I lost another true friend....

[sufisaint]

I am sure I am going to get alot of disagreement on this thread (or it will be ignored like most of my threads because I am not flirting or in the kissing each other asses crowd) but I talked to one of my good friend last night, we have known each other for at least ten years, worked together for the first two. She was a wonderful gentle soul who was usually quiet in group but very intelligent and adventerous thinker even though she is not "well educated." She was the kind of person who rescued animals, always had kind words for others and always tried to understand. We have gone through divorces together, having children and all the work stuff. Well, let me get to the point, being a deep and true caring person she, occasionally got down because of the general cruelty and callousness of people especially in the work place, as I often do. I was just always moved by her deep compassion for her own and other feelings. Well, talking to her last night was talking to like another person She was like a mindless feelingless robot who was obsesed with suburban life. I ask her, in a nice way, what has changed. Her answer, her now husband, who was tired of her "moodiness" urged her to go see a HMO psychologist/psychiatrist and of course was put on paxel ( I think) right away. Here is my point, medicating the misery out of your life is not the answer, killing a gentle loving soul so you can become like everyone is such a waste of life. There are so few people who really get it, and we are not 2.5 kids, two SUV, big colonial house on culdasack, two income family people we are usaully the artists, the writers ect... we are the eccentrics. And now were under attack, the drug companies have found they can make a huge profit on the misery of this materialistic society causes. Commercials selling happiness in a pill have come out of fiction andbecome reality. I just feel like a good friend has just died inside, I know some do need medical treatment, but not so many at such a cost. The sadness teaches compassion and is a motivation to make real changes in our lives and in society. All i can think of is the Oasis song..."How many special people change? How many lives are living strange." I guess my point is hold on to your individaulity...your own feelings...medication should be a last resort...not the first...I do not care if a doctor writes you a script...you are no different than the alcoholic who hides in a bottle instead of deeping their own soul... Just my opinion.

 

[Rambling Rose]

I'm sorry you feel like you've lost your friend.

 

[MissTaken]

If the medication is changing who she is, it is the wrong medication or perhaps unnecessary.

Paxil or anything like it, shouldn't change the persons energy or personality.

It should only assist them to view life without the red hue of anxiety and cope with the day's difficulties in a more reasonable fashion

 

[lost]

I'm sorry you lost your friend. I am personally very anti-"medico" so I understand where you are coming from. I hope she gets real help.

 

[superlittlegirl]

I agree with MissTaken. You might consider urging her to work with her care-provider on dosage or experimenting with different drugs. Drugs, categorically, are not a bad thing, but when they alter a person's personality so severely, they are not achieving the intended purpose. Don't give up on her, please. Do consider doing some preliminary research (on her behalf) to help educate her (and yourself) about mental illness and the range of treatments. So many people entrust themselves to doctors who don't know them well enough to gauge the efficacy of the drugs they are prescribing. Advocating for a loved one who is struggling with depression is hard work, but it is one of the best things you can do. it's not her fault that she's dosed incorrectly, and it sounds like you're blaming her for her body's reaction to the drug. Take a step back and evaluate whether the situation can be remedied with a little experimentation, rather than writing her off as a lost-friend-zombie.

Mental illness (and the treatment of it with drugs) is stigmatized because people think that drugs change the essence of a person, and that medicating for it is copping out. Really, I believe that many cases of medicine-related zombification are due to incorrect dosing, and should be treated as a medical problem that can be adjusted, rather than as a final verdict.

Do some research. Don't give up on your friend. It'll benefit you both to preserve the friendship.

 

[Lancecastor]

Sometimes drugs will change a persona.

If she and her family unit like what they now see in her versus the way you have known her, I'm at a loss to say which version of her is the "right" one, you know?

And I don't think anyone here can properly say what the "fix" is.

But I hear your sense of anger and loss at the "change".

Sometimes new meds take a while to "settle in"....like a pendulum.

Sounds like she's important to you...so I guess you'll be toughing it out.

Cheers;

Lance

 

[Nora]

There's a wonderful book by a man named Peter Breggin titled "Toxic Psychology" that I read in the early '90's. It's a discussion about how forms of medical therapies are being used as a quick fix in place of psychological therapies and are not always in the best interest of the patient.

Here's the author's website Peter Breggin, MD

 

[Siren]

 

[A Desert Rose]

Oh God

I have to go take a bath but...... Here's a thought to ponder.....

Guess who the biggest contributor to the children with attention deficeit disorder national organizaton is? Ceba-Giegy, the manufacturors of, you guessed it-- Ritalin. Ritalin is the drug of choice for children "diagnosed" with ADD.

I am sad that this has happened to you and your friend. Drugs are too often the wrong answer to the real questions.

Now I REALLY am going to take a bath.... and I mean it!


(edited because I said it backwards, ~smiling~)

 

[sufisaint]

I agree with MissTaken. You might consider urging her to work with her care-provider on dosage or experimenting with different drugs. Drugs, categorically, are not a bad thing, but when they alter a person's personality so severely, they are not achieving the intended purpose. Don't give up on her, please. Do consider doing some preliminary research (on her behalf) to help educate her (and yourself) about mental illness and the range of treatments. So many people entrust themselves to doctors who don't know them well enough to gauge the efficacy of the drugs they are prescribing. Advocating for a loved one who is struggling with depression is hard work, but it is one of the best things you can do. it's not her fault that she's dosed incorrectly, and it sounds like you're blaming her for her body's reaction to the drug. Take a step back and evaluate whether the situation can be remedied with a little experimentation, rather than writing her off as a lost-friend-zombie.

Mental illness (and the treatment of it with drugs) is stigmatized because people think that drugs change the essence of a person, and that medicating for it is copping out. Really, I believe that many cases of medicine-related zombification are due to incorrect dosing, and should be treated as a medical problem that can be adjusted, rather than as a final verdict.

Do some research. Don't give up on your friend. It'll benefit you both to preserve the friendship. [/QUO


I do have a my undergraduate degree in psychology and have researched the subject pretty thoroughly, although I could always learn more and I do realize that my psychology background does give me a biased view in someway because I do not believe in the purely medical model of treatment. I do think drugs, just like surgery should be a last resort...not perscribe on a single visit. Noone knows the long term effects of these drugs let alone how the actually work. It could be inncorrect dosage but I also do not believe in just taking out the lows, regardless of the other effects these drugs have on your personality. I am not blaming her, when I really think about, I am more pissed that her husband has kinda forced her, mostly I believe, from what I get from our past discussions is that he is not in touch with his emotions and even worse its his insensivitive behavior that causing her distress. His solution is for her to take drugs.

But to go back to my original thought, I do think the very essence of the person you are, the more sublime part of you is in your lows just as much as your highs. Just cutting them out is not the answer. Changing your life, express yourself more, gong through the process of individuation should be the answer not medication.

 

[sufisaint]

There's a wonderful book by a man named Peter Breggin titled "Toxic Psychology" that I read in the early '90's. It's a discussion about how forms of medical therapies are being used as a quick fix in place of psychological therapies and are not always in the best interest of the patient.

Here's the author's website Peter Breggin, MD

I do believe this is true...

 

[Rambrat]

I don't know how to reply to this. Some people do need something to balance out a chemical imbalance.

But I'm with you... one can overcome anything if they put their mind to it.

We should let nothing chemically control us.

 

[sufisaint]

good and proper medication wont change a person's personality.........it is only there to even out anxiety or lows and keep that person on an even keel.

It doesnt change the essence of who you are.......or at least it shouldnt if it is the proper meds.

If she has changed radically..........then talk to her and see if she can go to her doctor and get a modification or change in medications.

I kinda of said this above by i do think your essence is in lows...maybe your off keel because your true being is crying out to be expressed...but it easier to just numb it down. I am sure her husband is happy, people at work are happier with her, her ability to put up with more crap. But i see at the price of her true emotions. I maybe wrong too..I realize this...this maybe the way she chooses to be. It just seems sad to me, I think our emotions are the most precious things we have.

 

[LordLucan74]

I am sure I am going to get alot of disagreement on this thread (or it will be ignored like most of my threads because I am not flirting or in the kissing each other asses crowd) but I talked to one of my good friend last night, we have known each other for at least ten years, worked together for the first two. She was a wonderful gentle soul who was usually quiet in group but very intelligent and adventerous thinker even though she is not "well educated." She was the kind of person who rescued animals, always had kind words for others and always tried to understand. We have gone through divorces together, having children and all the work stuff. Well, let me get to the point, being a deep and true caring person she, occasionally got down because of the general cruelty and callousness of people especially in the work place, as I often do. I was just always moved by her deep compassion for her own and other feelings. Well, talking to her last night was talking to like another person She was like a mindless feelingless robot who was obsesed with suburban life. I ask her, in a nice way, what has changed. Her answer, her now husband, who was tired of her "moodiness" urged her to go see a HMO psychologist/psychiatrist and of course was put on paxel ( I think) right away. Here is my point, medicating the misery out of your life is not the answer, killing a gentle loving soul so you can become like everyone is such a waste of life. There are so few people who really get it, and we are not 2.5 kids, two SUV, big colonial house on culdasack, two income family people we are usaully the artists, the writers ect... we are the eccentrics. And now were under attack, the drug companies have found they can make a huge profit on the misery of this materialistic society causes. Commercials selling happiness in a pill have come out of fiction andbecome reality. I just feel like a good friend has just died inside, I know some do need medical treatment, but not so many at such a cost. The sadness teaches compassion and is a motivation to make real changes in our lives and in society. All i can think of is the Oasis song..."How many special people change? How many lives are living strange." I guess my point is hold on to your individaulity...your own feelings...medication should be a last resort...not the first...I do not care if a doctor writes you a script...you are no different than the alcoholic who hides in a bottle instead of deeping their own soul... Just my opinion.

My goodness... this moved me in so many directions. All I can do is say I am very sorry you have lost a friend.. and OASIS rocks!!!

<<<HUG>>>

 

[70/30]

You are such an agromaniac!!!!















keep it up.

 

[Suzi]

Sufi....

I am sorry for your sense of loss...believe me...I absolutely understand the feeling! (It happened to me, in a different way)

All I want to say, in addition to this, is not all people are affected this way by prescriptions for mental disorders/illness. Paxil made me lactate! Right now, I'm on Celexa (depression), Wellbutrin (mood stabilizer), and Topamax (offset the Wellb. and to help with the depression). My biggest problems are anger and depression. Now that I am on the meds, I feel a little more grounded. I still have my intuitions (the ones I had acquired over the last six years). My personality is really not changed at all---I am still the same odd person I always was

 

[ksmybuttons]

I think there are truly people who need SSRI's (Paxil, Prozac, Serzone, Celexa, Zoloft.)

I do think they are over prescribed. Brain chemistry is a fairly new field. Knowledge changes quickly and proves inaccuracies in previous beliefs.

I prefer to intermittantly play with that chemistry and not consistantly manipulate it like an SSRI does. I like my highs and my lows and I definately like my quick, hard orgasms.

In the 60's, Valium was the prescibed drug of choice for the woman who was unhappy, unfulfilled and lost. Now both women and men are using the new panacea of SSRI's instead of doing their work.

So, sufi, I totally agree with you and am sorry that you have lost the essense of your friend.

 

[seXieleXie]

so you think she should just remain sad because that is who she is?

 

[sufisaint]

I think there are truly people who need SSRI's (Paxil, Prozac, Serzone, Celexa, Zoloft.)

I do think they are over prescribed. Brain chemistry is a fairly new field. Knowledge changes quickly and proves inaccuracies in previous beliefs.

I prefer to intermittantly play with that chemistry and not consistantly manipulate it like an SSRI does. I like my highs and my lows and I definately like my quick, hard orgasms.

In the 60's, Valium was the prescibed drug of choice for the woman who was unhappy, unfulfilled and lost. Now both women and men are using the new panacea of SSRI's instead of doing their work.

So, sufi, I totally agree with you and am sorry that you have lost the essense of your friend.

Bingo1...and especially the constant manipulation...some things should make us sad...

 

[sufisaint]

so you think she should just remain sad because that is who she is?

No, not all, she used to be a very joyful and happy peron as well...her eyes lit up a room and she had a wicked sense of humor. My point is she should try and changes the things that make her sad instead of her brain chemistry...Feeling the sadness is a step in changing it. And I still believe feeling sad is also a true mark of compassion.

 

[Cheyenne]

http://www.psychiatrictimes.com/p020906.html

"Antidepressants Versus Placebos: Meaningful Advantages Are Lacking"

 

[sufisaint]

http://www.psychiatrictimes.com/p020906.html

"Antidepressants Versus Placebos: Meaningful Advantages Are Lacking"

The power of hope is amazing isn't it!!!

 

[Siren]

 

[LordOfDarkness]

sufisaint - you have a good heart

That was a very moving story.

Thanks for sharing.

 

[complicity]

I agree with your point that medication should be the last resort, but where required some medication can have a valid contribution to make to a persons life / recovery without changing their personality.

After many years of grief my son was diagnosed with ADD and put on ritalin. It hasn't changed him, he's still a great kid, out going and full of energy,but now he's a little more in control.


That said, I truly feel for your sence of loss. and hope you can come to terms with whatever future you and your friend can have together.