I NEVER thought I would run into LitE's underage issue, but here I am... advice, please.

MrPixel

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In a fit of character development, I've just written a passage about a key female character who was more or less forced into prostitution to survive at the age of 16. It was mostly to explain why her education was truncated, where she was subsequently denied the higher learning in keeping with her real life interest in an advanced STEM field. Nothing at all sexual about it, more of an "oh, gosh, that must have been awful" conversation, but by her smarts, both innate and "street", she was financially successful in a shady business.

The absolute "18 and over" rule stinks in this case because to move her dilemma just two years older means she would have (likely) finished high school and taken the college entry exams (SAT, ACT and so on). By achieving high scores commensurate with her intelligence, she would have received scholarships, recognition and other support and thusly wouldn't have necessarily entered into the sex trade. Blows the already-developed story line in a big way.

This story is months away from being ready to upload. Do I continue with this particular development and hope the powers-that-be don't shut down this one chapter, or do I gloss-over the supporting detail?
 
I see your point, but 16 + prostitution = rejection. It’s a hard limit.

OTOH, this is fiction. Would not the story work if she got forced into the sex trade at 18?
 
Yeah, this is the issue with the rule, it can be annoyingly restrictive, but more annoying when there's far worse that makes it through all the time.

My suggestion would be no age mentioned, but rather go with 'there was a point I had to resort to prostitution to get by. Leave it vague, and even though common sense would tell a reader she was under 18 its not the readers who whine about things like this. It should get through because as I keep insisting, the site doesn't care about under age, they care about you listing said age.
 
Mentioning the bare facts like you have in your OP is generally OK - it's making it any way sexualised that isn't. If you can summarise what you need to in one dispassionate sentence, like "I had to drop out of school at 16. Long story, but basically I was forced into prostitution. It took a couple years, but finally I escaped and was living on my wits, and despite no high school diploma I..." - it'll probably pass. I've had similar mentions of under-age rape or consensual sex, never had a problem.
 
Yeah, this is the issue with the rule, it can be annoyingly restrictive, but more annoying when there's far worse that makes it through all the time.

My suggestion would be no age mentioned, but rather go with 'there was a point I had to resort to prostitution to get by. Leave it vague, and even though common sense would tell a reader she was under 18 its not the readers who whine about things like this. It should get through because as I keep insisting, the site doesn't care about under age, they care about you listing said age.

Thanks! That I could do, by leaving it vague enough to infer she dropped out of high school, blah blah blah, without mentioning the "high" part. Only a 'graph or two to edit that way.
 
More-or-less what LC said. Give her situation but downplay her age. In fact, don't even mention her age, and don't describe any sexual acts. Saying what you need to say without crossing the line is a balancing act, but it isn't hard to do if you avoid titillating your readers with underage details.
 
In a fit of character development, I've just written a passage about a key female character who was more or less forced into prostitution to survive at the age of 16. It was mostly to explain why her education was truncated, where she was subsequently denied the higher learning in keeping with her real life interest in an advanced STEM field. Nothing at all sexual about it, more of an "oh, gosh, that must have been awful" conversation, but by her smarts, both innate and "street", she was financially successful in a shady business.

The absolute "18 and over" rule stinks in this case because to move her dilemma just two years older means she would have (likely) finished high school and taken the college entry exams (SAT, ACT and so on). By achieving high scores commensurate with her intelligence, she would have received scholarships, recognition and other support and thusly wouldn't have necessarily entered into the sex trade. Blows the already-developed story line in a big way.

This story is months away from being ready to upload. Do I continue with this particular development and hope the powers-that-be don't shut down this one chapter, or do I gloss-over the supporting detail?

PM Laurel. Make your case. I've done this twice and been successful both times.
 
Just finished the edits... ambiguous really works in this case; I hadn't written myself into a corner after all. Killed the two age references, and made it sound like she could have dropped out of junior college. No problemo.

Thanks again!
 
I had a similar issue with my first chapter published last year.

The girl was 17 and the chapter had them going to the junior prom and dating for another year in high school. In one discussion, she mentioned when she was in 8th grade and how her busty figure then caused an on-going fight between her and the more popular girls (thus she was a social outcast). There was no mention of actual sex, but I did have them allude to it by "going all the way for the whole prom experience. Use your imaginations."

When that story was rejected, I had to re-write everything for them explicitly being 18-year-old seniors when they got together for the senior prom.

It does detract from the credibility of the story when we already have it so well thought out with the younger years.
 
In a fit of character development, I've just written a passage about a key female character who was more or less forced into prostitution to survive at the age of 16. It was mostly to explain why her education was truncated, where she was subsequently denied the higher learning in keeping with her real life interest in an advanced STEM field. Nothing at all sexual about it, more of an "oh, gosh, that must have been awful" conversation, but by her smarts, both innate and "street", she was financially successful in a shady business.
Sorry, but you need to go back and look at this from the start again, because these two statements don't track. A female character forced into prostitution at 16 absolutely is an underage (for Literotica) sexual situation. There are ways to get it through at Literotica by glancing mention, but these contradictory statements indicate you are not yet in a position to understand how this works at Literotica.
 
PM Laurel. Make your case. I've done this twice and been successful both times.
This. I had a situation where a character got pregnant at 13. I PMed Laurel, explained the situation, included the exact paragraph I was proposing, and got pre-approval. Do this a week before you are ready to submit so she has time to review it and get back to you, and while it is still fresh in her memory when it comes through the queue.
 
You need to skirt the issue. Give the reader the opportunity to interpret the passage as less sexual if they want. I have a character who I know was raped when she was 15, but when asked about losing her virginity, she just says "It's not a very nice story. I don't want to talk about it." The readers know what it means but there is not enough there to appeal to the ones who want to get off on the idea of an underage girl.

You might be able to do something similar. Instead of explicitly saying "prostitution" you could say that your character was forced into a life she didn't want, made to do terrible things for people she hated. It's a challenge to work around the rule, but I bet you're up for it.
 
How important is it to your story that your character was forced into prostitution, specifically? Could she just as easily have been forced to do something equally disreputable, like dealing drugs, stealing cars, or picking pockets? Or is it significant to the story that she be a prostitute?
 
...is it significant to the story that she be a prostitute?

Very. Much development based on it. Integral to several plot lines. It's a big story, ~200 MSWord pages at this point.

Story is sort of fun at this particular point. Throughout the larger tome she is a former prostitute, the protagonist's financial expertise having helped her parlay her income into independence. Her real life interest is theoretical physics, which she knew early-on was its own difficult career, at least financially. The former turns out to be enabling the latter.

Like I said, problem is solved as LC recommended, deleting age references and making things ambiguous enough to pass muster. This small bit I tripped on is a retrospective vignette. That honest retrospectives constantly bump into this particular rule is a LitE failing, frankly, but it is what it is and we all have to work around it.
 
In a fit of character development, I've just written a passage about a key female character who was more or less forced into prostitution to survive at the age of 16. It was mostly to explain why her education was truncated, where she was subsequently denied the higher learning in keeping with her real life interest in an advanced STEM field. Nothing at all sexual about it, more of an "oh, gosh, that must have been awful" conversation, but by her smarts, both innate and "street", she was financially successful in a shady business.

The absolute "18 and over" rule stinks in this case because to move her dilemma just two years older means she would have (likely) finished high school and taken the college entry exams (SAT, ACT and so on). By achieving high scores commensurate with her intelligence, she would have received scholarships, recognition and other support and thusly wouldn't have necessarily entered into the sex trade. Blows the already-developed story line in a big way.

This story is months away from being ready to upload. Do I continue with this particular development and hope the powers-that-be don't shut down this one chapter, or do I gloss-over the supporting detail?
It is easily enough to change: "It was the summer of my sixteenth year" to "It was the summer of my eighteenth year" With the explanation of her being older for her class because of failing several grades.
 
Yeah, this is the issue with the rule, it can be annoyingly restrictive, but more annoying when there's far worse that makes it through all the time.

My suggestion would be no age mentioned, but rather go with 'there was a point I had to resort to prostitution to get by. Leave it vague, and even though common sense would tell a reader she was under 18 its not the readers who whine about things like this. It should get through because as I keep insisting, the site doesn't care about under age, they care about you listing said age.

Agreed.

This passed muster:
In a small town fifteen miles from the nearest movie theater, thirty miles from the nearest shopping mall, there were only a few means by which I could appease my restlessness. By the time I graduated from high school, I was well acquainted with liquor, with marijuana and with men.

It seems pretty obvious what I was a talking about, but it was accepted with no problem.
 
Very. Much development based on it. Integral to several plot lines. It's a big story, ~200 MSWord pages at this point.

Story is sort of fun at this particular point. Throughout the larger tome she is a former prostitute, the protagonist's financial expertise having helped her parlay her income into independence. Her real life interest is theoretical physics, which she knew early-on was its own difficult career, at least financially. The former turns out to be enabling the latter.

Like I said, problem is solved as LC recommended, deleting age references and making things ambiguous enough to pass muster. This small bit I tripped on is a retrospective vignette. That honest retrospectives constantly bump into this particular rule is a LitE failing, frankly, but it is what it is and we all have to work around it.

Next time, there are a number of other solutions that present themselves. What about that car accident she got into when she was a kid, making her miss a year of school and ensuring she was older than anyone else in her grade? Or remember how her parents were missionaries, so her early childhood education in Tanzania was truncated? When she came home, they decided to place her in a lower grade. Or, hell, maybe she's homeschooled and the usual SAT/ACT progression during "senior year" was meaningless.

I trust LC's solution will work, but squeamish readers might still find something. You're best off with an explicit statement that she never did anything sexual until after 18. The number of young people in Lit stories who lose their virginity "on their eighteenth birthday" must run to the tens of thousands.
 

Agreed.

This passed muster:

In a small town fifteen miles from the nearest movie theater, thirty miles from the nearest shopping mall, there were only a few means by which I could appease my restlessness. By the time I graduated from high school, I was well acquainted with liquor, with marijuana and with men.

It seems pretty obvious what I was a talking about, but it was accepted with no problem.
Right because you left out the age, and although I would read this as they had plenty of fun THROUGHOUT high school, lit's defense in letting it through would be 'well could have all been as a senior, seniors are 18.

Perfect example of less is more, make your point, but no number and no eroticizing it.
 
Next time, there are a number of other solutions that present themselves. What about that car accident she got into when she was a kid, making her miss a year of school and ensuring she was older than anyone else in her grade? Or remember how her parents were missionaries, so her early childhood education in Tanzania was truncated? When she came home, they decided to place her in a lower grade. Or, hell, maybe she's homeschooled and the usual SAT/ACT progression during "senior year" was meaningless.

I trust LC's solution will work, but squeamish readers might still find something. You're best off with an explicit statement that she never did anything sexual until after 18. The number of young people in Lit stories who lose their virginity "on their eighteenth birthday" must run to the tens of thousands.
Your ideas work, but at that point you're complicating the story and adding details you didn't need. I always embrace less is more or KISS principle. As for the readers....I know there is no way to know this for sure, but I don't see the readers being that picky. They read the story, they don't stop and say "hmm if she's x years old and she's saying had to turn to...OMG she may have been selling sex before 18!!!!! Reeeee!"

The fact there are so many blatantly rule breaking underage stories, rape stories, torture for titillation etc floating around on here tells me the readers don't care. Keep in mind, the average reader doesn't even know the rules here. Hell, authors who come here trying to find the rules can't find them(things that make you go Hmmm).

I tend to think most stories that are reported are a personal grudge with the author, a troll looking to report anything they can find, real or imagined, and the few readers who do know, and care about the rules.
 
As for the readers....I know there is no way to know this for sure, but I don't see the readers being that picky.

I used to like to think so as well, but then a few stories got kicked back to me after being posted for some time. I know who reported them, and he's a whiny and insecure douche, but the experience taught me you're best off giving trolls zero ammo.

FWIW, your solutions ought to work more elegantly.
 
Just to be certain, I turned it into, yes, a LitE trope:

"She had an awful home life. Her parents threw her out the very day she turned eighteen and she had to quit school to survive. Not finishing high school seriously crapped on her education prospects, and she had neither the opportunity nor the money to take the placement tests to qualify for a four-year college. After bouncing around from acquaintance to acquaintance for a sofa to crash on, she hit the streets, capitalizing on her beauty."

I hate to be dishonest this way with (what I perceive as) a quality story, but we have to toe the blurry censorship line here. I understand Laurel's point of view in that some authority-du-jour especially in the US may want to come after the site for distribution of underage porn, but the mere threat of censorship stifles legitimate creativity. Sad world we live in these days.
 
The absolute "18 and over" rule stinks in this case

Absolutely agree, but it's their site, their rules. You'll probably have to find another place to host it or host it yourself.

I will say that there are other sites that are FAR more restrictive, as in any mention of anything non-virginal before the 18th birthday gets folks instabanned, or even one site that I had briefly considered joining until I saw the rule that if your character gives birth you absolutely must fast-forward your story 18 years until the child is of age, like draconian stupid.
 
This. I had a situation where a character got pregnant at 13. I PMed Laurel, explained the situation, included the exact paragraph I was proposing, and got pre-approval. Do this a week before you are ready to submit so she has time to review it and get back to you, and while it is still fresh in her memory when it comes through the queue.
Yep, I have a story that mentions that Grandma got pregnant at 15, with a comment along the lines of "she was an adventurous young lady". That got through fine. As long as you leave it bare-bones like that, and give Laurel a heads-up so she looks at it rather than auto-rejecting, it'll probably go through.
 
Just to be certain, I turned it into, yes, a LitE trope:



I hate to be dishonest this way with (what I perceive as) a quality story, but we have to toe the blurry censorship line here. I understand Laurel's point of view in that some authority-du-jour especially in the US may want to come after the site for distribution of underage porn, but the mere threat of censorship stifles legitimate creativity. Sad world we live in these days.
The thing is, and this has been discussed often, under age sex in fiction is not illegal. The rules here are preference, not worrying about law suits. The other suggested reason is they don't want that crowd here because they are often being tracked.

But... those people will be here anyway and they can find that material as well as rape stories and whatever else.

Where I find this hypocritical is the loving wives section. Underage sex, rape... nothing is illegal in fiction. Know what is illegal? Hate speech. Know where you can find it? The Loving wives section and in abundance. Threats of violence against women, LGBT, Trans, Black people, the authors, other commenters...so. Now in a story? Being fiction can protect it, but these are people leaving comments, real people in the real world. Why nothing done about that? There are incels here, incels are, if not already, close to being branded legally a hate group, meaning Law enforcement could come here.

Somehow there is no concern. Personally I'd rather deal with a story that alludes to a 15 year old having sex, then some hate spewing lunatic telling people he's going to come to their house and kill them. One is a fictional story, one is a real life nut bag.

Also, many of the pictures and picture threads here shouldn't be here under not just revenge porn laws, but the new copyright laws that led to porn hub and other sites changing rules to try to enforce verification where you claim you own rights to anything you post, and if you can't be verified they remove all your content.

Lit doesn't seem to think this applies to them. Hopefully for everyone who comes here, they stay under the radar, but it wouldn't take much.

So...when I hear its about legal reasons I tend not to buy it, and I also don't believe there is an actual rule about under age, its about how you present it. To be clear, I would never do this, I'm not into writing under age sex, nor am I someone who would set out to deliberately post something they don't want me to, but I can assure you I can write and publish an under aged story very easily, as could many others here. Because we know its not about anything other than a number.
 
I see your POV, but I look at the "mood" out there with the politics. All it takes is one state or even local DA with a stick up his (always a "his") butt, determining he needs to pander to extreme and vocal religious tight-asses to get reelected. Boom, lawsuit for some target with a visible presence, with unlimited government money behind it to break the back of the hapless victim abiding by the letter of the law. When government bodies engage in civil prosecution, it skirts compliance with Constitutional protections, the letter of the law, and judicial precedence. The expense of fighting the litigation alone makes the practical point that you're on the losing end. I would bet the site operators see it that way - we're compliant, but we don't even want hints here about a current prosecutorial hot button topic.

I've been a victim of this corrupt practice myself, gov't civil litigation vs. the little guy, so know it well.
 
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