Writing 'The End' at the end of a story.

[KeithD]

How do people feel about:

I think "The End?" would make the attentive reader chuckle.

 

[Duleigh]

It astonishes me that people actually have strong opinions about this. The presence of "The End" at the end of a story has never had an impact on my appreciation of the story, and I can't imagine it doing so.

I'll note that The Lord Of The Rings ends with "The End," and I wouldn't call it amateurish. I think it's probably more accurate to say that it's a convention that is mostly out of fashion in modern fiction. But to the extent it serves a purpose--and in some cases, it does--I don't understand objecting to it.

I don't know why one would write "Fin" at the end of an English-language story rather than "The End." If you think "The End" seems amateurish, then you should think the same of "Fin," and it has the added defect of being slightly pretentious. Why end an English-language story with a French word?

I was speaking of movies when I mentioned Fin, and it was quite common up to the 1940s. Why Samuael Goldwin and his ilk chose to use Fin instead of "The End" is beyond me, but I would rather see that, or even "Kraj" then have to wait through 16 minutes of names of people I am never going to meet because my fanboy sons want to see a 1-minute post credit scene.

 

[SimonDoom]

How do people feel about:

Reminds me of the 1950s Sci Fi classic The Blob. The final scene of the movie shows the blob being dropped by parachute into the arctic and a question mark appears on the screen. It could work in the right story but possibly spoil the tone in the wrong one.

 

[SimonDoom]

But you're not participating in the silliness you identify, right?

I participate in all sorts of silliness here, but it's usually with a spirit of amusement and bemusement at the things people get worked up about. The attitude that "you shouldn't do that!" that is so often on display here is often puzzling to me.

 

[KeithD]

The question of whether something is standard or a sign of amateurism is not the same as whether it should or shouldn't be done here.

I, for instance, lest it should be forgotten (or ignored, as at least one poster attacking me personally did) said that it was considered amateurish in the industry to the point that it would usually be struck off in publishing (not for fairytale-style works, though) and I didn't do it for standalone stories here but that I did do it for the last chapter posted of a serial. I also directly said in one post (#22) that it's totally the writer's choice whether to use it at Literotica, and more than once I said that downrating for it was assholery.

My point on your post was that you were just extending the arguing of what folks should do on the issue while criticizing doing what you yourself were doing.

The point on Lovecraft68's posting is that he doesn't give a shit about the thread issue--he is just stalking me, which, yes, is boorish for the rest of us, but was totally his choice to do--and to do and to do and to do, for a decade and a half.

 

[lovecraft68]

Wonder when we can type the End on this thread?
probably never, Mr. I need the last word and I need to be right" himself is involved so as long as we keep going, he will.
Maybe we should make it a game.

 

[Kumquatqueen]

I've put 'THE END' once; at the end of the final chapter of a series, because I'd gone for the fairy-tale ending of a proposal and wedding, in a rather knowing way ('if in doubt, marry them'), so it seemed appropriate in that case.

It's Smoking Hot Ch.14 - no commenters objected, but probably only people not put off by the previous 100k words read it. I've written a couple more stories with the same characters set over the next couple years, but the story in the series was definitely ended.

 

[SimonDoom]

Wonder when we can type the End on this thread?
probably never, Mr. I need the last word and I need to be right" himself is involved so as long as we keep going, he will.
Maybe we should make it a game.

Anyone who's waiting for an Author's Hangout thread to end may be in for a long wait. Threads can come back from the dead at any time.

 

[KeithD]

Anyone who's waiting for an Author's Hangout thread to end may be in for a long wait. Threads can come back from the dead at any time.

Unless Lit. erases them, which it has done occasionally when a stalker takes over the thread.

 

[lovecraft68]

As the You tube movie review channel Cinema sins is fond of saying about a drawn out scene:
"This goes on for quite some time"

 

[ishtat]

I would like to read a story about Lit authors which ended: "and they all lived happily ever after."

 

[Bramblethorn]

I was speaking of movies when I mentioned Fin, and it was quite common up to the 1940s.

Feels like they should've done it on "Jaws".

 

[CuttingEdge]

Or just leave it there because no one really cares.

FFS, why is something this simple-and in some ways traditional-such an issue? Opinions on it, are fine, but I see the "no" faction as the one acting pretentious and snotty about it.

As for put readers first? Again, 12 years here and its the first time I ever saw someone say a reader complained. People should change because minute number of readers either have a pole up their ass or is more likely the case they're so immature they get upset when they're told a story is ending? And one more time for the slow people here, this is the exception in complaints, not the rule.

How about we follow this "You feel free to feel free, but don't feel free with me"

12 years here, and I am still blown away by the sheer pretentiousness of people writing smut on a free site.

I can only make the case for why writing "The End" is a tell-tale sign of poor authorship. People can be explained why the rules of writing exist, but it's their own choice whether they want to adapt to them, or remain the same. Close-minded people certainly have their choice, but their writings are also slow to improve when they are like that.

This has been discussed on many author sites, but it is Writing 101. On here... yeah... what does it matter, anything and everything is published? For publishers looking for published new work however, seeing "the end" an indicator what lies between the first and last chapters submitted.

My point has always been the same: writing erotica is an excellent way to prepare for something bigger. It may not be what you are gravitating towards LoveCraft68, but for others on here who just may be leading up to published novels (many who are lurkers perhaps) they might not know; it's a red flag publisher's are looking for.

 

[lovecraft68]

 

[Duleigh]

From fiction editor Beth Hill at The Editor's Blog:​

Don’t include the end for agents or editors (and professors and teachers) who don’t want it. For everyone else, include the words. Identify your final page and last words with a visual understandable to all.

 

[DarkRaven13]

From fiction editor Beth Hill at The Editor's Blog:​

That was a nice attachment to read.

 

[RejectReality]

I don't put it on most things, but fuck whatever the norms are when it comes to finishing something big like Danica, SOTM, Rage of a Goblin King... I'm going to End tag those every time.

 

[Bella_sensualJessie]

So this happened a few times already where someone commented on a story complaining about my use of the line "The End" at the end of a story.
I had someone recently say that it was juvenile because you can see that the story ended.
And a couple of people have said that line cost me a star rating.

I've been seeing "The End" my whole life, and many times in stories written on this site.
The story had concluded and there won't be a continuation in further chapters, so I see no problem with using that line.

I guess I could just let the story end without mentioning it, or write something else in it's place.
But is writing The End at the very end really a problem for some people?


.....

probably for some, but in my opinion it signifies the story ending. I like it.

 

[lovecraft68]

Never heard of Beth Hill. Is she a better known editor than, for example, KeithD or Bramblethorn, or is this just another opinion from just a random person?

First off, no one, and I mean no one, is a better or more well known editor than Keith, I mean, just ask him.
No idea who Beth Hill is, but the article didn't exactly pick a side of this debate other than if submission guidelines prohibit it, then don't.

But this brings us back to we're talking about here. The site we post stories on, the site the OP brought up as an example. But of course we have to get the usual blowhard talking about something that doesn't apply here.

I think for me, this ended when someone cited Tolkien's using The End. If that man's a hack I could only hope to be a fraction of that much of a hack.

 

[lovecraft68]

Interesting how you can't resist showing off your lunacy each time Keith's name shows up. Unlike him, you seem to be just plain crazy to me, without providing anything useful to the site.

I have far more dealings with that fool, than you and know how much damage he's done to the forum over the years with his bullying and stalking. I don't tolerate arrogance, bullies, or liars. This is a person outed for commenting on his own stories with his other alts...and there are people here with screen shots to prove it.

As for me not providing anything to this forum? Others can argue that if they choose to. I don't need to list the people I've helped behind the scenes, or publicly. My ego isn't fragile.

But what you can see easily for yourself is that I start threads here, I start conversation, I get people discussing and participating in those conversations, like many others here do.

Go find how many threads your friend has started....virtually none in all the years between his accounts here. He just blunders in to everyone else's threads, insults people and tried to make them about him, then cries when people return his attacks. His post here wasn't helpful it was to elevate himself and call people amateurs. Very useful.

To each their own, but I'll take crazy over a lying narcissist any day, I'll now let you get back to all the major contributions you feel you make here.

 

[JGittes]

I like Coppola's approach in Apocalypse Now. He started the film with The End, by the Doors. Deliberately.

 

[Bramblethorn]

Never heard of Beth Hill. Is she a better known editor than, for example, KeithD or Bramblethorn, or is this just another opinion from just a random person?

Kind of you to mention me, but I should perhaps note that my professional editing is entirely non-fiction. My job is about 85% field-specific stuff, 10% flow/clarity, and 5% spelling/punctuation/grammar.

Where matters of storytelling are concerned, I'm just an amateur with opinions. I try to give reasons for my opinions, but if those reasons don't convince, I can't claim any kind of authority.

 

[Parhelical]

'The End' is a forth wall break: a violation of the narrative you've spent the story building for the sake of stage directions.

Wherever possible a story should end in emptiness. Isn't it beautiful, that falling away into unconstructed space? Don't ruin it.

 

[KeithD]

Perhaps I shouldn't have mentioned your and Keith's name but keep it more general.

Well, yes, unless you enjoy setting off Lovecraft68's crazy foaming at the mouth.

 

[Bramblethorn]

'The End' is a forth wall break: a violation of the narrative you've spent the story building for the sake of stage directions.

Wherever possible a story should end in emptiness. Isn't it beautiful, that falling away into unconstructed space? Don't ruin it.

Stories on Literotica end with the author's name and a link to their profile, then a "Please rate this story", then a field for comments, then an ad for "live webcams". Falling away into unconstructed space isn't an option; it's just a question of what goes above the author's name/link.