A thought about incest

[La damnee elle la licorne]

 

[CyranoJ]

Gianbattista, actually Lit's written-in-stone rule is this:

You may not post sexually explicit pictures or stories featuring anyone under 18 years old. Literotica does not allow the posting of underage or animal sex pictures - or links to such, or text/story posts/links to advocation thereof - on the forum.

It does not prohibit mentioning that child rape or abuse exists and is a bad and damaging thing. IMO Harold_Hill is twisting the rule in an attempt to shut you up.

Otherwise thanks for your interesting posts and insights. I hadn't really treated the question of intergenerational issues but it's definitely part of the picture.

 

[La damnee elle la licorne]

 

[Harold_Hill]

Gianbattista, actually Lit's written-in-stone rule is this:



It does not prohibit mentioning that child rape or abuse exists and is a bad and damaging thing. IMO Harold_Hill is twisting the rule in an attempt to shut you up.

Otherwise thanks for your interesting posts and insights. I hadn't really treated the question of intergenerational issues but it's definitely part of the picture.

That's no quite accurate either. If you post an age under 18, (related to any sexual subject), the moderator will remove the post. I'm not sure who the Fetish & Sexuality Central moderator is now, but if it is Chargergirl, she can and does regularly remove posts that refer to underage. I wasn't trying to shut up Gianbatista, but if we are going to have a discussion, let have it within the rules of the web site.

 

[Harold_Hill]

Thank you for explaining the rules, . I inadvertently transgressed and am grateful for direction so I do not do so again. I apologise for discomfort I may have caused by this transgression to other users and out hosts.


And please do feel free to directly address a polite correction directly to me, I will not take offence .

You didn't offend or cause any discomfort, but as I pointed out, we need to keep it an adult level, otherwise, we may run afoul of the moderators. And no one wants their posts removed. With that said, children cannot legally or emotionally give consent, but adults can. If an 18 year old women says no to sex, (with a relative or anyone else), and she is forced or coerced, it is rape. If the same women says yes, then she is old enough to know what she wants to do. If it is non-consensual sex, (rape), there are legal mechanisms in place to deal with the crime, and counseling available if needed. But if she consents to sex, (even if it is with a close relative), I think the law and the courts need to stay out of our bedrooms.

Whether or not incest is legal depends on the state. In some states, it is legal for first cousins to marry, and if memory serves, (and I am not completely sure), but I think in New Jersey it is legal for siblings to have sex. In most states, the law simply turns a blind eye to adult incest and ignores it. Unless it comes to light connected with another crime. Child incest is illegal and destructive, but adult incest is whatever the adults make it. As I have pointed out, this is an adult web site, and if two adults want to fantasize about incest, or even take it to real time, who are we to criticize.

Not trying to scold anyone, it's just my opinion.

 

[La damnee elle la licorne]

 

[Harold_Hill]

I will say this

As far as sexually oriented web sites go, Literotica is one of the better. They don't have many rules here, but the few they do have, they seem to be very strict about it. Perhaps it keeps the owners from running afoul of the law.

 

[La damnee elle la licorne]

 

[Harold_Hill]

Nor am I scolding. I am saying it is not the roses and rainbows in reality that it is painted as. And I believe I am not an odd soul. I know this because there is a network of 'people like us' but very few speak out because most are afraid of the shame and implication. This is the first time I have spoken about it so we here like this. Shrug. I'm doing a lot of first things on literotica.


Especially for fantasy there is no shame, I'd even say its probably natural. IMO people can fantasise whatever they want. With cream, fudge sauce and cherries on top. And fireworks. Good for them.

The view that no one over eighteen can be manipulated, or give sex consensually but without knowing what HE or she wants ( why assume this is a situation that happens only to women?) wants to do in ANY situation is somewhat bizarre to me.

If you tell someone you are going to sleep with that x is the case and x is the basis on which the consent and it turns out that y is the case then the consent is somewhat 'stolen' ( though I would not say the act was rape most certainly, I would say the sex was manipulative and thus the partner was not giving in a way they wanted to.

This is not particular at all to incest. It can relate to a plethora of sexual situations affairs, not taking the pill when you have told your boyfriend you are......both of are acts of non consent in some way. Sometimes to look at a situation I think it helps to abstract it and look from another situation. Its hard to put things you like and feel precious of under examination of. That doesn't mean its not necessary. For fantasy, its not necessary.

I agree, anyone can in a weak moment, be manipulated into something they would be better off not. But take this for example: If a 50 year old woman decided to go to bed with her 30 year old son, at 50, it is unlikely that she will get pregnant, and they are both old enough, (and known each other long enough), to know what they want, who would it hurt? And since they are old enough, and it doesn't harm anyone, (physically or emotionally), in any real sense, exactly how is it wrong?

 

[La damnee elle la licorne]

 

[Harold_Hill]

You are convinced it won't harm anyone emotionally. I am not so sure. Here rests the fundamental difference in our belief perhaps? I accept one can be happy at the time and then feel 'wrong' even 'violated' some years later.

This is not something they can walk away from like any other partner with no ties if some boundary is crossed. If / when other people / partners for either arrive on the scene there may well be emotional fall out.

This is my point. Sometimes people in incestuous relationships do have regrets, and do suffer emotional trauma, but the question is: is the emotional trauma caused by some unknown genetic or mental defect, or, are so called incest victims traumatized by prevailing social attitudes?

This point may sound silly on the surface, but it wasn't that many years ago that gays were traumatized by intolerant social attitudes. Gays were made to feel bad about themselves, and even forced into treatment programs to cure homosexuality. Today, homosexuality is more accepted socially/politically, and being so, gays usually feel good about themselves and don't see themselves as sexual deviates. There was no change in gay people, the only change was in social bias against gays.

I believe people involved in adult incest are traumatized by social bias, and not by some unknown mental defect that drives them to have sex with a family member. Perhaps we should be attacking social intolerance and not trying to victimize adults in incestuous relationships.

 

[La damnee elle la licorne]

 

[Harold_Hill]

I get your point, its been made many times on the thread, and why I responded.

I answered not about social bias in my last post, or any illegality , or even the bigger picture. Its about people and emotions. People involved in the situation. Real feelings and emotions and the pain and hurt they can cause in a very real situation.

Blood is thicker than water when you are trying to swim out of it too.

I appreciate your point of view and enjoyed the discussion. Discussions like this is a good way of learning about life and ourselves.

 

[bunny4med]

blah blah blah. I've been involved in a consensual relationship with my brother for over 13 years. it was entered into as a young adult. we live as husband and wife. we will not have children. other people will label us as incest. incest involves power, control, abuse, and non consent. none of that is in our relationship. we are as normal a "married" couple as any other. my husband is 11 months older than me and we share the same profession. we do not have any other family and moved away from where we grew up to avoid over analytical labeling bullshit that for the most part is out of ignorance. two people who have the same experiences, who know each other better than anyone else, can experience true love at a depth that no one else can fathom. I will step off my soap box and let you all get back to analyzing and labeling people.

 

[CindyCD478]

blah blah blah. I've been involved in a consensual relationship with my brother for over 13 years. it was entered into as a young adult. we live as husband and wife. we will not have children. other people will label us as incest. incest involves power, control, abuse, and non consent. none of that is in our relationship. we are as normal a "married" couple as any other. my husband is 11 months older than me and we share the same profession. we do not have any other family and moved away from where we grew up to avoid over analytical labeling bullshit that for the most part is out of ignorance. two people who have the same experiences, who know each other better than anyone else, can experience true love at a depth that no one else can fathom. I will step off my soap box and let you all get back to analyzing and labeling people.

Thank you for your comments. Our son and daughter have been a couple for years and we see nothing wrong with it. We are aware of other brother/sister couples living as husband wife and enjoying life like you are.

 

[sexlover66]

blah blah blah. I've been involved in a consensual relationship with my brother for over 13 years. it was entered into as a young adult. we live as husband and wife. we will not have children. other people will label us as incest. incest involves power, control, abuse, and non consent. none of that is in our relationship. we are as normal a "married" couple as any other. my husband is 11 months older than me and we share the same profession. we do not have any other family and moved away from where we grew up to avoid over analytical labeling bullshit that for the most part is out of ignorance. two people who have the same experiences, who know each other better than anyone else, can experience true love at a depth that no one else can fathom. I will step off my soap box and let you all get back to analyzing and labeling people.

i am going to say this...i agree with you 100%...if you are consenting..and of age to where you understnad what you are doing and what is going on.....then more power to you. i was in an incestous relationship for many years and it didnt harm or scar me or make me attack lil kids on street corners or anything ike that...sex is wonderful betwen two people...family or not...who love and care about each other enough to share the intamacy..enjoy your life..

 

[sexlover66]

Thank you for your comments. Our son and daughter have been a couple for years and we see nothing wrong with it. We are aware of other brother/sister couples living as husband wife and enjoying life like you are.

I applaud you as wel...if they have made the conscious decision and are willing t live with the consequences...they are to be congratulated and celebrated....

 

[MyRubiLips]

In my opinion, there is nothing wrong with incest. It IS incest though. Incest does not "automatically" equal abuse.

 

[langleyr28]

blah blah blah. I've been involved in a consensual relationship with my brother for over 13 years. it was entered into as a young adult. we live as husband and wife. we will not have children. other people will label us as incest. incest involves power, control, abuse, and non consent. none of that is in our relationship. we are as normal a "married" couple as any other. my husband is 11 months older than me and we share the same profession. we do not have any other family and moved away from where we grew up to avoid over analytical labeling bullshit that for the most part is out of ignorance. two people who have the same experiences, who know each other better than anyone else, can experience true love at a depth that no one else can fathom. I will step off my soap box and let you all get back to analyzing and labeling people.

what my sister did not mention was that there was no sexual situations as kids. we dated other people until college. we were just extremely close and honest with each other our whole lives. the same as now. in my opinion our relationship is not incest.

 

[MyRubiLips]

what my sister did not mention was that there was no sexual situations as kids. we dated other people until college. we were just extremely close and honest with each other our whole lives. the same as now. in my opinion our relationship is not incest.

in·cestˈ/noun

-sexual relations between people classed as being too closely related to marry each other.

 

[langleyr28]

in·cestˈ/noun

-sexual relations between people classed as being too closely related to marry each other.

not being literal. just don't appreciate a label. most people hear incest and immediately think abuse.

 

[panchro]

Vicky, I wish you had a private PM address so I could give you the specifics of my personal experience.

 

[sexlover66]

not being literal. just don't appreciate a label. most people hear incest and immediately think abuse.

well people need to get over it...if people dont like the title and dont like how you do things...they can get the fuck over it and get off the site that allows people to express their needs wants and desires...if you and your sisters are lovers and wanna be lovers...as adults...you have that right in this country.....

 

[Cigtaker]

.....

 

[MyRubiLips]

not being literal. just don't appreciate a label. most people hear incest and immediately think abuse.

Those people are ignorant and their opinions don't matter.