How Many Martial Artists Do We Have?

[TheeGoatPig]

I definitely don't agree with everything he says, but even when I disagree with him at least he has gotten me to think of what I myself believe, and to have an opinion on certain subjects. It can be very eye opening to read through his opinions.

 

[S-Des]

The more rules there are to a fight, the less likely I am to win. I always want to aim for the kill shot. Break their knees as they approach, punch their throat to cave in their adams apple, or rip off a part of their body when they think getting close to me is a good idea.

Which is an odd way to think for a 6'-4" 230 pound man who knows martial arts. I should be looking at how to keep the damage to a minimum, and learning to throw my weight around more efficiently. I'll figure it all out someday

Have you ever seen the videohttp://gorillamask.net/kungfufighter.shtml of the guy experienced at Kung Fu in a fight with a punk on a playground? The setup was limited, but he was evidently with his girlfriend and couldn't extricate himself, and her, safely. They were some of the guy's buddies around, so he went into a very complex form, letting the guy know he wasn't to be messed with. The punk (obviously suffering from ego-overload), decided he could take him anyway. The results are truly wonderful to watch. My favorite part was when he decided to pump up his shoes.

 

[TheeGoatPig]

Have you ever seen the videohttp://gorillamask.net/kungfufighter.shtml of the guy experienced at Kung Fu in a fight with a punk on a playground? The setup was limited, but he was evidently with his girlfriend and couldn't extricate himself, and her, safely. They were some of the guy's buddies around, so he went into a very complex form, letting the guy know he wasn't to be messed with. The punk (obviously suffering from ego-overload), decided he could take him anyway. The results are truly wonderful to watch. My favorite part was when he decided to pump up his shoes.

Yes, I have seen it before, I have it saved to my hard drive I'd disagree a little on that. It's obvious he has had something similar to shaolin training, but I'm not sure to what extent. Heis stances are great, but for a fight, they look a little deep tp me. It looks silly. Meh... What do I know. I've only been doing it for a few years myself.

I pulled some muscle in my hip doing a low stance last night

 

[S-Des]

Yes, I have seen it before, I have it saved to my hard drive I'd disagree a little on that. It's obvious he has had something similar to shaolin training, but I'm not sure to what extent. Heis stances are great, but for a fight, they look a little deep tp me. It looks silly. Meh... What do I know. I've only been doing it for a few years myself.

I pulled some muscle in my hip doing a low stance last night

I got the impression he was doing the stances to intimidate the guy (which definitely happened). It's very telling that despite him obviously having some descent technique, everything he threw was with the hands. It's just so hard to get someone in position to hit with a serious kick. The most effective one we were taught was the inside kick to the shin (which looks a lot like what I did when I was 8, before my dad threatened me to get me to stop ).

The stances were always toughest for me. I could do everything else well, but my balance was mediocre and I got tired pretty quickly. After 3 months of taking Kung Foo at a gym (it was basically like what you'd expect at a YMCA), I decided I was glad that I did Hapkido first. Damn those are intense stances.

 

[TheeGoatPig]

I got the impression he was doing the stances to intimidate the guy (which definitely happened). It's very telling that despite him obviously having some descent technique, everything he threw was with the hands. It's just so hard to get someone in position to hit with a serious kick. The most effective one we were taught was the inside kick to the shin (which looks a lot like what I did when I was 8, before my dad threatened me to get me to stop ).

The stances were always toughest for me. I could do everything else well, but my balance was mediocre and I got tired pretty quickly. After 3 months of taking Kung Foo at a gym (it was basically like what you'd expect at a YMCA), I decided I was glad that I did Hapkido first. Damn those are intense stances.

I couldn't do the low stances the first year. Hell, I only started doing that first stance he postured (low tager) properly these last few months since I learned my broadsword routine. They definitely are a bitch, especially when you have bad knees. Pain...

I love the front inside heal kick, with a forward hop-step to surprise the hell out of someone switnging with a wide exagerated hook punch

 

[S-Des]

I couldn't do the low stances the first year. Hell, I only started doing that first stance he postured (low tager) properly these last few months since I learned my broadsword routine. They definitely are a bitch, especially when you have bad knees. Pain...

I love the front inside heal kick, with a forward hop-step to surprise the hell out of someone switnging with a wide exagerated hook punch

That's why Kempo was always so interesting to me. If you watched what Bruce Lee did to the style he learned in (I forget the name), it turned into a series of punches designed to wear down an opponent and not give them a chance to hit back (at least that was my take). Kempo always struck me the same way. Instead of hoping to land the big punch/kick/hold, you hit your opponent so fast, that you force them to retreat. That would set up the kick, rather than being squared off against someone whose fighting style (or lack thereof) is a complete mystery. I'd like RR to finish his thought about what isn't taught, that sounds like an interesting topic.

 

[Pure]

Use a cane. A simple hardwood cane is a devastating street weapon. Because it is light, it is longer than a knife that some street punk will carry. It is not often used as a swinging weapon, but rather as a thrusting weapon. A cane will keep at least one street punk off you, if you know how to use it.


what about those gadgets that kind of spring out from a 10 in length [looking like a cylinder, 1 inch diameter, 10 in long] to a 25 in length? i forget their name.

 

[popcorn2721]

as beauty4207 said I have my brown in Kenpo-Jujitsu

 

[R. Richard]

Use a cane. A simple hardwood cane is a devastating street weapon. Because it is light, it is longer than a knife that some street punk will carry. It is not often used as a swinging weapon, but rather as a thrusting weapon. A cane will keep at least one street punk off you, if you know how to use it.


what about those gadgets that kind of spring out from a 10 in length [looking like a cylinder, 1 inch diameter, 10 in long] to a 25 in length? i forget their name.

Cheap ones are not very stable and likely to break. Good ones are VERY expensive. Plus, they are considered to be a weapon. "My cane? Oh, I twisted my knee a little and I use the cane to keep pressure off of it."

 

[R. Richard]

Many kung-fu stances are used to develop the legs. Back when, the Chinese didn't have leg machines, or even weights. So they used things like stances to compensate. Mnay of the stances are hard on the legs and are a problem for some people. There are some kung-fu styles that differ from a parent style only in the fact that they use different [less stressful] footwork/stances.

 

[TheeGoatPig]

BUMP!

We have had such a rotation of members in the last (almost) year that I figured I'd see what has changed since then

 

[Guest]

edited

 

[Emerald_Dragon]

My husband and I taught Tae Kwon Do for 9 years. Our master instructors were awesome. When I was taking classes not only did you have to know your moves but memorize things like the history and meanings behind the colors on the Korean and American flags, Korean terms for kicks and blocks. I learned more about the history of the American flag in that dojang than I ever did in school.

Unfortunately lifestyle changes (kids, depression ect) got in the way and we also had to move several times with different jobs. I miss it.

 

[TheeGoatPig]

I've been on the verge of advancing by leaps and bounds. But I keep getting sick for the last year. I've missed weeks upon weeks, and each time it takes me even more weeks to get my strength and stamina back up to where they should be.

I'm so close to being an instructor I can taste it. It's the only thing I am good at helping people with. I tell them what to do, they listen, and I feel good about it. It's a great feeling. Butif I keep getting sick I will never advance anymore, and I won't be able to help as many people with as many things.

When I stopped in last Monday to explain my absence, my sifu practically begged me to come back already, even though I'm still a little sick. I wish I could have, but I just can't

 

[R. Richard]

Reading back over the thread, I notice a common complaint. The complaint is that the stances and the work are hard to do. The stances and the work are intended to be hard to do.

The stances are used to develop the muscles in the legs. In a real fight, stances are almost never used. In order to be effective, a punch must be thrown properly and recovered properly. If you want to throw an effective punch, the punch needs to have been practiced a thousand times before the fight. A proper punch is thrown with all of the arm muscles relaxed, except the specific muscles propelling the punch forward. The punch is not thrown until the opponent is in range of the punch. ALL of the arm muscles are tensed at the time of impact of the punch. The punch is then withdrawn at the same speed it was thrown. [If you let a punch hang out there, a Wing Chun practitioner will be happy to show you why this last is an error. A Chin Na practitioner will break the hanging arm.] QUICK QUIZ: Exactly what is the orientation of the fist during a properly thrown straight punch? [Hint: There is only one correct answer and most instructors don't even address the very important issue.]

There are any number of styles of self defense that allow the practitioner to easily defeat any opponent, even if the practitioner is out of shape and out of practice. IN YOUR DREAMS! I work out every day, seven days a week. I use resistance workouts to maximize muscle strength. I use isometric exercises to the same effect. [Note: The real strength benefits occur only at the angle(s) that the isometric exercises are done.] I use sparring, sometimes with full impact, to train for maximum hitting power. I use a makiwara and a heavy bag to get the feel of maximum impact punching. If I find myself in real confrontation, I go in to cut some meat.

Power for either kicks or punches ultimately comes from the legs. [I don't have time to explain the partial exceptions, such as drunken style.] The 'movie kicks' where a guy jumps four feet in the air and delivers a spinning kick are just that, 'movie kicks.' Effective combat kicks are low level kicks. They attack the legs, which limits the opponents power and ability to move. [Boxers have a saying, "If you kill the body, the head must die." If you kill the legs, the body dies. If you kill the body, the head dies. End of fight.]

Kicks are powered by leg muscles. Kung Fu stances are used to develop the leg muscles. Modern leg machines do the same thing, faster. Free runnning is also good for developing the legs [running uphill and downhill, varying the pace from distance to full sprint. Turning frequently.]

Initial punches should be delivered as straight punches, with speed emphasizes. Once the opponent is stunned, then hooks may be added, to increase the power. Power punches are thrown from a rooted stance. Frequently, an opponent will cover only the head while you are finishing. If the opponent gives you the legs and the body, use them!

If a dropping kick can be gotten through early in the fight, you may have disabled one of the opponent's legs. Always move toward the disabled leg and use the concentration of the disabled leg to first attack other targets of opportunity. Once you redirect the opponent's focus, destroy the disabled leg.

The are key points in the human body, where strikes are more effective. The knee is such a key point and it is effective. The goin is anothr such point, but it is protected and is difficult to hit. The solar plexus is a key vital spot. It is easy to hit and often improperly protected. The throat is another key spot, easy to hit and often improperly protected. The eyes are easy to hit and often improperly protected. The kidneys are easy to hit and often improperly protected.

NEVER stomp someone after you knock them down. The scumbags are death on the tactic. Do help your opponent to finish rising from the ground with a maximum front kick to the ribs. [There is no such thing as a fair fight; there are winners and loser.]

 

[SlickTony]

probably i'm confusing movie with reality, but is this issue [of close quarters] the one that's shown in "Kill Bill", where the kung fu master insists that she learn to strike a board [beginning] from four inches away [no drawback], not three feet.

The three-inch (or four-inch) punch is quite real--I've seen my Taekwondo instructor do it.

I have a 1st degree black belt in Taekwondo, but increasingly, it's making me feel old. I just can't execute a side kick as belt level. My hips won't do it. I cannot reach any adult's head with a round kick, although it's one of my best kicks in general--I almost never fail to break a board with it. Nor can I do a split, although week by week, I keep trying. For some reason, I can get down further with my left leg extended in front than with my right leg. And I can kick higher (for something like an axe kick) with my left leg. But I also have a chronic pain in my left hamstring that has my whole leg hurting the first thing I get up in the morning, and through half of class, although I have to admit that by the end of class I've just about worked it out. I told my chiropractor about it and he's treating it with acupuncture but I don't know how well that's working.

I've mentioned this before, but my present Taekwondo instructor will not test me for mid-term, or encourage me to test anywhere else, until I've gone back and recalled every single color belt and recommended black belt form and every single one-step, because he contends that a black belt should know them all. So I've been in a holding pattern, participating in all three of the classes that go down in the evening--white belt, lower-rank color belt, and high rank (green to black), because he's probably right. In the lower rank classes I assist him a little. But even in my own class I have not received any coaching in my own form since I don't know when. And, as I've said, I'm being made to feel totally inadequate on account of that sidekick. And of course if I try to use it in sparring I get a warning because it's sure to land in the middle of someone's thigh or worse. The thing is, if I were in a real fight I'd be going for the knees in the first place.

I don't want to change schools, however, because I'm getting a pretty decent workout for a bargain. I know I'd have to pay a bunch more anywhere but the Y. I wish, though, that I could take up a different art. The Taekwondo instructor knows a lot of Hapkido--his brother is a 3rd degree master, I think. I wish we'd get more Hapkido in my class and fewer high kicks.

For a long time, my son participated in the same classes with me. It didn't take him long to outstrip me in performance and rank. It was a joy to watch him snapkick things higher than his head (he's six feet tall) and to do flying sidekicks. He looked like he was flouting the law of gravity. But when our Taekwondo instructor disaffiliated himself from the American Taekwondo Foundation, it was like the fire went out in my son's belly. He'd planned to be an instructor, and he has picked up the idea that if he is going to take the black stripe of instructorship, he has to start his own school. I don't know if that's true or not. I do feel that, being an Asperger person, he felt that the disaffiliation deprived him of the structure he'd had before.

 

[oggbashan]

The only formal martial arts I've practised, apart from Tai Chi as an exercise to keep me slightly more flexible, is old-fashioned English quarterstaff (just like Robin Hood and Little John).

Unfortunately I'd look rather obvious walking the streets carrying a six foot ash staff.

It was very effective at keeping other martial arts practitioners at a distance. A six foot staff outreaches the longest leg or arm.

I also played some Australian Rules matches - the roughest game that uses a ball. I can't remember a single game ending without at least one injury, and Aussie Rules players don't regard sprains, bruises, small cuts or dripping blood as "injuries". Arterial blood and broken limbs counted. Broken nose? If the player was still breathing through it he could still play.

Og

 

[R. Richard]

The only formal martial arts I've practised, apart from Tai Chi as an exercise to keep me slightly more flexible, is old-fashioned English quarterstaff (just like Robin Hood and Little John).

Unfortunately I'd look rather obvious walking the streets carrying a six foot ash staff.

It was very effective at keeping other martial arts practitioners at a distance. A six foot staff outreaches the longest leg or arm.

Og

Og, try carrying a shillelagh. Still within the UK sphere of influence, traditional and you don't have to hire an archer to accompany you.

Oh yes, whistle the tune, The Rising of The Moon as you go.

 

[Joe Wordsworth]

Two years boxing. Eight months Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu. Active lifestyle. 6'6". 260 lbs.

I fear no man.

 

[TheeGoatPig]

Reading back over the thread, I notice a common complaint. The complaint is that the stances and the work are hard to do. The stances and the work are intended to be hard to do.

The stances are used to develop the muscles in the legs. In a real fight, stances are almost never used. In order to be effective, a punch must be thrown properly and recovered properly. If you want to throw an effective punch, the punch needs to have been practiced a thousand times before the fight. A proper punch is thrown with all of the arm muscles relaxed, except the specific muscles propelling the punch forward. The punch is not thrown until the opponent is in range of the punch. ALL of the arm muscles are tensed at the time of impact of the punch. The punch is then withdrawn at the same speed it was thrown. [If you let a punch hang out there, a Wing Chun practitioner will be happy to show you why this last is an error. A Chin Na practitioner will break the hanging arm.] QUICK QUIZ: Exactly what is the orientation of the fist during a properly thrown straight punch? [Hint: There is only one correct answer and most instructors don't even address the very important issue.]

I have been focusing mostly on Chin Na lately. It's turning into one of my loves. Every time I see someone in an American movie fight scene, and they are being held or choked by someone, all that I can think is "I could break their arm from there," or "They would be so dead if they tried that with me."

The three-inch (or four-inch) punch is quite real--I've seen my Taekwondo instructor do it.

It's real, Bruce Lee was a practitioner of the one-inch punch, but not to the degree that she used it in Kill Bill. No one could dig themselves out of a grave (shallow or otherwise) with it.

 

[SeaCat]

Don't know if this will help or if it even counts.

Took six years of Tae Kwon Do before I graduated High School. Then I was introduced to Krav Maga. Studied that for three years in Europe then when I came back managed to get further training in it here and there. Currently I train in it twice a week.

Cat

 

[TheeGoatPig]

Don't know if this will help or if it even counts.

Took six years of Tae Kwon Do before I graduated High School. Then I was introduced to Krav Maga. Studied that for three years in Europe then when I came back managed to get further training in it here and there. Currently I train in it twice a week.

Cat

Of course that counts. even if I can't remember what Krav Maga is...

*feels ignorant*

 

[rgraham666]

Of course that counts. even if I can't remember what Krav Maga is...

*feels ignorant*

Krav Maga

Video

 

[slyc_willie]

Lol. I remember this thread. Has it really been a year?

I learned a lot about the mechanics of martial arts when I went through my core training. But not so much of the philosophy behind it. I was told where to hit, and how hard, but never why. The 'why,' I learned later on, after my servitude to the US military.

I've been studying Tai Chi for years now. I practice it most every morning. Combining what I have learned from that soft art to my more aggressive combat training, I know I am more than capable in a fight. Not too long ago, I realized that some instincts can't be suppressed by time.

That said, I don't think I could ever be classified as a 'martial artist.' Not to the extent in which the art of violence and the art of movement are intertwined. I'm more of a 'stand fast, strike first' kind of guy.

 

[Xelebes]

Schoolyard fighter here, green-belt.