Greatest (and worse) generals

[REDWAVE]

Greatest (and worst) generals

There's another thread about the greatest American generals. Someone in it suggested a thread about greatest generals of all countries and of all time. I thought that was a good idea. Also, to make this topic as broad as possible, "general" is not limited to generals in official armies, but can also include commanders of rebel groups, revolting slaves (yeah, yeah, I know the joke), etc. Also, feel free to nominate what you consider some of the all time worst generals. In addition, if you wish to criticize any generals, or just make silly puns about general nausea, general disgust, etc., go for it.

I'll start it out. My nominee for greatest general of all time is Russia's General Winter. I don't think that one needs much explanation. Ole General Winter kicked the butts of Charles XII of Sweden, Napoleon, and Hitler and his Nazi German war machine-- defeating some of the greatest military stategists in history, and one of the most fearsome war machines ever. "Never march on Moscow" has become a military aphorism.

As for greatest human general of all time, I'll have to think about that one for a while.

 

[Synnerman]

One whole post and not one biggoted remark. You are slipping.

 

[Lost Cause]

My best top pick is General Anesthesia! Can knock out any foe!

My worst pick is General Zukov. He headed the most out of control, thieving, mob of rapists army the world has ever seen. Standard Zukov tactic, drive the conscripts against the Germans until their ammo was spent. If it wasn't, drive some more dumb slavs against them! Freed red army p.o.w.s killed themselves rather than return to the ranks. The Red Army killed as much of their fellow countrymen as the Germans did. Today, I would personally kick the balls of any grandkid of that sorry bag of dirt! Someday I'll tell you how I really feel!

 

[The Dipsomaniac]

Hal Moore? (We Were Soldiers Once)

 

[riff]

Is this another one of those list threads?

LOL

 

[heterotic]

I'm going with Belisarius. Time after time he saved the holy roman empire's ass from the turks. He started with vastly inferior resources and manpower, and each time got less and less, as the byzantine boys got more and more jealous of his popular appeal.
He fought the turks off over and over, without fail. Never had a Gettysburg, never had a Waterloo. He's right up there with Sun Tzu, in my book.

 

[Shaq]

Well I'm not as cultured as you all...if I had to vote on the best generals of all time I would have to say the canidates would be Hitler, Alexander the Great, Caesar, Lee, and Genghis Con.

The worst....I would have to say custer. Or whoever the fuck got beat at the alamo...

 

[heterotic]

Yup, Genghis Khan was pretty good too. He took out all of Europe just for the fun of it, then gave it back.

 

[KinkyKat]

Spartacus

1. Slave
2. European
3. Revolutionary of sorts
4. Never got rich from the movie rights

 

[missy2]

I kinda like General Admission-even if you do have to get there kinda early.

 

[bored1]

General Tire

 

[bluespoke]

Worst?

General Assembly!

 

[Paendragon]

Scipio Africanus.

We all know who Hannibal of Carthage is (rode the war elephants over the Alps to invade Rome), but not many know Scipio. He's the Roman general who pushed Hannibal out of Europe, and back to Carthage, despite being outnumbered more often than not.

He also devised the plan that eliminated Hannibal's most feared weapon, the elephant. He was directly responsible for bringing carthage controlled Africa under Roman rule, hence the last name.

 

[Weevil]

I'd have to go with General "Thunderbolt" Ross. He chased him for years but could never catch the Hulk.

 

[Dixon Carter Lee]

If we're going broad I'd have to say J. Edgar Hoover, you know, from the FBI?

By the way...? How the fuck is that going?

 

[Problem Child]

Redwave, shut the fuck up.

 

[miles]

General Shut the Fuck Up

 

[bored1]

The General Lee............... That was one of the best cars on tv only the original Batmobile was better.

 

[REDWAVE]

Big Five

Well, we've had a lot of suggestions here, some good, some not so good. I'm partial to Genghis Con myself. However, there are five generals who are generally agreed to be the greatest military genuises in history: Hannibal, Julius Caesar, Alexander the Great, Napoleon, and Robert E. Lee. Feel free to add to this list, or argue why you think one of them shouldn't be on the list, or even denigrate them personally. (As far as I know, all of them except Napoleon owned slaves, and Lee fought for a slaveowners' rebellion.) Those of you who want to tell me to shut the fuck up can follow their own advice.

Of the big five, I'm partial to the little Corsican. Not only was he such an unlikely military man to begin with, being so short and all, he fought for the continuation of what was left of the French Revolution-- an extremely progressive cause at the time. His opponents were all the most hidebound reactionaries of Europe: Czarist Russia, Hapsburg Austria, Hohenzollern Prussia, and (last but not least) "perfidious Albion." His campaigns in Italy and Germany were highly successful, and he came to dominate much of continental Europe. But he began to go astray with his invasion of Iberia, which met serious guerrilla resistence, and then went totally wrong with his disastrous invasion of Russia in 1812 ("Never march on Moscow!"). He was decisively defeated at Leipzig ("The Battle of The Nations"), but later made a short-lived comeback after escaping from Corsica before finally meeting his Waterloo. He spent the rest of his life on the island of Saint Helena, in the bleak South Atlantic.

 

[Starblayde]

We've fought a helluva lot of wars so Montgomery and Wellington should be in there somewhere.... Nelson and Drake for naval-related jiggery-pokery

 

[KinkyKat]

Re: Big Five

I'm partial to Genghis Con myself. However, there are five generals who are generally agreed to be the greatest military genuises in history: Hannibal, Julius Caesar, Alexander the Great, Napoleon, and Robert E. Lee. Feel free to add to this list, or argue why you think one of them shouldn't be on the list, or even denigrate them personally. (As far as I know, all of them except Napoleon owned slaves, and Lee fought for a slaveowners' rebellion.)

What difference does it make whether they had slaves or not? That has nothing to do with their abilities as generals.....does it?

And, Robt. E. Lee was basically AGAINST slavery. He only commanded the Confederate military the last few weeks of the civil war.

Lee would have been on the side of the Union had it not been for his beloved Virginia.

And, the Civil War was fought mostly over the issue of state's rights....not slavery.

btw...Glad we got Alexander The Great on the list. He certainly deserves to be there.

 

[REDWAVE]

Kinky Kat

Owning slaves has nothing to do with military ability, of course, but it does have to do with one's assessment of a general (war leader) as a human being.

Kinky Kat (or anybody), what was it about Alexander that made him a great general, in your opinion? Was he also a great human being?

 

[Weird Harold]

Re: Kinky Kat

Owning slaves has nothing to do with military ability, of course, but it does have to do with one's assessment of a general (war leader) as a human being.

I think you will find if you dig deep enough that almost every great general was not a very nice human being. The mind-set and personality that allows a person to make the life and death decisions a general has to make, also makes most generals unfit for a peaceful world and polite society.

At the very least, every great general was an egotistical bastard -- if he wasn't, he wouldn't be a great general.