*chuckle* Instead of more coverage, you get less. Government in a nutshell...

[4est_4est_Gump]

That way the white man can pay for it!
http://thecia.com.au/reviews/o/images/outlaw-josey-wales-3.jpg

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

http://c9.nrostatic.com/uploaded/pic_giant_121812_C.jpg
And us Cornball Brothers!
Me an' Obama are 1%ers, ask Tiger!

 

[RobDownSouth]

And that has what to do with health care reform?

Not one god damned thing. AJ sees how badly the discussion is going and is desperately attempting to change the subject.

Failing that, he'll start picture spamming the thread.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

http://www.eonline.com/eol_images/Entire_Site/2011125/300.sheen1.lc.022511.jpg
Manufacturing guns for tots!
Doin' the Lord's work!

 

[Sean]

its adherents could not adequately defend their economics so they resorted to name-calling, ridicule and ad hominem attacks

That's what I'm talkin' 'bout!
http://moonbattery.com/Melowese-Richardson.jpg
That's what I voted for!
6 TIMES!

http://up.xhamster.com/000/023/977/027_1000.jpg
60% Abortion Rate???
IS THAT the white man out to get you?





http://gifsoup.com/webroot/animatedgifs2/1371421_o.gif

http://up.xhamster.com/000/022/767/104_1000.jpg
I think we need an Abortion Tax!

That way the white man can pay for it!
http://thecia.com.au/reviews/o/images/outlaw-josey-wales-3.jpg

http://c9.nrostatic.com/uploaded/pic_giant_121812_C.jpg
And us Cornball Brothers!
Me an' Obama are 1%ers, ask Tiger!

Un hunh.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

A gathering of chuckleheads...



... a thousand proven points for me.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

What do you get when government decides what is the best way to run things?

Do you remember the rather brilliant comedy sketch featuring Harry Enfield and Paul Whitehouse in which they played laid-back police officers in Amsterdam, bragging that they no longer have to deal with the crime of murder in the Netherlands since the Dutch legalised it? Don’t laugh too hard. In 2000 the Dutch government decided to make it even easier for pimps, traffickers and punters by legalising the already massive and highly visible brothel trade. Their logic was as simple as it was deceptive: to make things safer for everyone. Make it a job like any other. Once the women were liberated from the underworld, the crooks, drug dealers and people traffickers would drift away.

Twelve years on, and we can now see the results of this experiment. Rather than afford better protection for the women, it has simply increased the market. Rather than confine the brothels to a discrete (and avoidable) part of the city, the sex industry has spilt out all over Amsterdam — including on-street. Rather than be given rights in the ‘workplace’, the prostitutes have found the pimps are as brutal as ever. The government-funded union set up to protect them has been shunned by the vast majority of prostitutes, who remain too scared to complain.

Pimps, under legalisation, have been reclassified as managers and businessmen. Abuse suffered by the women is now called an ‘occupational hazard’, like a stone dropped on a builder’s toe. Sex tourism has grown faster in Amsterdam than the regular type of tourism: as the city became the brothel of Europe, women have been imported by traffickers from Africa, Eastern Europe and Asia to meet the demand. In other words, the pimps remained but became legit — violence was still prevalent but part of the job, and trafficking increased. Support for the women to leave prostitution became almost nonexistent. The innate murkiness of the job has not been washed away by legal benediction.

The Dutch government hoped to play the role of the honourable pimp, taking its share in the proceeds of prostitution through taxation. But only 5 per cent of the women registered for tax, because no one wants to be known as a whore — however legal it may be. Illegality has simply taken a new form, with an increase in trafficking, unlicensed brothels and pimping; with policing completely out of the picture, it was easier to break the laws that remained. To pimp out women from non-EU countries, desperate for a new life, remains illegal. But it’s never been easier.

Legalisation has imposed brothels on areas all over Holland, whether they want them or not. Even if a city or town opposes establishing a brothel, it must allow at least one — not doing so is contrary to the basic federal right to work. To many Dutch, legality and decency have been irreconcilably divorced. It has been a social, legal and economic failure — and the madness, finally, is coming to an end.

The brothel boom is over. A third of Amsterdam’s bordellos have been closed due to the involvement of organised criminals and drug dealers and the increase in trafficking of women. Police now acknowledge that the red-light district has mutated into a global hub for human trafficking and money laundering. The streets have been infiltrated by grooming gangs seeking out young, vulnerable girls and marketing them to men as virgins who will do whatever they are told. Many of those involved in Amsterdam’s regular tourist trade — the museums and canals — fear that their visitors are vanishing along with the city’s reputation.

http://www.spectator.co.uk/features/8835071/flesh-for-sale/

 

[RobDownSouth]

Un hunh.

http://i1239.photobucket.com/albums/ff502/Soonyigump/35135649_zps4508d92a.jpg

 

[julybaby04]

1. The speaker who said political stuff was not a politician or a Democratic operative. He was just a friend who believed in the dead guy's causes and got emotional about them at a funeral.

2. The only Democrats even there were Minnesota state Reps. They hardly represent the national Democratic party.


Perhaps he was a friend.....but at least be willing to agree that dems are just as capable as republicans for picking wrongs times to share their views. A memorial service was just as inappropriate as a prayer breakfast was.


Obama just came off an election cycle where he had to sit and listen to someone who opposes his views and he listens to congress do it all the time both formally and informally. I'm sorry July, you're just flat wrong on facts. This isn't a matter of opinion, you're just wrong.

I disagree. Obama had his opinion heard at every single juncture. He was not forced to sit in a room for a year and half and have no way of responding. He has the media in his back pocket. Anything he wanted out there was there....truth or not.

You don't understand. Republicans will never be united under Obama. They literally hate him. Even when Obama supports Republican policies they oppose him. They will always call him a divider even when Obama has broad support of Americans for his policies. It's bullshit.

I hope you understand the difference. His policies are hated. The man makes no difference otherwise. To be a conservative and watch as every single thing that makes this country great, being destroyed, yes, it is hard to take.

Obama NEVER supports anything republican. To think otherwise is plain foolish. He may say he is, but in reality he does not. He may say he is giving in to republicans desires on certain bills and such, but that could not be further from the truth.

Obama is destroying this country ......just as he has planned......and the loyal democrats are helping him do this without a single thought about what is really going on.


Obamacare IS a plan for those without coverage. And there's no other way to do it other than mandated coverage that includes healthy people. Not without exploding the deficit by just giving away a lot of free stuff (ie Medicaid for everyone who doesn't have employer insurance), and then there would be no reason for employers to provide insurance and *poof*, you just created single payer universal coverage.

All that had to happen was for Obama to have a health plan that those WITHOUT healthcare could purchase.......which is what obamacare mandates anyway.

Instead, he is destroying everyone's healhcare......making companies reduce either number of hours worked, employees employed, or both.....just to bypass the mandate. He has a plan to force everyone into a single payer system, that by reported numbers by the IRS will cost 20K a year for a family.

The penatly will be what?...around 2K? So companies will pay this and people will STILL have no coverage. He (and the demo leaders) have taken a situation that needed to be truly helped and made it an impossible situation for every single American (and illegal, for that matter).

Oh, but......everyone will be taxed that 2K....so, that tax money will be rolling in, which was the whole purpose to begin with.

 

[mercury14]

Good god. You're just parroting Sean Hannity.

- Holy fuck, Obama just had to sit in a room multiple times during the presidential debates listening to someone trashing his agenda. Now you're saying it never happened. What's wrong with you?

- You don't know what the ACA is. You've proven that a dozen times here. Stop talking about it until you learn what it is. Really, the extent of your knowledge is a haphazard jumble of RW distoted talking points. I've tried to educate you with facts backed by links, then you log in a week later and act like you were never given any facts. You're ignorant because you choose to be that way, which is why I do not respect you.

- No Democrat I'm aware of ambushed a sitting Republican president the way Dr. Carson did. You're not aware of any either so you have no point.

- If Obama had the media in his pocket why did Obamacare and the stimulus get slammed by the media? Those were his two biggest policy items and they were trashed thoroughly. Therefore your argument is pretty damne of false.

- Obama supports a number of Republican ideas. Healthcare mandates were a Republican idea. Cap and trade was a Republican idea. Immigration reform with a type of amnesty was a Republican idea. Tax holidays are a Republican idea. Then then Obama supported them, Republicans changed their mind and said their very own ideas are evil socialism that will destroy America. The RW hypocrisy is nauseating and you're acting like none of it ever happened.

 

[RobDownSouth]

<snip> He has a plan to force everyone into a single payer system, that by reported numbers by the IRS will cost 20K a year for a family. <snip>

Fact Check: Cheapest ObamaCare Plan Won't Cost $20,000 Per Family

Cheapest family plan will likely run $13,000 per year in 2015.

Tell us, how much do you pay per year right now to insure your family's health?

 

[mercury14]

Fact Check: Cheapest ObamaCare Plan Won't Cost $20,000 Per Family

Cheapest family plan will likely run $13,000 per year in 2015.

Tell us, how much do you pay per year right now to insure your family's health?

She's an idiot who believes RW internet hoaxes as readily as Vettebigot.

Mandates for insurers to cover people regardless of preexisting conditions, mandates banning dropping sick people, mandates keeping young adults on their parents' insurance - all Republican ideas that are even written into their Pledge to America. But once Obama supported them did they give him credit for backing Republican policy and uniting America? NOPE!

Those things all changed from good Republican ideas to evil government takeovers and communism.

 

[julybaby04]

Good god. You're just parroting Sean Hannity.

- Holy fuck, Obama just had to sit in a room multiple times during the presidential debates listening to someone trashing his agenda. Now you're saying it never happened. What's wrong with you?

- You don't know what the ACA is. You've proven that a dozen times here. Stop talking about it until you learn what it is. Really, the extent of your knowledge is a haphazard jumble of RW distoted talking points. I've tried to educate you with facts backed by links, then you log in a week later and act like you were never given any facts. You're ignorant because you choose to be that way, which is why I do not respect you.

- No Democrat I'm aware of ambushed a sitting Republican president the way Dr. Carson did. You're not aware of any either so you have no point.

- If Obama had the media in his pocket why did Obamacare and the stimulus get slammed by the media? Those were his two biggest policy items and they were trashed thoroughly. Therefore your argument is pretty damne of false.

- Obama supports a number of Republican ideas. Healthcare mandates were a Republican idea. Cap and trade was a Republican idea. Immigration reform with a type of amnesty was a Republican idea. Tax holidays are a Republican idea. Then then Obama supported them, Republicans changed their mind and said their very own ideas are evil socialism that will destroy America. The RW hypocrisy is nauseating and you're acting like none of it ever happened.

You are a Obama fan....plain and simple.

I believe that sums it up completely. You will never truly look at Obama and what he is doing in any other way than positive....no matter what he does. THIS is the mantra by which all dems live by. It truly matters not what "our guy" does....just shut up, sit down, and support.....ALWAYS!!

I have no problem with you not respecting me as you only know me by these words...and apparently you truly care not to read them and even try to understand a differing point of view.

My lack of respect for you comes from your unwillingness to see a differing point of view at all.

I have mentioned before....when Obama was elected the first time (with his hope and change thing), even though I did not vote for him, I was proud of this country for "growing up" enough to give everyone a chance at life...not just certain people. I did not agree with "hope and change" and therefore didn't vote for him. If he had had a good first 4 years, and things were better in this country, I would have supported him in term #2....regardless of my conservative leanings.

However, he is destroying this country at a very fast pace. Bush had his own problems......but these last 4 years and now this first year of term 2 are all Obama's. He is not man enough to EVER admit that he has made bad judgement calls. He takes responsibility for NOTHING and blames everyone else for failings.

Obama is not a leader.....he is a child who pitches a fit if he does not get his own way....in essence he "crosses those arms across the body, gets a "mad" face, and stomps his foot". He "doubles-down" when he gets any kind of resistance. He is not a leader. He is just rather embarrassing as the leader of the free world.

I know you will never see this and some, probably have some unkind remarks or cussing, but as I have also said before, it does not matter. He is the potus and there is, sadly, nothing that can be done about that.

I do hope that when he really tanks this country, through obamacare, loss of freedoms, taxing to death...etc, that you will be man enough to admit that he was not a good president instead of making excuses for him.

In the meantime, those of us who could not disagree more, are doing whatever we can now, to ensure at least our own families will be ok, to best of our abilities....in spite of obama and the demo leadership. If you want specifics....that does include making sure the bulk of the money we have is no where near any government institution and learning to live with much less so that when we all have to, we will be able to.

(by the way, I stand by everything I have said. Obamacare is a mess and will not help those people thought it would. It is nothing more than a tax and a way for the government to be able to control a VERY large portion of the economy.....through forcing free US citizens to buy something they may not want.

.......freedom use to be free...... now it is a tax!

 

[julybaby04]

Fact Check: Cheapest ObamaCare Plan Won't Cost $20,000 Per Family

Cheapest family plan will likely run $13,000 per year in 2015.

Tell us, how much do you pay per year right now to insure your family's health?

...hmmm.....and my family's insurance is $6840 per year for a family of 6.

Thank goodness that Obama is stepping in to help reduce the burden....now we only have to come up with another 6K a year....when we were just fine on our own.....(or 12K if we pay the tax.....oops, I meant penalty)..

(just so you know....mine is NOT an employer health plan.....it is an individual plan that we purchased.)

 

[zipman]

That's right AJ, giving people access to health care they need to survive is clearly going to destroy them.

LOL,, he has "the socialist bullies on ignore."

 

[julybaby04]

She's an idiot who believes RW internet hoaxes as readily as Vettebigot.

Mandates for insurers to cover people regardless of preexisting conditions, mandates banning dropping sick people, mandates keeping young adults on their parents' insurance - all Republican ideas that are even written into their Pledge to America. But once Obama supported them did they give him credit for backing Republican policy and uniting America? NOPE!

Those things all changed from good Republican ideas to evil government takeovers and communism.

Then let those with THOSE CONDITIONS you spoke of, get coverage on their own......NOT mandate the whole darn country to change everything because of a few.

What a ridiculous way to govern. THIS is exactly how the dems govern. (except during an election...then the majority outweigh ANYONE and ANYTHING).

 

[RobDownSouth]

...hmmm.....and my family's insurance is $6840 per year for a family of 6.

Thank goodness that Obama is stepping in to help reduce the burden....now we only have to come up with another 6K a year....when we were just fine on our own.....(or 12K if we pay the tax.....oops, I meant penalty)..

(just so you know....mine is NOT an employer health plan.....it is an individual plan that we purchased.)

My apologies, I keep forgetting you're a literalist.

I should have said that the average cost of a private plan will begin at about $13,000 per year in 2015.

That's not the minimum cost of such a plan, your conjecture notwithstanding.

You mentioned recently that you have a new husband, does he have a job?

If so, you and he are a very distinct minority in America today, two gainfully employed adults in a situation where neither has access to an employer-provided health insurance plan.

$6840 per year is a fantastic bargain, you are to be commended for being such a "smart shopper".

Compare your cost vs. the average family plan cost in the USA:
http://www.kff.org/insurance/snapshot/images/Chart4_5.gif

 

[julybaby04]

My apologies, I keep forgetting you're a literalist.

I should have said that the average cost of a private plan will begin at about $13,000 per year in 2015.

That's not the minimum cost of such a plan, your conjecture notwithstanding.

You mentioned recently that you have a new husband, does he have a job?

If so, you and he are a very distinct minority in America today, two gainfully employed adults in a situation where neither has access to an employer-provided health insurance plan.

$6840 per year is a fantastic bargain, you are to be commended for being such a "smart shopper".

Compare your cost vs. the average family plan cost in the USA:
http://www.kff.org/insurance/snapshot/images/Chart4_5.gif

I appreciate that. I didn't do a lot of shopping around...very easy to find that coverage for that amount.

We are both employed, but with small companies and no health insurance option. We found a family plan on our own with a major carrier.

Also, even with your numbers being an average...we are still better off with what we have. Having to change would make it more expensive for us.

.....and I will be interested in seeing what the real cost is....not just estimations from any source.

 

[mercury14]

I appreciate that. I didn't do a lot of shopping around...very easy to find that coverage for that amount.

We are both employed, but with small companies and no health insurance option. We found a family plan on our own with a major carrier.

Also, even with your numbers being an average...we are still better off with what we have. Having to change would make it more expensive for us.

.....and I will be interested in seeing what the real cost is....not just estimations from any source.

If you pay $6840 per year for six people that's ultra cheap. You certainly have a sky-high deductible and limited coverage, right? Just plugging numbers into Aetna.com and United Healthcare I'm unable to find anything under $8256 per year. You're in luck though, because despite your vitriol, Obamacare is going to help your family immensely. In fact you're the exact kind of family it will help more than anyone.

Using the ACA subsidy calculator, assuming you and your husband make $70k per year combined and you're around age 40, you're eligible for a 45% tax credit on that $6840, so you come out ahead by about $3,100. And that's for a family of four, the calculator only goes up to that - so you'll actually surpass the $3.1k figure.

Go ahead and tell me how horrible it will be for your family to have an extra $31,000 in the bank over the next decade.

 

[koalabear]

If you pay $6840 per year for six people that's ultra cheap. You certainly have a sky-high deductible and limited coverage, right? Just plugging numbers into Aetna.com and United Healthcare I'm unable to find anything under $8256 per year. You're in luck though, because despite your vitriol, Obamacare is going to help your family immensely. In fact you're the exact kind of family it will help more than anyone.

Using the ACA subsidy calculator, assuming you and your husband make $70k per year combined and you're around age 40, you're eligible for a 45% tax credit on that $6840, so you come out ahead by about $3,100. And that's for a family of four, the calculator only goes up to that - so you'll actually surpass the $3.1k figure.

Go ahead and tell me how horrible it will be for your family to have an extra $31,000 in the bank over the next decade.

*views post*

*points and laughs*

 

[mercury14]

You are a Obama fan....plain and simple.

I believe that sums it up completely. You will never truly look at Obama and what he is doing in any other way than positive....no matter what he does. THIS is the mantra by which all dems live by. It truly matters not what "our guy" does....just shut up, sit down, and support.....ALWAYS!!

Debunking your misinformation and lies makes me a non-thinking sheep? But you sitting there literally choosing to remain ignorant on basic facts, consuming only right-wing media meant to deceive you, well that makes you a thinking person, right?

No, I think there are a number of problems with Obamacare. If you'd like we can discuss them. But the thing is, you don't want to. What you want to do is focus on some RW jackoff's lies about death panels. You want to talk about Rush Limbaugh's lie about people's insurance going up to $20k per year. You want to talk about nonexistent government takeovers and call Obama schoolyard names.

You're not a rational person. You avoid thinking for yourself, instead preferring to gush with angry emotion and hysterics. All the while claiming you're calm even as you demonize and sling names and labels people who think differently than you. You're a hypocrite and willfully ignorant; that's why I do not respect you.

 

[phrodeau]

When did Obama stamp his foot? I can find several RW blogs claiming that he did this but no video, pictures or real news sources.

 

[IrezumiKiss]

When did Obama stamp his foot? I can find several RW blogs claiming that he did this but no video, pictures or real news sources.

Maybe she's talking about when he did this:

http://static.fjcdn.com/gifs/obama_8dd210_1384716.gif

 

[julybaby04]

If you pay $6840 per year for six people that's ultra cheap. You certainly have a sky-high deductible and limited coverage, right? Just plugging numbers into Aetna.com and United Healthcare I'm unable to find anything under $8256 per year. You're in luck though, because despite your vitriol, Obamacare is going to help your family immensely. In fact you're the exact kind of family it will help more than anyone.

Using the ACA subsidy calculator, assuming you and your husband make $70k per year combined and you're around age 40, you're eligible for a 45% tax credit on that $6840, so you come out ahead by about $3,100. And that's for a family of four, the calculator only goes up to that - so you'll actually surpass the $3.1k figure.

Go ahead and tell me how horrible it will be for your family to have an extra $31,000 in the bank over the next decade.

Yes, $3k would be great to have each year.........

But, that is taxpayer money. We are doing just fine on our own, paying what we can afford, and not relying on the government for any of it.

We will lose the very good coverage we have for an "equal" "mediocre" "everyone is the same" mentality to healthcare.

Again....just leave those of us who are happy with what we have ALONE.....and let those who need or want coverage to participate in some government mandated system.

 

[julybaby04]

Debunking your misinformation and lies makes me a non-thinking sheep? But you sitting there literally choosing to remain ignorant on basic facts, consuming only right-wing media meant to deceive you, well that makes you a thinking person, right?

No, I think there are a number of problems with Obamacare. If you'd like we can discuss them. But the thing is, you don't want to. What you want to do is focus on some RW jackoff's lies about death panels. You want to talk about Rush Limbaugh's lie about people's insurance going up to $20k per year. You want to talk about nonexistent government takeovers and call Obama schoolyard names.

You're not a rational person. You avoid thinking for yourself, instead preferring to gush with angry emotion and hysterics. All the while claiming you're calm even as you demonize and sling names and labels people who think differently than you. You're a hypocrite and willfully ignorant; that's why I do not respect you.

Sir, the media you consume is left wing......and apparently you believe every single thing they have to say. You do not think for yourself. You never look at other options. If obama says it, or dem leaders say it, or the media shares it....it cannot be wrong...EVER!!!

Perhaps we are all sheep....but I would rather be in the group that doesn't worship a man trying to destroy the country.

The more you try and tell me how you do not respect me, the less I care. You are being fed a bunch of lies....and you are perfectly fine with it.

Again...let's just wait and see where we are 5 or 10 years down the road as every single freedom is gone .....every person is the same......no one can have more than the other (except the dems in power, of course)......and let's watch the crumbling of the citizens of this country as there is no longer a reason to try to be better....try to succeed......try to be the greatest nation on earth!!