Good Manners

[CutieMouse]

BTW on the driving thing I was specifically thinking of the trip I took last spring - it was more economical to drive my Honda than his truck, but he felt more comfortable as driver than passenger. We'd been dating a month or two at that point, so it was no big deal to me. First dates are a non-issue RE: cars, as I always meet them at the restaurant.

I also refuse to consider paying for a meal to be anything other than paying for a meal. Buying my dinner is not a free ticket to "F*ck Cutie Land". I've had first dates where I had iced tea with free refills; I've had first dates with really freaking expensive wine. Both ended with a handshake/hug and goodnight. I'm not forcing anyone to buy my drink/dinner/whatever, and (in my case) I haven't found that doing so has hampered communication/etc at all.

 

[FurryFury]

I agree that a dinner or drink bought for someone is not a ticket to any place including a fuck land, yet many seem to think it is.

FF

 

[radepor]

I agree, but...

Just wondering...

As a male (older), I never thought a dinner date was an automatic prelude to sex. However, I think some men did and maybe still do.

Just wondering tho; how many women ask men out to dinner and pay for it. What's their expectation?

I agree that a dinner or drink bought for someone is not a ticket to any place including a fuck land, yet many seem to think it is.

FF

 

[rosco rathbone]

I

God! Does everything have to be about control?

Yes, to some of us.

I order, I open doors, I pay. I'm not driving your car when I first meet you, though.

 

[rosco rathbone]

BTW on the driving thing I was specifically thinking of the trip I took last spring - it was more economical to drive my Honda than his truck, but he felt more comfortable as driver than passenger. We'd been dating a month or two at that point, so it was no big deal to me. First dates are a non-issue RE: cars, as I always meet them at the restaurant.

I also refuse to consider paying for a meal to be anything other than paying for a meal. Buying my dinner is not a free ticket to "F*ck Cutie Land". I've had first dates where I had iced tea with free refills; I've had first dates with really freaking expensive wine. Both ended with a handshake/hug and goodnight. I'm not forcing anyone to buy my drink/dinner/whatever, and (in my case) I haven't found that doing so has hampered communication/etc at all.

There's something erotic about an old school date, isn't there.

 

[CutieMouse]

Just wondering...

As a male (older), I never thought a dinner date was an automatic prelude to sex. However, I think some men did and maybe still do.

Just wondering tho; how many women ask men out to dinner and pay for it. What's their expectation?

I don't ask men out; I just don't.

However, every time I've been faster with the credit card to pay for dinner I've gotten the evil eye and been told in no uncertain terms that it was A) unnecessary and B) to not do it again. LOL

 

[CutieMouse]

There's something erotic about an old school date, isn't there.

With the right person everything about an old school date is erotic.

 

[Keroin]

BTW on the driving thing I was specifically thinking of the trip I took last spring - it was more economical to drive my Honda than his truck, but he felt more comfortable as driver than passenger. We'd been dating a month or two at that point, so it was no big deal to me. First dates are a non-issue RE: cars, as I always meet them at the restaurant.

That is a totally different situation. I just wouldn't let someone I don't know drive my vehicle. Manners and D/s doesn't enter into that equation.

I also refuse to consider paying for a meal to be anything other than paying for a meal. Buying my dinner is not a free ticket to "F*ck Cutie Land". I've had first dates where I had iced tea with free refills; I've had first dates with really freaking expensive wine. Both ended with a handshake/hug and goodnight. I'm not forcing anyone to buy my drink/dinner/whatever, and (in my case) I haven't found that doing so has hampered communication/etc at all.

I liked to keep first dates money neutral. That is to say, I liked them to involve minimum or no costs, that way the whole paying issue was avoided. (I have a friend who likes to take his first dates to feed the ducks in the park for that reason and others). After that, then it was usually 50/50 - he paid one time, I paid another, next time we went Dutch, etc - and I'm cool with that.

I don't think that women who enjoy these kinds of "old fashioned" manners are weak or anything of that sort, BTW. I just don't think that dating should be a one size fits all activity. The kind of behaviour I would enjoy on a date, is likely the kind of behaviour many other women would consider rude.

 

[intothewoods]

Is it really so totally from out of left field that "what sounds good" was actually intended to mean "what would you like?" It seems to me it could have gone either way. I just can't imagine getting worked up about it, even on a first date. If I'd really wanted something else, I think I would feel ok to just pipe up and say, oh, thank you, but I think I've decided instead on the blahblahblah. If it was a miscommunication, I would still think it sweet that he was making an effort to be courteous, in his mind anyway.

 

[intothewoods]

First date - I like drinks or coffee.

 

[rida]

Paying for my food/drinks does not give any date an advantage to get in my panties. At the same time I have no problem with picking up the bill or splitting it.

I did however find it a bit awkward when a date picked up the tab from the table, went to the register and when he got the total, just put down half of the money. I chalked it up to cultural differences.

 

[radepor]

Fine, it is about control -- for some

I believe myself to be a control freak; yet, I don't do it often and I try not to be.
Not your typical BDSM behavior is it?

I will never tell you your way of thinking is wrong; it's just wrong for me.

Yes, to some of us.

I order, I open doors, I pay. I'm not driving your car when I first meet you, though.

 

[neci]

i think it would shock me more than anything. i wouldn't make a deal of it, but it would make me pay closer attention.

 

[BiBunny]

Is it really so totally from out of left field that "what sounds good" was actually intended to mean "what would you like?" It seems to me it could have gone either way. I just can't imagine getting worked up about it, even on a first date. If I'd really wanted something else, I think I would feel ok to just pipe up and say, oh, thank you, but I think I've decided instead on the blahblahblah. If it was a miscommunication, I would still think it sweet that he was making an effort to be courteous, in his mind anyway.

Agreed.

I think that unless the guy acted like he had a major chip on his shoulder, I'd have been flattered rather than annoyed, were I in that position.

 

[Tetriak]

This whole mud-bath could have been avoided by taking her to the drive-though.

Driver orders. End of story.

Note to the Gentlemen: Avoid social faux pas by taking your women out for fast food in your jalopy. She'll appreciate you for avoiding the occasional awkwardness of formal dining.

 

[RJMasters]

I think the most curteous thing a guy can do when on a dinner date is to thank the server when your seated or when the drinks are brought, and then tell them you will signal them when you are both ready to order.

I think giving the person I'm with the time to look over the menu and discuss what looks good, and ask if she has decided on what she would like, then let the server know we are ready to order after I have all the infomation needed to place the order. For me this is just a much cleaner solution all the way around.

I pay. Whether you are a woman or a guy. When I go with friends or to a business meeting, I pay. I can afford it, and I like to do that for anyone that goes out to eat with me. Never once has it ever crossed my mind that by me paying gives me any liberty or right.

I think if a person had a problem with me ordering or me paying, then its likely not going to work out, because if we manage to remain together I would do the same on the 1000th date as I do on the 1st. Its not so much about controlling the other person as it is doing what I like to do when I go out to eat.

Since dating is about getting to know the other person, I would hope that this is something she likes about me. Because this is who I am. its the way I carry myself. If she doesn't like that about me, it doesn't mean I am some power controlling asshole, it means we may not be compatible.

I may need your consent to get into your panties, but I don't need it to pay for your dinner. If you don't like that, then we won't be doing dinner...now shut up and eat your broccoli.

 

[SimonBrooke]

Has anyone ever witness some poor schmuck chewed a new asshole for holding open a door? I'm just wondering where this happens...I get doors held for me occasionally, and all the dude gets is a smile and a "thank you" from me.

It's happened to me.

This whole mud-bath could have been avoided by taking her to the drive-though.

Driver orders. End of story.

Note to the Gentlemen: Avoid social faux pas by taking your women out for fast food in your jalopy. She'll appreciate you for avoiding the occasional awkwardness of formal dining.

Oh, help! I seriously hope this is satirical, but somehow I fear it is not. Taking a date to a drive-through.... dear God! Sic transit gloria mundi.

 

[Tetriak]

Oh, help! I seriously hope this is satirical, but somehow I fear it is not. Taking a date to a drive-through.... dear God! Sic transit gloria mundi.

I assumed that gratuitous use of the word 'jalopy' was a dead give-a-way for satirical content.

Regarding manners, generally, as a rule, if someone can't figure out whether to be offended or not, then the matter is best left alone. Additionally, jumping down someone's throat over a single relatively benign ambiguous gesture says more about you than them. What is indicated is not flattering.

 

[YourCaptor]

Ok do any of you ladies really give a shit if I order you what you want?

Unrelated to that first question.

When I take out girls its to a place I know, and often they don't, so I usually tell them whats especially good and they tend to pick from that. I get it for them, nobody ever complained, they usually thank me for the best thing they ever had.

Although I must say I think the sexiest girl would be the one that lets me pick out all her courses, I generally get all the adventurous stuff, and she loves all of it. Shit watching her eat that would be hot in it's own.

 

[FurryFury]

First date - I like drinks or coffee.

Me too.

FF

 

[FurryFury]

Just wondering...

As a male (older), I never thought a dinner date was an automatic prelude to sex. However, I think some men did and maybe still do.

Just wondering tho; how many women ask men out to dinner and pay for it. What's their expectation?

No idea.

I can only speak for myself and my experiences. I never expect anything but general courtesy from anyone regardless of if I pay or not.

FF

 

[where]

Just wondering...

As a male (older), I never thought a dinner date was an automatic prelude to sex. However, I think some men did and maybe still do.

Just wondering tho; how many women ask men out to dinner and pay for it. What's their expectation?

I'm not typical, but I have a complicated relationship with food and sex. I can only let someone pay for my meal if I want to fuck them. When men pay for my food and I don't want to fuck them, it throws me. Because of this I always make it clear from the start that we're splitting the bill.

Ok do any of you ladies really give a shit if I order you what you want?

Unrelated to that first question.

When I take out girls its to a place I know, and often they don't, so I usually tell them whats especially good and they tend to pick from that. I get it for them, nobody ever complained, they usually thank me for the best thing they ever had.

Although I must say I think the sexiest girl would be the one that lets me pick out all her courses, I generally get all the adventurous stuff, and she loves all of it. Shit watching her eat that would be hot in it's own.

I'm good with the man orders for me after he has checked what I want. But I prefer to choose my own food. I'm not a picky eater, but ending up with a chicken salad and a fruity dessert because that's what he ~thinks~ I'd like, is a passion killer.

If I knew he'd order me scallops, a blue ribeye and a double espresso, then I'd be totally cool with it.

 

[rosco rathbone]

I think if a person had a problem with me ordering or me paying, then its likely not going to work out

[/thread].....

 

[DVS]

I don't know what your reasons are, CM, but for me, sharing dinner out together is an intimate moment. Those first few dates, when we're learning about each other, call me a prude but I don't want to do anything intimate. I want to get to know you and I want you to get to know me in the most comfortable and informal setting possible.

Then, if we click, let the dinners out begin.

Hm, oddly enough I just realized that I would have sex on the first date but I wouldn't do a dinner out. So the term "intimate" is relative I guess, lol.

Ummm, whatcha doin' next Saturday night? How 'bout a wham bam, no dinner ma'am date?

 

[DVS]

PYL/pyl=Pick your label (capital letters for Master, Dom, Top, etc. and lower case letters for sub, slave, bottom, etc.) Just a simple shorthand thing.

I think this is all pretty ridiculous, on both sides of the discussion. First, this is a first date? If I was on a first date with someone, and I asked "what sounds good?" I wouldn't presume that my date wanted to eat what she had suggested. I'd guess she might be suggesting that I might like, maybe what she's heard is good from a friend or maybe even just being nice and suggesting something off the menu, because I asked. Does that mean I should assume she might like that, or even that she assumes that I might? Unless there was something else said in-between her suggestion and his ordering for her, I'd say he was rude and presumptuous.

If he had asked her what she was going to order, then ordered that for her, I'd still say he was a bit presumptuous, but not so rude. He should at least ask her if she minded he order for the two of them. Maybe saying something like "How about I order for us both? Is that OK with you?" I mean, we are on the first date here. He knows nothing about her.

But those saying he was attempting to be a PYL before he should is also taking it a little too far, for sure, if this is a vanilla date. But, we are a world of different people, different likes and dislikes and social tastes. Speaking of tastes, what if her dinner came with a salad and choice of veggie? Did he just decide dressing and veggie, too? She could take offense and toss her green beans at him just to show him how little he knows about her, because she wanted the corn.