raped on this very board and I find the pronouncement that they are in fact bound by wifely duty to be pretty reprehensible.

I say that it's perfectly within rights for people to do with their sexual right of forfeit whatever they want, and not exercise it as much as they want, but the leap to "I don't think a wife can be raped" carries a legal dimension to it that I find exceptionally problematic.

I, personally, do not feel that rape can exist in the relationship I have with T, my top. That has absolutely nothing to do with any person on earth except me, or to some degree, him. But mostly me, honestly. That's the point I'm concerned with. The only time I've ever felt disinterest was chemically induced, and he respected that disinterest and really didn't find anything erotic in overcoming it or changing it. He had no interest in doing me when I was wretched and un-do-able. If he did other people at that point, for that year, I honestly don't give a shit.

Mileage will vary I suppose. Right now, my experience is being married to someone whose sex drive is atypical for a male, and having had my own sex drive flattened medically for about a year solid. So marriage isn't a happy fuckfest to me in largest part nor even my relationship to my lover I bottom to.

Bottom line: I don't see "not now honey" as this colossal betrayal of all that's right and good about marriage. Or even D/s.

I suppose I've just found a lot more compassion for people turning sex away than I ever had prior to being so freaking sick. There's no reason for people who don't feel irritated stretches of bowel being hammered by penis when they get fucked to empathize, necessarily, but honestly I can't understand why this is such a litmus test when we're talking about relationships.

My husband's more a wife trying to pick a gender or non-gender. If the process leaves him fairly a sexual at times, I think it's absolutely idiotic for me to try and fight endocrines psychology and everything I actually *like* about this person in the first place in the name of Dominance.

 

[nh23]

Maybe I worded it in a bad way. Is it better if I say for me in my relationships marital rape doesn't exist. That's just me, and does not apply to anyone else. I don't believe in telling my husband or Master no. Therefore I cannot be raped by either. That is also just me and only applies to me.

I'm not trying to hurt anyone. So if I can word in a better manner I certainly will.

 

[Netzach]

Maybe I worded it in a bad way. Is it better if I say for me in my relationships marital rape doesn't exist. That's just me, and does not apply to anyone else. I don't believe in telling my husband or Master no. Therefore I cannot be raped by either. That is also just me and only applies to me.

I'm not trying to hurt anyone. So if I can word in a better manner I certainly will.

Eh, I'm not trying to censor people or beat anyone about the head, it's just an objection to a notion I'm not even certain you raised.

I think we're on the same page.

Frankly if anything I want more dicking, certainly not less. Maybe that's why I'm cranky.

 

[nh23]

Eh, I'm not trying to censor people or beat anyone about the head, it's just an objection to a notion I'm not even certain you raised.

I think we're on the same page.

Frankly if anything I want more dicking, certainly not less. Maybe that's why I'm cranky.

*nods* Here's to more dicking!

 

[Bandit58]

I was guilted into having sex with my ex husband, because if I said no I'd get the silent treatment for days. So if I said yes to keep the peace, it felt like a rape. I did not want it, I did not enjoy it, and I hated it

I have said no to Sir on occasion. There are times I am stressed out, have a headache, or am just too tired. I do feel bad about it, but He understands and we wait and have sex another time. Often He will tease me about being frigid (my ex used to call me that ). I am learning to laugh about it now.

Last night He slapped me on the butt and demanded a bj. I happily obliged, although I was rather sleepy. If the ex had done that, I would have considered it as rape.

Different partners, different feelings for the same scenario.....

 

[ataxia.girl]

i don't think it would be possible for either Daddy or Hubby to rape me in the legal sense of the word. my consent is always implied though i engage in rape play with both of them and am a huge fan of sleep\drunk sex\rape. With Hubby it is something we talked about over time and then it just evolved. With Daddy it is just part of the package because although i'm a big pain in the ass brat and we're long distance i still crave TPE-like experiences so consent to whatever Daddy can coerce, cajole, or force me to do is implied.

If either of them lost control to the point that my children were traumatized or i sensed that satisfying their own desire became more important to them than my general well being or the well being of our family it would be a breach of trust not easily mended. i don't know that i would call it "rape" if we had engaged in similar scenarios previously but i agree with others that it is abuse.

i absolutely think there can be rape in a marriage, even in a PYL\pyl based marriage it just depends on the couple and their individual relationship. i have my own opinions on what marriage means but they really only apply to my marriage.

 

[rosco rathbone]

I was guilted into having sex with my ex husband, because if I said no I'd get the silent treatment for days. So if I said yes to keep the peace, it felt like a rape. I did not want it, I did not enjoy it, and I hated it

I have said no to Sir on occasion. There are times I am stressed out, have a headache, or am just too tired. I do feel bad about it, but He understands and we wait and have sex another time. Often He will tease me about being frigid (my ex used to call me that ). I am learning to laugh about it now.

Last night He slapped me on the butt and demanded a bj. I happily obliged, although I was rather sleepy. If the ex had done that, I would have considered it as rape.

Different partners, different feelings for the same scenario.....

"The silent treatment" is passive aggressive.

The ass slap is aggressive aggressive.

 

[whiteswan]

i think thats sorta what happened to me...i was entirely freaked out at the time...but realized later that i was ENTIRELY turned on. and it felt more like a Dominant man taking what he wanted...which i liked....and me needing to learn to accept my place. i thin one of the hardest things ive ever done was going up to him in school and asking if he wanted to hook up again.

oh yes i understand completely.....and the more something disgusts or doesnt appeal to me ..the more turned on i become doing it ......

 

[CuteBrat]

oh yes i understand completely.....and the more something disgusts or doesnt appeal to me ..the more turned on i become doing it ......

TOTALLY!!!!!!

 

[bridgeburner]

Lordy, lordy, where to begin?

Uh, happy Independence Day fellow Yanks.

And what's this about Netzach's tits? Is this in celebration of the election results (finally!)?

Alright, this is a little backward in terms of ocurrance in the thread, but I'd rather address KC's friend first.

It was rape. What's more, he knew it.

When someone hurts you --- whether physically or emotionally --- and you tell them and then they try to tell you that you are in the wrong for feeling the way you do, that's someone trying to shirk responsibility and avoid blame.

The proper response when you have hurt someone unintentionally is to apologize and figure out how to avoid doing such in future. It is NOT to push the blame back on them and explain how it's their fault for feeling harmed because you didn't do anything wrong.

Man up. You hurt someone. Either aplogize or flat out state that you don't care that you hurt that person.

In this case the husband knows what he did was wrong. You don't keep fucking your wife even with her consent when your children are crying and pounding on the door. You might screw up and keep fucking your wife because you don't realize that she really, really doesn't want you to, but when you find out later that she was serious you apologize. You don't leave her crying and broken and then go sleep on the couch to avoid listening to her whiny-ass complaints and then tell her later to shut up crazy fucking bitch and get me a pot-pie.

 

[bridgeburner]

Okay, so I'm off to a barbeque now and don't have time to address all the posts I want to. I'll be back later.

 

[JMohegan]

Lordy, lordy, where to begin?

Uh, happy Independence Day fellow Yanks.

And what's this about Netzach's tits? Is this in celebration of the election results (finally!)?

Alright, this is a little backward in terms of ocurrance in the thread, but I'd rather address KC's friend first.

It was rape. What's more, he knew it.

When someone hurts you --- whether physically or emotionally --- and you tell them and then they try to tell you that you are in the wrong for feeling the way you do, that's someone trying to shirk responsibility and avoid blame.

The proper response when you have hurt someone unintentionally is to apologize and figure out how to avoid doing such in future. It is NOT to push the blame back on them and explain how it's their fault for feeling harmed because you didn't do anything wrong.

Man up. You hurt someone. Either aplogize or flat out state that you don't care that you hurt that person.

In this case the husband knows what he did was wrong. You don't keep fucking your wife even with her consent when your children are crying and pounding on the door. You might screw up and keep fucking your wife because you don't realize that she really, really doesn't want you to, but when you find out later that she was serious you apologize. You don't leave her crying and broken and then go sleep on the couch to avoid listening to her whiny-ass complaints and then tell her later to shut up crazy fucking bitch and get me a pot-pie.

Nice summation.

Re the tits - click me.

 

[bridgeburner]

Re the tits - click me.

Do we have an ETA???