So when is this "Honest" discussion regarding race relations goint to occur?

[Kitty]

Wow for a newb, you actually can follow a GB conversation. Most people would be lost. That is just about the size of his argument.

~impressed~

So, if you were scoring a 7th grade debate competition, how would you score the Canadian's rhetoric on American Politics and Race Relations in America Writ Large?

He doesn't speak fast enough and keeps stuttering and has a really annoying lisp, but we like his energy, if only he would stop spitting on the judges.

 

[Misshotndeep]

Here you go. And the title of the thread is "So when is this "Honest" discussion regarding race relations going to occur?" It was the very first post on the very first page. You're welcome.

Thank you. I was not sure if the hubbub was related to the actual thread or just random bickering. You never can tell on here.

I do agree there has not be a "real" discussion on race relations as of yet. It seems everyone is afraid of stepping on toes or offending some one. I personally think the African American population is much higher as Than reported. To be honest I have never seen or heard of a census worked going into predominantly Black neighborhoods. How would they know?

As to the fact there is a problem in the African American community with violence, I think we need to look back at the communities roots and see how the problem began. So many are trying to deny there is an epidemic of crime. You can not fix a problem that is not admitted. I believe better education and moral direction is needed from strong figures. The community has lacked true leadership and role models for a long time. If no one wants to take up those roles than the issues will only grow.

Also, I see lots of self Segregation. If the Black community as a hole wants to be accepted as a part of the American population they need to learn to adapt. Now this does not mean giving up one ethnic identity. No ethic race that has adapted has been forced to do this. Not the Irish, Jewish or any others. ( The exception being the Native Americans) Every race I know has a festival and passes on traditions. I can not for the life of me understand why The black community is not moving in this direction. Now I understand there was a time when As a whole in order to have TV shows, music and businesses the community had to create its own due to segregation laws, But those days are over. It's time to move on.

 

[Kitty]

This fucking guy.

lmao.

 

[monoblanco]

Major felonies where the race of the perpetrator is known. The source is the FBI UCR.

First you were talking about 'violent crime'.

Now, you're talking about 'major felonies'...

Which is it?

This is the FBI website I assume you're referring to:
http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2013/crime-in-the-u.s.-2013/cius-home

There's nothing on that website that supports your claim.

The breakdown of 'violent crime' by race doesn't agree with your 'facts'.

The breakdown of arrests for 'violent crime' doesn't agree with your 'facts'.

Would you care to site a SPECIFIC source? Perhaps one that DOES agree with your so called 'facts'?

These, according to the FBI website, are the facts:

Statistics for violent crime for which someone is indicted, do not include a breakdown by race.

Statistics for arrests are broken down by race and your numbers are way off.

Again, would you care to site a specific source?

Or should I just continue ignoring everything posted on the GB?

I think I just answered my own question...

 

[smoothg103rd]

Thank you. I was not sure if the hubbub was related to the actual thread or just random bickering. You never can tell on here.

I do agree there has not be a "real" discussion on race relations as of yet. It seems everyone is afraid of stepping on toes or offending some one. I personally think the African American population is much higher as Than reported. To be honest I have never seen or heard of a census worked going into predominantly Black neighborhoods. How would they know?

As to the fact there is a problem in the African American community with violence, I think we need to look back at the communities roots and see how the problem began. So many are trying to deny there is an epidemic of crime. You can not fix a problem that is not admitted. I believe better education and moral direction is needed from strong figures. The community has lacked true leadership and role models for a long time. If no one wants to take up those roles than the issues will only grow.

Also, I see lots of self Segregation. If the Black community as a hole wants to be accepted as a part of the American population they need to learn to adapt. Now this does not mean giving up one ethnic identity. No ethic race that has adapted has been forced to do this. Not the Irish, Jewish or any others. ( The exception being the Native Americans) Every race I know has a festival and passes on traditions. I can not for the life of me understand why The black community is not moving in this direction. Now I understand there was a time when As a whole in order to have TV shows, music and businesses the community had to create its own due to segregation laws, But those days are over. It's time to move on.

What you mean by self segregation?

 

[RobDownSouth]

Would you care to site a SPECIFIC source? Perhaps one that DOES agree with your so called 'facts'?

*snicker*

Welcome to Lit. I wish you the very best of luck getting verifiable sources from any of the Heroes Of Vietnam clique here (Ishmael, 4est_4est_Gump, Miles, Vetteman and JamesBJohnson).

 

[Kitty]

*snicker*

Welcome to Lit. I wish you the very best of luck getting verifiable sources from any of the Heroes Of Vietnam clique here (Ishmael, 4est_4est_Gump, Miles, Vetteman and JamesBJohnson).

He still hasn't answered which communities (if they exist) don't do crime while they're impoverished.

Since he's WRONG, it COMPLETELY demerits everything that followed.

 

[Kitty]

Thank you. I was not sure if the hubbub was related to the actual thread or just random bickering. You never can tell on here.

I do agree there has not be a "real" discussion on race relations as of yet. It seems everyone is afraid of stepping on toes or offending some one. I personally think the African American population is much higher as Than reported. To be honest I have never seen or heard of a census worked going into predominantly Black neighborhoods. How would they know?

As to the fact there is a problem in the African American community with violence, I think we need to look back at the communities roots and see how the problem began. So many are trying to deny there is an epidemic of crime. You can not fix a problem that is not admitted. I believe better education and moral direction is needed from strong figures. The community has lacked true leadership and role models for a long time. If no one wants to take up those roles than the issues will only grow.

Also, I see lots of self Segregation. If the Black community as a hole wants to be accepted as a part of the American population they need to learn to adapt. Now this does not mean giving up one ethnic identity. No ethic race that has adapted has been forced to do this. Not the Irish, Jewish or any others. ( The exception being the Native Americans) Every race I know has a festival and passes on traditions. I can not for the life of me understand why The black community is not moving in this direction. Now I understand there was a time when As a whole in order to have TV shows, music and businesses the community had to create its own due to segregation laws, But those days are over. It's time to move on.

Ok, so...what does it mean...?

And I think you need to look back at what you post before you post it Your horrible grammar is inadvertently contributing to the perpetuation of misogynistic bias amongst political discussion.

 

[monoblanco]

*snicker*

Welcome to Lit. I wish you the very best of luck getting verifiable sources from any of the Heroes Of Vietnam clique here (Ishmael, 4est_4est_Gump, Miles, Vetteman and JamesBJohnson).

Yeah...

That's why I usually ignore this pissing contests on the GB.

But every once in a while...

 

[Misshotndeep]

What you mean by self segregation?

Clubs where people look at you funny if our anything but black. African American parts of town where they give you dirty looks if your not black.. that sort of thing. Comments about interracial relationships, where the black person is accused of not thinking a black partner is good enough. Teasing and chastising in the community if one peaks proper English or one is not "black" enough.

Personally I think race is a man made category and that were all human. Ethnicity is nothing more than window dressing.

By the way I am an African American Woman.

 

[Misshotndeep]

*snicker*

Welcome to Lit. I wish you the very best of luck getting verifiable sources from any of the Heroes Of Vietnam clique here (Ishmael, 4est_4est_Gump, Miles, Vetteman and JamesBJohnson).

I have noticed that. It's just fun to know they are all red faced over things that are truths and not facts. Call me fun that way.

 

[Kitty]

Yeah...

That's why I usually ignore this pissing contests on the GB.

But every once in a while...

I wish I got the memo.

But now...
I'm in too deep.
Like Genesis.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=okgJc3qYkhg

All that time I was searching, nowhere to run to, it started me thinking,
Wondering what I could make of my life, and who'd be waiting,
Asking all kinds of questions, to myself, but never finding the answers,
Crying at the top of my voice, and no one listening,
All this time, I still remember everything you said
There's so much you promised, how could I ever forget.

Listen, you know I love you, but I just can't take this,
You know I love you, but I'm playing for keeps,
Although I need you, I'm not gonna make this,
You know I want to, but I'm in too deep.

So listen, listen to me,
Ooh you must believe me,
I can feel your eyes go thru me,
But I don't know why.

Ooh I know you're going, but I can't believe
It's the way that you're leaving,
It's like we never knew each other at all, it may be my fault,
I gave you too many reasons, being alone, when I didn't want to
I thought you'd always be there, I almost believed you,
All this time, I still remember everything you said, oh
There's so much you promised, how could I ever forget.

Listen, you know I love you, but I just can't take this,
You know I love you, but I'm playing for keeps,
Although I need you, I'm not gonna make this,
You know I want to, but I'm in too deep.

So listen, listen to me,
I can feel your eyes go thru me

It seems I've spent too long
Only thinking about myself - oh
Now I want to spend my life
Just caring bout somebody else.

Listen, you know I love you, but I just can't take this,
You know I love you, but I'm playing for keeps,
Although I need you, I'm not gonna make this,
You know I want to, but I'm in too deep.

You know I love you, but I just can't take this,
You know I love you, but I'm playing for keeps,
Although I need you, I'm not gonna make this,
You know I want to, but I'm in too deep...

 

[Sean Renaud]

Clubs where people look at you funny if our anything but black. African American parts of town where they give you dirty looks if your not black.. that sort of thing. Comments about interracial relationships, where the black person is accused of not thinking a black partner is good enough. Teasing and chastising in the community if one peaks proper English or one is not "black" enough.

Personally I think race is a man made category and that were all human. Ethnicity is nothing more than window dressing.

By the way I am an African American Woman.

Your first example isn't self segregation. That's just people living where they can afford to live. I've never even heard of a black community that's intentionally black in the same way that Little Tokyo or Haiti or any other ethnic group set up very intentionally like that.

The interracial thing is just gonna take another generation to die out and there's not much point in worrying about it. However there is some merit to the root of the argument which is that often times we move "out" of the black community because we think we're better than that.

Race is a man made construct but so are many things, it doesn't make it any less real.

 

[smoothg103rd]

Clubs where people look at you funny if our anything but black. African American parts of town where they give you dirty looks if your not black.. that sort of thing. Comments about interracial relationships, where the black person is accused of not thinking a black partner is good enough. Teasing and chastising in the community if one peaks proper English or one is not "black" enough.

Personally I think race is a man made category and that were all human. Ethnicity is nothing more than window dressing.

By the way I am an African American Woman.

Its like that every where. If I were to go to a all white community, people will look at me funny. I probably would get followed around by a cop. The same thing with any race. People react strangely to things they are not familiar with. I'm pretty sure white people say to other white people " You think you black? " just as we ask our kind do they think they are white. It's not just blacks who does that.

By the way I'm a black man.

 

[smoothg103rd]

Your first example isn't self segregation. That's just people living where they can afford to live. I've never even heard of a black community that's intentionally black in the same way that Little Tokyo or Haiti or any other ethnic group set up very intentionally like that.

The interracial thing is just gonna take another generation to die out and there's not much point in worrying about it. However there is some merit to the root of the argument which is that often times we move "out" of the black community because we think we're better than that.

Race is a man made construct but so are many things, it doesn't make it any less real.

We don't need the opinion of a "FuckBoy"

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

White flight was not a reaction to the presence of black people in the community.

It was a reaction to Liberal Democrat politicians and their proclivity to redistribution and program instead of focusing on staying out of the way of equal opportunity by the way of creating needless and false "opportunities."

So if you do not like what has happened in the cities, then blame the true culprit, the white self-righteous moral busybody that is the 60s era liberal who decided to put down his pipe bomb in order to infiltrate the colleges and and take over the leadership of the Democrat Party.

kbate, guess what I just stumbled upon?

The classic image of an American metropolis was that of a polyglot city surrounded by mostly white suburbs—the “chocolate city/vanilla suburbs” of the 1950s and 1960s, when white-dominated suburbanization left largely black minority populations stranded in many of the nation’s largest cities. That paradigm has almost entirely broken down. The rise of new minority populations, the sharp slowdown of white population growth, and the economic gains and increased residential freedom of new generations of blacks are rapidly changing the classic image of the suburban American dream. Together these trends paint a picture markedly different from the one etched in the minds of pollsters, political consultants, and the public at large.

As recently as 1980, less than one-half of metropolitan minorities resided in the suburbs. Only beginning in 1990 did more than half of metropolitan Asians become suburban residents, while Hispanics did not reach that tipping point until 2000. Moreover, it was not until 2010 that more than half of metropolitan blacks became suburban residents. An important milestone was passed when that year’s census became the first to show a majority of each of the nation’s largest racial minority groups residing in the suburbs. And those communities will only become more diverse in the years to come: Each of the major minority groups—Hispanics, Asians, and blacks—now contributes more than whites to suburban gains.

Another factor driving the diversification of the suburbs is the emergence of “black flight” from major cities with established black populations. Black population losses have been occurring in some cities since the 1970s, but the magnitude and pervasiveness of black losses in cities during the first decade of the 2000s were unprecedented. The central cities of the 100 largest metropolitan areas saw a total decline of 300,000 blacks, the first absolute population decrease among blacks for these cities as a group. The black presence, which has been the mainstay of many urban populations, is diminishing (in fact it is now Hispanics, not blacks, who constitute the largest minority group in cities).

http://www.newrepublic.com/article/120372/white-suburbs-are-more-and-more-thing-past

 

[monoblanco]

Fact:

100% of white men named Phil Collins born in Chiswick, Middlesex, England played drums for a band called Genesis.

See what I did there?

It's called a fact. You'll hafta look it up tho since sources are WAY too much trouble...

 

[Misshotndeep]

Your first example isn't self segregation. That's just people living where they can afford to live. I've never even heard of a black community that's intentionally black in the same way that Little Tokyo or Haiti or any other ethnic group set up very intentionally like that.

The interracial thing is just gonna take another generation to die out and there's not much point in worrying about it. However there is some merit to the root of the argument which is that often times we move "out" of the black community because we think we're better than that.

Race is a man made construct but so are many things, it doesn't make it any less real.

I agree that a lot of the living situation is more economic than racial. the dirty looks and bullying of those who have been properly educated is not. In my experience there is a stagnation in the community where they are so use to fighting they can't step outside of it and grow. You have to fit the status quo. Now I have also seen this in class relations. It's a difficult discussion since the two are so closely related.

 

[Kitty]

Your first example isn't self segregation. That's just people living where they can afford to live. I've never even heard of a black community that's intentionally black in the same way that Little Tokyo or Haiti or any other ethnic group set up very intentionally like that.

The interracial thing is just gonna take another generation to die out and there's not much point in worrying about it. However there is some merit to the root of the argument which is that often times we move "out" of the black community because we think we're better than that.

Race is a man made construct but so are many things, it doesn't make it any less real.

Little Tokyo, Little Haiti, those are immigrants. They probably heard of the place before flocking over, and all their neighbors and friends and fam still stuck over in the mainland, who can even afford the cost to even think about coming here, are made aware of the place and systematically agree it's a place they will settle. Like the colonialists did to the whole fucking country. As far as African Americans, who have been here since their descendants were enslaved, they went where they could and the "hood" is just a reflection of Western genocide and socioeconomic discrimination.

For her to even say "self segregation," I'm pissed I read that much to get there. And I am not even fully black and moved out the "hood" to a rural area with more land when my mom found a house and let's not discuss how we were fucking treated. We stay to ourselves because people treat us like shit when we move in, and let people rot where they've been for generations.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

Fact:

100% of white men named Phil Collins born in Chiswick, Middlesex, England played drums for a band called Genesis.

See what I did there?

It's called a fact. You'll hafta look it up tho since sources are WAY too much trouble...

You sure that no one else from Chiswick was never named Philip Collins?

 

[prdigy666]

Thank you. I was not sure if the hubbub was related to the actual thread or just random bickering. You never can tell on here.

I do agree there has not be a "real" discussion on race relations as of yet. It seems everyone is afraid of stepping on toes or offending some one. I personally think the African American population is much higher as Than reported. To be honest I have never seen or heard of a census worked going into predominantly Black neighborhoods. How would they know?

As to the fact there is a problem in the African American community with violence, I think we need to look back at the communities roots and see how the problem began. So many are trying to deny there is an epidemic of crime. You can not fix a problem that is not admitted. I believe better education and moral direction is needed from strong figures. The community has lacked true leadership and role models for a long time. If no one wants to take up those roles than the issues will only grow.

Also, I see lots of self Segregation. If the Black community as a hole wants to be accepted as a part of the American population they need to learn to adapt. Now this does not mean giving up one ethnic identity. No ethic race that has adapted has been forced to do this. Not the Irish, Jewish or any others. ( The exception being the Native Americans) Every race I know has a festival and passes on traditions. I can not for the life of me understand why The black community is not moving in this direction. Now I understand there was a time when As a whole in order to have TV shows, music and businesses the community had to create its own due to segregation laws, But those days are over. It's time to move on.

It does look like that on the surface but if you dig a little deeper into how other races, ethnicities, nationalities integrated into the local populous it took about 5 years... In the case of the African American it took nearly 300 years. Not only that, but during that time, many never knew their home country or customs as they were literally beaten out of them. Now you have an alien people with no real identity.

Some of the bigger problems were the promises that were made and broken after the American Revolution and Civil War. Once blacks were "freed" they were pretty much forced to keep doing what they did while they were slaves by working share cropping fields for their former masters. This happened because reintegration of the South back into the Union never really occurred and the responsibility or integrating blacks into the communities were delegated to the individual states as "punishment" for their rebellion. Of course, they took advantage of this situation and oppressed the shit out of the race. This really didn't change until the race movements in the 60's and 70's.

So, the problems are, slaves had been here since colonial times and didn't really get wide spread freedom until over 300 years later. That's a damned long time to be enslaved and oppressed. Top that with poverty, exploitation and the "sexification" of criminal behavior throughout the times, there's going to be a problem. I hate to sound like this because it sounds really really fucking liberal, but when you start to look at the inner workings and happenings of the history, you can kind of get a clearer picture. That, and it's a little harder to say, "niggers being niggers" (pardon my language but just trying to make the point of close minded assholes).

 

[Misshotndeep]

Its like that every where. If I were to go to a all white community, people will look at me funny. I probably would get followed around by a cop. The same thing with any race. People react strangely to things they are not familiar with. I'm pretty sure white people say to other white people " You think you black? " just as we ask our kind do they think they are white. It's not just blacks who does that.

By the way I'm a black man.

lol I have heard it... lol We called them inside out Oreos as a kid. lol But still. We are all Human. Ethnicity is window dressing. As long as we think of or promote differently, then there will be issues with it.

 

[Sean Renaud]

I agree that a lot of the living situation is more economic than racial. the dirty looks and bullying of those who have been properly educated is not. In my experience there is a stagnation in the community where they are so use to fighting they can't step outside of it and grow. You have to fit the status quo. Now I have also seen this in class relations. It's a difficult discussion since the two are so closely related.

Exactly my point. It would be one thing if blacks were self segregating into black communities instead of just being poor and all the poor people living together. The stagnation is a real problem as well.

 

[Misshotndeep]

I must say it much nicer to have this discussion than the fuck you... no fuck you fest... This is interesting! Thank you all for the honest and polite responses.

 

[monoblanco]

You sure that no one else from Chiswick was never named Philip Collins?

Fine...

I'm pretty sure that given how small that town is, Phil might've been the only baby born that day, but I'm willing to give you the benefit of the doubt...


How's this?

"100% of white men named Phil Collins born born 30 January 1951 in Chiswick, Middlesex, England played drums for a band called Genesis."