How EV sales are losing momentum with US buyers

[Leglover1234]

What makes me mad is this country is spending d so much money yet other countries don’t give a shit

 

[Lazaran]

Saying we're going to save energy by going all electric from centralized production is just like the daylight savings con where you take an hour from the morning and give it to the evening. Or, as some native American is credited with saying; it's like cutting off 1/3 from one end of a blanket and sewing it back onto the other end and saying you've got more blanket.

Energy costs money to produce, be it centralized or decentralized. It also produces pollution in the same amount when you factor in everything from bigger and more generators (which require pollution to mine and manufacture) to upgrading transmission lines (again, more pollution to manufacture) to charging stations (even more pollution).

^
Maybe the dumbest thing Derpy has ever posted.



<checks notes>

Nope, it’s not even in the top ten.



Derpy posting that water is carbon based tops the list.



Derpy

 

[AlexBailey]

Saying we're going to save energy by going all electric from centralized production is just like the daylight savings con where you take an hour from the morning and give it to the evening. Or, as some native American is credited with saying; it's like cutting off 1/3 from one end of a blanket and sewing it back onto the other end and saying you've got more blanket.

Energy costs money to produce, be it centralized or decentralized. It also produces pollution in the same amount when you factor in everything from bigger and more generators (which require pollution to mine and manufacture) to upgrading transmission lines (again, more pollution to manufacture) to charging stations (even more pollution).

You just aren’t up to speed, Harpy.

Have you bothered to keep track of lithium battery technology? A couple of months ago you were still copy pasting Breitbart articles about problems with lithium cobalt batteries.

Have you read more yet about how LFP and other chemistries are surpassing Cobalt now?

You’re behind on other energy tech as well, but that’s not surprising considering what information sources you use.

 

[HisArpy]

You just aren’t up to speed, Harpy.

Have you bothered to keep track of lithium battery technology? A couple of months ago you were still copy pasting Breitbart articles about problems with lithium cobalt batteries.

Have you read more yet about how LFP and other chemistries are surpassing Cobalt now?

You’re behind on other energy tech as well, but that’s not surprising considering what information sources you use.

dudly, WHERE THE FUCK do you think they get the lithium for those batteries? And HOW THE FUCK do you think the batteries get produced? Or transported to the car manufacturers?

And then of course you have to charge those batteries from electrical generators which, in some locations, are powered by fossil fuels. And you need A LOT more generators to do it as more and more EV powered transportation comes online.

All of which translates DIRECTLY into more pollution.

Honestly, it's like you only have half a brain and that half is defective.

 

[AlexBailey]

What makes me mad is this country is spending d so much money yet other countries don’t give a shit

Which other countries?

China has been trying to improver their own emissions because of the problems they’re facing.

Struggling developing nations are just trying to get by, if they have a petroleum resource they have an economic obligation to their population to use it.

Surviving today comes first. The US is the leader in technology- well, we didn’t stay ahead on battery technology and now China and S Korea are eating our lunch, but we can catch up - unless the petroleum industry buys enough influence to retard our growth.

 

[DeluxAuto]

what a triggered snowflake

 

[DeluxAuto]

dudly, WHERE THE FUCK do you think they get the lithium for those batteries? And HOW THE FUCK do you think the batteries get produced? Or transported to the car manufacturers?

And then of course you have to charge those batteries from electrical generators which, in some locations, are powered by fossil fuels. And you need A LOT more generators to do it as more and more EV powered transportation comes online.

All of which translates DIRECTLY into more pollution.

Honestly, it's like you only have half a brain and that half is defective.

Smart people know that the complete replacement will take time if it even is ever completed, Derpy.

You are not smart.

 

[AlexBailey]

dudly, WHERE THE FUCK do you think they get the lithium for those batteries? And HOW THE FUCK do you think the batteries get produced? Or transported to the car manufacturers?

And then of course you have to charge those batteries from electrical generators which, in some locations, are powered by fossil fuels. And you need A LOT more generators to do it as more and more EV powered transportation comes online.

All of which translates DIRECTLY into more pollution.

Honestly, it's like you only have half a brain and that half is defective.

Wrong.

All of the petroleum products are now using the same transportation. By using electricity instead we get better point of use emissions- cleaner air for the population.

You already ignored the fact that EVs are more efficient at turning petroleum produced electricity to the tires than petroleum direct.

Don’t be so obdurate and you might learn something.

 

[Bray123]

dudly, WHERE THE FUCK do you think they get the lithium for those batteries?

Brine.

 

[RobDownSouth]

dudly, WHERE THE FUCK do you think they get the lithium for those batteries? And HOW THE FUCK do you think the batteries get produced? Or transported to the car manufacturers?

And then of course you have to charge those batteries from electrical generators which, in some locations, are powered by fossil fuels. And you need A LOT more generators to do it as more and more EV powered transportation comes online.

All of which translates DIRECTLY into more pollution.

Honestly, it's like you only have half a brain and that half is defective.

It's not the "lithium", it's teh "cobalt" stupid.
Cobalt was considered a "waste element" for years until it was discovered that they increased the capacity of lithium batteries bigly.
The Chinese recognized this first, and there are enormous "waste pits" full of discarded cobalt in Africa that the Chinese wanted their hands on.

African nations offered to sell the rights to these pits to America in 2019, but the Trump administration did not want to entertain anything other than petroleum drilling funding.

Thankfully the Biden administration recognized the importance of Cobalt and reversed short-sighted Trump energy policy in 2021, resulting in massive imports of cobalt and subsequent price point drops of lithium batteries.

 

[HisArpy]

Wrong.

All of the petroleum products are now using the same transportation. By using electricity instead we get better point of use emissions- cleaner air for the population.

You already ignored the fact that EVs are more efficient at turning petroleum produced electricity to the tires than petroleum direct.

Don’t be so obdurate and you might learn something.

dudly, if you're using THE SAME transportation system to move the bulk product, you've not changed a dam thing. All you've done is add to the pollution by increasing the useage.

You REALLY need to STFU and start thinking for once in your life.

 

[Leglover1234]

So close have a good one everyone

 

[AlexBailey]

Brine.

We’ll be looking at lithium in the rear view mirror in a few years.

While lithium is a common element in modern batteries today there are already other technologies on deck - past alpha testing which show more promise.

Poor @HisArpy needs all batteries to be dirty and difficult to keep his argument going.

 

[AlexBailey]

dudly, if you're using THE SAME transportation system to move the bulk product, you've not changed a dam thing. All you've done is add to the pollution by increasing the useage.

You REALLY need to STFU and start thinking for once in your life.

Wrong again. Use more CAPS maybe?

A turbine petroleum electric generator can produce electricity which can be used in cars far more efficiently than putting gas in every tank.

Give it up, Luddite.

 

[HisArpy]

Wrong again. Use more CAPS maybe?

A turbine petroleum electric generator can produce electricity which can be used in cars far more efficiently than putting gas in every tank.

Give it up, Luddite.

You're going to need more of those. ALL of which run on fossil fuels.


I'm not an engineer but even I know about energy losses when you convert from one energy source to another. Somehow in your world that magically doesn't happen and we get mo powah! from the volts than the energy needed to produce it.

Which, in the real world is an impossibility.

 

[deltablues65]

I think the EV is most certainly beneficial in use in larger centers' but I do know for people whom are working in the trucking industry, especially those whom are delivering to remote communities, especially cold climate communities, electronic trucks( as in using a ECM for electronic fuel injection)......many still seek an engine with zero electronics(mechanical fuel systems that can be repaired if necessary) and not at the mercy of the computer, as electronics can and do fail, and its not always easy to troubleshoot a problem, especially in hostile weather(as in bitter cold)

 

[HisArpy]

We’ll be looking at lithium in the rear view mirror in a few years.

While lithium is a common element in modern batteries today there are already other technologies on deck - past alpha testing which show more promise.

Poor @HisArpy needs all batteries to be dirty and difficult to keep his argument going.

You really need to get a clue. It's not the storage matrix, it's what's required to mine/manufacture/transport/energize it where the pollution occurs.

And that's without even considering disposal.

But you keep on believing in the impossible.

 

[AlexBailey]

You really need to get a clue. It's not the storage matrix, it's what's required to mine/manufacture/transport/energize it where the pollution occurs.

And that's without even considering disposal.

But you keep on believing in the impossible.

So you're fully aware that the petroleum industry has these same problems, no? Is that truth just too inconvenient for you?

As I pointed out already, other battery technologies are being developed - some don't use any toxics or lithium. I've never said renewables are perfect and clean, only that they are cleaner and more efficient than petroleum.

The petrol industry relies on dupes, not reality to keep their market share.

 

[deltablues65]

I don’t doubt that, and I don’t doubt the pressure coming from the petroleum industry to keep it that way.

The US is the largest producer of petroleum and the largest consumer of any country, do you think the industry doesn’t try to influence public policy?

Again, diesel is the energy source, not the drive power. It can be changed.

EVs are so much more energy efficient than petroleum that with the economy of scale you can use a diesel generator to charge an EV more efficiently than driving with direct gas or diesel power.

watching rail in Europe.....they have the electric infrastructure.....and certainly where it is superior....they use energy, however when they are braking, energy goes back to the grid......diesel locomotives use dynamic braking with mechanical braking.....dynamic is converted heat and goes to atmosphere.....which is unfortunate

 

[HisArpy]

So you're fully aware that the petroleum industry has these same problems, no? Is that truth just too inconvenient for you?

As I pointed out already, other battery technologies are being developed - some don't use any toxics or lithium. I've never said renewables are perfect and clean, only that they are cleaned and more efficient than petroleum.

The petrol industry relies on dupes, not reality to keep their market share.

I'm fully aware that most people like you, and including the petroleum industry too, believe that fossil fuels are a real world example of perpetual motion and to which the first law of thermodynamics doesn't apply.

Basically, we use electric motors to power the oil well pumps to get the oil which we refine into fuel to run the generators which power the electric motors which pump the oil. Somewhere in all of that we also get more oil based products for consumers to use to power their cars, heat their homes, light the darkness, and make products like plastic.

You seem to be someone who believes that by taking all of the oil in that production loop away, you get more than enough electricity to power the electrical generators to give more electricity that consumers can tap for their needs. Which is even stupider than believing that oil production is perpetual motion.

 

[AlexBailey]

watching rail in Europe.....they have the electric infrastructure.....and certainly where it is superior....they use energy, however when they are braking, energy goes back to the grid......diesel locomotives use dynamic braking with mechanical braking.....dynamic is converted heat and goes to atmosphere.....which is unfortunate

Deisel electric designs typically also have large battery banks, which helps with some of the starting and stopping though the larger the payload the less effect it has.

 

[DeluxAuto]

Lol @ Derpy.

 

[AlexBailey]

I'm fully aware that most people like you, and including the petroleum industry too, believe that fossil fuels are a real world example of perpetual motion and to which the first law of thermodynamics doesn't apply.

Basically, we use electric motors to power the oil well pumps to get the oil which we refine into fuel to run the generators which power the electric motors which pump the oil. Somewhere in all of that we also get more oil based products for consumers to use to power their cars, heat their homes, light the darkness, and make products like plastic.

You seem to be someone who believes that by taking all of the oil in that production loop away, you get more than enough electricity to power the electrical generators to give more electricity that consumers can tap for their needs. Which is even stupider than believing that oil production is perpetual motion.

Why bother lying about me? It only undermines your argument.

I don't say we need to stop all petroleum use, and I sure as hell don't think petroleum and perpetual motion belong in the same serious discussion - but then as soon as you come in all seriousness goes out the window.

 

[deltablues65]

Deisel electric designs typically also have large battery banks, which helps with some of the starting and stopping though the larger the payload the less effect it

Lol @ Derpy.

View attachment 2300591

you bring up a interesting point....In the farming days of the past, a person could only work so many hours, as the horse teams needed to be cared for(fed and watered and downtime to rest)....invention of the tractor....one could work as many hours as weather or fatigue allowed.....more production equaled more dollars in the pocket

 

[Rightguide]

View attachment 2300488
https://www.wsj.com/business/autos/electric-vehicle-demand-charts-7d3089c7

People are beginning to identify the practical shortcomings of the available technology and the economic cluelessness behind the left-wing government mandates.