Advice on Loving Wives

[NoTalentHack]

Shows you never read enough stories there to have an idea. The main idea is CHEATING is what is hated, not women. The man who forced the or seduced or simply was available but knew the woman was married is targeted as well. The idea is justice is somehow delivered. Kids, courts, etc complicate the plots.

Yup, Cold Range by @Constories hit a lot of the same beats (admittedly very, very well) that “revenge on cheating wife” stories do, except it was a wife getting revenge on her husband and her best friend; it got a very solid 4.52 last I checked. They hate cheaters, not women. Well, no more than the rest of Literotica, anyways.

 

[Gamblnluck]

’ll keep your advice in mind. I was going to leave it open-ended for the FMC and her husband, but yeah, certain readers might not be into that.

Nope, that is the absolute WRONG thing to do. You will get flamed and told to 'finish the damn story"

 

[Gamblnluck]

Thx Gamblnluck. I’ll keep your advice in mind. I was going to leave it open-ended for the FMC and her husband, but yeah, certain readers might not be into that.

Regarding morality of the MMC- yeah, he’s a man of honor who goes to swinger resorts. The MMC is also a former manager of such a resort himself and he’s looking into partnership with the owner of the new resort, he’s enjoyed both polyamorous and monogamous relationships. His morality is… complicated. It’s enough for the FMC to be tempted by him as a Casanova figure and for him to accept her as sleeping with him because her marriage is in trouble. But once he learns she doesn’t want it to be in trouble… he advises her to go work things out with her husband and accept what they have as the fling it is.

So he is gonna be part of the problem. He is facilitating her cheating and then suggest she go home because of what she wants. That is certainly not gonna fly. She might accept what they had as a fling, but neither her husband nor the readers would accept that. She gets her cake and eats it too and her poor hubby sitting at home is the one screwed over.

 

[NoTalentHack]

You're showing a woman as being a bad person you will receive cheers and accolades from all the woman haters...so pretty much most of the category.
Now ask yourself if those are the fans you want. I'd rather get a 2.5 and a ton of abuse than a five from that crowd.

3...2....1 for NTH to come running in defending his favorite category and people.

Who was up whose butt again, LC? Oh, that’s right, you deleted that post because it was an absolute self-own.

Aaaanyways. To get back to the original point, LW will get you a lot of readers, but they may or may not like your other stuff. Some of them WILL go and rampage through your current works and downstate them; I know a bunch of my less-vanilla stuff has suffered from that.

But if you write well, you can find a niche anywhere among the broad swathe of interests. Frankly, the place could use a few more people that do nuanced takes on interesting storylines.

 

[NoTalentHack]

So he is gonna be part of the problem. He is facilitating her cheating and then suggest she go home because of what she wants. That is certainly not gonna fly. She might accept what they had as a fling, but neither her husband nor the readers would accept that. She gets her cake and eats it too and her poor hubby sitting at home is the one screwed over.

He could, however do a sort of “baton-pass” storyline. The first story is the one described. The next is the wife traveling home, trying to decide what to do, and ultimately choosing to confess. The next (final?) could be the husband making his choice. Could be very compelling.

 

[lovecraft68]

Ring the bell, they all come running.

 

[NoTalentHack]

Ring the bell, they all come running.

Wow, you mean when someone asks advice on something other writers are knowledgeable about, they give it? Shocking. Maybe try that instead of trolling, self-owning, and puffing yourself up. Or do we get to hear again what a tough guy you are, one from the school of hard knocks that knows that… blah blah blah.

Oh shit, I just realized! You’re an LW protagonist!

 

[Gamblnluck]

Yup, Cold Range by @Constories hit a lot of the same beats (admittedly very, dry well) that “revenge on cheating wife” stories do, except it was a wife getting revenge on her husband and her best friend; it got a very solid 4.52 last I checked. They hate cheaters, not women. Well, no more than the rest of Literotica, anyways.

An excellent story told from a woman's point of view. At first the plot seems muddled (deliberately), then all becomes clear. An example of an excellent plot with a bit of angst introduced to spice it up.

 

[Gamblnluck]

Most certainly, yes. I do most of my reading in LW and I have a couple stories I've written there as well.

My experience is that the trolls and haters will be out in force upon initial release of the story. Once the story isn't being shown in the new stories list, the negativity will slow down. From there, most of the people who read the story will be the ones who are looking for it and want to read the kind of story you've written.

Ratings-wise, both of my LW stories started around 2.5 - 3 stars. They have both risen to about 4.5 since. A lot of the negative comments come mostly in the beginning. If you want to stem the tide, you can change your settings to not allow anonymous comments.

LW is a cesspool, but if you're willing to wade through the muck, it can be rewarding to write there.

I think your saving grace was the story you wrote was well written. Many early readers left as soon as you said you husband character had cuckold fetishes. Often people come back to see how it went despite it not being what they'd like to read. Especially if they see ratings are good. I noticed you really did not finish the story plot. Was the wife willing to let the new neighbor impregnate her instead of her husband who she was so happy with early on? Would the husband's cuckold fantasy go that far? I 'squicked' a little. Mainly because I really cannot wrap my mind around letting the woman I love fuck others. I cannot consider it just her getting pleasure from a live sex toy rather than one made of latex. But you pulled it off. write more stories.

 

[AchtungNight]

Ok, this is already becoming a troll feeding frenzy. Thx again for everyone’s input. I will back out now and think about what it is best I do.

 

[Gamblnluck]

He could, however do a sort of “baton-pass” storyline. The first story is the one destined. The next is the wife traveling home, trying to decide what yo do, and ultimately choosing yo confess. The next (final?) could be the husband making his choice. Could be very compelling.

If done right, yes. A well done plot would great.

 

[Cagivagurl]

I want to challenge myself by venturing into that dreaded morass at least once. Before I do it, I have some questions.

The story involves an entertainment mogul who used to sleep around with a host of women- some celebrity and some otherwise. Now he’s been rendered involuntary celibate by depression over a divorce, business challenges, and the Covid pandemic. On impulse he reconnects with a childhood crush once the pandemic ends. She’s all grown up now and very beautiful, on vacation alone at the same Lake Tahoe resort as him. He treats her to dinner, they reconnect, she’s a skilled corporate lawyer that can help with his business woes. They also share chuckles over his crush- he said he would marry her, should they stay together, but circumstances separated them- and the fact that he is now an epic Casanova type while she barely remembers knowing him. On impulse, they have a one night affair. He dumps her the next morning when he overhears her telling her actual husband about it by phone call. He didn’t know about her cheating till then.

Are the local trolls going to slam me for this? If so, I will shrug and post in Erotic Couplings or another category instead. Recommendations appreciated.

The most important question is....
Does the story belong in LW?
If the answer is yes, then post in LW...
You do have to ask what you want... A high score, or three times more readers than you would otherwise get.
Posting a story in LW is an interesting exercise, and I recommend it.
What you will need is a thick skin. You will get some scathing nasty comments, but will open your talent to far more readers than EC, at least three times as many.
If you want high scores, but lower reader numbers. Post in EC.

LW has a small but vocal misogynistic element, and they will hate on and down vote any story where the woman is not burnt at the stake. It doesn't matter whether she was innocent or not. If she goes on to live a happy life, the BTB crowd will down vote, and comment viciously...
I speak from experience. My stories mostly focus on reconciliation, which the BTB crowd hate....
If you like your story, then do it.

Cagivagurl

 

[Lifestyle66]

I want to challenge myself by venturing into that dreaded morass at least once. Before I do it, I have some questions.

The story involves an entertainment mogul who used to sleep around with a host of women- some celebrity and some otherwise. Now he’s been rendered involuntary celibate by depression over a divorce, business challenges, and the Covid pandemic. On impulse he reconnects with a childhood crush once the pandemic ends. She’s all grown up now and very beautiful, on vacation alone at the same Lake Tahoe resort as him. He treats her to dinner, they reconnect, she’s a skilled corporate lawyer that can help with his business woes. They also share chuckles over his crush- he said he would marry her, should they stay together, but circumstances separated them- and the fact that he is now an epic Casanova type while she barely remembers knowing him. On impulse, they have a one night affair. He dumps her the next morning when he overhears her telling her actual husband about it by phone call. He didn’t know about her cheating till then.

Are the local trolls going to slam me for this? If so, I will shrug and post in Erotic Couplings or another category instead. Recommendations appreciated.

I read a lot of Loving Wives stories and half of mine are in LW (swingers, which Trolls hate).

Your story of the other guy having fun with the cheating wife goes rather well with the LW trolls. What they really hate is if the husband says he's OK with sharing, or the husband doesn't burn the bitch when he finds out.

So, their anger is focused on the husbands and their reaction to their cheating wife

 

[gunhilltrain]

Shows you never read enough stories there to have an idea. The main idea is CHEATING is what is hated, not women. The man who forced the or seduced or simply was available but knew the woman was married is targeted as well. The idea is justice is somehow delivered. Kids, courts, etc complicate the plots.

I wonder how many dozens, hundreds of times LW has been discussed here in the last twenty years? I could look at the tags portal for some clues.

My assessment is that the complainers over there dislike both the cheating and the women involved. I haven't studied that section enough to figure out if having a man initiate the act makes a difference. (Anybody know?) I should also check the tags to see how divorce is used as a plot device. I'd guess it's not common here.

 

[AchtungNight]

I read a lot of Loving Wives stories and half of mine are in LW (swingers, which Trolls hate).

You story of the other guy having fun with the cheating wife goes rather well with the KW trolls. What they really hate is if the husband says he's OK with sharing, our the husband doesn't burn the bitch when he finds out.

So, their anger is focused on the husbands and their reaction to their cheating wife

Well, I’m definitely not into “btb” stuff. Based on that, I’m probably better off staying out of LW. Thx.

 

[Lifestyle66]

I wonder how many dozens, hundreds of times LW has been discussed here in the last twenty years? I could look at the tags portal for some clues.

My assessment is that the complainers over there dislike both the cheating and the women involved. I haven't studied that section enough to figure out if having a man initiate the act makes a difference. (Anybody know?) I should also check the tags to see how divorce is used as a plot device. I'd guess it's not common here.

I've read LW stories written from the lover/bull/other guy's first-person POV, when he's having fun with a cheating wife.

The majority of LW 1-bombers hate cheating, sharing, or any extra-marital sex which the innocent spouse accepts or tolerates. With a shared or cheating wife, they want the husband to "grow a pair" and get some kind of revenge. And they consider a civilized divorce with an even split of assets as a wimp's response. The cheater must suffer something more than that.

In my own BTB-lite LW story, "What Were You Thinking?", the swinger couple wife breaks their rules by concealing from her husband that she wanted a weekend hall pass with a swinger guy she fucked before at a party, right beside her husband. When the husband finds out about her weekend without him present, he says she set the new standard. He separates their bank accounts (in case she wants a divorce) so he'll have his own retirement plan growing faster than hers, and that he will now fuck other women without his wife's permission. That story is rated 3.32 (after 1-scrapings), with 1,150 votes and 78.9k views. It started on day one with 1.84 and during the first week published barely rising above a 2.0.

EDIT: BTW, I post to LW now and fine tune my stories to study their reactions in both ratings and comments. I find it entertaining and educational to see how people think. That's why I wrote that story and the follow-on " What Were You Thinking? - Therapy" to see how they might take a reasonable response to cheating. (Therapy is at 3.1 with 299 votes and over 16K views.)

 

[Lifestyle66]

Beside my take on the cheating wife I described above with my BTB-lite story, my latest posting to LW was the swinger couple having a wife-sharing threesome ("A Dare at the Nude Resort".)

I wrote this one to show the husband getting everything he could want from his wife (with regards to sex), and the husband encouraging her to fulfill a fantasy he knew she wanted with the other guy. That story has done surprisingly well in LW rated at 3.84 with 173 votes and 19.8K views.

Either the monogamous-only trolls are becoming little more tolerant, or my writing is getting better. (I'm betting the former.)

 

[lc69hunter]

Out of curiousity, I have dm'd and engaged with several of the more vociferous haters in that genre, asking why, if they hate this so much, why do they read them. I was surprised by some of the answers, as I assumed that they were here for some other kink also.

There were several who told me they were here for one thing and one thing only. Cheating wives, betrayal, and proper retribution, and had no other interests on the site. Based upon that answer, I must assume that many of the anonymous posters are here for the very same reason, and we just have to live with it.

I think it is a very twisted way of thinking, but then who am I to say what is twisted and what is not, as we are all here because we are twisted in one way or another

 

[SimonDoom]

Out of curiousity, I have dm'd and engaged with several of the more vociferous haters in that genre, asking why, if they hate this so much, why do they read them. I was surprised by some of the answers, as I assumed that they were here for some other kink also.

There were several who told me they were here for one thing and one thing only. Cheating wives, betrayal, and proper retribution, and had no other interests on the site. Based upon that answer, I must assume that many of the anonymous posters are here for the very same reason, and we just have to live with it.

I think it is a very twisted way of thinking, but then who am I to say what is twisted and what is not, as we are all here because we are twisted in one way or another

That's very interesting. It seems like there's a lot of material there for someone to work with if they have the interest. It could be an interesting psychology paper.

To me, there's nothing erotic about these stories, so it's fascinating to me that people flock to Literotica to read them, and to read nothing else.

 

[MillieDynamite]

Well, yes, and they live for the ones that don't meet their expectations to vent their frustrations. I get that, always understood that part and it is best to let the vitriol roll off like water on a duck.

Out of curiousity, I have dm'd and engaged with several of the more vociferous haters in that genre, asking why, if they hate this so much, why do they read them. I was surprised by some of the answers, as I assumed that they were here for some other kink also.

There were several who told me they were here for one thing and one thing only. Cheating wives, betrayal, and proper retribution, and had no other interests on the site. Based upon that answer, I must assume that many of the anonymous posters are here for the very same reason, and we just have to live with it.

I think it is a very twisted way of thinking, but then who am I to say what is twisted and what is not, as we are all here because we are twisted in one way or another

 

[NoTalentHack]

That's very interesting. It seems like there's a lot of material there for someone to work with if they have the interest. It could be an interesting psychology paper.

To me, there's nothing erotic about these stories, so it's fascinating to me that people flock to Literotica to read them, and to read nothing else.

It’s because there’s not really another major site that has these stories. ASSTR has a few, but this is THE site for stories where a wife cheats and a husband reacts in a way other than “well, it’s hot, so I guess I’ll let it go.”

I have a theory why. I’ll probably expand on it in my essay for Lit 25, but basically it goes like this:

* In real life, man gets divorced or maybe even just breaks up with a longtime girlfriend. Could be because of cheating, communications, whatever, but he feels aggrieved, rightly or wrongly.
* He gets lonely and horny and goes to Literotica for relief.
* For whatever reason, he makes his way to LW. Lots of possible reasons, but the most obvious is that he’s just looking at the “new” page, since that’s apparently the big funnel everywhere.
* He finds a divorce drama story, and it’s everything his divorce wasn’t: the wife was wholly at fault or she’s remorseful or the guy manages to get out without getting taken to the cleaners or whatever. It’s his fantasy; not an erotic one, but a fantasy nonetheless.
* Different paths from here. Some guys leave the site after a while because they make a new life and don’t need the fantasy. Some stay but due to age or a new relationship or whatever, they don’t have the interest in erotica , but still like this particular type of drama. Some keep reading “normally” and hit LW as well as other stuff. And some move away from the divorce drama as they find it stops making them as happy, moving onto Romance or EC or whatever.

I’ve had conversations with representative members of each of those groups, and the through line for them is pretty much as listed above. There are readers who use the stories to help make sense of what happened to them years or decades before, too; one frequent commenter talks about his divorce that happened when he was in his late 30s, and he’s in his 80s now. This stuff just really wasn’t talked about as much fifty years ago, at least not with any real nuance.

There are divorce drama stories elsewhere on the internet, but most of them are very female-focused. They’re from the woman’s POV, or the husband is a villain, or the stories’ focus/plot driver is the husband’s flaws, rather than the wife’s infidelity. LW is the only place I know on the internet where these issues are discussed from the husband’s viewpoint (in fiction, at least) in this volume.

That said, a lot of it is talked about inartfully, or in contexts that are stereotypically “male.” Revenge stories, barely-interrogated emotion, performative displays of masculinity, etc. A lot of is very surface-level. I honestly think that’s why I’ve done as well as I’ve done there, because I try to talk about something besides the divorce and drama: the nature of vows in a modern context, rebuilding trust, obsession with virtue, the intersection of modern technology and social media with the process of rebuilding, etc.

Well, that and dogs ripping out the throat of an affair partner. But that was the Hammered story.

 

[Gamblnluck]

Beside my take on the cheating wife I described above with my BTB-lite story, my latest posting to LW was the swinger couple having a wife-sharing threesome ("A Dare at the Nude Resort".)

I wrote this one to show the husband getting everything he could want from his wife (with regards to sex), and the husband encouraging her to fulfill a fantasy he knew she wanted with the other guy. That story has done surprisingly well in LW rated at 3.84 with 173 votes and 19.8K views.

Your two stories were far apart. Yeah, I read the second and did like that both husband and wife were into playing around. Dare at the resort.The husband enjoyed (secretly) watching his wife mess around and dared her to do it. She watched him with others. The thing is there was HONESTY in the relationship. I'm sure there are those who feel that any sex outside of marriage is wrong, cheating etc and that lowered your score a tad. But 3.84 is NOT a bad rating.

In your other story, however, the wife was a bitch. While they both had lovers and sex with others, they had rules. The wife broke them. She cheated because she went to the cabin without her husband under false pretenses for a tryst with her lover. Then she compounded that by lying her ass off at first and then getting angry when her husband told her how he found out. Trail cameras he installed at her suggestion and insistence. She was pretty unrepentant. She was more concerned when he insisted they separate financial lives than anything else. The revenge? He screwed the one woman his wife detested and NEVER wanted him to touch. You dropped the story where he was going to tell her or show her etc and left her reaction to reader's imagination. I did not read your followup yet.
You still do not understand what ticks off the readers. It is mainly, the wife trying to get over on their husbands. Here are some examples: 1. The possibility of kids sired by other men but raised by the husband is foreign to most men. It is accepted if you adopt a kid from the woman's previous relationship, but not have it foisted on him by her getting pregnant.
2. Similar to the first, the weak ass hubby says 'Yes ma'am' and allows her to get pregnant by whoever and even participates to some degree by either facilitating the affair or doing nothing to stop or end it.
3. The wife unilaterally tells the hubby she is going to screw around and he can accept it or get crucified in court. And often at the same time telling him he will NOT engage in sex outside the marriage, or else.
4. The wife tells the hubby it is a one time thing to make her feel good and she will make it up to him. The idea here is her idea of how to make it up is hot sex where she still benefits. It cannot make up for his angst of having her throw it in his face. He'll feel like an ass if he lets her get away with it, but she never understands that as it was 'only sex'.
These are just a few examples of how the base readership feels. They look at the cheating as not just an act of sex, but a trouncing of his feelings, his manhood. It is a violation of his trust. That is a real thing for many. A story that evokes the emotions of the readers and then gives him a satisfactory resolution of those feelings is going to score high. THAT is far more important than the sex scenes or jerk off fodder as I like to view it.

 

[MillieDynamite]

I have a series of stories for sale featuring a couple, Sam and Kim, and it covers their sexual escapades. It's well into the series before the reader discovers Sam's job is as an escort. But he and his wife have fun with other women together. I have one of the stories here, Happy Birthday, Darling, which has been well received. Sam arranges for Kim and him to have a rendezvous with two strippers for her birthday. I didn't put in Loving Wives, first, it'd be hated on, second, she isn't a cheating wife, and she doesn't mind his conquest (either personal or professional). They quite often party together. And his gigolo life isn't covered only mentioned.

 

[Gamblnluck]

Out of curiousity, I have dm'd and engaged with several of the more vociferous haters in that genre, asking why, if they hate this so much, why do they read them. I was surprised by some of the answers, as I assumed that they were here for some other kink also.

I see you wrote some essays. I do not read those categories but will take a look after I write this. But asking a half dozen or so of the 'haters' is not gonna get you a decent response if you aren't reading into reading the stories as well. You assumed the sex scene thing was paramount. It is not. I have written several stories in LW. My latest got trounced because I did not stay 'true' to the female character as described. I thought I did. I just tried to write her rebuttal. Not a justification or excuse, but an explanation. It fell flat. The comments were almost universally scathing.
My first story submitted to Lit was on LW and did very well. Cajuns stick together. I tried to simply tell a story with a little humor, and a little pathos. You aren't going to please all factions. You get readers who honestly would love to watch their wives screw other men. Some even go so far as participate and lick their wife afterwards. At least in their imaginations. Personally, I find the very idea repulsive. I generally do not read enough of the story to judge it.

 

[Gamblnluck]

Out of curiousity, I have dm'd and engaged with several of the more vociferous haters in that genre, asking why, if they hate this so much, why do they read them. I was surprised by some of the answers, as I assumed that they were here for some other kink also.

OKAY, I read your essay, and will say it is full of crap. No wonder it was rated so low even in the essay category. I doubt it would have got 2 in LW. First of all, you claim cheating 'enhances' a marriage because it fires up the wife's libido. That is a common trope in the stories and is utter bullshit. If the husband finds out where all of a sudden his wife has got these new ideas, they are likely headed for divorce.
You get the cuckolded husband to suck learn how to deep throat so they might teach their future lovers? Again total crap. Most men would not hesitate to kick you out at the very suggestion.

Your 'essay' was nothing more than mildly covered fantasy. Sure you may have screwed some lonely wife while her husband was serving in the military overseas. I saw it happen often when I was in the Army an even before that with friends of my parents during Viet Nam. But if the returning soldier/sailor ever knew who you were, you might not be here right now.
During Desert Storm, I had a store. The wife of a friend came in and wrote several bad checks. She gave me 'collateral' to not file charges. When the guy returned, I found out how bad it really was. She had almost turned into a coke whore. He told me to keep the collateral as while it was worth far more than the money she got, it was small potatoes to how much she ruined him financially elsewhere. I asked if he was going after any of the guys and he laughed and said if he did, he'd be in jail forever for killing or maiming half the city. All he could do was declare bankruptcy which was hard to do back then while serving and drawing a paycheck. He finally managed it but he was left with his clothes and not much else for a while.