So can any of you talk with me about "impersonality?"

[Bramblethorn]

Indeed, Simon, a very different style. The men ‘plunged into her belly’ and so forth. And there is much subtlety. And, yes, O came to value herself as a part of the Roissy system, but (style and subtlety again), O screams or cries only under the whip. There is no sexual joy in her that I recall.

"O, still lying motionless on her back, her loins still aflame, was listening, and she had the feeling that by some strange substitution Sir Stephen was speaking for her, in her place. As though he was somehow in her body and could feel the anxiety, the anguish, and the shame, but also the secret pride and harrowing pleasure that she was feeling..."

"The pleasure she derived from seeing a girl pant beneath her caresses, seeing her eyes close and the tips of her breasts stiffen beneath her lips and teeth, the pleasure she got from exploring her fore and aft with her hand - and from feeling her tighten around her fingers, then sigh and moan - was more than she could bear; and if this pleasure was so intense, it was only because it made her constantly aware of the pleasure which she in turn gave when she tightened around whoever was holding her, whenever she sighed or moaned, with this difference, that she could not conceive of being given thus to a girl..."

Her pleasure comes from submission rather than from physical stimulation, but it's there and mentioned repeatedly:

"O was happy that Rene had had her whipped and had prostituted her, because her impassioned submission would furnish her lover with the proof that she belonged to him, but also because the pain and shame of the lash, and the outrage inflicted upon her by those who compelled her to pleasure when they took her, and at the same time delighted in their own without paying the slightest heed to hers, seemed to her the very redemption of her sins. ... And what if, in spite of that, Sir Stephen was right? What if she actually enjoyed her debasement? In that case, the baser she was, the more merciful was Rene to consent to make O the instrument of his pleasure."

"She also told him that she no longer had any inclination not to obey Sir Stephen, realizing full well that from this Rene would conclude that she deemed it essential, and even pleasant to be beaten (which was true; but this was not the only reason)."

etc. etc.

I’m not sure that Literotica would publish it. Mind you, the site wouldn’t publish Romeo and Juliet, either.

And yet... https://www.literotica.com/s/romeo-and-juliet-retold

 

[AG31]

But often in my stories, where it is either purchased sex or "can't help it" casual sex, total surrender--invaded and conquered at the core--is anything but the goal. The total surrender in those circumstances, sans the willingness to make a total commitment, becomes the tragedy of the story. Using your term, it's a failure to maintain self-containment. The protagonist has lost what he wanted to keep to himself.

Yes, I see your point. And those stories have definite power too. How the mighty fall.

 

[TarnishedPenny]

Bramblethorn - thanks for that. And for the R&J link!

Your quotes show, to my mind, that her pleasure was psychological rather than physical. A moot point perhaps; Love-15, sir. It’s your serve.

 

[SimonDoom]

Thanks for this. The first review I ever got for Twelve Maxbridge Street accused it of being "old fashioned," like "classic French erotica." I've taken that label as a badge of honor.

It's been a while since I read the book, but that's how I remember it. The book dealt with O's feelings in some ways but it left a lot out. It didn't treat sex the way many authors today do, with lots of rules and expectations. People just did things, leaving you to puzzle out how you felt about it. O was a bit of a mystery.

 

[madelinemasoch]

I think I like personality that looks like impersonality in erotica. For example, the "slave" diction is used, but that actually brings the characters closer together and not further apart. There's a difference between what my characters think and what they're actually doing that I find very interesting and composes this juxtaposition, I think. There's an objective personal element even when the characters act like it's an impersonal action.

 

[madelinemasoch]

I'm fascinated by the ways characters self-deceive.