Track Runner Hermaphodite?

[3113]

Have you heard about this 18-year-old, South African, world champion women's track runner, Caster Semenya?

http://assets.nydailynews.com/img/2009/09/12/alg_castor_semenya_runs.jpg

She's gotten a lot of press because (1) She's an amazing runner, and (2) many believes she's not a girl. Her gender has been very ambiguous from the first (i.e., she's always been told that she looks like a boy). The International Association of Athletics Federation, stating that they wanted to determine if she had a "rare medical condition" that was giving her an unfair competitive advantage, ordered a gender test after she won the women's 800 meters at the world championships last month in Berlin. Results of the test won't be released till November but she'd dropped out of a race over the gender flap. Unsubstantiated Rumors of the test are flying:

Caster Semenya...withdrew from a weekend race in South Africa amidst unconfirmed reports that her gender tests have revealed that she has both male and female sexual organs.

She was scheduled to compete in the 4,000 meters at the national cross country championships in Pretoria. Semenya's coach, Michael Seme, says his runner "isn't feeling well".

Yesterday, unsubstantiated reports from Australia and England said that Semenya's tests showed that she has no womb or ovaries and produces testosterone levels three times higher than a normal woman.

More here (including a video report on the situation).

Now, not surprisingly, there's a lot of anger toward the IAAF for doing this test and keeping up this controversy over her gender. On the one hand, she is this 18 year old from a small village, doing her best, and why should she be continually singled out? Why, if there were questions, wasn't this done earlier? On the other hand, this is competitive sports.

But what I wonder is, IF she is a hermaphrodite...does this mean that hermaphrodites have no right to compete in sports?

 

[voluptuary_manque]

As in so many things, reality turns out to be much less positive/negative, black/white, on/off than is convenient for most of us to believe. It's okay for children to think that everyone is either a boy or a girl. But at some time in our lives, we have to come to grips with the fact that human sexuality is a lot more complex than that. The Greeks understood. We don't seem to.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

VM

You dont get to play for every team, dear.

3113

Its a sex issue NOT a gender issue. When a fag dresses like a girl and tries to play girl sports, they toss his ass out, regardless of what the girl inside him sez.

 

[Pure]

3113 But what I wonder is, IF she is a hermaphrodite...does this mean that hermaphrodites have no right to compete in sports?

well, my question to you would be, IF it turns out she has no ovaries or womb, from birth; has levels of estrogen far below 99% of women, and levels of testosterone higher that almost all women, why she should compete is *women's* athletics? it's unfortunate she's caught in this gray area and she deserves compassion. but what's the solution to 'who can compete in women's athletics?'

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

Put 'her' in the Special Olympics.

 

[Jenny_Jackson]

Gay football players. Corked Bats. Growth Hormones. Now a hermaphrodite runner. Where will it end? Regarless of the sport there will always be bitchers and cheaters. Who really cares?

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

If youre a genuine female athlete who gets screwed by an imposter, you might care a little about it. The whole female sex gets screwed by one freak.

 

[3113]

what's the solution to 'who can compete in women's athletics?'

If I knew, I wouldn't be askin' you.

 

[Stella_Omega]

I'm sure the authorities will try to implement the most simplistic solution first-- and then advocates for transsexual and intersexed people will get into the act-- and the men's division will scream that they dont want a damn faggit running with them-- and so on and so forth.

Will she eventually be allowed to run in SOME division? That, I don't know.

 

[Lady_Guenivere]

VM

You dont get to play for every team, dear.

3113

Its a sex issue NOT a gender issue. When a fag dresses like a girl and tries to play girl sports, they toss his ass out, regardless of what the girl inside him sez.

Tell me...do you really believe your own rederick? You are simply a vulger bigot who seems to just like to hear (or see) himself speak.

 

[Jenny_Jackson]

I'm sure the authorities will try to implement the most simplistic solution first

No, Stella. The latest is the South Africans are threatening law suits, so the Officials are being careful and calling in "experts" to determine the sex. What kind of "experts" I don't even want to guess. Some Senior Faternaty Brother, perhaps(?)

Now, she has no overies and 3 times the testosteron levels of a normal woman. But the actual news is saying "sexual characteristics of both sexes" not that she has the sex organs of both. That seems to be a rumor. I'm still waiting for the outcome. Whatever it is, no one will be happy.

 

[Handley_Page]

If she IS female, complete with all the necessary bits, she competes as a woman in women's' races.
If she hasn't she cannot.

This problem arose a decade or three ago at the Olympics.
There were doubts expressed at the performance of some of the Eastern Block athletes and huge amounts of weird drugs were found in the samples (some of those from East Germany are still suffering).

This athlete can have and maybe deserves our sympathy. This athlete may even have some medical treatment to 'cure' the problem.

But this athlete should not enter a Women's' competition until there is no doubt.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

Tell me...do you really believe your own rederick? You are simply a vulger bigot who seems to just like to hear (or see) himself speak.

I'm just a simple country bigot boy who knows how to spell rhetoric and vulgar.

In our times all the freaks are running around claiming to be women; I mean women are only tits and a little different plumbing, right?

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

I think, but wont swear to it, that ARNOLD was a female weight lifter for Austria, no?

 

[voluptuary_manque]

No, Stella. The latest is the South Africans are threatening law suits, so the Officials are being careful and calling in "experts" to determine the sex. What kind of "experts" I don't even want to guess. Some Senior Faternaty Brother, perhaps(?)

Now, she has no overies and 3 times the testosteron levels of a normal woman. But the actual news is saying "sexual characteristics of both sexes" not that she has the sex organs of both. That seems to be a rumor. I'm still waiting for the outcome. Whatever it is, no one will be happy.

Agreed. Normally I consider the solution that pleases no one completely to be the best. But in this case I don't see one that will make anyone happy. Her kind of physiology is too uncommon for there to be a classification of their own and she so completely outclasses 'normal' women that the fairness of the competition is questionable. On the other hand, though her testosterone levels are very high for a woman, they're not male, either. She simply isn't big or strong enough to compete with world-class men. I really feel sorry for the poor thing.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

I think the Usual Suspects wanna make all sports the Special Olympics.

 

[TxRad]

I'm just a simple country bigot boy

The bigot part is right but you are not country. Country people have manners, even the poor white trash . So where does that put that shit house mouth of yours?

Try again idiot.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

The bigot part is right but you are not country. Country people have manners, even the poor white trash . So where does that put that shit house mouth of yours?

Try again idiot.

Why! I was raised on WCKY, the Grand Ole Opry, and sugarcane syrup. I still have my first pair of bib overalls. Born on a mountaintop in Tennessee (the greenest state in the land of the free!), raised in the woods so I knew every tree, killed me a bar' when I was only 3! And I never felt the need for any sissy cowboy hat. Did I mention we had cattle?

 

[3113]

If she IS female, complete with all the necessary bits, she competes as a woman in women's' races.
If she hasn't she cannot.

Well, but there's the sticking point, isn't it? What necessary bits are required? There are some young women who end up with medical conditions requiring that they have hysterectomies. Would such an athlete qualify because she used to have a womb and ovaries? I mean, technically, she'd have an advantage in that she wouldn't be dealing with monthly hormones or periods like the rest of the women she was competing against.

Yet if she's still female without, then why isn't this athlete?

What's confusing here is what constitutes an unfair advantage. Any athlete able to do amazing things, like break records and such, is, by definition, born with an unfair advantage. Nature gave them a little more of what they need to go beyond just sometimes winning a race and sometimes losing it.

Oh, and according to the news, Semenya will keep her medals no matter what as, obviously, she wasn't using anything in an attempt to cheat, she was just born this way. But see, that's what makes it even more confusing. Will they say that she "unfairly" won the medals but get to keep them as she wasn't trying to cheat, or that she won them fairly...but she can't run any future races as that's be unfair?

 

[Stella_Omega]

Tell me...do you really believe your own rederick? You are simply a vulger bigot who seems to just like to hear (or see) himself speak.

Many of us enjoy never hearing (seeing) him speak-- we keep him on ignore.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

3113

Then forfeit female sports to the carnival freaks, and the real girls can be cheerleaders on the sidelines. In your heart you know you want all sports to be Special Olympics.

 

[Stella_Omega]

Big props for these thoughts, 3113

Well, but there's the sticking point, isn't it? What necessary bits are required? There are some young women who end up with medical conditions requiring that they have hysterectomies. Would such an athlete qualify because she used to have a womb and ovaries? I mean, technically, she'd have an advantage in that she wouldn't be dealing with monthly hormones or periods like the rest of the women she was competing against.

Yet if she's still female without, then why isn't this athlete?

What's confusing here is what constitutes an unfair advantage. Any athlete able to do amazing things, like break records and such, is, by definition, born with an unfair advantage. Nature gave them a little more of what they need to go beyond just sometimes winning a race and sometimes losing it.

Oh, and according to the news, Semenya will keep her medals no matter what as, obviously, she wasn't using anything in an attempt to cheat, she was just born this way. But see, that's what makes it even more confusing. Will they say that she "unfairly" won the medals but get to keep them as she wasn't trying to cheat, or that she won them fairly...but she can't run any future races as that's be unfair?

 

[Verdad]

My heart goes out to the athlete in question, but I see no solution that would be fair to other contestants. What's to become of female sports if being a bio female were no longer a requirement? We can, perhaps, ask what it means to be a bio female, though. Does being an XX resolve the issue, or not?

 

[lesbiaphrodite]

There was a nice piece on this in the Times today. I am pasting it below for anyone interested in reading it.

What Makes a Woman a Woman?
By PEGGY ORENSTEIN

There is a painting by Richard Prince hanging in the Walker Art Center in Minneapolis, a purple canvas bisected by one line of chartreuse type that reads : “I met my first girl, her name was Sally. Was that a girl, was that a girl. That’s what people kept asking.” That refrain echoed in my head as I pored over the photos of 18-year-old Caster Semenya, the South African track star whose biological sex was called into question last month after she annihilated her competition, winning the 800-meter world championship in significantly less time than her own previous finishes.

Was that a girl, was that a girl. That’s what people kept asking.

Semenya’s saga was made for the news media. A girl who may not be a girl! That chest! Those arms! That face! She was the perfect vehicle for nearly any agenda: was this another incidence of people calling into question black female athletes’ femininity (the Williams sisters, the basketball legend Sheryl Swoopes)? Was it sexist to assume women were incapable of huge leaps in athletic performance? Should all female athletes be gender-verified, as they were in Olympic competition until 1999? (The practice was dropped because no competitive edge was proved for the few women with rare disorders of sex development — it served only to humiliate them.) Should the entire practice of sex-segregating sports be abandoned?

Was that a girl, was that a girl. That’s what people kept asking.

I had my own reasons to be fascinated by Semenya’s story: I related to it. Not directly — I mean, no one has ever called my biological sex into question. No one, that is, except for me. After my breast-cancer diagnosis at age 35, I was told I almost certainly had a genetic mutation that predisposed me to reproductive cancers. The way I could best reduce my risk would be to surgically remove both of my breasts and my ovaries. In other words, to amputate healthy body parts. But not just any parts: the ones associated in the most primal way with reproduction, sexuality, with my sense of myself as female. Even without that additional blow, breast cancer can feel like an assault on your femininity. Reconstructing the psyche becomes as much a part of going through treatment as reconstructing the body.

In the weeks that followed my diagnosis, during that heightened, crystalline time of fear and anxiety, I was not, I, admit, at my most rational. So I began to fret: without breasts or hormone-producing ovaries, what would the difference be, say, between myself and a pre-op female-to-male transsexual? Other than that my situation was involuntary? That seemed an awfully thin straw on which to base my entire sense of womanhood. What, precisely, made me a girl anyway? Who got to decide? How much did it matter?

When I was in college, in the early 1980s, the gospel was that the whole enchilada of gender was a social construct: differences between boys and girls were imposed by culture, rather than programmed by chromosomes and chemicals, and it was time to divest ourselves of them. That turned out to be less true than feminists of the era might have wished: physiology, not just sisterhood, is powerful. While femininity may be relative — slipping and sliding depending on the age in which you live, your stage of life, what you’re wearing (quick: do tailored clothes underscore or undercut it?) even the height of the person standing next to you — biology, at least to some degree, is destiny, though it should make no never mind to women’s rights or progress.

Even as I went on as a journalist to explore ideas about gender, I took the fact of my own for granted: as for most people — men and women alike — it was so clear to me as to be invisible. I was unnerved, then, to discover not only that it could be so easily threatened but also how intense that threat felt. That, too, gave me pause: why should being biologically male or female still be so critical to our self-definition? Is it nature — an evolutionary imperative to signal with whom we can reproduce? Is it nurture? Either way, and regardless of our changing roles and opportunities, it is profound.

Was that a girl, was that a girl. That’s what people kept asking.

And yet, identity is not simply the sum of our parts. That’s what makes Semenya — whose first name is usually conferred on a boy but happens to be Greek for “beaver” — so intriguing. Science may or may not be able to establish some medical truth about her, something that will be relevant on the playing field. But I doubt that will change who she considers herself to be. According to Sheri Berenbaum, a professor of psychology and pediatrics at Penn State who studies children with disorders of sex development, even people with ambiguous biology tend to identify as male or female, though what motivates that decision remains unclear. “People’s hormones matter,” she said, “but something about their rearing matters too. What about it, though, no one really knows.”

There is something mysterious at work, then, that makes us who we are, something internally driven. Maybe it’s about our innate need to categorize the world around us. Maybe it arises from — or gives rise to — languages that don’t allow for neutrality. My guess, however, is that it’s deeper than that, something that transcends objectivity, defies explanation. That’s what I concluded about myself, anyway. Although I have, so far, opted to hang onto my body parts (and still wonder, occasionally, if I would feel differently were, say, a kidney or an arm at issue), I know that my sex could never really be changed by any surgeon’s scalpel. Why not? Perhaps because of the chemistry set I was born with, one that Semenya may or may not share. Perhaps merely because . . . I say so. And maybe that will have to be enough.

 

[Verdad]

Thank you, Lesbia. A nice piece of writing indeed. It doesn't provide answers, but it raises a number of good questions.