Ethlical Dilemma

Samuari

Twice Blessed
Joined
Jul 20, 2000
Posts
4,072
Excerpt from Penthouse Letters, August, 1997 (by Carmen Ficarra):
Quick, what's the most common scenario we come across
in the letters we get from our readers? I ask people this
question all the time, and they usually say, "A man in bed
with two women." On one memorable occasion at a
restaurant in Washington, D.C., I'd barely gotten the question
out of my mouth when a man across the table blurted out,
"Sleeping with your mother!" As you might imagine, something
on the order of a stunned silence followed as the guy blushed
red as a hothouse tomato and the rest of us looked down at
our napkins and plates, the dust on the tips of our shoes - anything
to keep from making eye contact with him. Finally, I broke
the silence by revealing the truth:
The most common letter we get is from husbands, describing
how much they love watching their wives have sex with
other men. We know right away we've received one of these
letters too, because for all the hot-tub humping, steamy bar
scenes and backseat blowjobs they involve, they all seem to
start out with those three little words . . .
"My beautiful wife . . ."

Apparently a common enough fantancy, some of us have been lucky enough to have wives that are willing to indulge us. (That might the subject for a thread, but its likely been done, and there would be fifteen addys posted so that we newbys could catch up.)
This was indeed the fantasy of a friend of mine, who after much wheedling was able to convince his wife that she should go have some fun. When she came home and told him about it (part of the agreement) jealousy reared its ugly head. His job takes him out of town for extended periods, but when he is here he sticks to her like a shadow. Problem is that once she had tasted the forbidden fruit, she really liked it. She came to me in tears, wanting me to reason with her husband. When I was unable to get any where she said that she would wait until he was out of town, “After all, what he doesn’t know won’t hurt him, will it?” I told that if she played it would not be with me, nor would I have anything to do with deceiving my friend. As long as he had a problem, so did I. (Subject for thread 2, was I right?)
Now for my dilemma. After I thought some more, I realized that I was being hypocritical. My feeling about cyber fucking, sexual role-play, etc. has always been “Its just fantasy isn’t it? So what my wife’s nose isn’t rubbed in she doesn’t smell.” I’m not lying to her, she knows that I spend a lot of time on this site, but I haven’t told her the whole truth, either. A lie of omission is still a lie, and I am not going to continue to do it. I’m afraid that if I come out and catalogue my activities, that she will be hurt, even tough they are rather mild, by comparison. But if I don’t I will give up all sorts of fun stuff we do here, and I really don’t want to do that either. Is there any way for me to continue to play ethically, and not take the chance on hurting my dear longsuffering wife?
 
Hell yes.

Be completly honest with your wife. Don't just tell her what you have been doing here but why. Let her know this is just play and a form of expression. That you love her and only want her and see if she is interested in joining in. I bet you would have alot more fun on this board with your wife participating too. She loves you and If you are honest I don't think you will have any problems. If she does then stop. I'm sure your wife is far more important to you then this board. Let her know that as well and I'm willing to bet that everything will work out fine. Good luck Samuri!
 
Quite the dilemma, Samikins. Does anything you do in cyber land change your feelings for her? If so, curtailing that activity and honest confession is in order. If not, I dunno, maybe it's up to you. Maybe you need to have a conversation about the whole cyber life thing and see what she things/feels about it.
 
Here's what I do...

I am honest with my husband. He knows I have, shall we say appetites that he is not comfortable fulfilling, so he allows me the freedom to express those parts of me with the role playing and chatting. In return, I give him the best fucking he's ever had in his life. We both are as satisfied as we can be.

However, if I were to become seriously emotionally attached to someone I'd met on here, then I would consider that a problem and look for ways to untangle myself. That happened once, and untangling myself involved a LOT of pain, but I feel better for it.

Good luck! I hope, like Wolfy says, your wife sees this for the mode of expression it is rather than a wish to replace her or some other such nonsence :)
 
Long-assed, soapbox post warning

Now for my dilemma. After I thought some more, I realized that I was being hypocritical. My feeling about cyber fucking, sexual role-play, etc. has always been “Its just fantasy isn’t it? So what my wife’s nose isn’t rubbed in she doesn’t smell.” I’m not lying to her, she knows that I spend a lot of time on this site, but I haven’t told her the whole truth, either. A lie of omission is still a lie...

Sam, I think I may be the only one who thinks this, because no one else to my knowledge has ever posted in agreement with me, but...

While cyberfucking, etc. is fantasy, I don't think it's harmless to a relationship. In fact, I think if it is something in which you indulge in a lot (you have to judge what constitutes "a lot") that could be an indication that something is missing in your marriage.

Some people, like the Countess, openly acknowledge cybering and apparently it adds to their relationship, however, I think the majority of people, especially those who keep their online activities a secret, are treading on thin ice.

Think about it. Why would you keep it a secret if you weren't afraid she'd be hurt or upset by knowing?

I think cybering is mental cheating, and in some cases borders on physical cheating. When a married person cybers with someone else, they are interacting with a real person in order to get sexually aroused. And if you're masturbating in tandem, then you're getting off on it too--fulfilling your sexual needs with someone other than your spouse. It depends on your views on marriage, but because you're concerned with the adultery aspect with your friend, I'm assuming you adhere to the traditional view. When you bring someone else into your sexual life on a regular basis, I think that's going beyond the boundaries of what you promised when you said your vows.

I'm not talking out of both sides of my mouth either. I've been in your shoes and wrestled with this same dilemna. I've cybered. I've even cheated on my husband in the full physical sense. (As I've said before, it's not something I'm proud of, but it can't be undone.) But the fact is that if your wife finds out you've been pretending to have sex with other real, live people when you could have been having sex with her, she's probably going to be hurt. (Though to be truthful, I've heard of people confessing to cybering and the spouse says, "Who cares?") It depends on your wife. You know her. I don't.

I’m afraid that if I come out and catalogue my activities, that she will be hurt, even tough [though?] they are rather mild, by comparison. But if I don’t I will give up all sorts of fun stuff we do here, and I really don’t want to do that either. Is there any way for me to continue to play ethically, and not take the chance on hurting my dear longsuffering wife?

It's a tough choice, but you can't have your cake and eat it too. Here's what I've done. Because I believe it's cheating, I've stopped cybering. (It wasn't with any of the present regulars, so those of you curious people can just stop wondering.) But I still come here and interact and write stories. But it's tough. I am tempted every single day to step over that flirting line and go full bore, but since my decision, I have been able to resist.

In the end it's your choice. Like I said, you know your wife and are the best judge of how she may react. My suspicion is that you already know what you should do.

I sincerely hope you decide wisely.

[Edited by whispersecret on 10-26-2000 at 10:25 PM]
 
A tough one

I recognise what you mean about keeping it hidden from your wife. It was like this with my first wife. Not the cybersex but not being able to express sensual desires and fantasies openly with one another. It was like a wall that you could peer over rather than strut through the gate to the other side. Whether cybersex is "cheating" or not is one thing, but I think it really suggests that communication of fantasties and special desires could be better.

This all changed when I met and married Closet Desire-able. Suddenly there were no barriers to what we could share or talk about. Everything was fair game including fears and turn offs, past lovers etc. It was a different world.

If you already have a good relationship with your wife and you are friends then maybe you should try to add a more intimate angle to your relationship, one that includes the fantasies you indulge in on line. You might be surprised to find that when it is open and she feels free (you too) to express her hidden desires that it is no longer a threat, but a shared experience.

Obviously I don't know anything about you so I could be wide of the mark. This has been my experience. BTW Closet Desire-able and I do participate in the forums as well as co-author books of erotica, BUT we do not engage in one-to-one cybersex or respond to any of those "hey babe can I fuck you in the ass" sort of messages. So we do have some boundaries for what belongs to us alone and what we are willing to share with others.

Good luck resolving your dilemma.

CD
 
Re: A tough one

Closet Desire said:
BTW Closet Desire-able and I do participate in the forums as well as co-author books of erotica, BUT we do not engage in one-to-one cybersex or respond to any of those "hey babe can I fuck you in the ass" sort of messages. So we do have some boundaries for what belongs to us alone and what we are willing to share with others.
CD

But we have engaged in cybersex with each other CD - or have you forgotten?!!

Sam - have you thought about using email rather than a forum to start sharing with your wife? I know that it was easier for me to write about my fantasies at first than to share them face to face, even with my desirable CD. We both did huge amounts of writing behind the safety of email. It meant we could think about what we were writing as well as what we had read - no instant responses which we might regret later.

I'm afraid I agree that if you are sharing your sexuality and sensuality online with others then you are missing out on sharing it with your partner. We only keep secrets when we think someone else will disapprove or even stop us from doing whatever it is.

The real dilemna might be whether you and your partner are sexually tuned in to each other or whether you have to come to some arrangement where you both acknowledged you have needs which are met elsewhere in cybersex.

Good luck Sam - I've been in your shoes having fantasies and needs not shared by a partner.
 
You silly man

I’ve known “Sam” for 30 years and have been married to him for nearly 26, and you just saw a demonstration of his worst fault. He hates to hurt anyone, and over-reacts when he thinks that he has. I am not hurt in any way. I’ve read the stories that he has played in, and I am glad that he had such a good time, and was able to help others enjoy themselves also. There once was a time when it would have been me dragging him into those stories, but for several years now my libido has been decreasing. I just don’t think that I’ll be interested. But I do hope that everyone continues to enjoy each other, and take care of my man.

He is the gentlest soul that I know, but never think that he is weak, or simple. His other shortcoming is that he is extremely loyal. Don’t mess with his friends or family.
 
Now you know why Ilove her so much. It hasn't been an easy three decades, but it has usally been fun. A few details to attend to:
Wolfie, what I did tell her that I didn't think that she was aware of what I did on the boards, and that I felt that I was keeping something from her. So I opened up the SRPG threads that I have particepated in, and let her read them.
Cheri & Countess, I went for the Whole Hog.
Whisper, I've never considered wiether I have a conventual or unconventual marriage. We've just 'done our thing', it is a sacremental marriage. It is also what I understand an open marriage to be. In the last few years she has developed arthritius in her hips,and the pain meds in the strengh that provides relief, is robing her of her libido. A classic catch 22. If she is in the mood for sex, she hurts too much; if the pain is under controll, she isn't interested. She will go through the motions for my sake, but I feel like I'm making love to someone trying to be her. Yeach!
The ClosetDesires, Hearing from a couple was so helpful, it brought a fresh perpective to the problem.


Thank you all for your love and thoughtful replys. They were all very helpful, and as you see, I guess Cheri was right, there really was no problem, except between Samuari's ears.

[Edited by Samuari on 10-27-2000 at 04:16 PM]
 
See? There ya go. Another happy couple who is totally fine with it. I guess I'm just married to a stick in the mud.
 
Whispersecret said:
See? There ya go. Another happy couple who is totally fine with it. I guess I'm just married to a stick in the mud.

I'm just glad your "stick in the mud" is ok with you being here. I really think a lot of you, and am glad you are here.
 
Well, my goodness, y'all, this turned out neatly and sweetly...

Madam Samuari, I am saddened to hear of your physical ailments. You are a gracious lady.

Samuari, thunks on the head to you--evidently, you should have done this sooner. *wink* And both of you, thank you for sharing...

CD and Cd-able, glad to know of another couple here on the boards. My "main squeeze" and I have enjoyed ourselves here immensely. We have had fun stretching our creative abilities and sharing old and new fantasies with each other.

Literotica...we're an odd little community, aren't we....
 
Samuari:

Glad to see you clear up your delimma. As Whispersecret stated in her post, I would have to agree, without being open about what you are doing here, it could indeed be considered cheating. How very thoughtful of you to become mindful of this aspect, and include your lovely wife.

Being happily single myself, I don't run this risk. But if I were involved with a lover, I have to say, they would know what I'm doing here.

Take care, and I'll see you in the threads.

- Moon
 
Samauri, Geez. I am going to miss you if you decide to stop writing, we write well together. Do what you gotta do, and good luck.

I just want you to know that this writing is practice for me. Writing is what I do, it is who I am. My poetry is sensual, erotic. The books I am writing are thrillers. I am a published poet, not as an author, yet....This site is good for me, I enjoy it, it gets my creative juices flowing, as well as other juices...

As for cheating? I don't agree that this is cheating. It is not much different from a guy of girl writing a letter to Playboy, playgirl,penthouse or any other mag. out there talking about fantasy. My boyfriend knows I write here, and sometimes shows interest in what fantasy I am playing out via cyber space. When he doesn't want to know, he doesn't ask. He knows I want only his arms around me, his lips on mine. He has a collection of Playboy that stretches over 20 years....He just isn't as literal as I am...

I loved writing with you Samauri, I will still be here when you come back.
 
Ever hear of guilt???!!!

It can kill you especially if you love your relationship and your self. Notice that I have not alluded to your spouse? See, guilt is all about you and your feelings.

I have as good a relationship as I ever had with Dr. blue. Its based on who were are, today. That's why we don't live together. But we are still monogamous.

When I initially told her of my involvement here she became very concerned that I was going to become heavily involved with cyber-sex. I found out that it wasn't for me because I felt it was not a positive thing. I told her that and stopped. Had nothing to do with her. It was all about me!! And I am very comfortable with my decision. Makes my life a whole lot less complicated.

I just got done spending a lovely weekend with Dr. blue. We are back in our respective homes. Let me tell you about heaven, on earth.


blue
 
OOC: as you saw

She wants me to keep writing. It is one way that she keeps particapateing in our sex life. I just wish that I was better. Thanks for the suport. It means more than you know.

[Edited by Samuari on 10-29-2000 at 05:23 PM]
 
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