Defining Love

[MT_Pitcher]

Tie a ribbon on the Moosehead too!

Well, we'll get drunk for her....

 

[midwestyankee]

Well, we'll get drunk for her....

Stepping up to the bar I say, "I second that, in motion."

 

[midwestyankee]

It's time to get serious again, folks. Well, more or less.

Lately I've been meditating on the state one is in during the early stages of a powerful new love (and you thought my mind was filled with the Red Sox, didn't you?).

It can be an overwhelmingly powerful and pleasing experience. When nearly every corner of your life is filled with new meaning because your beloved loves you, when most of your thoughts from morning until night include your beloved, when even your dreams are no longer the same because so many now feature your beloved, it is like living in a whole new dimension.

I imagine that some drugs might invoke a similar state. Colors are brighter, foods taste better, the sun seems to shine more often, and when rain clouds appear they seem to bring drops of your beloved's tears (for she is crying in joy that you love her). And we won't even begin to talk about the impact of this love on sex. It is not mere sex at this stage: it is a union of an angel and a god and a whole world will be the product of these loins.

You can see where I'm going, can't you? I can see clearly how one could become addicted to this early stage of love. My word, it is so powerful, so much fun, so pleasing, so exciting! Who wouldn't want it to continue forever? Alas, most of us can not sustain this level of excitement (and our bodies and minds conspire to make this happen). Some, though, seem to seek it out time and time again. Some become serial lovers (like serial murderers but with healthier victims in the end ), and others no doubt add more and more new lovers to their lives until they are in a string of parallel relationships.

Have you ever known anyone who was addicted to falling in love? What was it like? How did this person behave? Did he or she ever change or was this a life-long behavior pattern?

 

[dcraz]

It's time to get serious again, folks. Well, more or less.

Lately I've been meditating on the state one is in during the early stages of a powerful new love (and you thought my mind was filled with the Red Sox, didn't you?).

It can be an overwhelmingly powerful and pleasing experience. When nearly every corner of your life is filled with new meaning because your beloved loves you, when most of your thoughts from morning until night include your beloved, when even your dreams are no longer the same because so many now feature your beloved, it is like living in a whole new dimension.

I imagine that some drugs might invoke a similar state. Colors are brighter, foods taste better, the sun seems to shine more often, and when rain clouds appear they seem to bring drops of your beloved's tears (for she is crying in joy that you love her). And we won't even begin to talk about the impact of this love on sex. It is not mere sex at this stage: it is a union of an angel and a god and a whole world will be the product of these loins.

You can see where I'm going, can't you? I can see clearly how one could become addicted to this early stage of love. My word, it is so powerful, so much fun, so pleasing, so exciting! Who wouldn't want it to continue forever? Alas, most of us can not sustain this level of excitement (and our bodies and minds conspire to make this happen). Some, though, seem to seek it out time and time again. Some become serial lovers (like serial murderers but with healthier victims in the end ), and others no doubt add more and more new lovers to their lives until they are in a string of parallel relationships.

Have you ever known anyone who was addicted to falling in love? What was it like? How did this person behave? Did he or she ever change or was this a life-long behavior pattern?

MWY,

No problem getting serious here. The thread IS entitled Defining Love. But I do admit to being somewhat confused by your post.

I agree with the feeling that accompanies the traditional early euphoria of falling in love. And it can certainly have effects similar to certain drugs. Which, by definition, is what makes these drugs so appealing.

But you infer that this level of euphoria cannot be maintained. This may be true for most people. But to accept the simple premise that we cannot possibly maintain that state of deep devotion and commitment is to imply that we quickly reach a peak, beyond which we are destined for failure and ever eroding love. Again, this may be what happens for most. But it is NOT a foregone conclusion. For example, I have repeatedly posted on this thread that I have an insatiable drive for more. I want to learn more, do more, experience more, meet more people and certainly love more. However, it is NEVER at the expense of others. This is also not to say, that I am not deeply devoted to the one I love. I will always strive to love her more as well. Nor is it to say that I am not happy or content. Rather, and I am speaking solely for myself here, if I were to accept that any part of my life were as good as it gets and I should not strive for more is to suggest once again that we have peaked and the road that lies before us is one of decay and increasing disappointment. This is NOT how I choose to look at life.

Finally, the last part of your post seems to be directed at someone specific. If this was directed at me because of my previous postings, then again, I think you miss the point of what I have been saying. But that is fine. Everyone here is entitled to their opinions. If it was directed at someone else, then I might suggest that it would be better posted with them directly in a PM. As I understand the origin of this thread, it was intended to query those who enter to offer their varying definitions of love. If we resort to judgment or attacks towards specific individuals, then I suspect it will quickly kill the thread and any future desires of others to post their feeling or opinions for fear of being judged themselves. The most wonderful part of this community is the freedom to be oneself without fear of judgment.

I for one, greatly value the diversity found on Lit and this thread in particular. And while I may not share the same opinions, views or values as some here, I cherish their right to free expression. And I do sincerely appreciate the many ideas and thoughts offered in the name of defining love. Just as I appreciate your posts and insights.

 

[wicked woman]

Originally posted by dcraz
MWY,

<snip>

But you infer that this level of euphoria cannot be maintained. This may be true for most people. But to accept the simple premise that we cannot possibly maintain that state of deep devotion and commitment is to imply that we quickly reach a peak, beyond which we are destined for failure and ever eroding love.


Finally, the last part of your post seems to be directed at someone specific.

<snip>

Wow! Did we read the same post? That wasn't how I interpreted it at all. I thought it was the distinction between that first 'euphoria' and the long term 'deep devotion and commitment' that Yank was talking about. How the fact that one loves your beloved does not change, but the way it manifests itself does. That beginning rush he was referring to versus the more comfortable, contentness that comes from loving someone a long time. Didn't hear it as a judgement either...just a statement of fact.

I also didn't see the last part as 'picking' on someone...more a question of any one who cared to answer if they'd known anyone like that...more from a discussion purpose to learn how it was for them...how they dealt with it.

But we can wait for Yank's reply and I'm sure he'll clarify what he meant.

btw sorry Yank but no answer to your question here. I'll admit I've seen...participated...in what you're discussing and that some people seem to go from relationship to relationship looking for that 'high'...thinking that's what love is. But no answer to you question...

 

[midwestyankee]

MWY,

No problem getting serious here. The thread IS entitled Defining Love. But I do admit to being somewhat confused by your post.

I agree with the feeling that accompanies the traditional early euphoria of falling in love. And it can certainly have effects similar to certain drugs. Which, by definition, is what makes these drugs so appealing.

But you infer that this level of euphoria cannot be maintained. This may be true for most people. But to accept the simple premise that we cannot possibly maintain that state of deep devotion and commitment is to imply that we quickly reach a peak, beyond which we are destined for failure and ever eroding love. Again, this may be what happens for most. But it is NOT a foregone conclusion. For example, I have repeatedly posted on this thread that I have an insatiable drive for more. I want to learn more, do more, experience more, meet more people and certainly love more. However, it is NEVER at the expense of others. This is also not to say, that I am not deeply devoted to the one I love. I will always strive to love her more as well. Nor is it to say that I am not happy or content. Rather, and I am speaking solely for myself here, if I were to accept that any part of my life were as good as it gets and I should not strive for more is to suggest once again that we have peaked and the road that lies before us is one of decay and increasing disappointment. This is NOT how I choose to look at life.

Finally, the last part of your post seems to be directed at someone specific. If this was directed at me because of my previous postings, then again, I think you miss the point of what I have been saying. But that is fine. Everyone here is entitled to their opinions. If it was directed at someone else, then I might suggest that it would be better posted with them directly in a PM. As I understand the origin of this thread, it was intended to query those who enter to offer their varying definitions of love. If we resort to judgment or attacks towards specific individuals, then I suspect it will quickly kill the thread and any future desires of others to post their feeling or opinions for fear of being judged themselves. The most wonderful part of this community is the freedom to be oneself without fear of judgment.

I for one, greatly value the diversity found on Lit and this thread in particular. And while I may not share the same opinions, views or values as some here, I cherish their right to free expression. And I do sincerely appreciate the many ideas and thoughts offered in the name of defining love. Just as I appreciate your posts and insights.

Dcraz, perhaps I did not make myself as clear as I should have. I was referring solely to the highly euphoric state that occurs at the very beginning of a powerful love. This is a rather self-centered state in which we tend to perceive the world differently because we are falling in love. At this point the devotion to our beloved has not taken much root and is only beginning to form. It is a stage of high excitement, extreme emotions, and a relatively surface-oriented relationship. It is from this very lustful (in the broadest sense of the word) state that we develop the deeper and longer-lasting devotion that marks a more mature (again, in the broadest sense of the word) love. So my description in no way is meant to discuss the kind of devotion you expressed for your beloved.

As for the notion that I was referring to any one person in particular, all I can say is the WW is right. I very often post questions here in the "you" form in hopes that anyone who reads the post will feel welcome to reply. In fact, if you go back to the very first post of the thread, you will probably find the word "you" several times.

I'm sorry if you took offense, but none was intended in any way.

 

[dcraz]

Dcraz, perhaps I did not make myself as clear as I should have. I was referring solely to the highly euphoric state that occurs at the very beginning of a powerful love. This is a rather self-centered state in which we tend to perceive the world differently because we are falling in love. At this point the devotion to our beloved has not taken much root and is only beginning to form. It is a stage of high excitement, extreme emotions, and a relatively surface-oriented relationship. It is from this very lustful (in the broadest sense of the word) state that we develop the deeper and longer-lasting devotion that marks a more mature (again, in the broadest sense of the word) love. So my description in no way is meant to discuss the kind of devotion you expressed for your beloved.

As for the notion that I was referring to any one person in particular, all I can say is the WW is right. I very often post questions here in the "you" form in hopes that anyone who reads the post will feel welcome to reply. In fact, if you go back to the very first post of the thread, you will probably find the word "you" several times.

I'm sorry if you took offense, but none was intended in any way.

MWY,

Thanks for the reply. I think I better understand what you were saying. And perhaps it was I that took offense. Clearly misdirected and I thank you for understanding.

The initial infatuation one feels with another during the first stages of love often pale in comparison to the infatuation we feel with ourselves. Everyone wants to be wanted, loved, desired. When we receive that initial attention, it is intoxicating to say the least. We feel better about ourselves, dress nicer, stand up straighter, smile more often. I believe this what you trying to describe and not the actual deep, commited love that may follow (what I was reading into it).

I may have also assumed, incorrectly, that the post was directed at me or someone else solely because it seemed to be addressing the very similar, but not identical, position I have taken here before. A position that is clearly in the minority and misunderstood by many who read it. I might do a better job of explaining in the future.

I accept your comments and response at face value and will not give it another thought. It is my sincere hope that no harm has been done here for I truly value and respect all the positions presented here. Even yours (tongue firmly planted in cheek).

I hope everyone that visits this thread today will be blessed with the love and beauty they so cheerish.

DC

 

[midwestyankee]

MWY,

Thanks for the reply. I think I better understand what you were saying. And perhaps it was I that took offense. Clearly misdirected and I thank you for understanding.

The initial infatuation one feels with another during the first stages of love often pale in comparison to the infatuation we feel with ourselves. Everyone wants to be wanted, loved, desired. When we receive that initial attention, it is intoxicating to say the least. We feel better about ourselves, dress nicer, stand up straighter, smile more often. I believe this what you trying to describe and not the actual deep, commited love that may follow (what I was reading into it).

I may have also assumed, incorrectly, that the post was directed at me or someone else solely because it seemed to be addressing the very similar, but not identical, position I have taken here before. A position that is clearly in the minority and misunderstood by many who read it. I might do a better job of explaining in the future.

I accept your comments and response at face value and will not give it another thought. It is my sincere hope that no harm has been done here for I truly value and respect all the positions presented here. Even yours (tongue firmly planted in cheek).

I hope everyone that visits this thread today will be blessed with the love and beauty they so cheerish.

DC

No harm done whatsoever.

 

[dcraz]

No harm done whatsoever.

Cool. None intended.

 

[Cathleen]

<snip>

Have you ever known anyone who was addicted to falling in love? What was it like? How did this person behave? Did he or she ever change or was this a life-long behavior pattern?

Speaking from the addicitive side of my personality, I say unequivocally, YES, to knowing this can happen.

I suppose I could state the obvious, that the endorphin release is pleasing and pleasurable. Humans can and do become addicted to so many things in life. Actually any behavior can become addicive and the extremes of most activity are not healthy, emotionally and many times physically. If we become addicted to an activity to the degree that we cannot function in a balanced manner through the day without that activity, then there is something to consider for us. So I can see the physical addiction to wanting to "fall in love" over and over, wanting the high, just as an addict wants the high from their drug of choice.

I look at this from of the affective domain in our brain, the emotions are heady, the pleasure is immense, why wouldn't someone want to maintain that pleasure? Again, it is a matter of balance and extremes. To be addicted to falling in love is unhealthy. If one were to pathologize this behavior I think it would become obvious that there is a payoff for the addict. One will generally not continue a behavior unless there is a payoff, positive or negative.

I would think the behavior would continue until the issue is examined. There is a need to uncover what it is that is being quenched for the addict, the awareness once brought forth, can lead to the discovery of learning healthy behaviors to "correct" (for lack of a better word) the unhealthy behavior.

To be addicted to falling in love, and collecting lovers, really is unhealthy to those involved ~ even the willing participants. I understand love can be so spansive in our life that it seems almost ridiculous to say it can be addictive, but it can in my opinion.

I understand addiction very well, in the personal sense, I've seen what I am capable of given a penchant for a pleasant emotion. Just as I used other substances to bury fear, loneliness, hurt, etc. it would be all to possible to use love in the same way. Far to easy. Here is where I see Lit as a place of possible addiction. I am only speaking for myself here.

I see how easily it would be to fall in love with person after person here, this is like living in a resort town. Everyone is smiling, we are laughing, enjoying each other very much. All nice things, but when I see my additive behaviors kick in and my emotions get unbalanced then I know I've gone to far. I've learned many tools in my life to notice those behaviors before they get to the unhealthy point, but do not always use them or use them in time before some unhealthy behavior has occured.

Most likely I will always be on guard to those behaviors, maintaining a vigilance if you will, but that is just the way it is for me, less I fall into denial. So to me, addiction to falling in love is so appealing but screams to me that I am not seeing things in a healthy mind set.

Addiction is real, and it is possible to become addicted to any substance or behavior.

 

[midwestyankee]

Cathleen, thanks so much for your thoughtful, personal, and powerful post. As always, you are a gem.

 

[sheath]

Howdy.

I rarely venture over to the playground, but I have been following this thread for some time. Though I don't have much to contribute to the previous discussion, I did want to post this.

In the original post, you asked for a definition of love. I had a long phone call today with a friend who is feeling the first flush of love...and she has been around this block a time or two, but this time is different, and she and I both knew it. It was abundantly clear when she said of her new beau:

"He makes me want to be more of ME."

That just might be the most apt definition of love I have ever heard.

S.

 

[midwestyankee]

Howdy.

I rarely venture over to the playground, but I have been following this thread for some time. Though I don't have much to contribute to the previous discussion, I did want to post this.

In the original post, you asked for a definition of love. I had a long phone call today with a friend who is feeling the first flush of love...and she has been around this block a time or two, but this time is different, and she and I both knew it. It was abundantly clear when she said of her new beau:

"He makes me want to be more of ME."

That just might be the most apt definition of love I have ever heard.

S.

Howdy to you, too! Welcome.

How simple a definition, and yet how elegant. I like it a lot.

When we really fall proufoundly in love, it's the spirit, the soul, the core of our beloved that we love. So this definition makes perfect sense to me.

In fact, I know someone who gives me the very same feeling your friend described.

 

[GiveawayGirl]

Howdy.

I rarely venture over to the playground, but I have been following this thread for some time. Though I don't have much to contribute to the previous discussion, I did want to post this.

In the original post, you asked for a definition of love. I had a long phone call today with a friend who is feeling the first flush of love...and she has been around this block a time or two, but this time is different, and she and I both knew it. It was abundantly clear when she said of her new beau:

"He makes me want to be more of ME."

That just might be the most apt definition of love I have ever heard.

S.

Hi Sheath, welcome. The yankster speaks very highly of you

I think the definition you offer is as close as any we've seen. Someone who gives you comfort in your own skin is a good fit to be sure.



And Yank, I've yet to fall proufoundly in love myself...I'm not sure what that is

(You had to know I couldn't let that one go untouched)

 

[midwestyankee]

Hi Sheath, welcome. The yankster speaks very highly of you

I think the definition you offer is as close as any we've seen. Someone who gives you comfort in your own skin is a good fit to be sure.



And Yank, I've yet to fall proufoundly in love myself...I'm not sure what that is

(You had to know I couldn't let that one go untouched)

Damn!

 

[GiveawayGirl]

Damn!

roflmao

 

[midwestyankee]

roflmao

I'm glad you got some entertainment value out of it.

 

[GiveawayGirl]

I'm glad you got some entertainment value out of it.

C'mon Yank, be a good sport.....It's not that often I can actually catch you with a typo. Give a girl a little pleasure now and then

 

[midwestyankee]

C'mon Yank, be a good sport.....It's not that often I can actually catch you with a typo. Give a girl a little pleasure now and then

You're welcome to all the pleasure you can get ... from my typoes.

 

[sheath]

Thanks for the welcome...I think quite highly of the yankster myself. And he seems to surround himself with the most wonderful people, as evidenced by this thread.

S.

 

[GiveawayGirl]

... from my typoes.

Oooh baby, was that good for you too?

 

[wicked woman]

Originally posted by sheath
Howdy.

I rarely venture over to the playground, but I have been following this thread for some time. Though I don't have much to contribute to the previous discussion, I did want to post this.

In the original post, you asked for a definition of love. I had a long phone call today with a friend who is feeling the first flush of love...and she has been around this block a time or two, but this time is different, and she and I both knew it. It was abundantly clear when she said of her new beau:

"He makes me want to be more of ME."

That just might be the most apt definition of love I have ever heard.

S.

Reminds me of the Jack Nicholson line ....you make me want to be a better person...to...uummm...it will come to be later...but hopefully someone knows the movie I'm referring to.


Welcome sheath...glad to see you posting here and enjoying.

 

[DLL]

Originally posted by wicked woman
Reminds me of the Jack Nicholson line ....you make me want to be a better person...to...uummm...it will come to be later...but hopefully someone knows the movie I'm referring to.


Welcome sheath...glad to see you posting here and enjoying.

Melvin says ," you make me want to be a better man." from as good as it gets.....

 

[wicked woman]

Originally posted by DLL
Melvin says ," you make me want to be a better man." from as good as it gets.....

Thanks DLL...do you know who the woman was? Not Holly Hunter...a blonde...I can see her but the name escapes me..oh Helen Hunt!

 

[DLL]

Originally posted by wicked woman
Thanks DLL...do you know who the woman was? Not Holly Hunter...a blonde...I can see her but the name escapes me..oh Helen Hunt!

yes helen hunt she played carol..they I guess you could say defined love in their own way..I loved that movie