Did you know?

[kbate]

Any guess on what ONE Harrier costs?

$0, you cannot purchase one, they are no longer built.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

$0, you cannot purchase one, they are no longer built.

Oh my Dear Girl, if you were a student of Pawn Stars, then you know the price actually just went up...





Program cost US$6.5 billion (1987)[5]
Unit cost US$24–30 million[6]

 

[kbate]

Oh my Dear Girl, if you were a student of Pawn Stars, then you know the price actually just went up...

Program cost US$6.5 billion (1987)[5]
Unit cost US$24–30 million[6]

Yes, it did. However, since they cannot be replaced except by stripping another squadron - the price is essentially $0.

Really the best thing would be for the Marines to get out of the fixed wing business anyway. The idea that the Marines should be a "stand-alone" force is overdue for review. After these wars, it is probably time to do away with the Marines and roll the ground force into the Army and the air-wing into the Airforce or Navy as fits.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

As the death toll hits 2000 to extraordinarily muted fanfare...

New Rules of Engagement in Afghanistan
Greg Richards, The American Thinker
(disclaimer: This is not being reported in the MSM, so it is probably a racist lie.)

There is a disturbing letter from one of our soldiers in Afghanistan to his father published on the website of the estimable Michael Yon.

The exact timing of the letter is not clear, but it is apparently very recent. The date on the website is September 26. It is a cri de coeur about our new rules of engagement following the recent green on blue attacks - i.e., the attacks by Afghans we are training on our own soldiers. It's probably best to let the soldier speak for himself:

"I am fed up. I cannot believe the lack of attention the recent changes in this war is receiving by the media or the country. I think I saw one thing on CNN about the following subject, but I had to dig extensively to find it. The purpose of this letter is to let you know of the garbage that our soldiers are going through right now. With this knowledge, I hope that you take action by writing your congressmen."

(snip)

"...because of this massive change in policy (and complete change in mission) all U.S. forces are forbidden to actively patrol their AO (Area of Operations) and are to remain on their respective COPs/FOBs (Combat Outpost/Forward Operating Base). There are only a few exceptions to this rule and they all pertain to "hardening" highway 1 in our AO. We have received orders that clearly state that all CF (Coalition Forces) will no longer be allowed to drop air to ground munitions within the country of Afghanistan. This preempts Karzi's (sic) announcement that will be made shortly that states the above mentioned order, making it a tactical directive that he is ordering."

The letter appears to say that a significant element of our combat air support - dropping ordnance on the bad guys - is being discontinued!

We do not get much reporting in the MSM from Afghanistan. They want the war to disappear between now and the election. However, this letter suggests that we have made a major shift in both strategy and tactics, and not to the benefit of the fighting men on the ground.

Although the letter is undated, the only point in Michael Yon's publishing it is if it were pertinent to current operations. There is a lot more in the letter. Read the whole thing.

http://www.michaelyon-online.com/americas-dumbest-war-ever.htm

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

Yes, it did. However, since they cannot be replaced except by stripping another squadron - the price is essentially $0.

Really the best thing would be for the Marines to get out of the fixed wing business anyway. The idea that the Marines should be a "stand-alone" force is overdue for review. After these wars, it is probably time to do away with the Marines and roll the ground force into the Army and the air-wing into the Airforce or Navy as fits.

CUNT!


Subversive!


The Marines would embarrASS the Army into quitting. They are the BEST part of the Navy.



The Marines had to have their own air wing because when the Navy and the Army actually could be prodded out of the own self-interests to provide some air cover, they usually bombed THE FUCKING MARINES!!!

 

[kbate]

The Marines had to have their own air wing because when the Navy and the Army actually could be prodded out of the own self-interests to provide some air cover, they usually bombed THE FUCKING MARINES!!!

That was then, this is now. The marines will never storm another beach, land on an island or be isolated from air-cover again. They are only included in Afghanistan because they had to be or the commandant couldn't justify his force's existence. They do look nice at Arlington though, so perhaps that company could remain active, along with the MSG force for the embassies.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

That was then, this is now. The marines will never storm another beach, land on an island or be isolated from air-cover again. They are only included in Afghanistan because they had to be or the commandant couldn't justify his force's existence. They do look nice at Arlington though, so perhaps that company could remain active, along with the MSG force for the embassies.

That is total bullshit.

They will cross the Potomac in the dead of night and liberate us from our occupiers!

A nation without Marines soon ceases to be a nation. Even the Swiss have them!!!

 

[kbate]

That is total bullshit.

They will cross the Potomac in the dead of night and liberate us from our occupiers!

A nation without Marines soon ceases to be a nation. Even the Swiss have them!!!

They're going to swim over to the Maryland side? They'd never make it up 95 from Quantico to DC - but if they 'tank-pooled' they could use the commuter lane and get as far as the pentagon.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

They're going to swim over to the Maryland side? They'd never make it up 95 from Quantico to DC - but if they 'tank-pooled' they could use the commuter lane and get as far as the pentagon.

They will fly up from Cherry Point and Humvee from Camp Lejeune...

 

[kbate]

They will fly up from Cherry Point and Humvee from Camp Lejeune...

Let's face it. Marines were a great idea when we had to sail places and land under fire, but today - they are an anachronism trying to maintain a 240 year tradition - just because there is a 240 year tradition.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

Let's face it. Marines were a great idea when we had to sail places and land under fire, but today - they are an anachronism trying to maintain a 240 year tradition - just because there is a 240 year tradition.

Bullshit!


Go Tell it to the Marines!


Funny how you wish to disassemble all Tradition!


Maybe we should end traditions like fees speech, assembly and religion too!


Imagine!

 

[kbate]

Bullshit!


Go Tell it to the Marines!


Funny how you wish to disassemble all Tradition!


Maybe we should end traditions like fees speech, assembly and religion too!


Imagine!

No, not those. Just the Marines.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

No, not those. Just the Marines.

When the Marines are gone, you will be put in a Burka!



And issued a husband!!!

 

[Johnny_Ray_Wilson]

Let's face it. Marines were a great idea when we had to sail places and land under fire, but today - they are an anachronism trying to maintain a 240 year tradition - just because there is a 240 year tradition.

kbate, I respectfully disagree w/you. I was in the Navy on submarines. The Marines ultimately fall under the control and authority of the USN. More than a few times, the Marines were assigned to protect us for various reasons. I sincerely appreciate those times they were there to cover our ass in hostile situations from the shore when were docked or in 'non-submersible' waters. Several times, it was our job to provide them with considerable firepower and cover their ass as well. Fortunately, we never had to launch those weapons to support them.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

kbate, I respectfully disagree w/you. I was in the Navy on submarines. The Marines ultimately fall under the control and authority of the USN. More than a few times, the Marines were assigned to protect us for various reasons. I sincerely appreciate those times they were there to cover our ass in hostile situations from the shore when were docked or in 'non-submersible' waters. Several times, it was our job to provide them with considerable firepower and cover their ass as well. Fortunately, we never had to launch those weapons to support them.

Plus Marines are notoriously good tippers. Oh TAXI!

 

[kbate]

kbate, I respectfully disagree w/you. I was in the Navy on submarines. The Marines ultimately fall under the control and authority of the USN. More than a few times, the Marines were assigned to protect us for various reasons. I sincerely appreciate those times they were there to cover our ass in hostile situations from the shore when were docked or in 'non-submersible' waters. Several times, it was our job to provide them with considerable firepower and cover their ass as well. Fortunately, we never had to launch those weapons to support them.

How does that prove that we need a 200,000 man marine corps, with their own armour, own fixed and own rotary winged aircraft?

 

[Johnny_Ray_Wilson]

Plus Marines are notoriously good tippers. Oh TAXI!

Times may have changed, but I can honestly say Marine Shore Patrol 'escorted' me and a few other plastered sailors out of several bars back in the day. Just about the time the locals were going kick our ass. (We were outnumbered, considerably, but a young, drunk, cocky submariner doesn't care about that shit)

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

How does that prove that we need a 200,000 man marine corps, with their own armour, own fixed and own rotary winged aircraft?

How can you prove that there will never be a need for those things?

All you have is conjecture and all the Marines have is a tradition of success and knowing how to accomplish the task assigned to them.

I hate to say it, but you're in some ways like merc who obviously had no idea the number of these aging aircraft the Marines had in a squadron he was thinking triple-digits from the way he was acting; but notice how quietly he slunk off...

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

Times may have changed, but I can honestly say Marine Shore Patrol 'escorted' me and a few other plastered sailors out of several bars back in the day. Just about the time the locals were going kick our ass. (We were outnumbered, considerably, but a young, drunk, cocky submariner doesn't care about that shit)

Our Marine MPs had no problem putting me in the brig...

 

[kbate]

How can you prove that there will never be a need for those things?

All you have is conjecture and all the Marines have is a tradition of success and knowing how to accomplish the task assigned to them.

I hate to say it, but you're in some ways like merc who obviously had no idea the number of these aging aircraft the Marines had in a squadron he was thinking triple-digits from the way he was acting; but notice how quietly he slunk off...

Non-Responsive, circular logic and ad hominem all in one post. Well done Marine.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

Non-Responsive, circular logic and ad hominem all in one post. Well done Marine.

Well, can you prove your contention?

I do not think so.

 

[RobDownSouth]

There they go again!
http://i1239.photobucket.com/albums/ff502/Soonyigump/kbate_gump_zpsf0d58444.jpg

 

[kbate]

Well, can you prove your contention?

I do not think so.

I do not have to prove that I think we can do without a Marine Corps. If we have to storm a beach, is it in any way possible to do that without a dedicated Marine Crops?

You see, the burden of proof falls on those who state that the Marine Copse is indispensable. You must be able to demonstrate a function that cannot be performed by any other force. If their mission of sea-based assault is so critical, why are we wasting them in Afghanistan?

All you have said so far, is that because we've always had Marines, we should always have them. Strong proof that.

 

[Johnny_Ray_Wilson]

How does that prove that we need a 200,000 man marine corps, with their own armour, own fixed and own rotary winged aircraft?

I know Liberals only want Marines there when needed; but want to shit on them or discard them in peace time. Yet, cannot comprehend why the Marines, or any other branch of service, is not there after they are removed away.

So you have a specific objective in mind? And you do not think that if you are placed into a strange place with strangers shooting at you that you don't need armour? You don't want someone above you who can see the enemy better than you?

I cannot give you a satisfactory answer. It would lead to more questions from those against the military. Do some research on them, talk to POSITIVE people who have served with them, etc..

No matter how you think of them, or any other military branch, they are indeed needed to protect the rights we have now. It never ceases to amaze me how often FREE Americans want to discard the ones that ensure their freedom.

Bottom line is, they are basically a political tool used to fight your battles for you against a perceived enemy. And when you take them away, they cannot be there for you.

When your ass is in a sling and about to die, that will be the moment where you realize you made a mistake in your decision to support their 'disbandment'. At that point, it will be to late.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

Who here honestly thinks that we will never put boots on the ground again, so we don't need an army at all! and if we do, we can just use the SEALs...

The Marines are a Rapidly Deployable Force.

By the time we get there, by design, the Army is still drafting the paperwork to begin moving, which is why we have to take our own support with us. Now the argument can be made that they are being wasted in Afghanistan, but Marines tend to get pissy when left out of a fight...

The Army tends to get pissy when it is deployed too long since it has become a jobs corp for families and pared down to the point where it is mainly a lot of National Guard units being fielded.

And it is not ad hominem to suggest that when it comes to the military you do not know shit from shinola...

If you got rid of the Marines, the army would have to duplicate the Navy's new work in recreating what we already had.