Does a man, have say so when it comes to abortion?

[cjh]

Just highlighting that rational discourse has been outlawed by the emotion of "my womb."

Once that phrase is uttered, the only thing a man can do is back away slowly; any further attempt at discussion then becomes the hateful misogyny of the 17th century when women and their wombs were chattel.

It is the triumph of the witch-doctor over mind.

If you're agreeing with him, I'd say you're irrational and hateful toward the child.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

It's not both ways.

Child support is for the child, not the mother.

Keep your dick in your pants if you're not willing to pay its freight.

Funny, we can say that with near impunity but we cannot say "keep your legs crossed if you're not willing to pay the freight..."

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

If you're agreeing with him, I'd say you're irrational and hateful toward the child.

No, but thank you for making my basic point.

Anything a man says other than "I believe that you, lady, define the right and wrong of abortion," then he is automatically hateful and irrational.

 

[cjh]

Funny, we can say that with near impunity but we cannot say "keep your legs crossed if you're not willing to pay the freight..."

You think women have no legal duty to bear the cost of raising their children?

 

[cjh]

No, but thank you for making my basic point.

Anything a man says other than "I believe that you, lady, define the right and wrong of abortion," then he is automatically hateful and irrational.

The only point that has been made by your participation in this thread is that you think fathers should have immunity from paying child support because women have a right to choose whether to bear a child.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

Bullshit



Never said anything of the sort. I said, in several different ways, that once the woman pronounces her womb as a right-holder, all conversation ends.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

You think women have no legal duty to bear the cost of raising their children?

Quit reading what you want to argue against and what I am saying.

I am saying that a man has no say.


Period.


.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

That's right.


It's your womb. End of conversation.


No woman should be allowed to tell another woman either.


Any abortion any time for any reason.


Of course men must support your baby if you do not abort it. After all, it's HIS baby too...

Period.

 

[Squibbs]

Yes, the man should have a say in the matter.

Unless it's due to rape, then I don't think the raper would want to stick around.

 

[cjh]

Bullshit



Never said anything of the sort. I said, in several different ways, that once the woman pronounces her womb as a right-holder, all conversation ends.

In your mind, maybe.

But not for those who have to make and live with that decision.

Make the argument for me that a father's obligation to pay child support should depend upon his right to force a mother to or not to abort.

 

[Squibbs]

Anyone who wants to have a baby should be required to take a competency test first.

 

[Peregrinator]

Yes. I think at least a conversation is in order.

Yup. My spooge, my potential kid? Fucking right I have a say in this.

 

[cjh]

Anyone who wants to have a baby should be required to take a competency test first.

Heh.

And show an ID.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

In your mind, maybe.

But not for those who have to make and live with that decision.

Make the argument for me that a father's obligation to pay child support should depend upon his right to force a mother to or not to abort.

I have never known you to work as hard as merc or Throb to be so purposefully stupid.

I only highlighted the double-think in the compartmentalized thinking of the liberated woman when it comes to her womb.

A_J's corollary #3, “The New Age Liberal maintains contradictory positions comfortably compartmentalized. (This is because the New Age Liberal is a creature that believes in consensus as a short-cut to an examination of the facts and a reasoned judgment about said facts. Corollary #2.)”

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

Yup. My spooge, my potential kid? Fucking right I have a say in this.

Not once she says, "you cannot tell me what to do with my reproductive system."

Conversation over.

Meanwhile, suggest she does not have a right, by way of Reductio ad absurdum, to child support and you get lit loon lawyers crawling up your ass to give you a rectal exam...

 

[NFLGIRL87]

If a woman wants to have an abortion, she should be allowed to have one. Period. I don't think it would hurt to have mandatory counselling before and after to make sure that it is the right decision for her and that she will be able to deal with the consequences either way.
If a man thinks he has the right to decide weather or not a woman is going to have to go through everything that a pregnancy and childbirth entails....I think that's just too bad for him. It isn't his body. When he becomes capable of carrying a child, he can have the right to decide weather or not that is something he is willing and ready to do.

 

[JohnnySavage]

Quit reading what you want to argue against and what I am saying.

I am saying that a man has no say.


Period.


.

Yet you have twice as many posts in an abortion thread than the second place holder.

 

[Disgustipated]

A_J calling cj stupid. Now I know why I took the idiot of ignore this week. Fer teh laffs.

 

[JohnnySavage]

A_J calling cj stupid. Now I know why I took the idiot of ignore this week. Fer teh laffs.

Word on the street is that, that's not you in the av.

Busted.

 

[cjh]

I have never known you to work as hard as merc or Throb to be so purposefully stupid.

I only highlighted the double-think in the compartmentalized thinking of the liberated woman when it comes to her womb.

A_J's corollary #3, “The New Age Liberal maintains contradictory positions comfortably compartmentalized. (This is because the New Age Liberal is a creature that believes in consensus as a short-cut to an examination of the facts and a reasoned judgment about said facts. Corollary #2.)”

It's not doublethink. And it's not contradictory. That's the point.

Regardless of whether you disagree with Roe v. Wade, for the moment it is the law of the land.

Right now, not all fetuses are afforded the rights or protections of those born.

Women have superior rights until the fetus is legally recognized as a person. Superior to the fetus, superior to the father.

Once the child is born, both parents owe duties to the child. Neither can legally walk away from them.

 

[Squibbs]

Heh.

And show an ID.

Register early and often.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

Yet you have twice as many posts in an abortion thread than the second place holder.

I'm sick and bored and killing time until the whisky and nyquil kick in.

And, I've only made one point, that men have no right to even be in the discussion.

It is an emotion-based issue and there are no winners in a thread like this; only confirmation of all of her worst fears, tat men would force her to stay pregnant against her wishes.

Then I threw out, the ol' herring, but she can force him to pay for her decision without any discussion and her champions are spoiling to fight for the honor of defending her womb...

It's kinda funny in a drunken hulk sorta way...

 

[thelovingsadist]

If a woman wants to have an abortion, she should be allowed to have one. Period. I don't think it would hurt to have mandatory counselling before and after to make sure that it is the right decision for her and that she will be able to deal with the consequences either way.
If a man thinks he has the right to decide weather or not a woman is going to have to go through everything that a pregnancy and childbirth entails....I think that's just too bad for him. It isn't his body. When he becomes capable of carrying a child, he can have the right to decide weather or not that is something he is willing and ready to do.

And yet, neither of your examples are examples of equality. They are examples of superiority. Either the man decides it or the woman decides it? That's not equality. That's not equal rights.

Sure, there are the other issues like incest and rape and not knowing who the father is (really? you whore's! ). But in general, in a healthy relationship, where it just happens, the woman still has ALL the say? No. That isn't equality.

If your going to ask for equal rights, then don't expect superiority. That's bullshit and sexist. Yes, I said sexist.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

It's not doublethink. And it's not contradictory. That's the point.

Regardless of whether you disagree with Roe v. Wade, for the moment it is the law of the land.

Right now, not all fetuses are afforded the rights or protections of those born.

Women have superior rights until the fetus is legally recognized as a person. Superior to the fetus, superior to the father.

Once the child is born, both parents owe duties to the child. Neither can legally walk away from them.

You are making up arguments to what you think I am saying or that you want me to be saying for the sake of proving your loyalty to the case.

It is admirable in one way and nauseating in another...

You just hammer home her point.

STFU!!!

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

If a woman wants to have an abortion, she should be allowed to have one. Period. I don't think it would hurt to have mandatory counselling before and after to make sure that it is the right decision for her and that she will be able to deal with the consequences either way.
If a man thinks he has the right to decide weather or not a woman is going to have to go through everything that a pregnancy and childbirth entails....I think that's just too bad for him. It isn't his body. When he becomes capable of carrying a child, he can have the right to decide weather or not that is something he is willing and ready to do.

See?

Last and only word.

End of discussion; that's what I said way back in post #2.

Men have no part or "right" in this discussion, it is her body.

Dollars to donuts though, she wants to debate whether or not I can be drafted for the honor of dying for my country!

But I do not DARE have a discussion about abortion other than to agree 100%, which I did, and STILL, I am the bad guy.