Poly + LDR = our crazy whirlwind

[Netzach]

Yeah I really don't know how to label my jealousy. Sometimes it is there... others it is non-existent. I suppose it is a little like your yard stick- so long as I have my reassurance, (and I mean real reassurance, not this 'there there, now now' crap) I am good to go.

No, not "there there" but also, I have to sometimes ask for it. Just say "I need you to say this to me" or "I need you to look at me and be meaningful here for a moment" because sometimes it's just that simple and I've given up on the school of thought that says it's ONLY meaningful if the other person does it unasked and knows exactly when to do it and all that crap. No one's telepathic.

 

[SweetGigi]

Yeah, this is true. I need to take a page from my own book. If I am gonna require others to not expect me to read their minds, then I need to extend the same. This will have to be something I work on. Carlos is very adept at telling me exactly what he wants and expects from me. I need to learn to do the same thing. false postulations only create drama and lord knows I don't need any more assumptions in my life. *sniggers*



Netzach, you are the coolest, you know that? Thanks!!

 

[Millificent]

ya'll get outta my head! lol

four days!

 

[SweetGigi]

we wouldn't be in your head if you wouldn't leave it wide open for us to crawl into.

 

[unpredictablebijou]

***

Jealousy, for me, is a yardstick. Whenever I'm feeling it, it usually means there's some very basic, simple reassurance of my relevance that I need - when I have that, the other person can go off on their dirty weekend and things are fine.

***

This is very well said. Jealousy is a huge catch-all term for a whole bunch of different issues, ranging from just not wanting to be alone to body image to just a simple need for reassurance. Sometimes all it takes is something like, "Tell me you'll be back eventually, and that you'll be happy to see me."

One is already way ahead when one is self-aware, and willing to own your own issues - 'that I'm feeling jealous is my issue and I need to figure it out,' rather than projecting it or being accusatory. From there it's just a question of breaking it down to the real issue, and setting boundaries or asking for help on whatever that is.

I know it's probably already been recommended a million times around here, but the book The Ethical Slut by Dossie Easton and damn I always forget the name of the other author is absolutely brilliant, and one of the first things anyone should read if they're thinking about these kinds of questions.

Netzach had a good point about being actually poly vs. bending yourself around someone else. That's always a good first question. But it kinda sounds like this may be a legitimate exploration into something you've always been interested in.

good luck!

bj


and Homburg, btw, thank you for the Dear X. It does help. hearts.

 

[EmpressFi]

I would strongly recommend the book The Ethical Slut. It's about poly relationships and Chapter 7 deals entirely about jealousy and covers most of what Netz said. (She's so wise *smooch*)

It's funny. I cant think of any time that I've been jealous of Malin being with someone else. But I have been jealous of the quantity of time he has. Right now, his OSO (other significant other) works with us and lives in the area, so they have a date night once a week. I love it because then Master and I get our alone time but, sometimes Malin's OSO comes over here for us to hang out. The rule is, when she's here, if I'm here, then she's a guest. Basically, right now, I feel weird if they're having sex in the next room. So they dont. They cuddle and kiss, etc, but she sleeps in the guest bed.

When I examined that "weirdness" what I discovered it THAT was my jealousy. I wanted my OSO. I didnt want to have to listen to them in the next room, when I was alone in mine. They both accept it and she even admitted that she was a little weirded out by it and so we're good with it.

My jealousy is at the thought of Master having another. Right now, he says he doesnt want one. but I'm always afraid he will. Ok.. maybe not always.. but still.. it's there.

anyway.. I've rambled enough..tonight's my date night with Master and 6 weeks from tomorrow I fly to his side.

 

[SweetGigi]

This is very well said. Jealousy is a huge catch-all term for a whole bunch of different issues, ranging from just not wanting to be alone to body image to just a simple need for reassurance. Sometimes all it takes is something like, "Tell me you'll be back eventually, and that you'll be happy to see me."

One is already way ahead when one is self-aware, and willing to own your own issues - 'that I'm feeling jealous is my issue and I need to figure it out,' rather than projecting it or being accusatory. From there it's just a question of breaking it down to the real issue, and setting boundaries or asking for help on whatever that is.

I know it's probably already been recommended a million times around here, but the book The Ethical Slut by Dossie Easton and damn I always forget the name of the other author is absolutely brilliant, and one of the first things anyone should read if they're thinking about these kinds of questions.

Netzach had a good point about being actually poly vs. bending yourself around someone else. That's always a good first question. But it kinda sounds like this may be a legitimate exploration into something you've always been interested in.

good luck!

bj

I've read the ethical slut before. I'll have to dive back into it to pick out the good bits.

I think I've got a pretty good handle on it all. I'm a little nervous about it, but it is a good sorta nervous. And thru it all I know I will have Carlos there to help guide me thru. I am excited. Thanks for all the advice, guys!

 

[SweetGigi]

I would strongly recommend the book The Ethical Slut. It's about poly relationships and Chapter 7 deals entirely about jealousy and covers most of what Netz said. (She's so wise *smooch*)

It's funny. I cant think of any time that I've been jealous of Malin being with someone else. But I have been jealous of the quantity of time he has. Right now, his OSO (other significant other) works with us and lives in the area, so they have a date night once a week. I love it because then Master and I get our alone time but, sometimes Malin's OSO comes over here for us to hang out. The rule is, when she's here, if I'm here, then she's a guest. Basically, right now, I feel weird if they're having sex in the next room. So they dont. They cuddle and kiss, etc, but she sleeps in the guest bed.

When I examined that "weirdness" what I discovered it THAT was my jealousy. I wanted my OSO. I didnt want to have to listen to them in the next room, when I was alone in mine. They both accept it and she even admitted that she was a little weirded out by it and so we're good with it.

My jealousy is at the thought of Master having another. Right now, he says he doesnt want one. but I'm always afraid he will. Ok.. maybe not always.. but still.. it's there.

anyway.. I've rambled enough..tonight's my date night with Master and 6 weeks from tomorrow I fly to his side.

awe, Fi, thanks for sharing that. You don't know how much that helps me feel better about all this. I sorta look up to you and your clan for inspiration and understanding in this new venture and to know that you have somethings that are hard for you makes me feel not so alone. Thank you!!

 

[Homburg]

I considered this before I posted and have been thinking on it since he left. I really don't think that it is me bending myself to fit into a mold he created- rather it is me finally coming to knowledge of something in myself I've long denied. It never really occurred to me to parallel my own life to that of other typical poly folks before now, but looking back at my past relationships, the proof is written all over the walls. Whether i admitted it or not, I have always been poly and now I am interested in how the conscious knowledge of this will effect my relationship with Carlos.

Same thing happened to me. I used to be pretty much against the idea of poly. I have a very good friend that has been poly damned near as long a sI've known him. Note the "damned near". This means I watched him go poly, and got to see the wreckage that came along at the same time. In my mind, I saw an intelligent guy that let his life go to shit and it all seemed to revolve around his relationships. It took me years to realise that it was his own self-destructive behaviour, not his relationship choices, that were wrecking his life. He realised it too.

Unfortunately the poor bastard kept true to form and swung too far. Now he is in a strictly monogamous marriage, and is utterly miserable, both because he is not getting his poly outlet, and because (due to medical reasons on his wife's part) sex is no longer an active part of their lives. And she cannot get her head around him with anyone else. I feel sorry for him, and for her and the kids when it explodes.

----

No, not "there there" but also, I have to sometimes ask for it. Just say "I need you to say this to me" or "I need you to look at me and be meaningful here for a moment" because sometimes it's just that simple and I've given up on the school of thought that says it's ONLY meaningful if the other person does it unasked and knows exactly when to do it and all that crap. No one's telepathic.

A-fucking-men. Hallelujah. Can we get this message out to others?

Though I will thank you for helping someone in my life realise this truth.

 

[rida]

As always, awesome post from Netzach & all. And good for you Gigi, for realizing that if you cannot be expected to read your partner's mind, you cannot expect for them to read yours.

The "no one's telephatic" is truly a golden rule. Just to be picky I'll add the "but being emphatic is a high necessity" for a successful poly arrangement. It does not mean to go out of your way to take care of the other person's emotions. It means to be aware of the impact of your actions/words and be mindful of them.

Hubby & I are also in the early days of being openly poly (we've kind of always been, just had not talk it out). I tend not to be jealous, as far as my value is not forgotten or overlooked, and I've learned to ask for reassurance when needed. Truth is thou that at the moment I do not have to deal with it as he is not seeing anyone else. I, on the other hand, right now am seeing a nice sweet young guy and a Sadist. They are not really relationship, more like play arrangement. Hubby is not jealous, but the rule is that I tell him everything that happens, if he so wishes. And that they do not come in the way of his requests/needs. He has a harder time expressing his needs, so I try to be aware of his moods and make sure to check with him how we stand.

Actually, I have a couple cute jealousy stories: the only time that Hubby got jealous is when I said that I gave a shoulder massage to the other man. And the only thing that annoyed me when Hubby told me about the woman he was seeing is that she was being multi-orgasmic when I still could not be.

Now, what if one of the relationship got further than play an became also deeply emotional? That is something we are still talking over. He knows that that is what I wish for, but I know that due to life circumstances it would be very hard to handle. At any rate, we are talking out what if scenarios, so that if they happen, we are not going to be totally unprepared.

And as always, the secret is ... roll of drums ... communication communication communication

 

[EmpressFi]

We actually had the emotional thing happen recently.

Master and I are very much in love. And I did feel badly that Malin didnt seem to have that. I know he loved his former Mistress very much, but well they had some problems.

A few weeks ago, Malin came home to tell me that he'd gotten up the courage to tell his OSO that he loved her.. and that she cried when she told him that she loved him too. It's such a great feeling. To not feel guilty that I have something he doesnt and relief knowing that someone loves him who's not going to hurt him..

 

[rida]

We actually had the emotional thing happen recently.

Master and I are very much in love. And I did feel badly that Malin didnt seem to have that. I know he loved his former Mistress very much, but well they had some problems.

A few weeks ago, Malin came home to tell me that he'd gotten up the courage to tell his OSO that he loved her.. and that she cried when she told him that she loved him too. It's such a great feeling. To not feel guilty that I have something he doesnt and relief knowing that someone loves him who's not going to hurt him..

YEY! Congratulations to all!
Thank you for sharing such a great news!

I too look up at you guys (and all the other poly families) and learn from each of your posts

 

[BiBunny]

I keep wanting to say something because I guess Kitty, Yeti, and I are kinda in a poly situation. We have a weird semi-triad thing going on. It works well for us, but I honestly can't thing of a single useful thing to post right now. I'll think on it and come back later.

 

[SubKekiLee]

I would strongly recommend the book The Ethical Slut. It's about poly relationships and Chapter 7 deals entirely about jealousy and covers most of what Netz said. (She's so wise *smooch*)

It's funny. I cant think of any time that I've been jealous of Malin being with someone else. But I have been jealous of the quantity of time he has. Right now, his OSO (other significant other) works with us and lives in the area, so they have a date night once a week. I love it because then Master and I get our alone time but, sometimes Malin's OSO comes over here for us to hang out. The rule is, when she's here, if I'm here, then she's a guest. Basically, right now, I feel weird if they're having sex in the next room. So they dont. They cuddle and kiss, etc, but she sleeps in the guest bed.

When I examined that "weirdness" what I discovered it THAT was my jealousy. I wanted my OSO. I didnt want to have to listen to them in the next room, when I was alone in mine. They both accept it and she even admitted that she was a little weirded out by it and so we're good with it.

My jealousy is at the thought of Master having another. Right now, he says he doesnt want one. but I'm always afraid he will. Ok.. maybe not always.. but still.. it's there.

anyway.. I've rambled enough..tonight's my date night with Master and 6 weeks from tomorrow I fly to his side.

I have to agree with Fi and Netz... I bought the book The Ethical Slut and it is AMAZING! I HIGHLY suggest reading it. It is GREAT and it isnt that expensive on Amazon.com...

 

[sexycaz22]

Have to put my hand up for The Ethical Slut too.

It's an amazing book, and even though I am not in a poly relationship, I am "open-dating" and seeing different guys for different reasons, whether it be drinks only; play sessions or a one-off play session, etc. And the book does help quite a lot in discovering and understanding the emotions and feelings I may have.

I do need to re-read it now, as there is a big potential that one guy and I will be getting serious.

Anyway.... I do agree with some others, Fi and Netzach are great examples of all poly-relationship stories, and I read each post with interest, admiration and amazement.

The same goes for Homburg, MIS and viv, of course and not forgetting the Bi-Critters trio!

 

[SweetGigi]

I have read TES once before for light and informative reading. As I said, I know I need to re-read it to pluck from it what can apply to our relationship.

Last night, Carlos called me to reassure me that nothing in the world could break our bonds. "Now that I have you, I will fight heaven and earth to keep you and defend your honour." *swoon* How sweet is that? He expressed that we will gradually move into a poly situation by first seeking out play partners in our respective cities and being personally involved in the search. He wants me to come into all this willingly, openly, and with no reservations. I think we are on the right path.

Thanks everyone.

 

[sexycaz22]

I have read TES once before for light and informative reading. As I said, I know I need to re-read it to pluck from it what can apply to our relationship.

Last night, Carlos called me to reassure me that nothing in the world could break out bonds. "Now that I have you, I will fight heaven and earth to keep you and defend your honour." *swoon* How sweet is that? He expressed that we will gradually move into a poly situation by first seeing out play partners in our respective cities and being personally involved in the search. He wants me to come into all this willingly, openly, and with no reservations. I think we are on the right path.

Thanks everyone.

Cool, your Carlos does sound like a lovely guy!

Wishing you all the best!

 

[myinnerslut]

wow, i step away from lit for a day or so to back and leave college for the summer and this thread exploded....

gigi- i wish you all the best. bring true to yourself is hard when its so entwined with doing what somebody else wants but im sure you can do it. also, i m going to piggy back on the advice directed to you and try to find a copy of "the ethical slut", which i still havnt read. congrats on the realtaionship and the directions its moving in.

bj- as always, you seem to know what to say. you really are a welath of knowledge. thank you for sharing.

netz- wonderful advice always. no ones telepathic. i'll have to remember that. thank you.

fi- you really are on of my main examples of a working poly relationship . than you for sharing. you are a role model and an inspiration.

bibunny- youve always been open about your poly-ness. i actually used to envy you a bit for having yourself worked out so well. im happy to hear that your semi-triad as you called it is working out for you.

rida- i think im the opposite of you. i tend to be jelouse and possessive. yet for some reason, this hasnt seemed to apply to Homburg and viv. personally, i think your handling things very well. case and point: "I try to be aware of his moods and make sure to check with him how we stand".


now i hae my own question: my life has been kind of complicated lately, largely in part to this new relationship. well, thats not true, largely in part to my interactions with other people about this new relationship would be more accurate. you see, my parents and i have alays been very close. we have always been able to share anything with each other, and i couldnt concieve of leaving something that was this much a part of my life.

they already knew i was submissive, they already knew that i would seek out a relationship within BDSM. that wasnt the shocker. they didnt care much about the age difference when i told them. they werent happy with poly, but after some talking understood. kids in the picture? once more not thrilled, but working towrads getting over it. the big one they can not get past is (drumroll please) Homburg and viv are married.

i havnt been able to xplain that im not the "other women", that im not an affair, that i am not a homewrecker (really hurt when my mother called me that), that im not trying to break up the marrige or replace viv in his life.

i suppose this was more of a rant of frudtration then anything else but if you have any advice, please share.

 

[Netzach]

wow, i step away from lit for a day or so to back and leave college for the summer and this thread exploded....

gigi- i wish you all the best. bring true to yourself is hard when its so entwined with doing what somebody else wants but im sure you can do it. also, i m going to piggy back on the advice directed to you and try to find a copy of "the ethical slut", which i still havnt read. congrats on the realtaionship and the directions its moving in.

bj- as always, you seem to know what to say. you really are a welath of knowledge. thank you for sharing.

netz- wonderful advice always. no ones telepathic. i'll have to remember that. thank you.

fi- you really are on of my main examples of a working poly relationship . than you for sharing. you are a role model and an inspiration.

bibunny- youve always been open about your poly-ness. i actually used to envy you a bit for having yourself worked out so well. im happy to hear that your semi-triad as you called it is working out for you.

rida- i think im the opposite of you. i tend to be jelouse and possessive. yet for some reason, this hasnt seemed to apply to Homburg and viv. personally, i think your handling things very well. case and point: "I try to be aware of his moods and make sure to check with him how we stand".


now i hae my own question: my life has been kind of complicated lately, largely in part to this new relationship. well, thats not true, largely in part to my interactions with other people about this new relationship would be more accurate. you see, my parents and i have alays been very close. we have always been able to share anything with each other, and i couldnt concieve of leaving something that was this much a part of my life.

they already knew i was submissive, they already knew that i would seek out a relationship within BDSM. that wasnt the shocker. they didnt care much about the age difference when i told them. they werent happy with poly, but after some talking understood. kids in the picture? once more not thrilled, but working towrads getting over it. the big one they can not get past is (drumroll please) Homburg and viv are married.

i havnt been able to xplain that im not the "other women", that im not an affair, that i am not a homewrecker (really hurt when my mother called me that), that im not trying to break up the marrige or replace viv in his life.

i suppose this was more of a rant of frudtration then anything else but if you have any advice, please share.

I don't have any advice. You're in a situation where someone's not going to listen to your explanations. Maybe after they've processed their freak out more and seen the relationship progressing more and not going away, they'll get used to it and maybe feel silly one day.

Maybe if you present it more as "I'm seeing this married couple" that might help some. Don't deal with them as individuals as much, but rather a united front that is hot for you, even if that seems cheap - it may kind of change the framework enough to create "huh, doesn't compute" - I think that's part of what's happening, you're in something that mom has NO frame of reference for other than "homewrecker"

 

[Millificent]

wow, i step away from lit for a day or so to back and leave college for the summer and this thread exploded....

gigi- i wish you all the best. bring true to yourself is hard when its so entwined with doing what somebody else wants but im sure you can do it. also, i m going to piggy back on the advice directed to you and try to find a copy of "the ethical slut", which i still havnt read.
congrats on the realtaionship and the directions its moving in.

netz- wonderful advice always. no ones telepathic. i'll have to remember that. thank you.

fi- you really are on of my main examples of a working poly relationship . than you for sharing. you are a role model and an inspiration.

bibunny- youve always been open about your poly-ness. i actually used to envy you a bit for having yourself worked out so well. im happy to hear that your semi-triad as you called it is working out for you.

rida- i think im the opposite of you. i tend to be jelouse and possessive. yet for some reason, this hasnt seemed to apply to Homburg and viv. personally, i think your handling things very well. case and point: "I try to be aware of his moods and make sure to check with him how we stand".


now i hae my own question: my life has been kind of complicated lately, largely in part to this new relationship. well, thats not true, largely in part to my interactions with other people about this new relationship would be more accurate. you see, my parents and i have alays been very close. we have always been able to share anything with each other, and i couldnt concieve of leaving something that was this much a part of my life.

they already knew i was submissive, they already knew that i would seek out a relationship within BDSM. that wasnt the shocker. they didnt care much about the age difference when i told them. they werent happy with poly, but after some talking understood. kids in the picture? once more not thrilled, but working towrads getting over it. the big one they can not get past is (drumroll please) Homburg and viv are married.

i havnt been able to xplain that im not the "other women", that im not an affair, that i am not a homewrecker (really hurt when my mother called me that), that im not trying to break up the marrige or replace viv in his life.

i suppose this was more of a rant of frudtration then anything else but if you have any advice, please share.

*hugs*

First, let me say that I think it's awesome that you are so close with your parents and that they are so accepting. I know the elders in my life would not be such. Some might more than others, but even then, I can't really be sure.

I think, really, that the best way (not the most feasible) would be to have them both see all of us together and the interaction between us. So that they can see for themselves that you aren't "the other woman", that you're not an affair, and that you are most certainly not a home wrecker.

Barring that, I'm not exactly sure. Pictures of when we are together? Letters? Phone calls?

We'll figure something out and we'll get through it

 

[catalina_francisco]

the big one they can not get past is (drumroll please) Homburg and viv are married.

i havnt been able to xplain that im not the "other women", that im not an affair, that i am not a homewrecker (really hurt when my mother called me that), that im not trying to break up the marrige or replace viv in his life.

i suppose this was more of a rant of frudtration then anything else but if you have any advice, please share.

I think the first thing I would offer you is that just as you wish them to understand you and your relationship, so they too expect and want you to understand and respect their thoughts and fears. I'm not sure I agree with viv that pushing for them to see you all together, sharing group photos etc., will help as most people would begin to feel you were shoving it in their face and down their throats, and then the normal reaction is to be more defensive and skeptical about the whole dynamic and future of the relationship, and most of all, only more fearful you are going to be the loser in this and hurt badly.

Parents are parents, and from past postings you have made, your parents do care about you deeply, and try to be open to you living your life your way. Give them time, let them see what the relationship is through longevity and your happiness, not trying to force them to accept something they do not fully understand.

It could be they are skeptical also because as yet you have not met viv and yet accepted a collar and consider you are in a relationship. While in theory you are, and while you feel you will still feel the way you do now, sometimes as much as we expect to click with another and everything to go wonderfully, when face to face, it sometimes happens that the attraction and/or chemistry is not there as expected. You can never 100% predict this, though you can feel you have a good idea of the reality. This might be be big part of why they fear you being a home wrecker as they put it...to date your interactions have been on a physical level solely with Homburg, not viv...they need to see how that step goes for all involved before they likely can accept you really are involved with 2 people and not one. You are also entering into a relationship with 2 people who have had an established relationship for a long time...your parents know you cannot assume to have that same security and history, thus it puts you in the position of newcomer who will at times feel an outsider or left out. Nothing can change that fully.

Add to that I believe, and expect they do also, that when children are involved, it is far from an easy road to walk, and in some ways no matter what any of you want, creates a hierarchy of sorts, or maybe a better way to think of it would be it is unequal in some respects. The children also deserve consideration, and if they begin to feel they are missing out on dad's attention, or you are imposing where they do not want you, or any number of issues children in the mix can add, they have to be heard and respected for their fears and feelings, and sometimes the outcome is that the relationship falters and/or ends. Your parents are probably wondering too if this is a very long term relationship, where do you stand in terms of ever having children of your own (their grandchildren). It may seem silly, but these things can often be the be all or end all of the relationship and happiness.

So what I am saying is try to see it from your parents viewpoint given they love and respect you so much, give them time and space to get used to the idea based on what they see in you, and don't force them to pretend to like it just because it will make life easier and possibly more guilt free for you for them to do so and give you their approval. Bottom line in any relationship is though it is nice to have the approval of those we love and love us, if it has any substance at all, approval or not should not make a difference beyond it being more pleasant.

Catalina

 

[Millificent]

Cat-you bring up some really good points I didn't mean to come across as shoving the relationship down their throats. I am a firm believer in taking things slow and letting things run the course, as it were.

 

[catalina_francisco]

Cat-you bring up some really good points I didn't mean to come across as shoving the relationship down their throats. I am a firm believer in taking things slow and letting things run the course, as it were.

I suspected you weren't. It is more about allowing for different perceptions and people usually become defensive if they feel they are being pressured. I think we all have times when we don't see things from another's position, especially when so closely and emotionally involved...someone on the outside looking in can often see it clearly and highlight the possible problems. I imagine like most parents, MIS parents just want what they feel is going to be the best for her and her future happiness and maybe all she can do is let time do the talking for her.

Catalina

 

[Homburg]

The kids are an issue, but, just as we do not do BDSM things in front of the kids, we won't be doing poly things in front of them either. When MIS visits, the kids won't bat an eye. We are hospitable people, and have frequently had people stay over. My friends know that they can always stay here if they are out of doors for some reason, and a number of them have taken me up on that. So the kids ar eused to other people staying here on occassion.

We've also introduced the idea of MIS to the kids as time has gone on. The webcam has been wildly useful for this, as she will have the cam on while she and viv are chatting, and the kids get to see her on viv's screen. They know who she is, and her name, etc. And most of them have talked to her on the phone, and know that she is coming to visit. The kids are friendly and hospitable like viv and I, and very good about new people coming into their lives.

We are working to minimise the disruption in their lives, but are also aware that children are not the delicate little snowflakes that people treat them like. I went to something like 11 schools before I graduated high schools, and have lived everywhere. There are people that would look at my childhood and think it horrible because we moved so much, and I never put roots down and never had friends for long. Whatever. I turned out okay.

I've watched a lot of kids grow up, and know an awful lot about the childhoods of friends of mine. I pay attention when people talk about their childhood and try to glean lessons in parenting from it. And the single biggest things that keeps popping up in the lives of folks that I would consider damaged were bad divorce and substance abuse. Not poly, not kink, not dad being on the road all the time. Alcholism and drug abuse, and nasty divorces really seem to be the big ones.

Now, I'm not passing judgement on divorcees or single parents, but the observation is there. And I really don't think that anyone is going to fault me for pointing out that substance abuse in a parent is a BAD thing.

That said, more than one person has commented on my attention being split. Not having as much time. My time may be a bit spread thin, but I am still here. They still get time. I am still a day-to-day presence in their lives, and available more than most dads because I work out of the home. In my own case, my dad was in the field and deployed quite a bit. The Army is unconcerned with Dad being home all the time. So again, my dad was frequently absent, yet I turned out okay.

I guess what I'm saying to the folks that worry about the kids is to get a grip. My kids are well-adjusted, well-behaved good kids. We constantly get compliments on how polite, cheerful, and cool our little hooligans are. I'm still here, still being Papa, and still taking care of my kids. The usual response in my shoes is to leave the wife for the new woman. So thanks for worrying, but don't get too widgey. I get that you don't like poly, or don't like poly with kids. Good for you. I would rather have poly with kids than have divorce and serial monogamy. No thanks.

 

[catalina_francisco]

I guess what I'm saying to the folks that worry about the kids is to get a grip. My kids are well-adjusted, well-behaved good kids. We constantly get compliments on how polite, cheerful, and cool our little hooligans are. I'm still here, still being Papa, and still taking care of my kids. The usual response in my shoes is to leave the wife for the new woman. So thanks for worrying, but don't get too widgey. I get that you don't like poly, or don't like poly with kids. Good for you. I would rather have poly with kids than have divorce and serial monogamy. No thanks.

There is no need to get so defensive H, and by doing so it actually raises concerns where I had none previously because apart from the need on your part to tell people who cite it as a possible problem in the future to get over it, you also keep validating anything which may happen by mentioning your childhood and how you feel you have turned out all right. That is your view and your entitled to it, but one of the biggest mistakes parents make...single, divorced, poly, abusers, drug takers, alcoholics, average suburbia, married make is thinking just because something was OK with them, it will be OK with and for their own children.

Children are individuals, and one thing I have learned as a parent and grand parent is there are often things they feel that they would never tell their parent/s, especially if they felt it was selfish on their part, or going to upset their parent, or just not be heard. Your experiences are yours, not theirs..for one thing, as you say, they are used to a completely different lifestyle to what you grew up with...they live in a different era, they have different feelings, needs, wants, expectations. Each of your children will also have a different experience to each other both with each other and with you and viv as parents..it is life. While it is convenient for them to cope with adult choices and changes, I don't feel it is something that can always be assumed to be in their best interests, even if only from their standpoint alone.

On another note, I for one didnt expect you to be doing poly things in front of them in a sexual senses, but it is and already has impacted on them whether you want to see it or not. While you are visiting MIS, you are not with them as a family and I expect you usually are....that is a huge change for them to adjust to. You not being home on mother's day may also have impacted and set of concerns for them if it has traditionally been a family day for you all. And I for one never questioned your or your children's hospitality and find it quite offensive for you te accuse anyone of that unless they have specifically told you so. You visiting MIS while viv remains home with the children has nothing to do with whether you are hospitable to others...it has to do with whether your sex life (and yes, I can be blunt too when it is thrown at me) is impacting on your children and your need to follow your desires blinds you to what might be going on in their impressionable minds. You underate children and their intelligence...they pick up on more than what is put before their eyes. You choose parenthood, you can't turn it on and off at whim or pretend all you want is good and fitting with your children's wants or be damned. Being a responsible parent also is not about forcing your values and choices onto your children an expecting them to accept and like them.

For all your sakes I hope it works well, and your children don't suffer, but if you bury your head in the sand and blast anyone who mentions it as a concern (as I did where MIS's parents are concerned) I don't feel you are interested in letting it get in your way and basically put them on the list of peopel who need to get over it if they have issues with it.

Catalina