what do you do??

[Netzach]

On the disrespect issue, I will add that it's tough to be the third. I played with a couple once and it was fairly disastrous for a variety of reasons. This was casual play and not a triad. Part of me felt like seriously, folks, I cannot figure out your couple. That's your work. At the time, I was newly single and not looking for anything, so that was a level of complication I just didn't need. I think there's an issue of compatability there. You need to find someone who is looking for a level of attention and to provide a level of respect that the couple wants.

OMG, holy cats is this ever true. It's like, dudes, I'm here to fuck, not watch you drama.

 

[Netzach]

It's part jealousy and part fear of fucking us up and wrecking this thing.

Ah. Trust in the rock-solidity of this thing and see what works.

 

[intothewoods]

OMG, holy cats is this ever true. It's like, dudes, I'm here to fuck, not watch you drama.

I once had a guy I'd just met ask me to thank his gf after I played with him. Uh no. Well, actually, uh yes because I wanted to avoid drama.

Ah. Trust in the rock-solidity of this thing and see what works.

I like that. We need to keep talking and thinking on this. But I tend to think about it in the abstract. I don't wake up and think I want to fuck X or whatever. When I go to the local group hang out thing, I sometimes think, man I want to go to a party and play. Stuff like that. We really dated for a long time doing our own thing. I think we haven't figured out how this stuff works for us as a couple, if at all.

 

[ecstaticsub]

That's cool, it's really unusual that everyone is copacetic and mellow like that. He found his upside, a highly sexual and sexually fulfilled partner.

It's much more common, you have to admit, that someone's frustrated when the rules are I can and you can't. It's usually an imposition and not organic at all.

That's what I mean dooms things, I guess.

I don't think my situation is all that unusual. There are tons of men into wifesharing where all they want is to watch their wife get fucked by someone else. Most that I have talked to aren't interested in having another female in the mix. As long as their wife is open and honest with them, and for most the husband wants to watch or join in too, then they are good.

 

[Homburg]

I once had a guy I'd just met ask me to thank his gf after I played with him. Uh no. Well, actually, uh yes because I wanted to avoid drama.

I remember a really cute young thing that rather badly wanted me to tie her asking me if I would ask her dominant if it was okay if I tied her. I said no. I'm not that interested that I am going to petition another dominant for permission to play with his submissive. Not my thing. In my eyes, the motivated party needs to do the asking.

That said, I have no qualms about thanking someone when I play with their partner. Doesn't impact me one bit. It is all about acknowledging the partner as well. It is a respect issue. I respect their dynamic, so I will address every party in that dynamic.

As an extension of the first part, while I'm not going to ask another dominant for permission out of the blue, I will make sure that they're okay with it. I don't like crossed wires.

 

[Netzach]

I don't think my situation is all that unusual. There are tons of men into wifesharing where all they want is to watch their wife get fucked by someone else. Most that I have talked to aren't interested in having another female in the mix. As long as their wife is open and honest with them, and for most the husband wants to watch or join in too, then they are good.

OMG, you are so so so right. I completely forgot this context. I'm still trained on the OP to the point where I'm thinking MFF, and I've noticed what you're talking about in MMF a lot. Shit, like, every day of my life. Ha!

 

[JMohegan]

Definitely.



Ha ha ha. Good one. Actually I find that (can wives be cuckolded?) super hawt and terrible all at the same time.



Ha, the bolded bit made me laugh.

Definitely no close friends with whom I'm just dying to become intimate. In fact, at a certain point, I became more uncomfortable doing anything sexual with folks I consider friends in the scene. People I'd fooled around with before -- all of a sudden the thought of even kissing them made me want to run in the other direction. Strangely, impact play to me is like going for a jog with someone. Mister Man thinks it's all sex. We put a stop on everything for the foreseeable future.

I'd say there are two things that are behind my desire. Hot guys and women, yeah, but more like enjoying the conquest and the uncomplicatedness of bottoming. As to the first, I just didn't do a lot of conquesting in my early twenties. I don't have to have sex to feel like I conquered. And it's not like the be all end all, but it's fun. As to the second, I enjoy the feeling of freedom and cutting loose that I get from going to a party or event. I sometimes have issues with accepting that the mom/responsible person me exists in the same body as the person with fucked up fantasy x and y. I like the escapist aspect. Of course, there are people at events that are douchebags. Mister Man will never play at an event. In many ways, I like that he's not in the scene (see aforementioned douchebags), but I sometimes wish he were into it just a little.

Fwiw, Mister Man has said that there is some sort of checklist appeal to sexual experiences, and that's what appeals to him about non-monogamy. This seems to resonate with other men I've spoken with. They say: oh yeah, the checklist, sure. I want to check off threesome, etc. Otherwise he thinks that there is a lot of risk and that we'd both have to be very comfortable with whatever was going to transpire. So far the entire thing always ends up too complicated to go anywhere. I actually am hugely satisfied just knowing it's not a closed topic forever and ever. Eh, so maybe the omg last cock forever thing is part of it. Ha.

You know, really, all of the above is superficial. I think for both of us we wonder what the goal is in terms of a married couple. The family part? I get it. He gets it. And we love each other and want to be with each other but I don't know what twenty years, forty years of monogamy is supposed to look like, feel like, be like. I don't have a lot of married friends about whom I can say THAT's what I want. And as an adult, I haven't had that really long term married couple in my life as the model I can point to. I think he and I and people I feel similarly to re: marriage feel very much in the present and that we're building this together and what exactly will happen in ten years in terms of monogamy is not set in stone but will evolve. What I know for sure is that when I heard Dan Savage say that your husband or wife should be your sexual partner in crime, I thought yes, that is exactly it.

I did a whole hell of a lot of oat sowing in my late teens and early twenties. When it came to embracing monogamy later on, I think this helped me a lot.

Mister Man thinks impact play is sexual because he's getting turned on. That, I get. You, I don't.

Jogging? Jogging? I can relate to the sense of physical release that comes from a good hard run. However, and please pardon me for saying so, but if you don't ever get aroused from impact play, then you've never been properly flogged.

Of course, I've never been aroused on the receiving end of impact play either! Being struck with anything just makes me want to turn around and throttle the Top. So maybe your "jogging" reaction is just some variation of a head thing that I've never thought about.

 

[Netzach]

I did a whole hell of a lot of oat sowing in my late teens and early twenties. When it came to embracing monogamy later on, I think this helped me a lot.

Mister Man thinks impact play is sexual because he's getting turned on. That, I get. You, I don't.

Jogging? Jogging? I can relate to the sense of physical release that comes from a good hard run. However, and please pardon me for saying so, but if you don't ever get aroused from impact play, then you've never been properly flogged.

Of course, I've never been aroused on the receiving end of impact play either! Being struck with anything just makes me want to turn around and throttle the Top. So maybe your "jogging" reaction is just some variation of a head thing that I've never thought about.

It's not a purely below the belt pleasure for some people, or rather *with* some people. The reasons I pursued it heavily had very little to do with genital pleasure per se, and more issues like challenge, catharsis, self-learning, a different kind of release. Trying to find tops who can cope with that level of non-investment isn't as hard as it seems sometimes. Sometimes I had to lay some smackdown over a case of assumed authority later on.

Sexual but not the same kind.

For me it was interesting, slightly arousing like masturbation is, and I felt as much tug toward the other person as I would toward any friend I'd go jogging with. But I can't say I don't like it. It's something I currently find unneccessary but you never know who you'll meet at those girly activist picnics.

If T's doing the same thing to me, it's sex, absolutely.

It looks the same from the outside maybe, but that's the extent of it. I'm at the point where I don't care to do it without it being sex generally, but I'd never promise him that none other shall ever do anything painful to me for fun. I don't take experiences off the table for myself prematurely.

 

[Anne_Prospere]

I have been thinking about jealousy a lot lately. How does one really know if you are hard wired for poly or mono anyway? How do you know if it is worth it?

So far my instincts are pretty hypocritical and lame. I have a wandering eye. Wouldn't mind the occasional something, play with someone else even. The idea of him doing the same? Fine, no big deal. The reality? Hell no mother fucker. That cock is mine.

I have no idea where one goes from here, if anywhere. We talk about it. We don't seem to reach any conclusions. And then life comes up and we talk about something else for a while.

lol, i think sometimes this may stem from how you feel about your own desires to be with someone else. If you feel deceitful, or as if your desire for some side penis is an act of infidelity, than the idea that your mate would do that to you is unthinkable.

I dunno, maybe try messing around together, if he isnt too worried about having an open relationship, maybe you can suggest moving at a slowww pace, experimenting with extra partners as a couple, see how that goes..

 

[Anne_Prospere]

I may be wrong but those are my thoughts and gut feelings.

I may have been kind of vague in my initial post (i tend to do that.) I am not married, we are a D/s open couple, with a few caveats.

Most of the women he encounters, know about me. He is more often than not totally respectful of my feelings, and I do my best not to let my jealousy get in the way of his pussy plunderings.

 

[Anne_Prospere]

damn i missed so much of this thread, its really hard to keep up with you guys. good stuff!

 

[Homburg]

It's not a purely below the belt pleasure for some people, or rather *with* some people. The reasons I pursued it heavily had very little to do with genital pleasure per se, and more issues like challenge, catharsis, self-learning, a different kind of release. Trying to find tops who can cope with that level of non-investment isn't as hard as it seems sometimes. Sometimes I had to lay some smackdown over a case of assumed authority later on.

Sexual but not the same kind.

For me it was interesting, slightly arousing like masturbation is, and I felt as much tug toward the other person as I would toward any friend I'd go jogging with. But I can't say I don't like it. It's something I currently find unneccessary but you never know who you'll meet at those girly activist picnics.

I'm in the same boat. And there are plenty of times when it is not even as sexual as masturbation. If I am working on learning a new skill, or trying a new technique, it is entirely cerebral. I am mentally "aroused" but it's nowhere near sexual. The feeling is very much akin to the level of concentration and involvement I felt when learning and practicing MA, or some complex movement in a sport. 100% head involvement, and the body is a responsive tool. That's it.

As a result, yeah, I can happily play with friends, with no issues. I'm not going to say that neither one of us will not be sexually aroused (the bottom is more likely to get there than I am), but it is not a guarantee.

If T's doing the same thing to me, it's sex, absolutely.

It looks the same from the outside maybe, but that's the extent of it. I'm at the point where I don't care to do it without it being sex generally, but I'd never promise him that none other shall ever do anything painful to me for fun. I don't take experiences off the table for myself prematurely.

*nod* Different partners inspire different headpsaces. I can get the jogging idea, and the "yes, this is sex" penetration or not. It is, like much of everything else, situational.

 

[intothewoods]

I did a whole hell of a lot of oat sowing in my late teens and early twenties. When it came to embracing monogamy later on, I think this helped me a lot.

Mister Man thinks impact play is sexual because he's getting turned on. That, I get. You, I don't.

Jogging? Jogging? I can relate to the sense of physical release that comes from a good hard run. However, and please pardon me for saying so, but if you don't ever get aroused from impact play, then you've never been properly flogged.

Of course, I've never been aroused on the receiving end of impact play either! Being struck with anything just makes me want to turn around and throttle the Top. So maybe your "jogging" reaction is just some variation of a head thing that I've never thought about.

JM - I was kidding about the jogging! Good lord. Obviously it's not exactly like jogging, but it's a lot more about endurance than it is a sexual turn on when it's with someone I'm not in a relationship with. It's a whole other thing when it's with Mister Man.

The other thing is that the flogging/spanking/whatever often turns into fucking very quickly with him, whereas with a play partner who I'm not fucking, well, it doesn't. So that's kind of it's own thing.

lol, i think sometimes this may stem from how you feel about your own desires to be with someone else. If you feel deceitful, or as if your desire for some side penis is an act of infidelity, than the idea that your mate would do that to you is unthinkable.

I dunno, maybe try messing around together, if he isnt too worried about having an open relationship, maybe you can suggest moving at a slowww pace, experimenting with extra partners as a couple, see how that goes..

Could be, honestly. I'll own that. I think there's still some part of me that likens non-monogamy to something secretive.

Re: messing around together, we tend to meet people so differently...the logistics are just tough. It could happen at some point though. Who knows.

 

[intothewoods]

It's not a purely below the belt pleasure for some people, or rather *with* some people. The reasons I pursued it heavily had very little to do with genital pleasure per se, and more issues like challenge, catharsis, self-learning, a different kind of release. Trying to find tops who can cope with that level of non-investment isn't as hard as it seems sometimes. Sometimes I had to lay some smackdown over a case of assumed authority later on.

Sexual but not the same kind.

For me it was interesting, slightly arousing like masturbation is, and I felt as much tug toward the other person as I would toward any friend I'd go jogging with. But I can't say I don't like it. It's something I currently find unneccessary but you never know who you'll meet at those girly activist picnics.

If T's doing the same thing to me, it's sex, absolutely.

It looks the same from the outside maybe, but that's the extent of it. I'm at the point where I don't care to do it without it being sex generally, but I'd never promise him that none other shall ever do anything painful to me for fun. I don't take experiences off the table for myself prematurely.

Yeah, it depends on the person. I am friends with the people I used to play with regularly. There's a flirtation there to some degree with all of them but it's not like godI'msoturnedongoingtocomenowsquee!

 

[JMohegan]

It's not a purely below the belt pleasure for some people, or rather *with* some people. The reasons I pursued it heavily had very little to do with genital pleasure per se, and more issues like challenge, catharsis, self-learning, a different kind of release. Trying to find tops who can cope with that level of non-investment isn't as hard as it seems sometimes. Sometimes I had to lay some smackdown over a case of assumed authority later on.

Sexual but not the same kind.

For me it was interesting, slightly arousing like masturbation is, and I felt as much tug toward the other person as I would toward any friend I'd go jogging with. But I can't say I don't like it. It's something I currently find unneccessary but you never know who you'll meet at those girly activist picnics.

If T's doing the same thing to me, it's sex, absolutely.

It looks the same from the outside maybe, but that's the extent of it. I'm at the point where I don't care to do it without it being sex generally, but I'd never promise him that none other shall ever do anything painful to me for fun. I don't take experiences off the table for myself prematurely.

Thank you, this helps a lot.

JM - I was kidding about the jogging! Good lord. Obviously it's not exactly like jogging, but it's a lot more about endurance than it is a sexual turn on when it's with someone I'm not in a relationship with. It's a whole other thing when it's with Mister Man.

The other thing is that the flogging/spanking/whatever often turns into fucking very quickly with him, whereas with a play partner who I'm not fucking, well, it doesn't. So that's kind of it's own thing.

Does MM know it's the endurance thing you miss from casual play?

If MM has a self control issue, my recommendation would be a nice bj or hand job for starters, followed by an extended impact play session and then whatever conclusion he desires. But he's probably already thought of that.

If it's a plain disinterest in lengthy impact play sessions, well, that's more of a problem.

 

[intothewoods]

Thank you, this helps a lot.



Does MM know it's the endurance thing you miss from casual play?

If MM has a self control issue, my recommendation would be a nice bj or hand job for starters, followed by an extended impact play session and then whatever conclusion he desires. But he's probably already thought of that.

If it's a plain disinterest in lengthy impact play sessions, well, that's more of a problem.

It's not disinterest per se, though I think his s&m/play type interests ebb and flow depending on how much other stuff is going on. Right now there's a lot of stuff going on, for both of us. I'll think about that though. Maybe if I made it set up in some way for him, or just easier, it wouldn't be like, now why don't you take care of this too.

 

[Netzach]

It's not disinterest per se, though I think his s&m/play type interests ebb and flow depending on how much other stuff is going on. Right now there's a lot of stuff going on, for both of us. I'll think about that though. Maybe if I made it set up in some way for him, or just easier, it wouldn't be like, now why don't you take care of this too.

I can't begin to tell you how much I can relate to MM.

I may be the top, but I need to be seduced too. I'm still a fucking girl, for one. My confidence has shook badly after being sick for what seemed like eons, I don't even know what I like anymore, and if it feels like another chore or obligation forget it.

 

[intothewoods]

I can't begin to tell you how much I can relate to MM.

I may be the top, but I need to be seduced too. I'm still a fucking girl, for one. My confidence has shook badly after being sick for what seemed like eons, I don't even know what I like anymore, and if it feels like another chore or obligation forget it.

I've often felt like your dynamic with M (that's your husband right? I always get the initials confused!) is similar to ours!

I mean, I think the last time we had this conversation he said something like, I know baby, but I'm just so busy right now, thinking up elaborate scenes is kind of beyond me. The last time he was on vacation, he all of a sudden started ordering toys and tying me up. And right now I can only make life easier for him to a certain extent, for various logistical reasons. In a couple of months, this will change and hooray for that.

 

[catalina_francisco]

I have been thinking about jealousy a lot lately. How does one really know if you are hard wired for poly or mono anyway? How do you know if it is worth it?

So far my instincts are pretty hypocritical and lame. I have a wandering eye. Wouldn't mind the occasional something, play with someone else even. The idea of him doing the same? Fine, no big deal. The reality? Hell no mother fucker. That cock is mine.

I have no idea where one goes from here, if anywhere. We talk about it. We don't seem to reach any conclusions. And then life comes up and we talk about something else for a while.

I have so much to catch up with and so little energy, but while skimming I saw this so thought I would get started somewhere. I think in part you have answered your own question in terms of how to know how you are wired. I also think there is a continuum for most people, and often 2 people in a relationship will find themselves at different points on that continuum in terms of how far they would like to go in either direction. Knowing those points are important when contemplating a long term relationship IMHO.

For me it is fairly simple, I simply have no desire or need to be with anyone else for the sake of another relationship or play. It can enter into our thoughts when talking in terms of humiliation and slavery, but is not a need I have, nor something I find myself wondering how I could suggest we go there...it is all about how he would derive pleasure from putting me in that position and his fantasies in those directions. He is a little less so wired, but still does not have a lot of desire to play with anyone else, and admits a relationship with someone else also does not interest him. That does not make our position right or wrong, but is indicative of how we are wired at this point in time in terms of mono vs poly.

Catalina