Non-stroke Erotica

[SimonDoom]

We all get the idea of "stroke" erotica: a story that helps somebody get off, in one way or another. But what about "non-stroke" erotica? Does that mean something to you? If so what? I'm not talking about non-erotic stories. I'm talking about stories that are definitely erotic, whatever that means, but that aren't necessarily something you'd want to get off to.

I just finished reading JG Ballard's Crash, which is an novel about a group of people with an erotic obsession with car crashes. It's not a stroker (at least, not to me--maybe it is to some), but it's undeniably erotic. It's well-written and it captures the dark, obsessive, and sometimes dangerous aspects of erotic desire. I get its erotic appeal even if the particular subject is one that doesn't seem at all erotic to me personally.

In your own reading or writing, do you carve out a space for erotica of that kind? Do you enjoy erotica that takes you to places that don't erotically interest you in a real-life way? I do, often. I enjoy it when an author can make me erotically interested in a subject that in real life wouldn't interest me at all.

 

[John_Vandermeer]

I distinguish stroke from non-stroke on the basis of if there is more than interests me in the story than the juicy bits. If I want to know what happens beyond the erotic action. But in erotica I feel ultimately I want a passage that turns me on. And actually, if it is only a stroker, it tends to interest me less.

Separately, I don't regularly read all kinds of erotica that do it for me. So far I have basically written one kind, femdom, but I actually am not a one issue eroticist. I like good maledom too, for example, among other things. I definetely like to read things that do it for me that I don't read regularly. Remind me, or even first time show me, the full range of erotica I like. That is tricky though, as I tend to find my standards of quality tend to go higher outside my bread and butter core.

 

[Euphony]

Your example is more along the Masterclass of erotica end of the spectrum and falls under the "I appreciate it exists and what I might steal from it but I won't engage with it much beyond its novelty."

I would say the thread linking all the offbeat things I do "like" is an underlying appreciation and desire for passion. As long as something isn't too far afield to be understandable and/or not too personally squick, I can be siren called by a person's commitment and someone devoting themselves to shining light on something few bother to.

I suppose research is as close to writing application I get to subject matters that don't feature prominently in my personal sexual repertoire. Though I assume the draw of that is more from a sense of curiosity and want of understanding versus any tangential interest to the subject at hand. (it baffles me people are so quick to attach significance to research/writing as proof of "want' when writing is as much about working through/figuring out this oddball world to me (and the page just happens to be the venue that works best for me)

Wholly dispassionate writers are luckily few and far between here but there is a subsection that are very repetitive in their beats/explorations/themes/etc.

Everyone should write what they are compelled to write but even as only a reader I lose motivation to revisit well worn tropes. I can't imagine investing significant time, effort, emotional resources to run essentially the same story back again with a few character or setting changes to keep full copycat at bay.

I understand we all come to the erotic space for different reasons (that can very wildly as its a huge spectrum) but even within my (likely) more vanilla proclivities, I like to feel I grow as a reader more than I am merely serviced by having my needs set met and I giddily vote based off that dopamine hit and not the overall quality or challenge of the piece.

 

[Carnevil9]

What about stories that you read with a partner? In order to get each other even more in the mood that you were before, or to spice up an otherwise repetitive sex life? Would that count as stroke erotica? In some ways it's the same, but in other ways it is different.

 

[Beholders_Eye]

As a guy, when I read (well written) lesbian erotica, I am strongly taken in to the story.

There is just the sheer pleasure of them enjoying each other’s person, bodies & sexual response. Usually the stories and depictions are very tender and caring toward her girl partner; maybe that is what I am missing in my life: the tenderness (nurturing?). Almost as if the sex is more…what, pure? More authentic? More sensual?

At any rate, I am turned on by lesbian stories, even though I cannot (by virtue of gender and anatomy) visualize myself as being a part of the story. So, it is not 'stroke material' as such, but does induce strong concupiscent feelings.

Not sure that all makes sense, but came to mind as I read the thread. And as they say on the internet, YMMV...

 

[KeithD]

"non-stroke" erotica?

I think that's a contradiction in terms, although I could see it indicating erotica that just isn't that reader's "thing."

 

[Blind_Justice]

To me, non-stroker erotica stories use sex to enhance the plot, not be the plot. In most of my stories, I'll make sure the sex matters and isn't just there to justify the story's existence. Few sex scenes for their own sake, most are kinda important for the plot as well. As such, I tend to stay away from "porn logic" which tends to exist a lot in erotic SF/F stories.

Example: In "Red Tsonia and the Jungles Of Madness", the first sexual encounter occurs when the villain of the story catches Tsonia while bathing and he uses his charm powers to get a blowjob from her (with the intent of getting much more, but then things happen to thwart that). The main reason for the scene to exist is twofold. First, it gives the reader an insight into Tsonia's personality. She's a bit vain and uses the first opportunity to cleanse herself after a shipwreck. It's also a great vehicle to show the villain's powers without dropping a huge exposition bomb on the reader and third it sets up the rest of the story - the natives crashing the pond party bring their own doom upon themselves by snatching the villain and dragging him to their village.

The tentacle sex scene in the latter half of the story has a lot less baggage attached to it though

 

[yukonnights]

I would say good number of my stories are not what I consider "focused" on the descriptions of sexual scenes. I try to first craft a good plot — a plot that would most likely still be a good story without drawn out sex scenes. The ones that come to mind are western stories and some contemporary stories that focus more on the emotional aspects of the relationships. My preference, in both reading and writing, is in the thoughts & emotions of intimate relationships.

 

[Fatdog25]

I do differentiate between the two. In my case, I define a "non-stroke" story as one where the sex enhances the story, it's just not the whole story.

I avoid stroke stories, most of the ones I've tried to read are just a bit too...crude, which does nothing for me. I've seen a few good stroke stories but they've been few and far between (and are probably really "non-stroke" stories that are just heavy on sex scenes.)

A good erotica story, where the sex scenes make sense (mostly) and fit the plot and the characters, is what I'm looking for when I'm in the mood to read. It doesn't have to be in my kink wheelhouse, either.

 

[KeithD]

I've read stroker stories that were not only highly erotic but also literary masterpieces. I like to think I've written them. I certainly tried to do so.

 

[Cagivagurl]

Erotica...
A story that titillates, or arouses. It is not the depiction of the physical mechanics. It is the prelude. The seduction rather than the act itself.
Perhaps the chase rather than the catch...
Personally, I love the erotic elements of a story. When it comes to the sex scenes, I skip them entirely.
For me it is the emotional elements of the story.
We are all different thankfully. What arouses me, will leave others cold...
That's life, and long may it last...
A wonderfully crafted seduction IMO is far nicer than the in and out of the act...

Cagivagurl

 

[KeithD]

Erotica...
A story that titillates, or arouses. It is not the depiction of the physical mechanics. It is the prelude. The seduction rather than the act itself.

There's no reason why it can't include the carry through.

 

[KeithD]

Give a link.

I think this one qualifies as both high-heat stroker and literary. In this case, part of the goal was to be capable of being read as either straight or GM (and there was a discussion about this aspect at one time on the discussion board).

https://www.literotica.com/s/licorice-centered-milk-chocolate

But for anyone who insists on being smugly dismissive of strokers, I'm sure there will be no example possible.

 

[KeithD]

One of yours, seriously?

Since I frequently note I don't read the stories here, what did you think you were challenging me to cite? I posted that I try to do this myself with strokers.

Do you want to discuss the issue or just continue to be an asshole? We all, of course, know which it will be with you.

I stand on the opinion that a work doesn't have to be crap just because it's a stroker--and that anyone who thinks so is being close-minded.

 

[bumpercars]

I feel like some people use stroker as a category and some use it as a derogatory term, so you're unlikely to get agreement here.

But, it's erotica if it's meant to excite the reader, and it's good writing if you're drawn into the world and you care about the characters, no matter how long it is.

 

[SimonDoom]

I feel like some people use stroker as a category and some use it as a derogatory term, so you're unlikely to get agreement here.

To clarify, I don't use it as a derogatory term. I don't think a story is "less" because the author wrote it with this in mind, or because readers gravitate to it for that purpose.

I may be unusual, but I seldom use erotic stories personally for this purpose as a reader, although I often write stories hoping that some readers will find the story useful for that purpose. For me, there's a kind of erotic pleasure that has nothing to do with trying to achieve orgasm. The stories I like best as a reader stimulate that pleasure for me.

The novel Crash, which I referred to, falls into this camp. It doesn't make me want to orgasm, but I DO find it erotic in a weird and interesting way. I'm curious whether others have similar views and if so what, for them, falls into this category.

 

[ElectricBlue]

We all get the idea of "stroke" erotica: a story that helps somebody get off, in one way or another. But what about "non-stroke" erotica? Does that mean something to you? If so what? I'm not talking about non-erotic stories. I'm talking about stories that are definitely erotic, whatever that means, but that aren't necessarily something you'd want to get off to.

I just finished reading JG Ballard's Crash, which is an novel about a group of people with an erotic obsession with car crashes. It's not a stroker (at least, not to me--maybe it is to some), but it's undeniably erotic. It's well-written and it captures the dark, obsessive, and sometimes dangerous aspects of erotic desire. I get its erotic appeal even if the particular subject is one that doesn't seem at all erotic to me personally.

In your own reading or writing, do you carve out a space for erotica of that kind? Do you enjoy erotica that takes you to places that don't erotically interest you in a real-life way? I do, often. I enjoy it when an author can make me erotically interested in a subject that in real life wouldn't interest me at all.

I don't understand the question. You seem to be saying, "It's not my kink, but I can see the story is erotic."

I agree with you about Crash, though. Ballard often zooms in on the highly erotic (he can even make atom bomb testing a turn on - but then, so does Florence Pugh). And when you combine Ballard with David Cronenberg, you're onto something that's off the wall.

 

[Britva415]

Erotica...
A story that titillates, or arouses. It is not the depiction of the physical mechanics. It is the prelude. The seduction rather than the act itself.

Yeah, exactly. The erotica is the non-stroke parts. The stroke parts is the smut.

 

[KeithD]

Yeah, exactly. The erotica is the non-stroke parts. The stroke parts is the smut.

So, description of the sex act can't be written to arouse?

 

[Britva415]

So, description of the sex act can't be written to arouse?

I don't know. Can a passage not be both erotica and smut?

 

[KeithD]

I don't know. Can a passage not be both erotica and smut?

Yes, I think it can. But you seemed to define them as separate in your post. You certainly were separating erotica from smut. If you are now saying the passage can be both, that's my point too.

 

[NotWise]

What I think of as "non-stroke" erotica is about the relationship that leads to sex, and about the story that wraps around it. It's far from non-erotic. To some readers the relationship enhances the eroticism, and to some it may be the sole source of the eroticism.

 

[Kumquatqueen]

Maybe it's because I'm female, but the concept of timing a read to fit with masturbation is alien to me. Read something inspiring, then wank, is how I plan things.

The inspiring work could be pure erotica or porn, but could be any other feast of sensations - a vivid film or TV episode, or a good meal, can have the same effect. If a story evokes an erotic atmosphere and has a character wanting sex, that's what works for me. A simple retelling of an erotic encounter, even if it's my perfect fantasy, doesn't work for the purpose.

 

[SimonDoom]

Maybe it's because I'm female, but the concept of timing a read to fit with masturbation is alien to me. Read something inspiring, then wank, is how I plan things.

The inspiring work could be pure erotica or porn, but could be any other feast of sensations - a vivid film or TV episode, or a good meal, can have the same effect. If a story evokes an erotic atmosphere and has a character wanting sex, that's what works for me. A simple retelling of an erotic encounter, even if it's my perfect fantasy, doesn't work for the purpose.

I've had readers tell me the exact moment in my story when they came. I confess it was pleasing to know that.

 

[ElectricBlue]

I've had readers tell me the exact moment in my story when they came. I confess it was pleasing to know that.

Yep, there's something satisfyingly perverse about that.

I've got a few stories of my own that always "work" with me, whenever I read them, and it's always the same place. I am my own Pavlov's dog, and I wrote the damn things!