Planned Parenthood Prez: Fund Planned Parenthood to stop abortion

[LadyFunkenstein]

That's what pro-choice is - a recognition of the other side. As opposed to places like China that mandate abortions.

I didn't say ALL women. But you cannot deny that abortion is an important part of women's healthcare, surely?

I don't care if a person has a different opinion they wish to apply to themselves. It's when they wish to apply their opinion to others I have a problem with. As should you.

We went through this already.

Everyone can apply his/her personal opinions and interests at the voting box, in order to change legislation to what we want. That's the way our democracy works.

Capital punishment is legal in many (or most). If you are for it and think it is i
important, you vote for the person who will fight to enact/keep it. If you are against it, you vote for the person who will fight to get rid of it/block it. It isn't just up to people facing capital punishment to decide, it is up to everyone who is a citizen. In the end, we each are applying our opinions to other people. Why is this a difficult concept?

 

[LadyFunkenstein]

What's difficult to understand about you being a compete psycho bitch?

What is difficult to understand that a loser who bases an alt on a joke from 2005 will be put on ignore?

 

[adrina]

We went through this already.

Everyone can apply his/her personal opinions and interests at the voting box, in order to change legislation to what we want. That's the way our democracy works. Capital punishment is legal in many (or most). If you are for it and think it is important, you vote for the person who will fight to enact/keep it. If you are against it, you vote for the person who will fight to get rid of it/block it. Either way, we each are applying our opinions to other people. Why is this a difficult concept?

Yes we did. And the vote was cast.

That changes nothing in regards to the actuality of justice. We have a court system and things work their way through. To say something is okay, fair, just or acceptable just because it is a law or policy denies the entire basis of our system of government.

Additionally, on a sheer logic level alone, republicans would be foolish to defund PPH because of the popularity it enjoys. PPH is worth fighting for. I've done my thing - donated, written my reps, voted etc. So basically at this point, you'd just have me sit down and shut up then because of the power structure currently?

I am unapologetically pro-choice. I will fight vociferously for a woman's right to have an abortion as well as her right to carry through with the pregnancy. I do not see that as trying to cram my view down someone's throat. Especially as opposed to those that are anti-abortion that will only fight against abortion.

 

[LadyFunkenstein]

Yes we did. And the vote was cast.

That changes nothing in regards to the actuality of justice. We have a court system and things work their way through. To say something is okay, fair, just or acceptable just because it is a law or policy denies the entire basis of our system of government.

Additionally, on a sheer logic level alone, republicans would be foolish to defund PPH because of the popularity it enjoys. PPH is worth fighting for. I've done my thing - donated, written my reps, voted etc. So basically at this point, you'd just have me sit down and shut up then because of the power structure currently?

I am unapologetically pro-choice. I will fight vociferously for a woman's right to have an abortion as well as her right to carry through with the pregnancy. I do not see that as trying to cram my view down someone's throat. Especially as opposed to those that are anti-abortion that will only fight against abortion.

I never said anything about "okay" nor "fair". I am far too old to believe the world works that way.

PPH is less popular than you think, which is why the de-funding will likely be successful. Some of us do know their history vis a vis the founder and it isn't pretty. (Fuck that bitch.) I believe their services are very important and therefore I don't rant against them, but if they didn't exist and an new organization without eugenics as their founding goal would be formed, I'd be pleased.

I am not telling you to do nothing. I am suggesting you stop challenging people on "why [they] have such a problem with abortion". It's just ridiculously arrogant.

 

[adrina]

I never said anything about "okay" nor "fair". I am far too old to believe the world works that way.

PPH is less popular than you think, which is why the de-funding will likely be successful. Some of us do know their history vis a vis the founder and it isn't pretty. (Fuck that bitch.) I believe their services are very important and therefore I don't rant against them, but if they didn't exist and an new organization without eugenics as their founding goal would be formed, I'd be pleased.

I am not telling you to do nothing. I am suggesting you stop challenging people on "why [they] have such a problem with abortion". It's just ridiculously arrogant.

Actually no it's not ridiculous or arrogant. What is both ridiculous and arrogant is that there are people that want to remove health services to a large chunk of the population based on their dislike of a procedure no one will ever force them to have or actively deal with.

It's ridiculous that we think it's any of our business whatsoever.

Also, at this point you should kinda watch the propaganda. While no one is perfect, she's been demonized to the point of ridiculous.

 

[Que]

Actually I don't have a problem with that.

If you want to talk government subsidies and how much of an "investment" they are into society, we should look to the oil industries. But they don't provide abortions, so they aren't on your radar. Oil companies get $4 billion of taxpayer money yet Exxon Mobil raked in over $32 billion in profits.

Your vitriol isn't about taxpayer money.

Being able to pay less in taxes because you can deduct actual expenditures from your profits the same as any other business or industry does is not the government handing you a huge, actual check. The way they used to do for Planned Parenthood.

This is one of those hot button issues that since the right people howl about it, I am becoming more and more in favor of. At this point I kind of hope Ted Cruz gets on the bench. Somehow I can see him overturning Roe vs. Wade and sending that issue back to the various States. That would be deliciously awesome to watch your meltdown on having to cross State lines. Much better than your meltdown over the fact that Planned Parenthood won't be getting the federal money to not spend on abortions that they currently don't spend on abortions. Which is only 3% of their business.

I've never had particularly strong anti-abortion feelings. Not something I'm particularly in favor of but it's something that I always saw as a woman's choice until I met you now that I've experienced your level of vitriol and personal attacks I'm thinking I should probably open my wallet today and find some were the anti-abortion crazy to send some money to.

I'm glad I erased the personal experience that I shared and then thought better of the other night. The long and the short of it is I had a very close friend who had to make that difficult decision you are so glib about, not once, but twice. Once, she chose to take her gestation to full term and is thrilled, if financially burdened by her second child. (1st was with her then husband) and the second time, faced with the same decision again despite having used birth control prior to both pregnancies she (after a lot of deep and painful soul-searching )decided to terminate. I was supportive of her in every way you can think of about both decisions. Neither of which were easy for her. -And no neither child was mine, you presumptive bitch.

Quite frankly, you deserve every bit of the vitriol you are ever going to experience in your life from the anti-abortion crazies. It's people like you that turn this issue into the circus it is.

You will notice that I haven't asked you how many babies you've killed and why you can't fucking figure out how to make birth control work.

The reason I haven't done that isn't because you don't deserve that level of vitriol but because that's not the reality that women face and I happen to know a little bit about this.

In addition to where it's intersected with my life my mom's surgical experience was primarily working with an OBGYN and my brother is a high-tisk obstetric surgeon. I've never once had a conversation with him about whether or not he has performed abortions because in his line of work...without a doubt...it would have to come up as medically necessary. His patients, by self selection, ate generally struggling to bring their collections of cells to term. They call 'em babies because they atent as wise and worldly as you. I know my brother and his sensitivity and compassion and am certain that he would not only lidten to the patients needs and pergorm whatever procedure is best for the pstient on every level, he, unlike PP, is not hustling emotionally vulnerable patients into a quick, profitable procedure with no thought as to the actual psyhological care that should be given in accordance with the gravity of such a decision.

You dismissed such concerns out of hand along with the hesrtfelt moral qualms some have. A of which makes you a detestable person.

 

[adrina]

Being able to pay less in taxes because you can deduct actual expenditures from your profits the same as any other business or industry does is not the government handing you a huge, actual check. The way they used to do for Planned Parenthood.

This is one of those hot button issues that since the right people howl about it, I am becoming more and more in favor of. At this point I kind of hope Ted Cruz gets on the bench. Somehow I can see him overturning Roe vs. Wade and sending that issue back to the various States. That would be deliciously awesome to watch your meltdown on having to cross State lines. Much better than your meltdown over the fact that Planned Parenthood won't be getting the federal money to not spend on abortions that they currently don't spend on abortions. Which is only 3% of their business.

I've never had particularly strong anti-abortion feelings. Not something I'm particularly in favor of but it's something that I always saw as a woman's choice until I met you now that I've experienced your level of vitriol and personal attacks I'm thinking I should probably open my wallet today and find some were the anti-abortion crazy to send some money to.

I'm glad I erased the personal experience that I shared and then thought better of the other night. the long and the short of it is I had a very close friend who had to make that difficult decision you are so glib about, ywice. Once she chose to take her gedtation to full term and is thrilled, if finacially burdened by her second child. (1st was with her then husband) faced with the same decision again despite having used birth control prior to both pregnancies she (after a lot of deep and painful soul-searching )decided to terminate. I was supportive of her in every way you can think of about both decisions. Neither of which were easy for her. -And no neither child was mine, you presumptive bitch.

Quite frankly, you deserve every bit of the vitriol you are ever going to experience in your life from the anti-abortion crazies. It's people like you that turn this issue into the circus it is.

You will notice that I haven't asked you how many babies you've killed and why you can't fucking figure out how to make birth control work.

The reason I haven't done that isn't because you don't deserve that level of vitriol but because that's not the reality that women face and I happen to know a little bit about this.

In addition to where it's intersected with my life my mom's surgical experience was primarily working with an OBGYN and my brother is a high-tisk obstetric surgeon. I've never once had a conversation with him about whether or not he has performed abortions because in his line of work...without a doubt...it would have to come up as medically necessary. His patients, by self selection, ate generally struggling to bring their collections of cells to term. They call 'em babies because they atent as wise and worldly as you. I know my brother and his sensitivity and compassion and am certain that he would not only lidten to the patients needs and pergorm whatever procedure is best for the pstient on every level, he, unlike PP, is not hustling emotionally vulnerable patients into a quick, profitable procedure with no thought as to the actual psyhological care that should be given in accordance with the gravity of such a decision.

You dismissed such concerns out of hand along with the hesrtfelt moral qualms some have. A of which makes you a detestable person.

So basically you're just going to go about your usual hate fest - you've been an ass to me (under several of your incarnations) since I walked into this board and you wonder why I treat you with utter contempt. I really have no idea why you took it upon yourself to be such a complete asshole to me and frankly at this point I don't care.

My open stance of being pro-choice and unapologetic support of an organization that does a lot of good things is enough to make you support an anti-abortion group?

You are your own worst poison.

 

[Que]

So basically you're just going to go about your usual hate fest - you've been an ass to me (under several of your incarnations) since I walked into this board and you wonder why I treat you with utter contempt. I really have no idea why you took it upon yourself to be such a complete asshole to me and frankly at this point I don't care.

My open stance of being pro-choice and unapologetic support of an organization that does a lot of good things is enough to make you support an anti-abortion group?

You are your own worst poison.

Operation rescue is an obvious choice, but maybe there is something more militant? I don't really follow these things that closely which organization would you be the most personally offended by?

https://secure.giveworks.net/operationrescue/donate/WEB5617

I do like that they have a recurring donation feature. I don't see an option though to specifically make it a gift made out to "adrina."

I'm thinking needs to be an organization with street level demonstrations. You know the ones that get right up in women's faces as they're coming and going from these sort of places. That would be the moral equivelent of the vitriol you spewed at me for not sharing your enthusism for abortions. The problem is that would directly affect women who have in no way offended me the way you have. That would go against my own personal moral code.

I envy your ability to poutrage without having any particular moral framework to constrain you.

 

[adrina]

Operation rescue is an obvious choice, but maybe there is something more militant? I don't really follow these things that closely which organization would you be the most personally offended by?

https://secure.giveworks.net/operationrescue/donate/WEB5617

I do like that they have a recurring donation feature. I don't see an option though to specifically make it a gift made out to "adrina."

I'm thinking needs to be an organization with street level demonstrations. You know the ones that get right up in women's faces as they're coming and going from these sort of places. That would be the moral equivelent of the vitriol you spewed at me for not sharing your enthusism for abortions. The problem is that would directly affect women who have in no way offended me the way you have. That would go against my own personal moral code.

I envy your ability to poutrage without having any particular moral framework to constrain you.

Whatever dude.

 

[LadyFunkenstein]

Actually no it's not ridiculous or arrogant. What is both ridiculous and arrogant is that there are people that want to remove health services to a large chunk of the population based on their dislike of a procedure no one will ever force them to have or actively deal with.

It's ridiculous that we think it's any of our business whatsoever.

Also, at this point you should kinda watch the propaganda. While no one is perfect, she's been demonized to the point of ridiculous.

Again, your opinion is no more righteous than theirs. You only think it is.

 

[adrina]

Again, your opinion is no more righteous than theirs. You only think it is.

It's not about righteous. It's about all people having the ability to act in accordance with their conscience.

 

[Que]

It's not about righteous. It's about all people having the ability to act in accordance with their conscience.

Too funny.

You mean as long as their actual conscience aligns with your rudderless "conscience."

As well read as LadyFunk is, she has probably already read it, but I just picked up a copy of "The Meme Machine" by Susan Blackmore.

The way that you present your ideas is strongly suggestive that you have simply absorbed societal memes of a particular stripe, and their presense in your mind convinces you with certitude of their righteousness despite the obvious problem with some of your ideas being at odds with thousands of years recorded history and obvious logical inconsistancies with any sort of biological imperative towards continuing one's own genes.

According to Blackmore's thesis my own belief systems and structures would of course be similarly affected by whatever memes I've been exposed to an absorbed and therefore believe to be correct.

Just at a glance I win because your point of view results in fewer copies of your genes and internal memes to be propagated.

 

[adrina]

Too funny.

You mean as long as their actual conscience aligns with your rudderless "conscience."

As well read as LadyFunk is, she has probably already read it, but I just picked up a copy of "The Meme Machine" by Susan Blackmore.

The way that you present your ideas is strongly suggestive that you have simply absorbed societal memes of a particular stripe, and their presense in your mind convinces you with certitude of their righteousness despite the obvious problem with some of your ideas being at odds with thousands of years recorded history and obvious logical inconsistancies with any sort of biological imperative towards continuing one's own genes.

According to Blackmore's thesis my own belief systems and structures would of course be similarly affected by whatever memes I've been exposed to an absorbed and therefore believe to be correct.

Just at a glance I win because your point of view results in fewer copies of your genes and internal memes to be propagated.

Whatever dude.

 

[mark_j]

Actually no it's not ridiculous or arrogant. What is both ridiculous and arrogant is that there are people that want to remove health services to a large chunk of the population based on their dislike of a procedure no one will ever force them to have or actively deal with.

Let’s get something straight.

With the exception of abortion services and anonymity (in certain states), there isn't one medical/gynacological/birth control service offered at PPH that a woman cannot get at the local county health or walk in clinic. Usually at equally low cost or free (for those that qualify for medicaid) as in the case at PPH.

So let's stop with the fallacy that de-funding PPH is going to deny a woman access to essential female health services. It isn't.

 

[Que]

Let’s get something straight.

With the exception of abortion services and anonymity (in certain states), there isn't one medical/gynacological/birth control service offered at PPH that a woman cannot get at the local county health or walk in clinic. Usually at equally low cost or free (for those that qualify for medicaid) as in the case at PPH.

So let's stop with the fallacy that de-funding PPH is going to deny a woman access to essential female health services. It isn't.

Nonsense. Unless those Medicaid dollars are spent in a clinic that also spends "3% of its efforts!!" providing abortion services, the woman getting those free services, (all of which are covered under all insurance plans due to tbe ACA) she is not getting to "choose." So she will likely get knocked up or die from cancer.

My favorite PP claim was how important they are for mammagrophy....when none of their clinics are equipped for that.

 

[Que]

The world would have been better off had you been aborted.

Sorry, didn't see this to acknowlege you.

Your life, I'm sure, would be better and more fulfilling according to how you prefer to fill it, had I not been born, but I don't see you in the role of the world's spokesmodel. No matter how excellently you ellocute plagerized speeches.

 

[mark_j]

Nonsense. Unless those Medicaid dollars are spent in a clinic that also spends "3% of its efforts!!" providing abortion services, the woman getting those free services, (all of which are covered under all insurance plans due to tbe ACA) she is not getting to "choose." So she will likely get knocked up or die from cancer.

My favorite PP claim was how important they are for mammagrophy....when none of their clinics are equipped for that.

I think you missed my point...

 

[LadyFunkenstein]

It's not about righteous. It's about all people having the ability to act in accordance with their conscience.

True. And people who are against abortion should act in accordance with their conscience, just as you should act in accordance with yours and I should act in accordance with mine.

 

[LadyFunkenstein]

Let’s get something straight.

With the exception of abortion services and anonymity (in certain states), there isn't one medical/gynacological/birth control service offered at PPH that a woman cannot get at the local county health or walk in clinic. Usually at equally low cost or free (for those that qualify for medicaid) as in the case at PPH.

So let's stop with the fallacy that de-funding PPH is going to deny a woman access to essential female health services. It isn't.

Not true. Walk in clinics want to see your insurance card and call it in before anything else. I went to PP in my early 20s and walked out with birth control pills 30 minutes later. Can't say whether things are the same today, but I assume they are.

 

[Que]

I think you missed my point...

My sarcasm was a little obtuse.

As you know you are correct. At issue is of the millions of dollars of funding the Planned Parenthood receives.

Assuming that it's in any way true that they are not squandering any portion of those funds on abortion (which would be against the law) is there not some better, more cost-effective use for those dollars going into Women's Health Care. I don't see how anyone can reasonably object to a dollar for dollar match of current Federal funding for those things, just because it goes to clinics without the PP brand name attached to it.

Planned Parenthood has spent a lot of money trying to elect Democrats and they have lost. Elections have consequences. If for no other reason than that the people that they were backing specifically so that they could get money kicked back to them is more than enough reason to defund them.

Abit of an aside, but ASFME has spent million on buying Democrats. If Republican majorities get large enough, you simply outlaw unionization of government employees. No one ever thought that the union stranglehold over Michigan would be broken but at this point they have zero power in Michigan is a right-to-work State.

PP can do like ACORN. Acorn rebranded and reformed and still gets Fed money, just not the huge slush fund it got before.

 

[LadyFunkenstein]

Too funny.

You mean as long as their actual conscience aligns with your rudderless "conscience."

As well read as LadyFunk is, she has probably already read it, but I just picked up a copy of "The Meme Machine" by Susan Blackmore.

The way that you present your ideas is strongly suggestive that you have simply absorbed societal memes of a particular stripe, and their presense in your mind convinces you with certitude of their righteousness despite the obvious problem with some of your ideas being at odds with thousands of years recorded history and obvious logical inconsistancies with any sort of biological imperative towards continuing one's own genes.

According to Blackmore's thesis my own belief systems and structures would of course be similarly affected by whatever memes I've been exposed to an absorbed and therefore believe to be correct.

Just at a glance I win because your point of view results in fewer copies of your genes and internal memes to be propagated.

I actually do have that book but have not read it yet.

 

[Que]

Not true. Walk in clinics want to see your insurance card and call it in before anything else. I went to PP in my early 20s and walked out with birth control pills 30 minutes later. Can't say whether things are the same today, but I assume they are.

Seems like you could streamline whatever hoops PP jumped through to have a cabinet-full of Fed-funded BC so that any clinic or Doctor could do the same, no?

Seems like a good test-run for what will some day be universal healthcare. See if we can set up distribution channels, docs and clinics to do just one simple thing like that. I don't know right off hand why this stuff can't be more or less over the counter and or pharmacist be in the business of prescribing these sort of things.

I don't know but I have this vague idea that in some other countries pharmacists actually recommend and dispense drugs on their own.

 

[BotanyBoy]

It's not about righteous. It's about all people having the ability to act in accordance with their conscience.

Making everyone pay for their own shit is in no way preventing anyone from acting in accordance with their conscience.

You're pro PPH, that's cool...but you don't have to be so dishonest when arguing for public funding of PPH.

Just be honest, and tell everyone you think they should pay for other people to fuck and fuck up.

 

[Que]

I actually do have that book but have not read it yet.

I just got it yesterday and when it caught my eye and from the spine I thought it was going to have something to do with social media and I was prepared to quickly dismiss it out of hand but found it to be pretty interesting.

At the time the first thing I thought was this looks like something that lady Funk would have read.

I'm not sure if you've ever exactly said what you did but I thought of you as some sort of "Three Days of the Condor style reader devouring books (for a publishing house or a literary agent maybe) making recommendations and the like.

 

[LadyFunkenstein]

I just got it yesterday and when it caught my eye and from the spine I thought it was going to have something to do with social media and I was prepared to quickly dismiss it out of hand but found it to be pretty interesting.

At the time the first thing I thought was this looks like something that lady Funk would have read.

I'm not sure if you've ever exactly said what you did but I thought of you as some sort of "Three Days of the Condor style reader devouring books (for a publishing house or a literary agent maybe) making recommendations and the like.

I used to work in publishing but left in 2011.

I am still an insane reader of books as well as online stuff. Sometimes I stay up all night following a rabbit hole. Last night I learned about AI videos on YouTube - this is fresh, happening right now - targeted to toddlers with weird adult themes such as violence, lying and a but of ass play. They use Disney characters yet there is no cease and desist.... Hmmm. Also an occult background to Pepe... That is of course he same school as Podesta and his 14/fish wiki leak pic. Weird Crowley shit. Another hmmm...