FAWC You, Two!

[NaokoSmith]

Thanks Naoko - I understand mine is a bit of a long read, and not everyone's cup of tea. Still not certain if I'll leave it as is, in the Chain Story category. Thanks for the offer to read it, I'm sure I'll be getting feedback in the future, once the regulars find it

I actually liked that a lot. I prefer dialog to be more natural, while keeping the narrative in a more proper voice.

Good luck with your adventure.

Thank you so much for the feedback.

I will do my best to read the FAWC story. I've just long wanted to read the Accidental Nudist Cabin - and I never get time to do anything unless I stay up till midnight, LOL, so I have to have a sharp point-y thing to make me do it, like FAWC anonymous author guessing.

 

[NaokoSmith]

I do have one question. In my story, the one element that I gather people thought I could have handled better was "intellect," defined as "one of the characters is very smart." I don't entirely disagree, but I would like to know -- what would have been a better way to handle it?

I thought you handled the intellectual character well. You made him clearly intellectual. However, he was also witty and charming. That made the story less balanced - with him being intellectual, and the female protagonist streetsmart - although it made it more likely that they would get it together.

The issue for me was the rest of the people he worked with. I liked how you depicted Kayla's anxiety at going into the intellectual world - meeting Jaden's colleagues. Her fear about not having the right dress to wear was excellent; I think you could have done more with that. I have a hilarious story about wearing the wrong dress to an academic dinner! and I am an intellectual, LOL.

(In brief my chum who is an engineering Don was told off he had to invite another academic to some stuck-up totally way out Oxbridge college dinner and as he was new in the job he thought they meant someone nice and sociable so he invited me instead of another engineering smarty-pants. I also thought it would be some fun night out so I wore a Thai silk cocktail dress with a split up the skirt. I can still see the look on the face of the Master of the college as I walked up with my friend! He said: "And are you an engineer too?" in a petrified voice, cuz OK yah, I look like a fucking top class hooker in that dress and I don't mean the rugby kind. And I was like, "No, anthropologist." Wow, the sweat of relief just came pouring off that man's brow. But the most hilarious thing was that there happened to be a number of senior anthropologists at the dinner whom I knew really well so I fitted in excellently although nobody else was dressed like me . There were like, six of us under sixty and four of us who were women . It was black tie so you can tell they really meant: Invite a bloke.)

Now that I understand the intellectual character was originally to be female, I understand better how he came to immediately grasp the principles of football. As he is now a bloke, that is something I'd change if it was my story; maybe make him ask questions that are a bit geek-y about the game.

I think the problem is less how do you show someone is intellectual, and more how do you showcase Kayla's street-wise wit and charm in a way that shows that intellect alone is not that cool after all. That gives her more of a chance to be with Jaden in the future.

For me that would be about depicting Jaden's colleagues. He is witty and charming but they are dull ole intellects alone. They can do all the bio-medical blahdiblah but they have no idea how to have fun.

I would also cut out him going to the game to his firm's box, because that's unrealistic - academic kind of firms don't have boxes at sporting events. They are really poor at charming their clients because they think their brains should be good enough to do it. Maybe have a friend who is into football be taking him along, saying: You need to get out more and have fun. You could make this a friend from his schooldays or college, someone who's not a bio-medical researcher, not an intellectual - to whom he's complained about how boring the rest of his colleagues are?

I know about football (soccer), although we rugby players think it is a wimp's game you play as a warm-up to the main rugby match, as well as academia so if you would like, I could help you with this story.

 

[NaokoSmith]

That was my comment about affectation. I had affectation as well, and I guess I understood it differently.

This story has stuck with me. I just keep thinking about it. It's a good one.

You used affectation well too - to further illuminate the humble character of your heroine. I guess that underlines FAWCker/Willie's point about him not having preconceived ideas about the basket ingredients, just offering them as inspiration for writers to use as we wished.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

I didn't go into too much specificity on the basket ingredients mainly because I know there are a lot of interpretations for just about all of them. How an author sees "intellectual" isn't necessarily how the readers will see it. As has been pointed out, an intellectual isn't the same for everyone.

Personally, when I think intellectual, I think someone who has a large amount of knowledge across a broad number of fields. Not a bookworm who can simply regurgitate endless facts, figures, dates, and so forth, but someone who can assimilate the knowledge and use it correctly.

Ben Franklin was an intellectual. Albert Einstein was an intellectual. Isaac Asimov was an intellectual. They were well-read, but were also inventive. They could apply what they learned and read in new and different ways.

At the same time, in the context of a story, an intellectual could just be a physics professor. Intelligence is implied for someone in such a field, and that's usually enough for most readers.

INTELLECTUAL has nuthin to do with application or perception, its understanding via thought. And the library is its symbol. Cant be a laboratory. Cant be a telescope.

As has been pointed out, an intellectual isn't the same for everyone. NO SHIT SHERLOCK. We make it up as we go along, change meanings cuz we're too fucking lazy to consult a dictionary or check the etymology, and create Babble no one gets.

 

[NaokoSmith]

As has been pointed out, an intellectual isn't the same for everyone. NO SHIT SHERLOCK. We make it up as we go along, change meanings cuz we're too fucking lazy to consult a dictionary or check the etymology, and create Babble no one gets.

There are two broad theories on language use. One, that language is an approximation of meaning. Nobody means the same thing by words we use but we struggle by. The other theory is that words have a clear reference to that which we are talking about.

Those who subscribe to the first theory are more inclined to let languages grow and develop, those to the second to attempt to fix language. This is exemplifid in the French trying to ban all imported words in the language - causing difficulties in football (soccer) and rugby since almost all footballing terms had been Franglicised.

A jolly book on linguistic philosophy is Ian Hacking's Why Does Language Matter to Philosophy. I don't know why, because it's an excellent account of thinking on language, but whenever I read it, it makes me want to roll all over the floor laughing.

 

[PennLady]

I thought you handled the intellectual character well. You made him clearly intellectual. However, he was also witty and charming. That made the story less balanced - with him being intellectual, and the female protagonist streetsmart - although it made it more likely that they would get it together.

Thanks. I didn't intentionally make him "witty and charming," although I did want him to be likable. There was a bit of opposites-attract going on, I guess. I was also not trying to make him a geek, just a smart guy. Smart doesn't have to equal geek. (Although my library is running an "I geek [interest]" campaign right now, so I guess we can all be a geek.)

The issue for me was the rest of the people he worked with.

Aside from one guy, I didn't really depict any of his coworkers. That was in part because (again) of the time issue, but also because I was keeping things kind of tight and trying to focus on the two of them.

I liked how you depicted Kayla's anxiety at going into the intellectual world - meeting Jaden's colleagues. Her fear about not having the right dress to wear was excellent; I think you could have done more with that.

In a revision, I can see expanding on the dinner/party thing. This was a place where I told the reader what was going on. Any showing was mostly implied through Kayla's actions and speech.

Now that I understand the intellectual character was originally to be female, I understand better how he came to immediately grasp the principles of football. As he is now a bloke, that is something I'd change if it was my story; maybe make him ask questions that are a bit geek-y about the game.

That's something to consider, but I don't know that it makes a difference to me. I don't see why he can't just put it together himself as my female character did. Not every guy likes sports, and I've known many of those.

I would also cut out him going to the game to his firm's box, because that's unrealistic - academic kind of firms don't have boxes at sporting events. They are really poor at charming their clients because they think their brains should be good enough to do it.

We may be thinking of different things here. Abbott Laboratories (a real business in the Chicago area) is not an academic firm. They are a multi-national corporation with many areas of production and research. It is perhaps more reasonable that they'd have a box at a football or baseball or even hockey stadium, but it isn't unreasonable that they'd have one somewhere, even just as a perk for employees.

I worked for a small newsletter publishing firm in Virginia, and they had seats (not boxes, though) at baseball and basketball games that were made available to employees on a first-come, first-served basis. This is a small place, like I said, and I'm not even sure where the seats were. We also didn't solicit executives -- the firm is too small and owned by one or two people -- but it was a nice thing for the employees. Some firms will do things like this.

I know about football (soccer), although we rugby players think it is a wimp's game you play as a warm-up to the main rugby match, as well as academia so if you would like, I could help you with this story.

Thanks for the offer. I'll have to see when I get time to work on this. I have a bunch of things lined up and mostly am waiting for school to start so I can start hacking away at the list.

 

[MSTarot]

This was my favourite story

The background world of Indie Wrestling is very well depicted.

LOL, I had to think a bit about ‘affectation’.

(I kinda would have liked a bit more maybe on the threesome sex, la la la, y'know just as uh, a bit of background information on uh, caravans. ).

Well, thank you Naoko. I'm glad you enjoyed it.

It was fun story to write.

When I got 'Sport' I was just shaking my head. Where I'm from sports are all about either college football or Nascar Racing. And if you say you have no interest in either one of those (which I don't) you get looked at like your a drag queen in training. I went to bed that night with my head spinning with basket ingredients just trying to make something make sense.

I had to look affectation up, not a word I hear often. I knew that vehicle and Envy i could spin into the story but those two were giving me fits for about thirty minutes. Then I thought about wrestling.

The whole thing is about being someone and doing something you're not! It hit with the 'click' feeling. I have friends that have done indie level wrestling. I remember talking to them about them doing shows for the cost of the gas to get there.

I wanted the story to have the feeling of the Mickey Rourke movie 'The Wrestler' but be about a young wrestler, still struggling to make it big.

Vehicle fell into line when I thought abut him driving a big rig from show to show pulling a trailer with everything.

Like I said it was just fun to write. Sorry about the typos, I am working on that.

(The three some) I had thought about doing a full scene there but then I looked at it and decided that it was a kind of 'off the path' of the main story line, that would have added sex just for sex sake (Not always a a bad thing but not when it's distracting) I kind of felt that the story was long enough already without another page or two just to have that scene.


I'm sorry the dust in your house is getting to you and making you cry. You could try what I do, open the windows and doors and get the electric leaf blower.

MST

 

[patientlee]

Well, thank you Naoko. I'm glad you enjoyed it.

It was fun story to write.

When I got 'Sport' I was just shaking my head. Where I'm from sports are all about either college football or Nascar Racing. And if you say you have no interest in either one of those (which I don't) you get looked at like your a drag queen in training. I went to bed that night with my head spinning with basket ingredients just trying to make something make sense.

I had to look affectation up, not a word I hear often. I knew that vehicle and Envy i could spin into the story but those two were giving me fits for about thirty minutes. Then I thought about wrestling.

The whole thing is about being someone and doing something you're not! It hit with the 'click' feeling. I have friends that have done indie level wrestling. I remember talking to them about them doing shows for the cost of the gas to get there.

I wanted the story to have the feeling of the Mickey Rourke movie 'The Wrestler' but be about a young wrestler, still struggling to make it big.

Vehicle fell into line when I thought abut him driving a big rig from show to show pulling a trailer with everything.

Like I said it was just fun to write. Sorry about the typos, I am working on that.

(The three some) I had thought about doing a full scene there but then I looked at it and decided that it was a kind of 'off the path' of the main story line, that would have added sex just for sex sake (Not always a a bad thing but not when it's distracting) I kind of felt that the story was long enough already without another page or two just to have that scene.


I'm sorry the dust in your house is getting to you and making you cry. You could try what I do, open the windows and doors and get the electric leaf blower.

MST

You did the envy so well without being obnoxious. I loved the ending.

 

[_Lynn_]

I scored three of them 5, the others are solid 4s but I didn't score them, because what I dislike about them is my personal bias against what I call BRADY BUNCH/HAPPY DAYS/PRETTY WOMAN prose tone. But there truly are no runts in this litter.

I couldn't reply to this when you posted it, but now the challenge is over . . . thanks for the 5 vote.

 

[NaokoSmith]

Well, thank you Naoko. I'm glad you enjoyed it.

...
(The three some) I had thought about doing a full scene there but then I looked at it and decided that it was a kind of 'off the path' of the main story line, that would have added sex just for sex sake (Not always a a bad thing but not when it's distracting) I kind of felt that the story was long enough already without another page or two just to have that scene.

I'm sorry the dust in your house is getting to you and making you cry. You could try what I do, open the windows and doors and get the electric leaf blower.

MST

You might think about cutting the hooker character? I'm not sure she really added to the story, although she offered the possibility of hot loose sex, LOL.

Until you posted here I totally forgot 'vehicle' was one of your words, you integrated it so well.

I must really try that with the leaf blower. It might help with my kitten infestation! And there are a few other things I wouldn't mind seeing blowing away in a high wind

 

[NaokoSmith]

Thanks for the offer. I'll have to see when I get time to work on this. I have a bunch of things lined up and mostly am waiting for school to start so I can start hacking away at the list.

OMG! School school! I am going to run home on the first day and throw crisps* on the living room floor, stamp them into the carpet, and roll on them while eating chocolate and sweets for lunch and watching Pirates of the Caribbean 3; repeating the 'marry me' scene several times just for the pleasure of watching it without someone making 'urggh' and kissy noises in the background.


*Translator's note: potato chips. For those who mean something different by 'chips' but we struggle by and manage to communicate.

 

[slyc_willie]

OMG! School school! I am going to run home on the first day and throw crisps* on the living room floor, stamp them into the carpet, and roll on them while eating chocolate and sweets for lunch and watching Pirates of the Caribbean 3; repeating the 'marry me' scene several times just for the pleasure of watching it without someone making 'urggh' and kissy noises in the background.


*Translator's note: potato chips. For those who mean something different by 'chips' but we struggle by and manage to communicate.

Was that the scene in which Orlando Bloom and Kiera Knightly get married by Barbosa in the middle of a battle? I actually loved that scene. The Pirates of the Caribbean franchise may have been lauded off as eye candy, but there really were some artfully crafted scenes and some great dialogue.

"Did everybody see that? Because, I will not be doing that again." -- one of my favorite lines from the entire series.

 

[NaokoSmith]

Was that the scene in which Orlando Bloom and Kiera Knightly get married by Barbosa in the middle of a battle? I actually loved that scene. The Pirates of the Caribbean franchise may have been lauded off as eye candy, but there really were some artfully crafted scenes and some great dialogue.

"Did everybody see that? Because, I will not be doing that again." -- one of my favorite lines from the entire series.

Yes! that's the scene. God I love Pirates films - although I wasn't so keen on 4. Only because I totally adore 1,2 and 3! I mean, the escape from St James's Palace! and when he sucks Judi Dench's ear! talk about a gorgeous display of British icons.

I love best Cutler Beckett's lines.

"It's Lord now, actually. Lord Beckett."

"No doubt you've discovered that loyalty is no longer the currency of the realm, as your father believes."
Elizabeth Swann: "Then what is?"
"I'm afraid currency is the currency of the realm."

"The immaterial has become ... immaterial."



(On Piglet's first day in full school I seriously ran all the way home and put Pirates 3 on the DVD player although I didn't roll in crisps and chocolate on the floor, LOL.)

 

[xelliebabex]

OMG! School school! I am going to run home on the first day and throw crisps* on the living room floor, stamp them into the carpet, and roll on them while eating chocolate and sweets for lunch and watching Pirates of the Caribbean 3; repeating the 'marry me' scene several times just for the pleasure of watching it without someone making 'urggh' and kissy noises in the background.


*Translator's note: potato chips. For those who mean something different by 'chips' but we struggle by and manage to communicate.

I have exactly 3 weeks, that's 15 work days, until spring break here and all the little darlings are safely at home with their mommies and daddies for two weeks...... crisps and chocolate combined with pirates.... I may just do that on a number of days now that the idea is festering in my poor overworked little brain....

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

I couldn't reply to this when you posted it, but now the challenge is over . . . thanks for the 5 vote.

Do I know how to pick winners or what! Congrats!

 

[NaokoSmith]

I have exactly 3 weeks, that's 15 work days, until spring break here and all the little darlings are safely at home with their mommies and daddies for two weeks...... crisps and chocolate combined with pirates.... I may just do that on a number of days now that the idea is festering in my poor overworked little brain....

LOL, you are allowed to do it with them in the name of some ultra cool educational theory! We moms are supposed to set a good example.

Ummm I said supposed to ...

 

[NaokoSmith]

Do I know how to pick winners or what! Congrats!

You are a very sharp analytic mind when you get going, which is why we value your serious feedback comments. (The posts with capital letters are not usually as thoughtful or constructive as those in lower case .)

 

[patientlee]

OMG! School school! I am going to run home on the first day and throw crisps* on the living room floor, stamp them into the carpet, and roll on them while eating chocolate and sweets for lunch and watching Pirates of the Caribbean 3; repeating the 'marry me' scene several times just for the pleasure of watching it without someone making 'urggh' and kissy noises in the background.


*Translator's note: potato chips. For those who mean something different by 'chips' but we struggle by and manage to communicate.

You enjoy that. Meanwhile, I'll be stuck in a small, un- air conditioned room with 30 fourteen year olds who are thrilled to be back in school so they can have an audience when they fart, draw penises on the desks, and ask me why everyone can't just speak English.

Is my first day anxiety showing yet? I summer.

 

[MSTarot]

You might think about cutting the hooker character? I'm not sure she really added to the story, although she offered the possibility of hot loose sex, LOL.


I must really try that with the leaf blower. It might help with my kitten infestation!

She was added for a future story if I ever wanted to do one. I do that a lot. I put small sub plot characters in that if I want to write a part two (say when I have nothing else in my head to write about and need something to just pass the time with) all I have to do is go and read back through the story and there she will be ready to be come a wrestler and cause all sorts of story mischief


"Meeoooooooooooooooooowwwwwwwwwwwww." THump!

The visuals I wake up to in the morning.

 

[NaokoSmith]

She was added for a future story if I ever wanted to do one. I do that a lot. I put small sub plot characters in that if I want to write a part two (say when I have nothing else in my head to write about and need something to just pass the time with) all I have to do is go and read back through the story and there she will be ready to be come a wrestler and cause all sorts of story mischief


"Meeoooooooooooooooooowwwwwwwwwwwww." THump!

The visuals I wake up to in the morning.

Ooh, nice one!

I have lots of characters who snuck into my novels and started spiralling out of control so in the end I had to give them their own bloody story! I love them. I can't wait for the hooker story. There will be lots of rugby in it, right?

Perhaps you would like a kitten for one of your stories? They look good floating in the air above a leaf blower, and make an interesting THump! when they land ...

 

[NaokoSmith]

You enjoy that. Meanwhile, I'll be stuck in a small, un- air conditioned room with 30 fourteen year olds who are thrilled to be back in school so they can have an audience when they fart, draw penises on the desks, and ask me why everyone can't just speak English.

Is my first day anxiety showing yet? I summer.

Show them Pirates of the Caribbean 2. It's full of people who would make you glad to speak another language - and several versions of Pidgin - if you met them!

Acksherly I love the realism of the P of C characters' multi-cultural backgrounds. I mean, that point when one of the sailors in the Islands says to Will Turner: "mmmm, delicious long pork!" can be got on the island Cap'n Jack Sparrow and the Black Pearl crew have gone to. If Will Turner had only realised that 'long pork' is the Melanesian Island term for cooked human flesh ...

 

[Tx Tall Tales]

Change to the Top List

Quick Note to all The FAWC and FAWC too authors - Darkniciad, you might be interested in this.

Laurel and Manu have changed the Chain Stories criteria. To qualify for the toplist in chain stories, it appears that you now need 50 votes, not 100.

Several stories have made it into the list. This is only true if you got there from the TopList selection on the main page. If you go through the Chain Stories Hub, the Hall of Fame still seems to require 100 votes.

Just though some of you might want to know.

 

[RejectReality]

Uhm, the requirement ( at least last time I checked ) was actually 30.

*Looks*

Yep, it's still 30. Has been since a few categories were changed from the 100 standard shortly after the new toplists were brought online.

Quick Note to all The FAWC and FAWC too authors - Darkniciad, you might be interested in this.

Laurel and Manu have changed the Chain Stories criteria. To qualify for the toplist in chain stories, it appears that you now need 50 votes, not 100.

Several stories have made it into the list. This is only true if you got there from the TopList selection on the main page. If you go through the Chain Stories Hub, the Hall of Fame still seems to require 100 votes.

Just though some of you might want to know.

 

[Tx Tall Tales]

Uhm, the requirement ( at least last time I checked ) was actually 30.

*Looks*

Yep, it's still 30. Has been since a few categories were changed from the 100 standard shortly after the new toplists were brought online.

It may be, and have been 30, but until two days ago, no story made the top list without 100 votes. What's written somewhere, and what is real, in this case was two very different things.

You're welcome to check it out. Three days ago my story was number 2 on the top list. Number 2 on the Hub Hall of fame.

Now it's much lower on the top list (7). It remains the same on the Hall of Fame (2). You have stories at #3, #4, and #6 that weren't on the Top List Friday.

You are correct, the number is now 30, as evidenced by your #6 entry with 30 votes.

Just wanted to bring it to the attention of anyone who cares. They fixed the Chain Stories Top List. The Incest one is still badly broken.

 

[Darkniciad]

That's weird, because I looked at it a couple of weeks ago, and that wasn't what I saw. I noticed because my VR: DQ stories had made the list.

I'm fairly certain I actually mentioned the 30 vote threshold in another post several days ago. I'll have to see if I can find it.

It looks like it's 100 on Celebs. Celeb authors could lobby to have it lowered, because they aren't all 100 minimum. That just seems to be the baseline set when they were created. I know the Chain Stories category has a much lower bar, which appears to be 30.

I suppose an extra large amount of sniping, cheerleader voting, and sweeps to correct same could cause some sort of overflow error that could break the toplist, but I would suspect that we'd see the same sort of thing in LW if that was the case.

Found it. That was Tuesday the 10th.

It's always been lower than 100 since the new toplists came out, though. Maybe not 30, but it's not been 100 since the first tweaks only days after the new toplists were unveiled. All of the Hub "hall of fame" listings are 100 vote minimum, though.

My Laresa stories have all always been on the list, and looking back, at least one of them had fewer than 40 votes back about the time they updated the toplists to the new version.

Maybe you just happened to look on a day when they were trying to tweak things to fix the Incest toplist, and all of them were behaving strangely?

It may be, and have been 30, but until two days ago, no story made the top list without 100 votes. What's written somewhere, and what is real, in this case was two very different things.

You're welcome to check it out. Three days ago my story was number 2 on the top list. Number 2 on the Hub Hall of fame.

Now it's much lower on the top list (7). It remains the same on the Hall of Fame (2). You have stories at #3, #4, and #6 that weren't on the Top List Friday.

You are correct, the number is now 30, as evidenced by your #6 entry with 30 votes.

Just wanted to bring it to the attention of anyone who cares. They fixed the Chain Stories Top List. The Incest one is still badly broken.