Stop sexual assaults on women NOW.

LJ_Reloaded

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First, the article, and a bit of light-hearted parody.
Second post, I'll outline what the fuck is outrageously STUPID about what women say in this article.

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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-12771938

25 March 2011 Last updated at 12:25 ET Share this pageFacebookTwitterShareEmailPrint
Why do men shout at women in the street?
By Brigitt Hauck
BBC News

From whistling to catcalling, and even groping, street harassment is an everyday reality for many women around the world. But now a new wave of feminist groups are organising to stop it.

One dark evening in south London, a group of men slow their car behind a young woman walking alone.

They call out to her, propositioning her to get into their vehicle.

She keeps walking, heart rate quickening, ignoring their lewd comments. The men continue to follow her and their words get more aggressive.

Just before she reaches the nearest underground station, she's had enough. She strikes the men's car and flees down the station steps.

In a rage, the men leap out of their car, chase her, grab her by the neck and pin her to the wall.

This was an experience that drove Vicky Simister to take action and found Anti-Street Harassment UK.

It's one of a new wave of groups tackling an age-old problem. At the forefront of the movement is the international Hollaback! campaign group. Having started in the US, it will open another dozen chapters next week, everywhere from India to Croatia.

Hollaback! and Anti-Street Harassment UK offer forums in which women can share their experiences, share photos of their harassers and view maps of where previous incidents have occurred.

Most people would recognise that what happened to Simister was totally unacceptable. But what if the incident had not escalated into violence? What if Simister had not been followed? What if it was just suggestive remarks shouted across a street?

Day in and day out millions of women are whistled at or shouted at on public streets. It can be unpleasant, and for Hollaback! activists it's all part of the nasty business of street harassment.

They're in a long tradition - going back to the 1970s Reclaim the Night movement - of trying to make the streets safer and more pleasant for women. Much has been done, in the West at least, to deal with harassment in the workplace, but the streets remain a different proposition.

There's no suggestion that most men carry out harassment in the street, but occurrences are widespread.

In an online study by stopstreetharassment.com, 95% of respondents said they had been the victims of leering, honking or whistling and a large proportion have been groped or grabbed in public.

Emily May, the founder of Hollaback!, is on a mission to stop the harassment.

"It stems from a broader culture of gender based violence," says May. "To shift that culture it takes people standing up and saying street harassment is not okay because most people in our society don't want it to exist."

When a man shouts "hi gorgeous" or "come over here love", the recipient of the comments might be annoyed, but the remarks are often disregarded by bystanders, so the problem goes largely unaddressed.

"Women are advised to ignore it, and we don't speak up about it. Therefore, these men keep on doing it and push boundaries further and further," says Simister.

And it's dangerous because it's difficult to distinguish which men simply shout and which ones may use catcalls as a gateway to violence or sexual aggression.

"If a guy is checking out a woman it's annoying, but that's how sexual predators who are honing their craft test how far they can go," says activist and filmmaker Maggie Hadleigh-West.

And street harassment varies from country to country. In the UK and US, most women will experience only shouting, but in many parts of the world street harassment can escalate to groping and more frequent public sexual assaults.

In India it is euphemistically referred to as "eve teasing", in Japan groping on the subway has long been a problem, and the attack on Lara Logan in Egypt gained international attention.

But why do some men harass women in public?

Street harassment occurs because our society has always allowed it and dismissed the behaviour as "men being men", says Hadleigh-West.

"Culturally, men have been indoctrinated into it, and it's been a privilege for them to walk down the street fantasising about women. The culture hasn't checked the behaviour."

Because society has perpetuated this as a cultural norm, men tend to engage in street harassment as a way to prove their masculinity, says Northeastern University associate professor of sociology Kathrin Zippel.

"Often times it's not really about the women, it's just about the men performing masculine acts for each other and establishing a pecking order amongst themselves. What is really going on is the dynamic among men."

So can the leering, the catcalls and the grabs ever really be stopped?

"Some activists have targeted city planners and the public transport officers to make the case that women should not face harassment in the streets," says Zippel.

In response some countries such as India and Japan have created women-only subway cars.

But critics say this sort of measure is only a temporary fix.

"I find recreating segregation in public to be highly problematic. In the short term it might be a good solution, but they also notice that if women step onto mixed cars there are less women on them and the ones who are experience more harassment," explains Zippel.

To take the burden off women, the founder of stopstreetharassment.com Holly Kearl suggests that councils gather survey data on assaults and sexual harassment and then work out what kind of responses work.

On college campuses in the US officials addressed safety concerns by adding more lighting, installing safety phones and redesigning bus stops

Not all men impose unwanted attention upon women, and Kearl agrees that it's important for these men to join in the movement to stop street harassment.

"We have to engage men. In our society it is easy to sexually objectify women, so it is important to make men realise that every woman you harass is someone's mother, sister or daughter, and she is a person who deserves respect."

When men take accountability for the actions of themselves and their peers, it helps to create a cultural shift in attitude. If a man feels that catcalling won't be accepted by his peers, he is less likely to engage in the behaviour.

"When men are made aware of it, hopefully by women they love, they can listen, hear and see what is going on. It becomes an individual responsibility and men really do care when they get it," says Hadleigh-West. "I have seen enormous change happen in the consciousness of men."
 
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Maybe the women should pick on nerds then, they're desperate for action. You sexually harass the hell out of them. I don't think they'd mind.
 
First of all, catcalls are rude. They're stupid and pointless and pathetic. A man should have more pride in himself than that.

I am actually in favor of women-only cars in Japan and India because of all the harassment that goes on there. I've said that before on here.

That said.

1. The article conflates catcalls and leering with chasing a woman down and shoving her against the wall, and other incidents of physical violence. Looking at a woman (and mind you, LEERING is in the eye of the beholder - that means she can make up any point she wants where you cross the line) and making a stupid catcall comment is the same as a Japanese woman being groped in a train. The same thing. No difference. You groped her with your eyes, dude. You raped her with the words that came out of your lips.

So basically, in the minds of the women in this article, the violence starts when you lay your eyes on the woman. Much less opened your mouth. You're a filthy rapist right there and then.

2. "Men have been indoctrinated into it, and it's been a privilege for them to walk down the street fantasising about women” - Maggie Hadleigh-West, Activist and film-maker

So, essentially, if you entertain sexual fantasies about a woman that you walk by on the street, you are indoctrinated. You are a mindless evil fucking brutish pig beast. You are raping women with your mind!!!

You mindless sexist brutes. And all that bullshit.
 
The human is a peculiar animal. The female of the spieces both chooses the mate and wears the peacock robe. This causes a fair bit of confusion.
 
The human is a peculiar animal. The female of the spieces both chooses the mate and wears the peacock robe. This causes a fair bit of confusion.
Human females have it the worst of all female species.

In almost all animal species the male does all the work in finding a mate. When it comes to mating the female does little if any work to attract a mate. Black widows and praying mantis females eat their males.

Only human females actually have to compete in any marginal way for males. Now you know what feminism comes from: it really sucks to be a human woman! :eek: :D :rolleyes:
 
i took it to be more that sexual assaults often start that way, so that kind of behaviour (even if, as is more common, the guys mean no harm) can be terrifying for the woman, who fears it might escalate.
 
i took it to be more that sexual assaults often start that way, so that kind of behaviour (even if, as is more common, the guys mean no harm) can be terrifying for the woman, who fears it might escalate.
Going by that logic, sexual assaults can escalate from a man leaving his house. Or even being born.

Are men necessary?
 
Human females have it the worst of all female species.

In almost all animal species the male does all the work in finding a mate. When it comes to mating the female does little if any work to attract a mate. Black widows and praying mantis females eat their males.

Only human females actually have to compete in any marginal way for males. Now you know what feminism comes from: it really sucks to be a human woman! :eek: :D :rolleyes:

As I understand it, in many Asian countries, There are more men than women. For some strange reason, they want boy babies rather than girls. I wonder how competitive the girls are there for boys? Or rather how competitive the boys are for girls?
 
As I understand it, in many Asian countries, There are more men than women. For some strange reason, they want boy babies rather than girls. I wonder how competitive the girls are there for boys? Or rather how competitive the boys are for girls?
Competiton for women by men is off the fucking hook there.

But as I said before, when you abort baby girls and kill them in such ludicrously large numbers as they do in India and China, this problem of ruthless competition for women is exactly what the men there deserve. They got themselves into that mess.

Now if Amicus's and Frisco Slug's dreams of capitalism were really for real there'd be a boom in the birth of girls right now. Women can command quite a dowry-equivalent in that region.
 
Going by that logic, sexual assaults can escalate from a man leaving his house. Or even being born.

Are men necessary?

men, in general, are great.
some are arseholes who give the rest a bad name.

but following anyone down the street, shouting unwanted comments...that's intimidation and harassment. it's not ok to target the disabled this way, the obese, people of other races, etc.

if your daughter came running into the house, crying and scared, because a big group of guys were following her and she thought they were going to assault her? i'm guessing your first reaction would be to go outside and break somebody's nose.
 
Competiton for women by men is off the fucking hook there.

But as I said before, when you abort baby girls and kill them in such ludicrously large numbers as they do in India and China, this problem of ruthless competition for women is exactly what the men there deserve. They got themselves into that mess.

Now if Amicus's and Frisco Slug's dreams of capitalism were really for real there'd be a boom in the birth of girls right now. Women can command quite a dowry-equivalent in that region.

ignorant fucker. the women aren't 'paid for', they are abducted and raped.
 
men, in general, are great.
some are arseholes who give the rest a bad name.

but following anyone down the street, shouting unwanted comments...that's intimidation and harassment. it's not ok to target the disabled this way, the obese, people of other races, etc.

if your daughter came running into the house, crying and scared, because a big group of guys were following her and she thought they were going to assault her? i'm guessing your first reaction would be to go outside and break somebody's nose.
True, but that's not my point. Making catcalls is stupid, everyone agrees with that. But that's not the same as following a woman, much less following her and making catcalls. Not the same at all.

Plus, the article went nutcase extremist with bullshit like

"Men have been indoctrinated into it, and it's been a privilege for them to walk down the street fantasising about women”

Now unless I am a Babylon 5 Psi-Cop telepath I've neither the power nor the right to police someone's thoughts. Fantasize all you want, but don't be chasing her down. No one is in favor of following a woman when she doesn't want to be followed.

I see we're getting tied up in a nonexistent discussion over whether it's right to follow a woman or grope or grab her. That's not up for discussion. It's wrong. Guys who do that deserve to get struck by a double decker and dragged across cobblestone. You should know me well enough to know I'll be driving.

My beef is about the idea that everyone who catcalls or even FANTASIZES about sex with a woman passerby is going to physically chase her down. Going by this logic a certain portion of men who leave the house are going to look at you and fantasize about sex; and some of them are going to catcall; and some of those are going to slam you against the wall. Therefore let's not let men out of the house. EVER. Problem solved. :rolleyes:
 
the language used is a bit tweed knikerish,
but i think that, in essence, they're asking for a society where catcalling is considered as uncool and antisocial as facial swastika tattoos.
at the moment it's just seen as boys being boys.
 
the language used is a bit tweed knikerish,
but i think that, in essence, they're asking for a society where catcalling is considered as uncool and antisocial as facial swastika tattoos.
at the moment it's just seen as boys being boys.
I can go with that. Catcalling is stupid and should be stamped out by one's peers.

But the article went off the fucking rails when they started saying that looking at a woman or even FANTASIZING about a woman passerby is on the same moral level as slamming her against the wall. And the "one escalates to the other" was equally lame for the reasons I pointed out.

That's the problem with feminists. They're the Knight Templar Big Brother trope except for women. Take down not only the rapists and assaulters but any male that even fantasizes about sex with a woman.

It's like this with feminists:

You have a little sibling. Either full-blooded, half-blooded, or just adoptive (or, in some odd cases, more than one of those at once). Especially a sister. The kid is wronged somehow. What do you do?

Do you deal with the offender in a calm, civil manner?

Or failing that, perhaps you are a little upset, yet you keep control over your emotions, and keep yourself as restrained as you can?

Or do you go after the offender, the offender's friends, anyone connected to the offender, as well as anyone who even looks like they could be an offender sometime in the indeterminate future and decapitate them all?

If you are the latter, then congratulations! You are a Knight Templar Big Brother.
 
Man bashing doesn't solve it. It's why we have families, friends, groups, societies and laws. It's not perfect, but it's what it is. Live with it and get along, fight, or go be a hermit somewhere else where no one will bother you.

I'm quite happy being a man. And yep, I do fantasize about women. I'm hard wired for it. Can't escape it, even if I tried. :p ( the catcall thing is kind of weird though, can't say I get that, though it seems ok in strip clubs for some reason )

And, yes, to the one post above, if my daughter came home like that, there would definitely be some asses getting beat. Its my job, duty, and instinct to protect my females. Gee, where does that fit in to your rant?

My suggestion? If you are so in fear, surround yourself with people you can count on and trust, instead of going at it alone.

All the women in my life don't go running around ranting that way. They have faith in their fellow human beings.


( hate bash articles like that )
 
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And, yes, to the one post above, if my daughter came home like that, there would definitely be some asses getting beat. Its my job, duty, and instinct to protect my females. Gee, where does that fit in to your rant?

I see we're getting tied up in a nonexistent discussion over whether it's right to follow a woman or grope or grab her. That's not up for discussion. It's wrong. Guys who do that deserve to get struck by a double decker and dragged across cobblestone. You should know me well enough to know I'll be driving.
^^^^ did you see this "rant" which I posted a while back?
 
I agree with Mencken: If a woman wants you she'll come get you. If you end up a bachelor its cuz no one wanted you.

That said, there's no point in chasing females. Have some fun till your number is called.
 
I agree with Mencken: If a woman wants you she'll come get you. If you end up a bachelor its cuz no one wanted you.

That said, there's no point in chasing females. Have some fun till your number is called.
When a woman approaches you it means she's actually willing to put some skin in the game and take a share of the risk. I married a woman who did that.
 
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