Gunplay

[zathras52003]

I believe Daystate is on the right track.

Most forms of recreation with firearms are very safe as long as you observe some simple rules (see below). By my read, your form of gunplay violates rule #2 directly, and can violate rule #3 indirectly, unless you have sandbags set up so that if you accidentally shoot your partner, it doesn't travel on and hit someone else.

For those unfamiliar:

Rule # 1: All firearms are always loaded. Even if they are not, treat them as if they are.

Rule # 2: Never allow the muzzle of your firearm to point toward anything you do not intend to kill or destroy.

Rule # 3: Keep your finger off the trigger until your sights are aligned with your target and you are ready to shoot.

Rule # 4: Be sure of your target, it's surroundings, and what's beyond it. Never shoot at anything that you have not positively identified. a.k.a. the "Laser Rule."


I guess my perspective is that gunplay as you have described it, cannot be safe or sane, just consensual.

 

[Pachet]

So it doesn't make you nervous or anything like that? I mean it probably does obviously ... but you know. Weird.

No, it doesn't make me nervous... it scares the hell out of me. Every moment that gun is pointed in my direction or pressed against my skin, I'm aware of it. It's impossible to do anything but be completely in the moment. When he jams the muzzle up under my chin and tilts my head up to look into his eyes, and kisses me - yes, it's scary...and romantic, and pretty much indescribable.

 

[DVS]

I believe Daystate is on the right track.

Most forms of recreation with firearms are very safe as long as you observe some simple rules (see below). By my read, your form of gunplay violates rule #2 directly, and can violate rule #3 indirectly, unless you have sandbags set up so that if you accidentally shoot your partner, it doesn't travel on and hit someone else.

For those unfamiliar:

Rule # 1: All firearms are always loaded. Even if they are not, treat them as if they are.

Rule # 2: Never allow the muzzle of your firearm to point toward anything you do not intend to kill or destroy.

Rule # 3: Keep your finger off the trigger until your sights are aligned with your target and you are ready to shoot.

Rule # 4: Be sure of your target, it's surroundings, and what's beyond it. Never shoot at anything that you have not positively identified. a.k.a. the "Laser Rule."


I guess my perspective is that gunplay as you have described it, cannot be safe or sane, just consensual.

To the bold part of your post...that's why they're using R.A.C.K. instead of SS&C. R.A.C.K. allows risk into the scenario and even potentially unsafe risk, as long as everybody concerned is aware and agrees to that risk. Using the SS&C guidelines, you have safe and sane to deal with.

BDSM involves a lot of different people and tastes. We should all let them live their own lives as they see fit. We can express our concerns and make sure that they understand those concerns, but we really shouldn't try to change their minds other than that.

I enjoy electroplay. Some people consider that dangerous. And to someone who knows nothing about electricity, it can be. But, I'd take offense at someone trying to tell me I shouldn't play with electricity because it's just not safe. I know the risks and accept those risks. Even though I'm educated in how electricity works and know the precautions, there is always a small amount of risk involved. And if that risk is realized, there's a chance someone could die or be seriously burned.

It's very similar to this situation. While we all know guns can kill and it can happen in an instant, there are people who will enjoy that adrenaline rush so much they will accept the fact that the gun could go off. Me? I've had a loaded gun pointed at me more than once and I've seen what a gun does to a human body. It's not very pretty, especially when the wound is in the head.

But, when this situation is defined by R.A.C.K. they are accepting the risks involved. Personally, I think having a round in the chamber is going too far, but that's just me. I don't need the adrenaline rush of knowing that, during a sexual scene, especially with no safety on the gun. I think that might even cause me to lose a hard on.

 

[Pachet]

You're gonna do what you're gonna do. All I said was the one thing I thought was mitigating. And it's mitigating a level of risk I think makes no sense for an orgasm.

I just wanted to come back to this, because it bothered me.

Our gunplay is about way more than "just an orgasm". I mean, even the lightest play we do is about more than that.

Is that all your play is to you? A means to an orgasm?

 

[Netzach]

I just wanted to come back to this, because it bothered me.

Our gunplay is about way more than "just an orgasm". I mean, even the lightest play we do is about more than that.

Is that all your play is to you? A means to an orgasm?

Yes and no and no and yes. Make sense?

It's easy to make too big a deal out of and not big enough a deal out of.

Orgasms are pretty important, and self-sacrifice can be way overblown.

 

[Pachet]

Yes and no and no and yes. Make sense?

It's easy to make too big a deal out of and not big enough a deal out of.

Orgasms are pretty important, and self-sacrifice can be way overblown.

Yeah, makes sense. For me it's probably 50% sex though, and 50% other stuff entirely.

What do you mean by self-sacrifice?

 

[Netzach]

zomgz I love you I'm yours I'm totally urs for liiiiife

Sometimes I'm like, shut up, I just made you cum really hard, ok?

 

[Primalex]

when in truth, breath play probably kills way more people each year than gunplay.

According to this logic, driving a car is much more dangerous than cave diving, after all, more people die in car accidents than in cave diving accidents.

 

[Primalex]

While we all know guns can kill and it can happen in an instant
[...]
But, when this situation is defined by R.A.C.K. they are accepting the risks involved.

A drunk driver knows about the risk - the fact that he drives doesn't mean that he accepted the risk though, in reality he denies the risk - "it does happen to other people, not to me".

This is not R.A.C.K. (for me) though. Accepting a risk in R.A.C.K. means accepting that the risk might happen to me and _that this is okay_, too. If the risk did occur and you say:"Oh shit, I wouldn't have done this if I had known before that this would happen to me." then, in my book, you didn't accept the risk, but denied it.

 

[Bramblethorn]

A drunk driver knows about the risk - the fact that he drives doesn't mean that he accepted the risk though, in reality he denies the risk - "it does happen to other people, not to me".

On a side note, DUI fails the 'C' part even if the driver has accepted the risk, because the other people on the road didn't get to choose their acceptable levels of risk.

 

[Pachet]

A drunk driver knows about the risk - the fact that he drives doesn't mean that he accepted the risk though, in reality he denies the risk - "it does happen to other people, not to me".

This is not R.A.C.K. (for me) though. Accepting a risk in R.A.C.K. means accepting that the risk might happen to me and _that this is okay_, too. If the risk did occur and you say:"Oh shit, I wouldn't have done this if I had known before that this would happen to me." then, in my book, you didn't accept the risk, but denied it.

We do accept the risk. We both know that during play he could end up doing a Jackson Pollock on the bedroom wall. _and this is okay_

 

[bambikiller]

I play with guns all the time.
Oh you mean in the bed room.
No sorry haven't done that but if it's unloaded and your partner isn't a total idiot and makes sure it is unloaded I don't see a problem with it.

 

[Pachet]

He's very, very experienced with guns. But in the bedroom, he chooses to handle his guns a bit differently than he would at the range. We do play loaded.

 

[Pachet]

http://i.imgur.com/u7oR8xu.jpg

got a nearly perfect imprint of the Sig's muzzle this afternoon

 

[bambikiller]

That's great, Having just completed a 16 hour gun safty course that I didn't have to take but I did anyways I have the following comments.

I'll admit I didn't read all the comments that were made before I made may comment. I gone back and read them and noticed everyone said it was a bad idea.
You said you're S.O. used a loaded weapon. You also stated that he was verry exsperienced with guns.

That's great I have my own thoughts about that. Anyone that wants to know what they are can P.O. me.

What I question is that you seem to push the subject.
Why, are you so proud of the fact that he does this to you.
It seams like it you get off on the fact that everyone in thi s forum tells you that it's a bad idea and you get off on the humiliation aspect of it.

I don't know if I knew all the answers I'd be a rich man but I'm thinking that not only do you get off on the fear factor but you get off on the humilation of everyone telling that you're an idoit.

Just my thought on the subject

 

[Pachet]

That's great, Having just completed a 16 hour gun safty course that I didn't have to take but I did anyways .

good for you?

I'll admit I didn't read all the comments that were made before I made may comment. I gone back and read them and noticed everyone said it was a bad idea.
You said you're S.O. used a loaded weapon. You also stated that he was verry exsperienced with guns.

That's great I have my own thoughts about that. Anyone that wants to know what they are can P.O. me.

What I question is that you seem to push the subject.
Why, are you so proud of the fact that he does this to you.

Why do people post here talking about the stripes they got from a caning? Or how dark their bruises are from their last scene? Being proud of your play and marks is hardly gunplay-specific. It stands out to you though, because you find gunplay shocking. If you browse this forum you'll find plenty of people proud of the various forms of play they engage in.

I'll answer your question though. Why am I 'proud'? I guess because both he and I choose to push limits most people won't... and therefore get to go places most people don't get to go. I don't mean that I'm better than anyone because we take more risks than most do. That'd be as asinine as bragging that you're better than others because you're the most super super safest player out there and never take any risks. It's not about "better". Maybe it's about being part of a really small group of people who do really dangerous things. Like wingwalking or walking a tightrope over the grand canyon. Sure, some people say "that's fucking stupid", but millions tune in to watch in awe, regardless. Actually, walking on a tightrope is a nice metaphor for gunplay. The guy who walked the tightrope across the grand canyon - I'm sure you can imagine the fear he felt during it... but can you imagine the adrenaline... the bliss he felt halfway through, looking around him and seeing nothing but open sky and air and incredible views, feeling the wind all around him, threatening to knock him off the rope? Most people will never feel anything remotely like that in their lives. Oh, they'll tell themselves they did, when they went on that rollercoaster or took those flying lessons or rode that horse down a steep trail. But to be actually on that tightrope where one wrong move could send you tumbling? Most people will never do it.

Why do I "push it"? I don't think I do. I made a thread about gunplay, people came in and gave their views, I gave mine. Because I didn't immediately back down and say "omg guys, you're right!" I'm pushing it?

It seams like it you get off on the fact that everyone in thi s forum tells you that it's a bad idea and you get off on the humiliation aspect of it.

I don't know if I knew all the answers I'd be a rich man but I'm thinking that not only do you get off on the fear factor but you get off on the humilation of everyone telling that you're an idoit.

Just my thought on the subject

I've never gotten off on humiliation - it's actually a limit of mine. If you went to a conservative Christian forum (for example) and posted about how much you loved being tied up and flogged, and many members came in and told you you were sick and stupid for that... would you feel humiliated? Or would your knowledge of what BDSM really is, and your experience with it, keep you from feeling that way?

I don't know what your answer is, but... I don't think what I do is stupid. I just don't. Risky, yes. But... It's not that I don't know how to handle guns, or know the safe use of them, or know the risks. I know all these things, I just choose to take the risk anyway. That's not stupidity (not knowing the right thing to do or right way to act), it's making a personal choice.

Lastly, I will cop to enjoying the shocked responses a bit. I can't lie. But it's not why I made the thread.

 

[Felonious1]

good for you?



Why do people post here talking about the stripes they got from a caning? Or how dark their bruises are from their last scene? Being proud of your play and marks is hardly gunplay-specific. It stands out to you though, because you find gunplay shocking. If you browse this forum you'll find plenty of people proud of the various forms of play they engage in.

I'll answer your question though. Why am I 'proud'? I guess because both he and I choose to push limits most people won't... and therefore get to go places most people don't get to go. I don't mean that I'm better than anyone because we take more risks than most do. That'd be as asinine as bragging that you're better than others because you're the most super super safest player out there and never take any risks. It's not about "better". Maybe it's about being part of a really small group of people who do really dangerous things. Like wingwalking or walking a tightrope over the grand canyon. Sure, some people say "that's fucking stupid", but millions tune in to watch in awe, regardless. Actually, walking on a tightrope is a nice metaphor for gunplay. The guy who walked the tightrope across the grand canyon - I'm sure you can imagine the fear he felt during it... but can you imagine the adrenaline... the bliss he felt halfway through, looking around him and seeing nothing but open sky and air and incredible views, feeling the wind all around him, threatening to knock him off the rope? Most people will never feel anything remotely like that in their lives. Oh, they'll tell themselves they did, when they went on that rollercoaster or took those flying lessons or rode that horse down a steep trail. But to be actually on that tightrope where one wrong move could send you tumbling? Most people will never do it.

Why do I "push it"? I don't think I do. I made a thread about gunplay, people came in and gave their views, I gave mine. Because I didn't immediately back down and say "omg guys, you're right!" I'm pushing it?




I've never gotten off on humiliation - it's actually a limit of mine. If you went to a conservative Christian forum (for example) and posted about how much you loved being tied up and flogged, and many members came in and told you you were sick and stupid for that... would you feel humiliated? Or would your knowledge of what BDSM really is, and your experience with it, keep you from feeling that way?

I don't know what your answer is, but... I don't think what I do is stupid. I just don't. Risky, yes. But... It's not that I don't know how to handle guns, or know the safe use of them, or know the risks. I know all these things, I just choose to take the risk anyway. That's not stupidity (not knowing the right thing to do or right way to act), it's making a personal choice.

Lastly, I will cop to enjoying the shocked responses a bit. I can't lie. But it's not why I made the thread.

From a gunsmith standpoint.....The safety mechanism on a firearm is designed to prevent the operator from pulling the trigger and causing the weapon to fire. But in reality, the concept of the safety mechanism on a gun only sets the user up for a false sense of security because the user never considers the fact that mechanical devices fail and accidental discharges happen.

Any firearm that lacks an exposed hammer, and is loaded with a live cartridge In the chamber, is only prevented from firing by a mechanical device that prevents the firing pin from striking the primer that its poised to detonate. These so-called safety mechanisms have failed in 1000's of reported cases in the past. Thus resulting in numerous deaths and subsequent lawsuits against many major, big name manufactures. Thus the "safety" on any firearm is NOT to be trusted.


From a gunsmith/kinkster stand point.......the only way gun play could be remotely done safely is with hand loaded ammo that isn't charged with powder or live primers. Or with a double action revolver without live ammo in the firing position under the hammer. You've still got the human error factor involved with either option though. So risks are still there, albeit greatly reduced.

In reality.......there's only one true safety when handling any firearm. That being muzzle control directed away from unintended potential targets. Intentionally pointing a firearm at someone has inherit, human-error risks to be considered.


From a kinkster standpoint........I full well know the near compulsive draw to fulfill fantasies, thus turning them into experienced realities. I've waded some potentially dangerous waters myself. Took some risks that could have been disastrous if things hadn't gone as expected. I too am all about some edge play. Yet one must consider the fact that they're perceptions regarding perceived outcomes could very well be wrong. With disastrous and potentially deadly results in the fallout. So I'm not throwing stones out the window of my own glass house.

Of course......it comes down to life decisions vs potential consequences. If you wind up with your brains scattered on a wall and your partner sitting in pound-my-ass prison after an unexpected accidental discharge? All I can say is the two of you did it your way and I hope it was fun while it lasted.

 

[MissVianne]

Oh boy, this thread has all sorts of wrong going on. I mean I can see the appeal from a STRICTLY FANTASY point on view but really? This is pushing the boundaries of snuff fetish a little too far. As someone who has extreme fantasies I can understand but with FAKE guns.

But if you're just in to clean the gene pool by all means.

 

[Pachet]

From a gunsmith standpoint.....The safety mechanism on a firearm is designed to prevent the operator from pulling the trigger and causing the weapon to fire. But in reality, the concept of the safety mechanism on a gun only sets the user up for a false sense of security because the user never considers the fact that mechanical devices fail and accidental discharges happen.

Any firearm that lacks an exposed hammer, and is loaded with a live cartridge In the chamber, is only prevented from firing by a mechanical device that prevents the firing pin from striking the primer that its poised to detonate. These so-called safety mechanisms have failed in 1000's of reported cases in the past. Thus resulting in numerous deaths and subsequent lawsuits against many major, big name manufactures. Thus the "safety" on any firearm is NOT to be trusted.


From a gunsmith/kinkster stand point.......the only way gun play could be remotely done safely is with hand loaded ammo that isn't charged with powder or live primers. Or with a double action revolver without live ammo in the firing position under the hammer. You've still got the human error factor involved with either option though. So risks are still there, albeit greatly reduced.

In reality.......there's only one true safety when handling any firearm. That being muzzle control directed away from unintended potential targets. Intentionally pointing a firearm at someone has inherit, human-error risks to be considered.


From a kinkster standpoint........I full well know the near compulsive draw to fulfill fantasies, thus turning them into experienced realities. I've waded some potentially dangerous waters myself. Took some risks that could have been disastrous if things hadn't gone as expected. I too am all about some edge play. Yet one must consider the fact that they're perceptions regarding perceived outcomes could very well be wrong. With disastrous and potentially deadly results in the fallout. So I'm not throwing stones out the window of my own glass house.

Of course......it comes down to life decisions vs potential consequences. If you wind up with your brains scattered on a wall and your partner sitting in pound-my-ass prison after an unexpected accidental discharge? All I can say is the two of you did it your way and I hope it was fun while it lasted.

We don't rely on the safety - it's usually off anyway. As he likes to say, "this", (holding up his trigger finger) "is the safety".

I'm glad at least someone admitted that they too have done dangerous things that could've had disasterous consequences.

I don't think I have any false perceptions about what could happen. We know the risks, it's not like we say "oh, we're so good and safe at this". That isn't the conversation. We're aware. But yeah... both of us have had these fantasies since our teens. Both of us have gone most of our lives thinking it just wasn't something we'd ever get to do IRL. And then we found eachother.

 

[Pachet]

Oh boy, this thread has all sorts of wrong going on. I mean I can see the appeal from a STRICTLY FANTASY point on view but really? This is pushing the boundaries of snuff fetish a little too far. As someone who has extreme fantasies I can understand but with FAKE guns.

Not a snuff fetish. I'd elaborate, but I have a feeling I'd be wasting my breath.

But if you're just in to clean the gene pool by all means.

Sweet of you, thanks.

 

[Felonious1]

We don't rely on the safety - it's usually off anyway. As he likes to say, "this", (holding up his trigger finger) "is the safety".

I'm glad at least someone admitted that they too have done dangerous things that could've had disasterous consequences.

I don't think I have any false perceptions about what could happen. We know the risks, it's not like we say "oh, we're so good and safe at this". That isn't the conversation. We're aware. But yeah... both of us have had these fantasies since our teens. Both of us have gone most of our lives thinking it just wasn't something we'd ever get to do IRL. And then we found eachother.

Yes......I most definitely have flirted with disaster. Yet its only figurative edge play that pings my sensors and creates the out-of-body endorphin rush that borders on being clinically addictive in nature.


Sounds like the R.A.C.K. principles have been duly weighed out in this case. I understand the draw to long held fetish fantasies that are potentially felonious in nature. Albeit ones that were previously thought to remain only a fantasy, never to actually be fulfilled in a realistic sense.

Live the dream, enjoy yourself.

 

[bambikiller]

Wow, I can't believe this this theard is still alive.
Hate to break it to you Pechet but if your S.O. realy knows about guns then the bullet it is a dummy. The primmer is spent and the load is empty. I have one myself. Also if he knows so much about guns the firing pin has been taken out.
Sorry to break it to you.
So much for your fear factor.
Didn't mean to not get you off.
Ether that that or your boy is an idoit so take your choice.

I didn't want to bring this up earlier but there seams to be still cocern about your safty on this theard. so I ruined your orgasam in the hopes that this theard will die and people will realise that guns can be safe. Then again as much as I believe in the second amendment if your boy is playing with a live load than he's too stupied to to own a weapon.

 

[Pachet]

Wow, I can't believe this this theard is still alive.
Hate to break it to you Pechet but if your S.O. realy knows about guns then the bullet it is a dummy. The primmer is spent and the load is empty. I have one myself. Also if he knows so much about guns the firing pin has been taken out.
Sorry to break it to you.
So much for your fear factor.
Didn't mean to not get you off.
Ether that that or your boy is an idoit so take your choice.

First of all, Pachet, not Pechet.

Do you really think I haven't thought of the things you mentioned? That I don't know what a firing pin is or haven't heard of dummy rounds? Trust me, we're playing live & loaded.

You do reveal a lot about the kind of person you are though, with your half-hearted attempt at punching a hole in my fantasy. It must suck to go through life as you.

I didn't want to bring this up earlier but there seams to be still cocern about your safty on this theard.

lol. Don't pawn it off on some nebulous "concern from others". The last post on the subject before yours stated that R.A.C.K. (do you even know what that is?) principles seem to have been weighed out in this case, and ended "live the dream". Yes some people showed concern - so what? Are you the Lit cop or something?

so I ruined your orgasam

*orgasm. And no, you didn't.

in the hopes that this theard will die and people will realise that guns can be safe.

It's not your job to police the forum and decide which threads die and which don't. This thread has as much right to be here as threads on asphyxiation or electroplay or any other potentially deadly type of play. And who are these "people" you speak of? They'd have to be borderline brain-dead if they came to the conclusion that guns in general are unsafe because of one thread a user made about gunplay. That doesn't even make sense.

 

[bambikiller]

You do reveal a lot about the kind of person you are though, with your half-hearted attempt at punching a hole in my fantasy. It must suck to go through life as you.

Actually I'm fine with who I am, I rather in ejoy it.

 

[Pachet]

how do you in ejoy something? Is that Swahili?