Landmark Report Concludes Abortion In U.S. Is Safe

[BotanyBoy]

You two either need to fuck or shut the fuck up. My fucking god. Every gottdamn thread you two argue the same points/counterpoints and hurl the same lame ass insults.

Oh common now I'm relatively certain you know I'm an ace with more interest in street food than sex.

 

[beew]

^ This.

Those who argue against abortion rights, under whatever guise, typically have as a middle conclusion a conflict of interest between mother and fetus - a conflict of rights. Assuming at some point during gestation the fetus becomes morally considerable and acquires rights (and not everyone agrees to this), for abortion to be morally permissible that conflict must be resolved. Rob's argument is the best I've encountered, though it's sometimes uncharitably called the parasite argument. It's a stronger argument than one grounded on privacy rights, which doesn't determine the status of the fetus, but merely presupposes it.

You keep patting yourself on your shoulder but indeed, this is one of the best arguments that I've read.
I think that the 'Abortion debate' is one of the most complex and unsolvable ethical debates.

If I became President, I'd focus on prevention instead.
Like making contraception cheaper, and easier or free access to prescribing doctors.

I'd also make sure somehow that the women who underwent more than two abortions were exposed to education and had contraception readily available.
Within limits of course, because for most of them the decision was heartbreaking and traumatizing.

However, I'd be much more forceful with those who had more than four abortions; I'd ask them to attend regular doctor appointments, or in extreme either mandate them and their partners to have a semi-permanent method of contraception (IUD, tubal ligation or vasectomy). Rights over your body my ass, when you're using abortion as a method of contraception.

 

[Boxlicker101]

You keep patting yourself on your shoulder but indeed, this is one of the best arguments that I've read.
I think that the 'Abortion debate' is one of the most complex and unsolvable ethical debates.

If I became President, I'd focus on prevention instead.
Like making contraception cheaper, and easier or free access to prescribing doctors.

I'd also make sure somehow that the women who underwent more than two abortions were exposed to education and had contraception readily available.
Within limits of course, because for most of them the decision was heartbreaking and traumatizing.

However, I'd be much more forceful with those who had more than four abortions; I'd ask them to attend regular doctor appointments, or in extreme either mandate them and their partners to have a semi-permanent method of contraception (IUD, tubal ligation or vasectomy). Rights over your body my ass, when you're using abortion as a method of contraception.

Contraception is already cheap and easy. I can walk into drug stores everywhere and buy condoms for very low prices. And, besides preventing pregnancy, they also prevent STD's and AIDS, which are always risks with casual sex.

 

[beew]

Contraception is already cheap and easy. I can walk into drug stores everywhere and buy condoms for very low prices. And, besides preventing pregnancy, they also prevent STD's and AIDS, which are always risks with casual sex.

Yes, but that's the typical contraception for casual sex. But those in committed relationships prefer the other types of contraception, which require consult with a doctor, blodd tests or so on.

 

[Chancellor_Palpatine]

You keep patting yourself on your shoulder but indeed, this is one of the best arguments that I've read.
I think that the 'Abortion debate' is one of the most complex and unsolvable ethical debates.

Hashtag is agreeing with me. FUCK!

 

[KimGordon67]

I'm thinking it is NOT safe for the baby!

And I would take a long look at that study also...

It's not a baby.

 

[KimGordon67]

Don't have to be.

What was wrong yesterday is wrong today and will be wrong tomorrow.

I am smart enough to know that.

And THAT is a hell of a lot smarter than about a third of this nation.

It may surprise you to know that abortions aren't a new thing - people have been working out ways to do that for centuries. What's new is that it's now more effective, and safer.

 

[BobaFetaCheese]

Yes, but that's the typical contraception for casual sex. But those in committed relationships prefer the other types of contraception, which require consult with a doctor, blodd tests or so on.

What the hell are you talking about?

 

[BobaFetaCheese]

Hashtag is agreeing with me. FUCK!

Only time he's ever been right about anything from what I've seen.

 

[BobBalouski]

Just a pop at the unqualified men here who like to lecture women about their bodies. If men got pregnant there wouldn't be a discussion

stickyguy wannabeing a woman again...

 

[BobBalouski]

Not only that, but this is from someone who does not play by the rules.

 

[KimGordon67]

You keep patting yourself on your shoulder but indeed, this is one of the best arguments that I've read.
I think that the 'Abortion debate' is one of the most complex and unsolvable ethical debates.

If I became President, I'd focus on prevention instead.
Like making contraception cheaper, and easier or free access to prescribing doctors.

I'd also make sure somehow that the women who underwent more than two abortions were exposed to education and had contraception readily available.
Within limits of course, because for most of them the decision was heartbreaking and traumatizing.

However, I'd be much more forceful with those who had more than four abortions; I'd ask them to attend regular doctor appointments, or in extreme either mandate them and their partners to have a semi-permanent method of contraception (IUD, tubal ligation or vasectomy). Rights over your body my ass, when you're using abortion as a method of contraception.

Very very few people use abortion as a 'means of contraception'. (I'd say 'no one', but someone would find one case just to prove me wrong, so I'll go with 'very few'.)
There's a whole raft of reasons unintended pregnancies happy (source). And you can puff your chest out and say 'Oh, I'd always be more sensible than that' all you want, but anyone whose actually had sex that had one iota of passion in it will know that, in the heat of the moment, you can make some dumb arse decisions. And if you were sexually active in your youth with people you weren't necessarily in 'relationships' with, it's entirely possible you were the cause of an abortion you never even knew about.
Yes, we shouldn't make those stupid decisions in the heat of the moment - but to punish someone with a lifetime of unwanted parenting because of a stupid decision seems ridiculously harsh ... especially when, in many instances, you're also consigning the hypothetical child to a less-than-ideal life.

Sex is a pretty easy thing, and let's not pretend that we all approach it with great gravitas and forethought, because we just don't.
Becoming a parent is a serious undertaking. It's not something that should be foisted upon someone because of any of the reasons listed in the above Wiki entry, or simply because of an error of judgement.

 

[cowslinger64]

No it's objectively irrelevant because it has NOTHING to do with the topic at hand.



Do the pro-choice folks not regularly want public support?

Do they not want HC services and abortions paid by others?



Irrelevant bullshit again that's off topic.

The topic being government forcing money out of people.....not the virtues of publicly funded abortions.



Because nobody gives 2 pumps of rat shit about your fucking feelings cupcake!!

They do care about money and who's getting it though.



You've got it backwards.

Emotional arguments are also known as a sales pitch for a reason...start talking cold hard cash without the emotional appeal in place to support it and MOST people close their wallets and walk away.

How many different people need to point out what a total dumbfuck you are before it sinks in?

You win the dumbass of the internet. I never thought anyone could top vette.. but you are a WINNER!!!

 

[beew]

Very very few people use abortion as a 'means of contraception'. (I'd say 'no one', but someone would find one case just to prove me wrong, so I'll go with 'very few'.)
There's a whole raft of reasons unintended pregnancies happy (source). And you can puff your chest out and say 'Oh, I'd always be more sensible than that' all you want, but anyone whose actually had sex that had one iota of passion in it will know that, in the heat of the moment, you can make some dumb arse decisions. And if you were sexually active in your youth with people you weren't necessarily in 'relationships' with, it's entirely possible you were the cause of an abortion you never even knew about.
Yes, we shouldn't make those stupid decisions in the heat of the moment - but to punish someone with a lifetime of unwanted parenting because of a stupid decision seems ridiculously harsh ... especially when, in many instances, you're also consigning the hypothetical child to a less-than-ideal life.

Sex is a pretty easy thing, and let's not pretend that we all approach it with great gravitas and forethought, because we just don't.
Becoming a parent is a serious undertaking. It's not something that should be foisted upon someone because of any of the reasons listed in the above Wiki entry, or simply because of an error of judgement.

I think that you misunderstood my posts.
What I was trying to get at:

Imo, up to 2 abortions are understandable and most likely accidental.
I, like you, empathise with their situation and am against conservatives who attack those women.

But a person who had more than 4 abortions: that points to sloppy practices.
I'm not implying that those women constitute the majority; on the contrary, they are in a minority. But those women Do exist.

And what's so punishing about having one's doctor insist on IUD to the person who habitually forgets to take the pill? Or a vassectomy for th guy who doesn't like to use condoms? Those procedures aren't permanent, after all.
It's much worse to have such a flippant attitude about a lifeform.

 

[KimGordon67]

I think that you misunderstood my posts.
What I was trying to get at:

Imo, up to 2 abortions are understandable and most likely accidental.
I, like you, empathise with their situation and am against conservatives who attack those women.

But a person who had more than 4 abortions: that points to sloppy practices.
I'm not implying that those women constitute the majority; on the contrary, they are in a minority. But those women Do exist.

And what's so punishing about having one's doctor insist on IUD to the person who habitually forgets to take the pill? Or a vassectomy for th guy who doesn't like to use condoms? Those procedures aren't permanent, after all.
It's much worse to have such a flippant attitude about a lifeform.

LMAO. Have you ever tried to talk a guy into having a vasectomy?

And again, even if someone is 'sloppy', does that mean we should consign them to 20+ years of parenting?
(And you can't have doctors 'insist' on anything - the right to refuse medical treatment is pretty fundamental.)

 

[adrina]

You two either need to fuck or shut the fuck up. My fucking god. Every gottdamn thread you two argue the same points/counterpoints and hurl the same lame ass insults.

I'll opt for shutting up as one thing is as certain as the rising sun - this is boring and tedious. This is why I try to stick with not interacting with him. It's pointless (no offense to pointless) and frankly goes nowhere. Idiot doesn't understand human nature enough to understand some very basic concepts.

There's actual fun to be had here - and this sure ain't it.

 

[beew]

LMAO. Have you ever tried to talk a guy into having a vasectomy?

And again, even if someone is 'sloppy', does that mean we should consign them to 20+ years of parenting?
(And you can't have doctors 'insist' on anything - the right to refuse medical treatment is pretty fundamental.)

You're deflecting and twisting words. I never said what you're implying: "even if someone is 'sloppy', does that mean we should consign them to 20+ years of parenting?"

I'm fine with people who are pointing out the errors in my thinking, however harsh they might be. But not with zealots who are purposefully twisting my words and putting words into my mouth.

That's the plight of Centrists nowadays. The Right and Left say: "Either you're with us, or against us."

 

[Saint_Ann]

I'll opt for shutting up as one thing is as certain as the rising sun - this is boring and tedious. This is why I try to stick with not interacting with him. It's pointless (no offense to pointless) and frankly goes nowhere. Idiot doesn't understand human nature enough to understand some very basic concepts.

There's actual fun to be had here - and this sure ain't it.

Ain't nothing quite as fun as scraping a baby off the uterine wall with a spoon and sucking it out with a hose.

 

[Chancellor_Palpatine]

Ain't nothing quite as fun as scraping a baby off the uterine wall with a spoon and sucking it out with a hose.

Oh my gawd, that makes me harrrd.

 

[adrina]

Oh my gawd, that makes me harrrd.

Let's go get an abortion. Should be a great date night.

 

[Chancellor_Palpatine]

Let's go get an abortion. Should be a great date night.

I'll pay for the first two, but you get the third. Then we can sell it for the profit$.

 

[adrina]

I'll pay for the first two, but you get the third. Then we can sell it for the profit$.

Such a gentleman... not even going dutch treat.

Sounds like a plan.

 

[beew]

LMAO. Have you ever tried to talk a guy into having a vasectomy?

And again, even if someone is 'sloppy', does that mean we should consign them to 20+ years of parenting?
(And you can't have doctors 'insist' on anything - the right to refuse medical treatment is pretty fundamental.)

My point was:
Unintended pregnancies are - roughly speaking- due to either contraceptive failure, or forgetfullness.
In case of the latter:

Personally, I would never dare to judge a woman who had two abortions because she forgot to take her pills or to ask her partner to use a condom.

But any ethical or reflective person would ask herself deeper, more meaningful questions after that, and would take measures so that such accidents don't reccur.
I find those persons who continue to have 3, 4, 5 abortions because they either continue to forget about contraception, or didn't consider IUD or vasectomy in their partner, to be irresponsible.

ETA
Those particular women are a very small minority, and I wouldn't have continued on the topic unless you did.

 

[BotanyBoy]

How many different people need to point out what a total dumbfuck you are before it sinks in?

You win the dumbass of the internet. I never thought anyone could top vette.. but you are a WINNER!!!

Nobody's done such a thing.

Your name calling, lies and bullshitting don't count.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Idiot doesn't understand human nature enough to understand some very basic concepts.

^ can't even begin to identify much less explain those "very basic" concepts because so compelled to make emotional appeals about side topics.