Litiquette2

[JoyDyan]

Good morning Litiquette.

So apparently Robin Williams died. I was a fan as were millions of others. But here was a case of when I didn't enjoy social. Yes you were shocked, yes you were sad, yes he mad you laugh. These are universal truths, no sense in flooding the social media pipeline with the same thoughts over and over.

Or maybe I'm just grumpy.

Social media - of any kind, including Lit - is really just a means for people to unload things that are too big to keep in their heads. It was such a shock to hear of a seemingly happy, healthy person, who made the world laugh for so long, who could not find a reason to live. It is a normal, natural thing for humans to share their grief and shock when the unexpected happens. And to join into the communal grieving process....that herding instinct is very strong.

I hated Sociology class, but it helps me understand things better sometimes.

 

[Aquagal]

I had a family member who killed himself after battles with severe drugs and depression, so I am incredibly sensitive to these kinds of things. And I'm also annoyed at the stupid shit people say during those times. I am all for well wishes to the families though. In an awful time like this, it can be comforting to know that the person who passed had a huge impact on the lives of so many.

What does get my goat is the reactions of the news and the press in these instances. I remember when Michael Jackson died, I was so fucking annoyed. The same outlets that called him a child molester and mocked his plastic surgery were the very ones who immediately started talking about his amazing contributions to music. Same with Anna Nicole Smith. These people were the joke of the media and then they were held up with such high esteem the moment they passed. If I was a family member I would want to give a big fuck you to them. You don't get to wash your hands of all the bad shit you said by "remembering them". Here it is in graph form:


http://nces.ed.gov/nceskids/createagraph/graphwrite.aspx?ID=fdf3b444751242db96087d3092bb0293&r=34810.0278152&file=png

Wrong. Michael Jackson was creepy before and that's not changed in death. That's irrelevant of his talent in music. I think people get all sensitive when speaking ill of the dead.

Meh.

 

[Lord Pmann]

Wrong. Michael Jackson was creepy before and that's not changed in death. That's irrelevant of his talent in music. I think people get all sensitive when speaking ill of the dead.

Meh.

I think you missed my point. I think he was creepy, but I also think he's fucking awesome. But the same media outlets and people on Facebook who would've been making fun of his creepy arse were talking about what a great man he was and how he gave so much and all that.

You can be the sweetheart of the media one day and the devil the next. Apparently you can go from the devil to the sweetheart by dying.

And I want to say none of these comments are aimed at Robin Williams. He seemed super cool. Less creepy than MJ.

 

[Aquagal]

I think you missed my point. I think he was creepy, but I also think he's fucking awesome. But the same media outlets and people on Facebook who would've been making fun of his creepy arse were talking about what a great man he was and how he gave so much and all that.

You can be the sweetheart of the media one day and the devil the next. Apparently you can go from the devil to the sweetheart by dying.

And I want to say none of these comments are aimed at Robin Williams. He seemed super cool. Less creepy than MJ.

On a MJ creepy scale he was about a 0.

Maybe after Mel Gibson dies, he'll be hailed as this kind, compassionate, forgiving man.

 

[SweetSam42]

I'd agree with the point that social media being flooded with people sharing their sadness, etc., is irritating, but only to an extent.

I do like seeing how people are posting about mental illness, and for twitter/FB/etc to be flooded with personal stories about depression is an absolute positive in my book. Here is a man who had the financial means to receive the best treatment the world has to offer for depression, he was vocal about it and his addictions, and he couldn't overcome it. The stigma against people who suffer from depression or any other mental illness is outrageous. For so many, it's a disease full of shame and secrecy. I think the more people realize that depression is a disease like any other medical condition, the more people who suffer from it will be able to seek the treatment they need, and get the support they deserve from friends and family.

I hear people talk about how "selfish" suicide is, and how people with depression should just "get over it." Say what you will about Big Pharma, but SSRIs are a treatment that improves the lives of so many, exponentially. Would you say that someone who died of cancer was "selfish" in that death? Depression can be fatal. If Robin Williams' death helps the awareness for this condition, then I welcome a flood of tweets/posts/etc about it.

 

[LusterMunky]

I hear people talk about how "selfish" suicide is

Everything we do is selfish.

 

[dutchrain]

I think you missed my point. I think he was creepy, but I also think he's fucking awesome. But the same media outlets and people on Facebook who would've been making fun of his creepy arse were talking about what a great man he was and how he gave so much and all that.

You can be the sweetheart of the media one day and the devil the next. Apparently you can go from the devil to the sweetheart by dying.

And I want to say none of these comments are aimed at Robin Williams. He seemed super cool. Less creepy than MJ.

Well, you know it is a polite custom to not say anything bad about a dead person, and in MJ case the media simply obeyed to this rule. It was just all these very good journalists remembering their good upbringing.



People jump to public mourning (of famous persons), because so many old mourning habits have disappeared out off private life. People who openly mourn a loved person (husband, wife, child) for longer than a certain period (I believe six weeks is deemed enough to be so sad to break out in tears at random times) get diagnosed as having a depression and get medication.

Not so many years ago it was common use to wear black for at least a year, if a close family member had died. If someone would do that now, people would start to tell her or him after a month to "get on with life", to "move forward", to "get out and meet people" and so on.

In most cultures close family members stayed at home for a certain time after someone had died. At least a week. In that time they didn't even have to cook, neighbors or more distant family members took care of them. The only thing the mourning had to do, was to concentrate on their mourning.

Nowadays we have to be strong. We have to deal with it. We have to be brave about dead. But we can't. Death is as strong an impact in our personal lives as a birth is. But social customs have changed. You still openly take care of a newborn child for twenty-something years, that is normal. But you don't openly mourn a loved one for a long time. That isn't deemed normal anymore. We, as a society, don't like death, we don't like to have to deal with it. We have to celebrate life. Death isn't a thing which deserves the same amount of celebration anymore.

But since we all are stupid people who don't understand what is best for us (to only celebrate life), we do substitute mourning for celebrities and post messages on social media, lay flowers down in front of their homes, and other such things. It is more accepted to weep when you put down flowers on Elvis' grave, than to cry at the funeral of a loved one.

 

[RubenesqueAphrodite]

I haven't paid a great deal of attention to the social media over RW.. I did however watch Neil Cavuto just now do an interview with Joe Piscopo about Robin Williams. He spoke of what a brilliant and gentle man Williams was, and asked that we remember that. While I do always feel a twinge of "why did they do it?", in the back of my mind, having suffered from severe depression, I can say without a shadow of a doubt that I actually "do" know. Depression is such a beast. It lies. It makes you feel hopeless and only those who have wrestled with it will ever truly understand the impact it can and does have on someone's life.

I am very sad about Robin Williams. He was a great comedian, philanthropist, just brilliant when it came to making people laugh. (something I strive to do every day).

While I hate any sensationalization ( is that a word?) around untimely deaths, my hope will remain that his death will continue to shed light on mental illness, depression, and anxiety.
What I fear, however, is that, like all media frenzies, the awareness of it will be only as long lived as it takes to find something else to report on...

 

[Lord Pmann]

I never saw anyone before or after his death portray Michael Jackson as a noble man.

Oh they talked relentlessly about how wonderful he was.

And for the record, I absolutely love MJ. His music is great. I think he is weird. I don't think he was as bad as the media portrayed either.

Just so we were clear... I am not cool with them talking ill of MJ. I don't think people get my beef. They demonized him one day. He does. Then he's the greatest thing since sliced bread.

Same think with Anna Nicole Smith. She was called a gold digger, fatty and a bimbo. Then she died. And it was a a tragic loss and a such beauty. I just think it's transparent.

That's my beef.

 

[makinmepurr]

Oh they talked relentlessly about how wonderful he was.

And for the record, I absolutely love MJ. His music is great. I think he is weird. I don't think he was as bad as the media portrayed either.

Just so we were clear... I am not cool with them talking ill of MJ. I don't think people get my beef. They demonized him one day. He does. Then he's the greatest thing since sliced bread.

Same think with Anna Nicole Smith. She was called a gold digger, fatty and a bimbo. Then she died. And it was a a tragic loss and a such beauty. I just think it's transparent.

That's my beef.

I get your point. Media is fickle.
And see, I didn' t even touch the beef comment.

 

[JoyDyan]

Well, you know it is a polite custom to not say anything bad about a dead person, and in MJ case the media simply obeyed to this rule. It was just all these very good journalists remembering their good upbringing.



People jump to public mourning (of famous persons), because so many old mourning habits have disappeared out off private life. People who openly mourn a loved person (husband, wife, child) for longer than a certain period (I believe six weeks is deemed enough to be so sad to break out in tears at random times) get diagnosed as having a depression and get medication.

Not so many years ago it was common use to wear black for at least a year, if a close family member had died. If someone would do that now, people would start to tell her or him after a month to "get on with life", to "move forward", to "get out and meet people" and so on.

In most cultures close family members stayed at home for a certain time after someone had died. At least a week. In that time they didn't even have to cook, neighbors or more distant family members took care of them. The only thing the mourning had to do, was to concentrate on their mourning.

Nowadays we have to be strong. We have to deal with it. We have to be brave about dead. But we can't. Death is as strong an impact in our personal lives as a birth is. But social customs have changed. You still openly take care of a newborn child for twenty-something years, that is normal. But you don't openly mourn a loved one for a long time. That isn't deemed normal anymore. We, as a society, don't like death, we don't like to have to deal with it. We have to celebrate life. Death isn't a thing which deserves the same amount of celebration anymore.

But since we all are stupid people who don't understand what is best for us (to only celebrate life), we do substitute mourning for celebrities and post messages on social media, lay flowers down in front of their homes, and other such things. It is more accepted to weep when you put down flowers on Elvis' grave, than to cry at the funeral of a loved one.

I agree, dutch. .. even after 17 years, i sometimes cry about my mother's death. .. Christmas and mother's day are terrible, and her birthday is awful. I will never forget how my former mother-in-law - whose mother is still alive - told me that after 5 years, i should be able to 'get past it' and stop ruining her Mother's Day. I stopped going to her house for that day after that.

I hope that the media attention will help sensitize people to what a real illness depression is. In that respect, the social media coverage is much needed.

 

[SweetSam42]

...I will never forget how my former mother-in-law - whose mother is still alive - told me that after 5 years, i should be able to 'get past it' and stop ruining her Mother's Day. I stopped going to her house for that day after that...

I really should stop being shocked at what mothers in law say to their daughters in law. Absolutely incredible.

I can speak form experience for this. My daughter had been dead two weeks before my sister-in-law (at the time) suggested I get a prescription for anti-depressants, they'd "really helped her when she was younger" she said. "Helped you bury your daughter and go on waking up every day for the rest of your life without her?" I asked. "You have to move on." she said. Needless to say, I moved on from her and eventually so did my brother.

There is no timeframe on grieving and no right or wrong way to do it. One thing is certain, is that it must be done. I will be doing it my whole life.

Your story and JoyDyan's certainly illustrate how invasive people can be when it comes to grief. Everyone thinks they know best.

 

[ChainedUp]

Lots of heavy but good posts here, thanks for everyone's sharing on an important issue.

Today let's go a little lighter. Let's share a few cyber war stories for our newer readers (and for us because let's face it, they're fun). What "did he/she really just say that?" moments have you seen in your PM inbox?

 

[GiggLeGasm]

I know it's time to move to a new topic.

I just needed to acknowledge everyone who shared from the heart yesterday. I don't know if it was any one post. Dutch, your words are so very true. I remember when my grandfather died and was laid out in his home (with pennies in his eyes to keep away the evil) and how the family truly took the time to grieve. When my grandmother died years later, her house listed with a realtor before she was even buried. Death has been a part of my life since I lost my mom while still in high school.. and it never gets easier to deal with - but we keep losing the resources that used to help us feel like someone gave us permission to grieve..

so - I guess I just need to say thank you to everyone who has shared on this one. It sometimes feels so necessary to know that other people understand. I wish that we would cherish that space where our sadness can be embodied without other people making it seem inappropriate. Yesterday was a strong and beautiful day on this tread, filled with an intimate kind of courage. thank you.

 

[NorthRockJohnson]

I know it's time to move to a new topic.

I just needed to acknowledge everyone who shared from the heart yesterday. I don't know if it was any one post. Dutch, your words are so very true. I remember when my grandfather died and was laid out in his home (with pennies in his eyes to keep away the evil) and how the family truly took the time to grieve. When my grandmother died years later, her house listed with a realtor before she was even buried. Death has been a part of my life since I lost my mom while still in high school.. and it never gets easier to deal with - but we keep losing the resources that used to help us feel like someone gave us permission to grieve..

so - I guess I just need to say thank you to everyone who has shared on this one. It sometimes feels so necessary to know that other people understand. I wish that we would cherish that space where our sadness can be embodied without other people making it seem inappropriate. Yesterday was a strong and beautiful day on this tread, filled with an intimate kind of courage. thank you.

(Big giant hugs) I love you, GG!

 

[dutchrain]

Lots of heavy but good posts here, thanks for everyone's sharing on an important issue.

Today let's go a little lighter. Let's share a few cyber war stories for our newer readers (and for us because let's face it, they're fun). What "did he/she really just say that?" moments have you seen in your PM inbox?

Quite a lot. A 'request' to describe my body in detail in the very first PM I was sent by someone.

Using words I have clearly stated I don't like.

What irritates me most though, is when someone starts to describe my orgasm. I'll do that when I think the appropriate time to do it has arrived, thank you very much!

And then there is the break in a cyber session. By Jove, it isn't that difficult to post (Sorry, I have to leave now, but I am looking forward to continue later/tomorrow/next week) under a hot PM instead of just leaving a person hanging in the air.

Also people who don't separate RL messages from cyber by putting them in brackets, or putting RL in front of them or something like that.

 

[Lord Pmann]

Today let's go a little lighter. Let's share a few cyber war stories for our newer readers (and for us because let's face it, they're fun). What "did he/she really just say that?" moments have you seen in your PM inbox?

I had a pretty open, public argument with one Lister who was just being a complete fuckwit, I'll give her the random nickname SD. I think I posted about it in this thread a couple weeks back. She was just one of those posters who had this high and mighty way about her that got on my nerves. Her self importance and lack of self awareness was blinding. She would be so snarky and mean to people for things that she deemed offensive. Everyone was supposed to apologize and how to her whims, but if anyone called her out on it, she would respond with some condescending drivel that made her look like an idiot. I've seen her get made because someone says something like the word sweety, yet she will wish cancer on people who do things with which she disagrees. (This has been a year and my blood still boils- in fact, the anniversary of this fight is tomorrow)

I'm just gonna warn the readers, this is a lot of aggression you're about to read. You have been warned. Because she still gets on my nerves more than anything on earth.

I will probably say things some find offensive. You have been warned twice now.

Well, one day someone posted a question in the How To cafe about "hair sticks, like the ones they wear in Asian movies". Like, those things women put in their hair that keep the hair up. Just a normal question. Nothing wrong with it. This fuckwit SD comes out from her fire and brimstone lair and tells the person asking the question (who is Asian, by the way) that it's offensive to say "Asian movies".

Well I had enough of her shit. I had already seen and dealt with it before. So I told her as nice as I could that her offense was silly and that saying that movies made in Asia are okay to be called Asian movies.

The fight erupted. It was massive. I called her out on every shitty thing she did. I told her what a self absorbed twat she was and how she was intolerable. I tried to teach her the different between what a Nobel prize and a "noble" prize was, but she was too thick to understand. Apparently, loads of people agreed. People I never even saw on the forums were sending me PMs saying I was saying everything they ever thought about her. I had at least 15 people to whom I had never spoken send me messages saying they were glad someone stood up to this carnivorous cunt.

The fight was going so incredibly poorly for her it was laughable. I didn't set out to make her look like an idiot. It was an added benefit. My intent was to hopefully make her see that her job as the PC police was getting on people's fucking nerves. I knew she wouldn't take it well.

In the end we all had a lot of laughs about this cockwallet's comments. Most of the people really seemed to hate her posts like I did. I was glad to see that there were so many people who were bothered like I was. Sometimes little things can annoy the testicles off of me. But I was so happy to see that this wasn't the case.

Long story. I get it.

 

[Aquagal]

^^^

The same poster bugs the hell out of me, but I've never called her on it. Her How To thread that she gives advice on and people come in and ask honest questions and her replies are idiotic and ill informed. Sometimes I don't who irritates me more, her for giving bad feedback or the questions that are posted and not seeing through her stupid advice. At first I thought some of her responses were joking, but quickly found out how sincere she is while I'm thinking What. The. Fuck...why would you tell someone that?

 

[NorthRockJohnson]

Lots of heavy but good posts here, thanks for everyone's sharing on an important issue.

Today let's go a little lighter. Let's share a few cyber war stories for our newer readers (and for us because let's face it, they're fun). What "did he/she really just say that?" moments have you seen in your PM inbox?

Nothing crazy recently but some stuff I've encountered in the past (here and other places)...

- Took a girl out to dinner. She seemed really cool, I liked her. Date ended with her telling me "Yeah, I'm spending the night at my guy friends house. We're gonna hook up." This was CLEARLY a date we were on. So I was kinda like "uh..." It ended with me telling her "Tell your friend he owes me $50 for dinner." She laughed because she thought I was joking.

- On a date with a girl talking about funny work experiences. She busts out with "Yeah, I used to work with these guys. They were a bunch of niggers." We, uh, didn't work out.

- A girl I was dating for awhile telling me "I'm pregnant. But don't worry, it's not yours."

- Talking with a girl online. Told me he REFUSES to give oral. Why? Because "it's unnatural". Know what she IS into, though? Fruit fucking.

 

[NorthRockJohnson]

Oh wait, CYBER war stories. Sorry, I'm a dummy. Lol

 

[PeteHulbert37]

Nothing crazy recently but some stuff I've encountered in the past (here and other places)...

- Took a girl out to dinner. She seemed really cool, I liked her. Date ended with her telling me "Yeah, I'm spending the night at my guy friends house. We're gonna hook up." This was CLEARLY a date we were on. So I was kinda like "uh..." It ended with me telling her "Tell your friend he owes me $50 for dinner." She laughed because she thought I was joking.

- On a date with a girl talking about funny work experiences. She busts out with "Yeah, I used to work with these guys. They were a bunch of niggers." We, uh, didn't work out.

- A girl I was dating for awhile telling me "I'm pregnant. But don't worry, it's not yours."

- Talking with a girl online. Told me he REFUSES to give oral. Why? Because "it's unnatural". Know what she IS into, though? Fruit fucking.

Dude, you have encountered some obscenely unique individuals. Lol

 

[Lord Pmann]

^^^

The same poster bugs the hell out of me, but I've never called her on it. Her How To thread that she gives advice on and people come in and ask honest questions and her replies are idiotic and ill informed. Sometimes I don't who irritates me more, her for giving bad feedback or the questions that are posted and not seeing through her stupid advice. At first I thought some of her responses were joking, but quickly found out how sincere she is while I'm thinking What. The. Fuck...why would you tell someone that?

How could you possibly know who I was talking about?!?! I was so clever with the nickname.

 

[Lord Pmann]

- Talking with a girl online. Told me he REFUSES to give oral. Why? Because "it's unnatural". Know what she IS into, though? Fruit fucking.

So is the use of condoms. I bet she wouldn't go for that logic.

Even though they weren't cyber stories, they were pretty awesome. Glad you posted.

 

[Lord Pmann]

Quite a lot. A 'request' to describe my body in detail in the very first PM I was sent by someone.

That's the standard cowslinger welcome PM.

Your list was pretty funny. I could sense the frustration.

 

[NorthRockJohnson]

Dude, you have encountered some obscenely unique individuals. Lol

Lol oh yeah, I look back and gotta laugh.

So is the use of condoms. I bet she wouldn't go for that logic.

Even though they weren't cyber stories, they were pretty awesome. Glad you posted.

Thanks, man! I'm sure I have more somewhere.