Loving Wives is the only place hotwife stories are abused

[Altissimus]

It sure isn't for "those authors who want 5's," is it.

Everyone gets 5s. It's the other scores that make the difference.

Top lists in LW have 4.9s with vote numbers in the thousands. Kinda undermines the argument, doesn't it?

 

[TadOverdon]

The Penthouse Letters books were virtually built on the appeal of hotwife tales - that and IR, often both combined.

 

[NoTalentHack]

According to the category description (hotwives, cucking, swapping, sharing) that's not the place for the monogamy fetish at all.

Hot take: Maybe "Romance" is the place for the monogamy fetish.

It’s not, I don’t think. They have their own structure to storytelling over there, and the two kinds don’t mesh well.

 

[Britva415]

Everyone gets 5s. It's the other scores that make the difference.

Top lists in LW have 4.9s with vote numbers in the thousands. Kinda undermines the argument, doesn't it?

C'mon, have a sense of nuance, for God's sake. Stop pretending anyone anywhere ever meant "all 5's all the time." You know that wasn't what I meant, and you know that wasn't what the person I was responding to meant.

 

[Britva415]

It’s not, I don’t think. They have their own structure to storytelling over there, and the two kinds don’t mesh well.

It's worth discussing, though, in my opinion.

It's not like "one category with structures which don't mesh well" is banned around here or something. There couldn't be a better example of that than Loving Wives. Yet neither of the competing interests in LW align with what OP says is important about their story.

 

[Altissimus]

C'mon, have a sense of nuance, for God's sake. Stop pretending anyone anywhere ever meant "all 5's all the time." You know that wasn't what I meant, and you know that wasn't what the person I was responding to meant.

Either way, top lists in LW score 4.9, so the category does score high for the right story. I get that LW scores lower, on average, than other categories - I saw the recent stats from 8Letter too. But so what? Almost no one scores perfect scores in any category. Whether you write in a category or not isn't decided by your 'fear' of getting less than perfect scores. To suggest otherwise is infantile, and to suggest that LW is only for those who can 'cope' is juvenile.

 

[OverconfidentSarcasm]

It's worth discussing, though, in my opinion.

Is it, though?

I mean, seriously, Literotica is a buyer's market. You put your stories out there for free and then expect people to appreciate it simply because it's free... that's not how it works. People visit categories with clear expectations of what they'll find and, sadly, that doesn't have to align with what the category description says.

"Don't like it, don't read it" is also not gonna help anyone, since, well, I kinda have to read it to know whether I like it.

So, right now, Lit has two options:

They can humor all of the seven authors who keep complaining about the commenters in LW while actually posting their stories to that category, split it in half, and send the BTB crowd on their way. Or they can indulge the readers, who coincidentally are the only ones Lit makes money off, and let them be while you authors can just post your stories in the fetish category, where everything the LW readers hate is well received.

But back to the original topic.

I'm not entirely sure how the comparison between Lit, a free site with free content, is in any way comparable to the paid market. Of course Cuckolding and hotwife stories get better ratings on paid sites, as it turns out that people don't usually pay for stuff they don't want.

And porn videos? I took a quick trip to PornHub and checked the comments under the first few videos I got after searching for "cuckold". What did I find? A mixture of power fantasies and indifference. Barely anyone comments on the cucking in those videos. They just watch a woman get fucked and comment on how "she can take a proper fucking". Those who do comment on the actual theme are mostly imagining themselves in the position of the Bull, something that is hardly possible here since most cuckolding stories are written from the hotwife's or the cuck's POV.

 

[madelinemasoch]

who coincidentally are the only ones Lit makes money off

If we didn't write the stories, there'd be nothing to read. Also, we use the site too: we also give them ad money. Point is, we produce all the content.

 

[Devinter]

Also in the pay market-or a place like PH that makes money on traffic-they're not going to fill the site with content people have a negative reaction to.

I don't know what you mean by this, exactly? I would assume more or less every pornographic site - free or paid for - have content that caters to specific niches, of which the vast majority of the visitors to said site still strongly disapproves? I mean, most people that visit a pornographic site aren't going to go on there and search for one of the most extreme of tags - merely looking for something quite basic-but-satisfactory. Therefore, there is a lot of content on these sites that many people would have negative reactions to, whether it is cuckold stuff, watersports, violent sex, or whatever it may be.

My assumption is that the same can be said about Lit. But here, it's not quite as clear what you're getting yourself into at the beginning of reading a story - compared to visual pornography - unless the author is very good at tagging their stories correctly and includes a plethora of warnings in the foreword / opening of their creation. So, if you're a reader and you're suddenly hit with something you dislike, you're going to have a more negative reaction, because you've invested time into reading the story and then all of a sudden you're made to feel uncomfortable, getting something you're not at all into.

If you expect one thing, and then get another, I don't find it strange that the author would receive a negative reaction. In fact, I would go as far as to say that it is warranted. That doesn't mean that the reader should lash out and act childish over it, of course - but some people are highly emotional and immature.

 

[AwkwardlySet]

If we didn't write the stories, there'd be nothing to read. Also, we use the site too: we also give them ad money. Point is, we produce all the content.

That is a valid point, one that website owners and the majority of readers are happy to ignore. Authors in general should give more voice to their needs and wants in general. There are some changes that could be made to improve the position of authors without taking anything from the readers.

 

[Britva415]

Is it, though?

I mean, seriously, Literotica is a buyer's market.

You might as well say that nothing at all is worth discussing.

Let's just close the Author's Hangout.

 

[AngelRider]

I see it as misogyny and entitlement. I agree with others that its not necessarily incels. I have used that before too but not all incels are black pill swallowing antisocial assholes. Monogamy fetishists doesn't seem to work either because we don't see the same vitriol from other groups. Incest fans don't lose their mind when a story portrays incest with revulsion. The actual cuckold/hot wife fans tend to ignore btb stories rather than bitch out the author.

Its interesting to note that burn the bastard stories with devoted wives and cheating husbands do not perform as well as their counterpart with cheating wives. If the author is presumed female, the story will underperform. Amyyum is a perfect example of this.

 

[NoTalentHack]

If we didn't write the stories, there'd be nothing to read. Also, we use the site too: we also give them ad money. Point is, we produce all the content.

We represent only the tiniest sliver of content here. Every single writer on AH could disappear from the site, and the amount of content would barely dip. Writers come and go from the site every day, and most people never notice.

 

[OverconfidentSarcasm]

If we didn't write the stories, there'd be nothing to read. Also, we use the site too: we also give them ad money. Point is, we produce all the content.

First of all: Lit makes Ad money?
I always thought their only income is generated by their adult store and cam site. Your stories are just a way to generate traffic to advertise those two ventures. And, if readers find that the stories they're looking for get banned or buried, those revenue streams will dry up as the traffic goes down.

You might as well say that nothing at all is worth discussing.

Let's just close the Author's Hangout.

Sorry, not exactly sure why you would take it that way. My argument was that this is a free site. If you want to please your customers, you'll have to give them something they'll enjoy... or look for another market where the customers look for what you're creating.

 

[pink_silk_glove]

That is a valid point, one that website owners and the majority of readers are happy to ignore. Authors in general should give more voice to their needs and wants in general. There are some changes that could be made to improve the position of authors without taking anything from the readers.

What position of authors?

There are plenty of places out there where you can post your stuff behind a paywall. Lit is a place where anyone can post anything with little to no barriers to jump over. It's a place where authors can post their work for a free chance just to be seen. The site is very up front about this and every author who posts accepts this. To then turn around after the fact and insinuate that the author should be compensated in some way is ridiculous. We all fully knowingly post to a free site! There is no compensation owed, neither in money nor in special exposure nor accolades nor anything else. If you win a contest, if you make a top list, cool, but it is not owed, not in the least.

 

[Trionyx]

A future story of mine- “Fire Woman”, I’ve talked about it before- will be placed in Loving Wives. I’ve made that decision. A man and woman, happily married, allow each other brief flings, come back to each other afterwards, their marriage remains intact. Each new fling has the potential to upset the apple cart, but they walk the tightrope and trust each other. This works for them. I like to think this is a polyamorous relationship but also monogamous in its own way.

We’ll see what the readers think of it. Saints preserve me, I’ll start writing it soon.

I wrote one with this exact theme and the vitriol it generated was phenomenal. Basically, the couple, by mutual consent, dipped their toes into a non-monogamous lifestyle and were successful. The comments were so hateful, sexist and even racist that I pulled the story. Never again.

 

[madelinemasoch]

First of all: Lit makes Ad money?
I always thought their only income is generated by their adult store and cam site. Your stories are just a way to generate traffic to advertise those two ventures. And, if readers find that the stories they're looking for get banned or buried, those revenue streams will dry up as the traffic goes down.

Oh. I guess I didn't realize all the ads on here are for Lit's own business.

 

[SimonDoom]

There are some changes that could be made to improve the position of authors without taking anything from the readers.

Such as? 99% of the suggestions for site changes that I see would compromise the interests of readers. This has been true for the entire period (nearly seven years) that I have participated in this forum and read about all the different ways that authors think the site should do things differently. In nearly every case, the suggested change would work against the interest of readers while helping just part of the authors (and ignoring the other authors, like those of us who WANT anonymous comments).

 

[AwkwardlySet]

What position of authors?

There are plenty of places out there where you can post your stuff behind a paywall. Lit is a place where anyone can post anything with little to no barriers to jump over. It's a place where authors can post their work for a free chance just to be seen. The site is very up front about this and every author who posts accepts this. To then turn around after the fact and insinuate that the author should be compensated in some way is ridiculous. We all fully knowingly post to a free site! There is no compensation owed, neither in money nor in special exposure nor accolades nor anything else. If you win a contest, if you make a top list, cool, but it is not owed, not in the least.

You are putting words in my mouth. No one asked for monetary compensation. If I wanted that, I wouldn't be posting here. But there are things that could improve our communication with the readers, for example, some things that could be done to improve the visibility of our stories, some things that could be done to lessen the impact of malicious voting/top list tampering/contest tampering etc.

 

[AchtungNight]

I wrote one with this exact theme and the vitriol it generated was phenomenal. Basically, the couple, by mutual consent, dipped their toes into a non-monogamous lifestyle and were successful. The comments were so hateful, sexist and even racist that I pulled the story. Never again.

Heh. Now you got me interested. Since the couple in question is a celebrity playboy entertainment mogul married to an unorthodox psychologist and this particular story explores his reunion with a childhood crush who is now a sex crime defense attorney, former prosecutor, and she prefers to represent the falsely accused… this might be fun. I have enjoyed troll conflicts before. We’ll see how this plays out.

 

[AwkwardlySet]

Such as? 99% of the suggestions for site changes that I see would compromise the interests of readers. This has been true for the entire period (nearly seven years) that I have participated in this forum and read about all the different ways that authors think the site should do things differently. In nearly every case, the suggested change would work against the interest of readers while helping just part of the authors (and ignoring the other authors, like those of us who WANT anonymous comments).

Is this the "put words in my mouth" night? I'd rather have some lovely lady body parts in it instead, thank you.
I urge you to point out when I ever said anything against anonymous comments? I love them, I crave them, why would I want them gone?

 

[SimonDoom]

Is this the "put words in my mouth" night? I'd rather have some lovely lady body parts in it instead, thank you.
I urge you to point out when I ever said anything against anonymous comments? I love them, I crave them, why would I want them gone?

I didn't mean to say that's what YOU said, I used it as an illustration of one of the changes authors here often recommend, while they disregard the very obvious fact that this would be highly unappealing to readers. Most of the changes people propose here would be unappealing to readers.

 

[AwkwardlySet]

I didn't mean to say that's what YOU said, I used it as an illustration of one of the changes authors here often recommend, while they disregard the very obvious fact that this would be highly unappealing to readers. Most of the changes people propose here would be unappealing to readers.

Instant comments?

 

[pink_silk_glove]

You are putting words in my mouth. No one asked for monetary compensation. If I wanted that, I wouldn't be posting here. But there are things that could improve our communication with the readers, for example, some things that could be done to improve the visibility of our stories, some things that could be done to lessen the impact of malicious voting/top list tampering/contest tampering etc.

I said monetary or otherwise.

Your argument has come up often. Many many times people have suggested in many many different discussions that since the site "makes money off our backs" or something to that extent, that the authors are somehow owed, monetarily or otherwise. Well, no they're not. The site offers to host the author's work for free and that's that. The author agrees to this. At first it seems like a great deal. Then for one reason or another the author feels that it;s not enough and wants to change the agreement after the fact. I've heard many people say, "well we provide the content that the site gets its traffic for, without us ... blahblahblah ..." and by that same token we get no traffic without the lit host. Fair is fair. They offer to host for free, you upload for free, a deal is a deal and it's fair. There is no, "lit owes it to me to only allow nice comments on my stories" or anything like that. There are plenty of other ways for us to put our stuff out there and maintain all the control that we want. Lit owes us nothing.

Now don't get me wrong. The place isn't perfect. It's always okay to suggest a change or a new idea and for us to discuss these things, but to justify a change on the assumption that "lit owes us for our content" is bollocks.

It's like someone puts up a playground with a swingset and a slide but for whatever reason there are no monkey bars. They let everyone come play in the playground for free. The playground becomes quite popular. Then one day someone gets upset because there have never been monkey bars and they really want monkey bars. So they stomp their feet and have a tantrum demanding that the playground owner add monkey bars because a person has an inherent right to enjoy monkey bars for free dammit! Yet the truth remains that the playground is not infringing upon anyone's right to monkey bars by providing free swings and a slide.

 

[AwkwardlySet]

I said monetary or otherwise.

Your argument has come up often. Many many times people have suggested in many many different discussions that since the site "makes money off our backs" or something to that extent, that the authors are somehow owed, monetarily or otherwise. Well, no they're not. The site offers to host the author's work for free and that's that. The author agrees to this. At first it seems like a great deal. Then for one reason or another the author feels that it;s not enough and wants to change the agreement after the fact. I've heard many people say, "well we provide the content that the site gets its traffic for, without us ... blahblahblah ..." and by that same token we get no traffic without the lit host. Fair is fair. They offer to host for free, you upload for free, a deal is a deal and it's fair. There is no, "lit owes it to me to only allow nice comments on my stories" or anything like that. There are plenty of other ways for us to put our stuff out there and maintain all the control that we want. Lit owes us nothing.

Now don't get me wrong. The place isn't perfect. It's always okay to suggest a change or a new idea and for us to discuss these things, but to justify a change on the assumption that "lit owes us for our content" is bollocks.

It's like someone puts up a playground with a swingset and a slide but for whatever reason there are no monkey bars. They let everyone come play in the playground for free. The playground becomes quite popular. Then one day someone gets upset because there have never been monkey bars and they really want monkey bars. So they stomp their feet and have a tantrum demanding that the playground owner add monkey bars because a person has an inherent right to enjoy monkey bars for free dammit! Yet the truth remains that the playground is not infringing upon anyone's right to monkey bars by providing free swings and a slide.

Lit doesn't owe us, authors, anything. I absolutely agree with that one. Your example with the playground isn't a good one, because it neglects to mention that the playground owner earns good money because of those very kids, not from them, but because of them being there. If all the kids abandoned the playground, the playground owner would go broke. It still doesn't mean that the playground owner owes anything to the kids. It does seem strange that he is not willing to communicate and hear them out from time to time. Sometimes, the kids don't ask for monkey bars or anything radical. Sometimes they just ask for a bit of a shade, or a small water faucet so they could drink some water when they get tired.

Huh, this metaphor...