Lost my Cherry in LW!

[MarcDwayne]

Hello Everyone -

I have posted here a couple of times. Thankk you to everyone that has helped! It is appreciated.

First, I was in search of an editor—or better yet, my failed search for an editor. I had a behemoth of a first effort and knew I needed an editor. No-can-do, it seems. I had some "friends" who tried, but I think a story destined for the Loving Wives category requires an interested reader. My friends were kinky, but not for the arc of an LW story.

My Cconclusion from the "Editor" search: Publish something, then look for an editor (advice I got here). This has worked and as I recover from losing my publishing virginity, I am now hopeful I can find an editor or two.

Second was to ask everyone here if I should publish it as one big story or in a series over time.

As 'one story' was the most popular, but in a series (only if completed), was a close second. I had written 90% of the story and painfully edited it myself (a long learning process), to which I got some "editor" feedback. Mainly, your work is so messy that it's not ready for an editor. The horror.

Here is the rub. For my first effort, I didn't write a short story; I wrote a four-part, 109K word small book. What was I thinking?

I released the verbose part one and got eviscerated in the comments section, but there was also a slow rumble of support and encouragement. Part two came quickly, and I informed everyone there would be a final part three. Then I split the ending and published part 3, adding that there was a part 4 conclusion coming. I had not written the ending. You can guess how that went.

The comments - oh, the comments - it burns! The feedback ranged from downright nasty to outright encouragement. Please finish the story! These actually paralyzed me. I'd been warned LW feedback would be spirited, so I was prepared to an extent. It did stop me dead in my tracks.

Do I change direction? Heed the haters? Address all the constructive feedback? Or - die by the sword I began the work?

Conclusion—releasing in a series felt right, given the length of the story. Not having the ending ready, even for the final edit, was a mistake. The delay was unfair, but I never thought anyone would read past part 1. After some thought, I chose "dying by the sword" and followed my notes full speed ahead.

I survived. Here is the list of my feedback conclusions.

Taking in all feedback in the aggregate was a massive learning experience. Thank you everyone!

1)The story was way too long
2)To brave in the point of view changes
3) Too much overlap and repetition in the story
4) God forbid too much sex
5) Deplorable characters (I really tried to make each flawed and two-dimensional, with redemption always possible, but I was shocked at the judgments people made. This is noted for the future)
6) I'm a total shit writer
7) Enough positive feedback to ignore those that claimed #6
8) And all the rest
So why am I here?

This was the most extensive effort I ever made to be a writer. This was my 101 writers' workshop. There is a wonderful feeling that people read what I wrote, and even those who hated it still opened my eyes.

Yet, I am still trying to figure out what the stats tell me. I know I will continue to write, as the encouragement was inspiring. All of these stats were surprising to me: 73 followers, 41K views, 108 comments (still coming), and a 3.6 average rating (which is not terrible in LW I have read, but what do I know).

My writer's surprise is probably why I am writing this big thing here.

1) Messy writing did not come into the feedback equation. Verbose, yes. Point of view switching and overlap, yes. But not messy writing. This was my biggest fear. Now, I still need to learn how to write better. My prose is often messy, and I break the rules, but I made considerable efforts to write dialog and explore points of view. I will have to thank @Altissimus for his initial offer of feedback on this subject. Also @ElectricBlue - yes I am still Marvin the Paranoid Android but your feedback did shift me.

2) Character development—I wrote every character as flawed with two sides. I was floored that readers made choices, ignored the conflict I tried to create, and left room for awareness, growth, or redemption. I did get feedback that this had worked, but my question here is this: Should I exaggerate the positives and negatives? Should I really stay true to the Hero and Villain? Or should I just write them as I see them?

3) Confirming that LW is a minefield but also that I agree with @NoTalentHack - from his excellent Reviews and Essays called "Loving Locing Wives." The very challenge has improved me.

4) Really, too much sex?

5) Back to point - one. I would like to find an editor.

Last, thank you, everyone. I was on a small island in trepidation about publishing that behemoth I wrote. It was in this forum (I forgot the member) that I got the very simple feedback: Just publish and let the chips fall. That and other feedback I got in this forum really pushed me over the edge. So, thank you!

Marc

 

[EmilyMiller]

Hey,

Congrats on your first step into a larger world. Or maybe a smaller one as it’s LW .

My advice (and this is more do as I say, not as I do):

1. Triage the comments. Anything that is just bile or clearly illiterate, ignore (or delete, you have that option). Anything that is positive, analyze if they also said why they liked your story. If there is any content like that, then take note, otherwise ignore. Anything negative (or mixed) but cogently expressed, consider whether or not they have a point and what you would do about it. Maybe even consider PMing the commenter to ask more (and say thank you for the feedback).
2. Within the above, if you notice the names of any actual authors, take a look at their work. Are they any good? If so, try to strike up a convo.
3. After a decent period (how long is up to you - a week, a month, whatever) go back to your story, but as a reader. What strikes you as working / not working, what would you do differently. Did any of those comments actually have a point?

Then, don’t rewrite your story, but try to think about what you can do better next time.

Writing is not about being great, it’s about getting a little better over time.

Good luck!

Emily

 

[Lifestyle66]

Hello Everyone -

I have posted here a couple of times. Thankk you to everyone that has helped! It is appreciated.

First, I was in search of an editor—or better yet, my failed search for an editor. I had a behemoth of a first effort and knew I needed an editor. No-can-do, it seems. I had some "friends" who tried, but I think a story destined for the Loving Wives category requires an interested reader. My friends were kinky, but not for the arc of an LW story.

My Cconclusion from the "Editor" search: Publish something, then look for an editor (advice I got here). This has worked and as I recover from losing my publishing virginity, I am now hopeful I can find an editor or two.

Second was to ask everyone here if I should publish it as one big story or in a series over time.

As 'one story' was the most popular, but in a series (only if completed), was a close second. I had written 90% of the story and painfully edited it myself (a long learning process), to which I got some "editor" feedback. Mainly, your work is so messy that it's not ready for an editor. The horror.

Here is the rub. For my first effort, I didn't write a short story; I wrote a four-part, 109K word small book. What was I thinking?

I released the verbose part one and got eviscerated in the comments section, but there was also a slow rumble of support and encouragement. Part two came quickly, and I informed everyone there would be a final part three. Then I split the ending and published part 3, adding that there was a part 4 conclusion coming. I had not written the ending. You can guess how that went.

The comments - oh, the comments - it burns! The feedback ranged from downright nasty to outright encouragement. Please finish the story! These actually paralyzed me. I'd been warned LW feedback would be spirited, so I was prepared to an extent. It did stop me dead in my tracks.

Do I change direction? Heed the haters? Address all the constructive feedback? Or - die by the sword I began the work?

Conclusion—releasing in a series felt right, given the length of the story. Not having the ending ready, even for the final edit, was a mistake. The delay was unfair, but I never thought anyone would read past part 1. After some thought, I chose "dying by the sword" and followed my notes full speed ahead.

I survived. Here is the list of my feedback conclusions.

Taking in all feedback in the aggregate was a massive learning experience. Thank you everyone!

1)The story was way too long
2)To brave in the point of view changes
3) Too much overlap and repetition in the story
4) God forbid too much sex
5) Deplorable characters (I really tried to make each flawed and two-dimensional, with redemption always possible, but I was shocked at the judgments people made. This is noted for the future)
6) I'm a total shit writer
7) Enough positive feedback to ignore those that claimed #6
8) And all the rest
So why am I here?

This was the most extensive effort I ever made to be a writer. This was my 101 writers' workshop. There is a wonderful feeling that people read what I wrote, and even those who hated it still opened my eyes.

Yet, I am still trying to figure out what the stats tell me. I know I will continue to write, as the encouragement was inspiring. All of these stats were surprising to me: 73 followers, 41K views, 108 comments (still coming), and a 3.6 average rating (which is not terrible in LW I have read, but what do I know).

My writer's surprise is probably why I am writing this big thing here.

1) Messy writing did not come into the feedback equation. Verbose, yes. Point of view switching and overlap, yes. But not messy writing. This was my biggest fear. Now, I still need to learn how to write better. My prose is often messy, and I break the rules, but I made considerable efforts to write dialog and explore points of view. I will have to thank @Altissimus for his initial offer of feedback on this subject. Also @ElectricBlue - yes I am still Marvin the Paranoid Android but your feedback did shift me.

2) Character development—I wrote every character as flawed with two sides. I was floored that readers made choices, ignored the conflict I tried to create, and left room for awareness, growth, or redemption. I did get feedback that this had worked, but my question here is this: Should I exaggerate the positives and negatives? Should I really stay true to the Hero and Villain? Or should I just write them as I see them?

3) Confirming that LW is a minefield but also that I agree with @NoTalentHack - from his excellent Reviews and Essays called "Loving Locing Wives." The very challenge has improved me.

4) Really, too much sex?

5) Back to point - one. I would like to find an editor.

Last, thank you, everyone. I was on a small island in trepidation about publishing that behemoth I wrote. It was in this forum (I forgot the member) that I got the very simple feedback: Just publish and let the chips fall. That and other feedback I got in this forum really pushed me over the edge. So, thank you!

Marc

Congratulations on taking this big step into the LW swamp!

Seriously, you'll find many negative opinions here in the forum disparaging the LW audience. And many of those nay-sayers won't publish there for fear of attracting 1-bombers. But your story rated at 3.6 and higher for those four parts is GOOD! If you wanted a 4.5 rating, then it would need to be a BTB story. So, ratings are relative to the category audience, and I recommend NOT getting too focused on chasing the "Red-H" of a 4.5 (as many other authors seem to need.)


I'll try reading yours and if I do, I'll definitely leave honest comments. But reading 104K words (to me) is a daunting task. So, I make no promises beyond the first part.

 

[NoTalentHack]

Welcome! Glad to have you writing here.

 

[MarcDwayne]

Congratulations on taking this big step into the LW swamp!

Seriously, you'll find many negative opinions here in the forum disparaging the LW audience. And many of those nay-sayers won't publish there for fear of attracting 1-bombers. But your story rated at 3.6 and higher for those four parts is GOOD! If you wanted a 4.5 rating, then it would need to be a BTB story. So, ratings are relative to the category audience, and I recommend NOT getting too focused on chasing the "Red-H" of a 4.5 (as many other authors seem to need.)


I'll try reading yours and if I do, I'll definitely leave honest comments. But reading 104K words (to me) is a daunting task. So, I make no promises beyond the first part.

Thank you for the feedback - and I know it's too long, especially at the front end. So Part One is the most verbose and has the most point of view changes with duplications (something I will be very very mindful to limit or not do going forward.) This all evens out as the parts evolve w Part 4 being the most clean. The best advice I got - was I should have accelerated the betrayal and spent more time on the ending ... you can probably speed read part one .. but I appreciate the offer and do not have an explanation why I wrote such a long first effort.

 

[joy_of_cooking]

Congratulations on your first novel, in LW no less! Truly a trial by fire. Thank you for writing up these reflections.

If you're still looking for an editor, consider writing a shorter story and asking for someone to read that story. It's a way for both parties to try out the editor-author relationship without a big commitment.

 

[MarcDwayne]

Welcome! Glad to have you writing here.

Thank you! Your essay (and stories) helped a lot.

 

[MarcDwayne]

Congratulations on your first novel, in LW no less! Truly a trial by fire. Thank you for writing up these reflections.

If you're still looking for an editor, consider writing a shorter story and asking for someone to read that story. It's a way for both parties to try out the editor-author relationship without a big commitment.

Yea - the next one will be music shorter. I was very surprised so many read the whole thing! Thank you!

 

[EmilyMiller]

Welcome! Glad to have you writing here.

Hey! Jinx

 

[MarcDwayne]

Hey,

Congrats on your first step into a larger world. Or maybe a smaller one as it’s LW .

My advice (and this is more do as I say, not as I do):

1. Triage the comments. Anything that is just bile or clearly illiterate, ignore (or delete, you have that option). Anything that is positive, analyze if they also said why they liked your story. If there is any content like that, then take note, otherwise ignore. Anything negative (or mixed) but cogently expressed, consider whether or not they have a point and what you would do about it. Maybe even consider PMing the commenter to ask more (and say thank you for the feedback).
2. Within the above, if you notice the names of any actual authors, take a look at their work. Are they any good? If so, try to strike up a convo.
3. After a decent period (how long is up to you - a week, a month, whatever) go back to your story, but as a reader. What strikes you as working / not working, what would you do differently. Did any of those comments actually have a point?

Then, don’t rewrite your story, but try to think about what you can do better next time.

Writing is not about being great, it’s about getting a little better over time.

Good luck!

Emily

Thank you Emily! True words.

 

[lovecraft68]

Be aware that if you choose to post your next story in another category the result will be far more positive than what you received in LW. Lot of angry people over there.

 

[Lifestyle66]

Be aware that if you choose to post your next story in another category the result will be far more positive than what you received in LW. Lot of angry people over there.

So says one of the Red-H chasers.

Be aware that if MarcDwayne posts to any other category, the story will be read by less than half as many people as it would in LW.

Two years ago, I posted a 750-word story to Humor & Satire("Getting Too Close - 750 Words"), and after two years it still has only less than 3k views with 51 votes for 3.39.

This year, I have a "Humor & Satire" story which I posted to LW("Chasing Her in the Wild"), which (in just two weeks) has over 13K views and rated about the same 3.47 with 251 votes!

So, which is better: an audience of 3K or 13K?

 

[NoTalentHack]

Be aware that if you choose to post your next story in another category the result will be far more positive than what you received in LW. Lot of angry people over there.

Possibly. However, he may also run into what I have, i.e., that the folks from LW follow on to other categories. My stories get a LOT more comments--and did, even early on--than others in the same categories, and most of them are coming from folks active in the LW comments. And they will, some of them anyways, judge them by the standards they apply to LW stories. It's a double-edged sword.

 

[lovecraft68]

So says one of the Red-H chasers.

Be aware that if MarcDwayne posts to any other category, the story will be read by less than half as many people as it would in LW.

Two years ago, I posted a 750-word story to Humor & Satire, and after two years it still has only less than 3k views with 51 votes for 3.39.

This year, I have a "Humor & Satire" story which I posted to LW, with (in just two weeks) has over 13K views and rated about the same 3.47 with 251 votes!

So, which is better: an audience of 3K or 13K?

The OP is brand new, so I'm pointing out he won't get abused the same way in other categories. I say this because I don't want him to be put off like so many others have from a crappy reaction to a first story.

To your example, what's more important, quality or quantity? Some prefer less comments and views, providing they're getting a better response to more of each and most of them nasty.

That varies from author to author, but being he's new he should know the landscape and be informed enough to make the choice.

I also wouldn't make a comment to anyone about chasing H's when you're obviously obsessed with votes and views.

I've posted in LW, therefore I can speak to what its like there.

 

[Lifestyle66]

I've posted in LW, therefore I can speak to what its like there.

You have four stories over the past 12 years posted to LW. The first posted 12 years ago, and (from its title and description) indicates a wife's revenge against her cheating husband. It's rated 4.57 (Red-H), and yet you have repeatedly disparaged the LW audience as misogynistic women haters. Your own stories and ratings there suggests otherwise.

From what I see in your 4 stories in LW, that audience just hates extra-marital sex, whether it's male or female cheaters, and they like revenge against cheaters. The majority tend to hate extra-marital sex when it's consensual.


And BTW: I'm not obsessed with votes and views. I'm obsessed with gathering a larger sample size to better quantify how shitty my writing is. A handful of "5-bombing lovers of my stories" isn't realistic.

 

[MarcDwayne]

The OP is brand new, so I'm pointing out he won't get abused the same way in other categories. I say this because I don't want him to be put off like so many others have from a crappy reaction to a first story.

To your example, what's more important, quality or quantity? Some prefer less comments and views, providing they're getting a better response to more of each and most of them nasty.

That varies from author to author, but being he's new he should know the landscape and be informed enough to make the choice.

I also wouldn't make a comment to anyone about chasing H's when you're obviously obsessed with votes and views.

I've posted in LW, therefore I can speak to what its like there.

Hello Lovecraft68 - thank yo so much for the feedback. Luckily for me, I had read @NoTalentHack 's well written Loving Loving Wives essay. I was also a voracious reader of the LW category. I knew full well the lions den I was entering. Funny enough, I had little hopes of readership and personally thought my grasp of the English language would be the item thrown into the crucible. It was not, funny enough (still much work to do).

Now, I went to battle w the comments a bit. I even deleted a few but left the vast majority intact. What I decided was to do was very close to what @EmilyMiller and others suggested. However, even the haters had much of their criticism right. I've never understood "nasty" so I sifted to deduce what their ire was. In many cases, I realized even the most vitriol of 'anonymous' commenters - actually read the story. It was my Howard Stern moment I guess.

Net result I created aggregate conclusions - which forced me to be reflective.

At this point, I am recent ex-virgin and just the fact I got any views, tickled me pink.

The only part that rankled was how hated the two MC's were by some, when I purposely wrote them flawed - as I thought that was realistic. Also, I tackled Addiction - which again I was surprised how few really understand its power to distort people. It seems redemption or wisdom, or growth is not possible to so many - which was both a lesson and a conundrum for future writing (or not).

I thank you for your kind positive words ...

 

[MillieDynamite]

I applaud your efforts. I know only a few writers who write stories without any likable characters and still have people who love their work. At the top of that list is the Catholic Southern Gothic author Flannery O'Connor. If you pull that little tidbit, you are the writer extraordinar.

Hello Everyone -

Taking in all feedback in the aggregate was a massive learning experience. Thank you everyone!

5) Deplorable characters (I really tried to make each flawed and two-dimensional, with redemption always possible, but I was shocked at the judgments people made. This is noted for the future)


Marc

 

[MarcDwayne]

I applaud your efforts. I know only a few writers who write stories without any likable characters and still have people who love their work. At the top of that list is the Catholic Southern Gothic author Flannery O'Connor. If you pull that little tidbit, you are the writer extraordinar.

Thank you so much for that rabbit hole. My curiosity is triggered! Southern Gothic - digging in. Thank you.

Truth be told, in the end many did see that the cloud of addiction was in play ...

"I was frozen when I found the dirty coke mirror. I stared at it. Seeing my reflection behind the residue of the drugs I was so in love with. This metaphor was stark. My reflection was obscured by drugs. Using had blurred who I was. In a flash, I cleaned that mirror. I doused it with disinfectant, then Windex, followed by a polishing cloth. I never looked at it while doing this, but I timidly peered into the new reflection once it was clean.

What I saw was a very sad, broken young girl, scared and alone."

 

[MillieDynamite]

Well, she is a Catholic writer, so there are morals in the story, though if you're not a Catholic or at least religious, you'll miss the symbolism. But her stories are pretty good. At least, I love them.

Thank you so much for that rabbit hole. My curiosity is triggered! Southern Gothic - digging in. Thank you.

Truth be told, in the end many did see that the cloud of addiction was in play ...

"I was frozen when I found the dirty coke mirror. I stared at it. Seeing my reflection behind the residue of the drugs I was so in love with. This metaphor was stark. My reflection was obscured by drugs. Using had blurred who I was. In a flash, I cleaned that mirror. I doused it with disinfectant, then Windex, followed by a polishing cloth. I never looked at it while doing this, but I timidly peered into the new reflection once it was clean.

What I saw was a very sad, broken young girl, scared and alone."

 

[Dark_Logan_]

So the general unwritten rule is expect the brown stuff to hit the fan in LW so the writer should just ignore the associated detritus that flies back in your face… sorry, the associated constructive criticism ?

It’s not a category I’ve broached yet BUT I’ve a story I’m slowly working on and given the theme of its overall plot I’m struggling to think of a better place to host it than anywhere other than LW (Spoiler Alert; it’s central character seduces a married woman and leads her astray across several chapters)

The associated content is sure to poke the bear

What might infuriate the reader even further is my personal preference to turn off voting on all my stories

I can feel the unbridled rage already

 

[Lifestyle66]

Thank you for the feedback - and I know it's too long, especially at the front end. So Part One is the most verbose and has the most point of view changes with duplications (something I will be very very mindful to limit or not do going forward.) This all evens out as the parts evolve w Part 4 being the most clean. The best advice I got - was I should have accelerated the betrayal and spent more time on the ending ... you can probably speed read part one .. but I appreciate the offer and do not have an explanation why I wrote such a long first effort.

Okay, I'll admit right now that I'm only a third of the way through part 1.

For longer stories, I use a text to speech program and listen to them. And Part 1 took ten changes from male to female to male voices. I've only listened to the first two (his then hers) for a total of fifty minute. Yes, it is a long story. But, I'm taking a break and I'll give you my first impressions.

In looking at some of the text, there are errors to work on. There are some partial sentences. And I've learned via text-to-speech that "yea" and "yeah" are two very different words. "Yea" (which you use) is an exclamation of affirmative joy, while you might use "yeah" which is like a more common "yes".

As for the speed reading, I won't recommend that for anyone reading this story. You've written a great deal of detail to make the characters come alive! People should read and appreciate that detail! I looked at some of the critical comments, and some decry the drug use. But these are real people, and some people do live that way. You're showing a very different aspect of life. And so far, it reminds me of Steinbeck's "Cannery Row", not your average middle-class or even working-class characters, but a very different part of life.

So, if you had stopped at this point with a chapter dedicated to just that part when she goes back to her own place, I'd give it a well-earned 5! Leave the voting on and take it! Run with it. Appreciate the larger audience you are sharing this with!

 

[MarcDwayne]

Okay, I'll admit right now that I'm only a third of the way through part 1.

For longer stories, I use a text to speech program and listen to them. And Part 1 took ten changes from male to female to male voices. I've only listened to the first two (his then hers) for a total of fifty minute. Yes, it is a long story. But, I'm taking a break and I'll give you my first impressions.

In looking at some of the text, there are errors to work on. There are some partial sentences. And I've learned via text-to-speech that "yea" and "yeah" are two very different words. "Yea" (which you use) is an exclamation of affirmative joy, while you might use "yeah" which is like a more common "yes".

As for the speed reading, I won't recommend that for anyone reading this story. You've written a great deal of detail to make the characters come alive! People should read and appreciate that detail! I looked at some of the critical comments, and some decry the drug use. But these are real people, and some people do live that way. You're showing a very different aspect of life. And so far, it reminds me of Steinbeck's "Cannery Row", not your average middle-class or even working-class characters, but a very different part of life.

So, if you had stopped at this point with a chapter dedicated to just that part when she goes back to her own place, I'd give it a well-earned 5! Leave the voting on and take it! Run with it. Appreciate the larger audience you are sharing this with!

Thank you so much … I am not totally clear about “So, if you had stopped … “ but not matter, I appreciate this a lot!

 

[Djmac1031]

Gonna be straight up honest that I probably won't get to your story... not huge on the LW category... but I am absolutely intrigued and interested in your post here.

It's rare to see a first time writer so thoroughly... and HONESTLY... examine not just the process of writing it, but the aftermath and what you can learn from the experience

So kudos to you. Wishing you many more stories.

 

[Helgamite]

Hello Everyone -

I have posted here a couple of times. Thankk you to everyone that has helped! It is appreciated.

First, I was in search of an editor—or better yet, my failed search for an editor. I had a behemoth of a first effort and knew I needed an editor. No-can-do, it seems. I had some "friends" who tried, but I think a story destined for the Loving Wives category requires an interested reader. My friends were kinky, but not for the arc of an LW story.

My Cconclusion from the "Editor" search: Publish something, then look for an editor (advice I got here). This has worked and as I recover from losing my publishing virginity, I am now hopeful I can find an editor or two.

Second was to ask everyone here if I should publish it as one big story or in a series over time.

As 'one story' was the most popular, but in a series (only if completed), was a close second. I had written 90% of the story and painfully edited it myself (a long learning process), to which I got some "editor" feedback. Mainly, your work is so messy that it's not ready for an editor. The horror.

Here is the rub. For my first effort, I didn't write a short story; I wrote a four-part, 109K word small book. What was I thinking?

I released the verbose part one and got eviscerated in the comments section, but there was also a slow rumble of support and encouragement. Part two came quickly, and I informed everyone there would be a final part three. Then I split the ending and published part 3, adding that there was a part 4 conclusion coming. I had not written the ending. You can guess how that went.

The comments - oh, the comments - it burns! The feedback ranged from downright nasty to outright encouragement. Please finish the story! These actually paralyzed me. I'd been warned LW feedback would be spirited, so I was prepared to an extent. It did stop me dead in my tracks.

Do I change direction? Heed the haters? Address all the constructive feedback? Or - die by the sword I began the work?

Conclusion—releasing in a series felt right, given the length of the story. Not having the ending ready, even for the final edit, was a mistake. The delay was unfair, but I never thought anyone would read past part 1. After some thought, I chose "dying by the sword" and followed my notes full speed ahead.

I survived. Here is the list of my feedback conclusions.

Taking in all feedback in the aggregate was a massive learning experience. Thank you everyone!

1)The story was way too long
2)To brave in the point of view changes
3) Too much overlap and repetition in the story
4) God forbid too much sex
5) Deplorable characters (I really tried to make each flawed and two-dimensional, with redemption always possible, but I was shocked at the judgments people made. This is noted for the future)
6) I'm a total shit writer
7) Enough positive feedback to ignore those that claimed #6
8) And all the rest
So why am I here?

This was the most extensive effort I ever made to be a writer. This was my 101 writers' workshop. There is a wonderful feeling that people read what I wrote, and even those who hated it still opened my eyes.

Yet, I am still trying to figure out what the stats tell me. I know I will continue to write, as the encouragement was inspiring. All of these stats were surprising to me: 73 followers, 41K views, 108 comments (still coming), and a 3.6 average rating (which is not terrible in LW I have read, but what do I know).

My writer's surprise is probably why I am writing this big thing here.

1) Messy writing did not come into the feedback equation. Verbose, yes. Point of view switching and overlap, yes. But not messy writing. This was my biggest fear. Now, I still need to learn how to write better. My prose is often messy, and I break the rules, but I made considerable efforts to write dialog and explore points of view. I will have to thank @Altissimus for his initial offer of feedback on this subject. Also @ElectricBlue - yes I am still Marvin the Paranoid Android but your feedback did shift me.

2) Character development—I wrote every character as flawed with two sides. I was floored that readers made choices, ignored the conflict I tried to create, and left room for awareness, growth, or redemption. I did get feedback that this had worked, but my question here is this: Should I exaggerate the positives and negatives? Should I really stay true to the Hero and Villain? Or should I just write them as I see them?

3) Confirming that LW is a minefield but also that I agree with @NoTalentHack - from his excellent Reviews and Essays called "Loving Locing Wives." The very challenge has improved me.

4) Really, too much sex?

5) Back to point - one. I would like to find an editor.

Last, thank you, everyone. I was on a small island in trepidation about publishing that behemoth I wrote. It was in this forum (I forgot the member) that I got the very simple feedback: Just publish and let the chips fall. That and other feedback I got in this forum really pushed me over the edge. So, thank you!

Marc

If your still curious about the stats. I had a thread about it with @EmilyMiller and a couple others helping me understand the stats and what they mean. Emily is Real good, I would listen to her when she comments.

https://forum.literotica.com/threads/stats-on-stories.1605212/#post-98408581

that is my stats thread, they helped me understand it all better. Take a look at it as it might help you as well.

 

[gunhilltrain]

Thank you for the feedback - and I know it's too long, especially at the front end. So Part One is the most verbose and has the most point of view changes with duplications (something I will be very very mindful to limit or not do going forward.) This all evens out as the parts evolve w Part 4 being the most clean. The best advice I got - was I should have accelerated the betrayal and spent more time on the ending ... you can probably speed read part one .. but I appreciate the offer and do not have an explanation why I wrote such a long first effort.

If I may digress a bit: you probably have realized that posting in LW is like throwing meat into the lion cages (back when zoos still used cages for lions). They roar at bit, chew on their meal, and then fall asleep. Meanwhile, you are on the other side of the bars and you are free to go visit the show-off walrus in his water compound.

https://zooinstitutes.com/img/animals/33/3381.jpg.pagespeed.ce.HdFSLQppRa.jpg