Your "belief" is not more important than my reality.

[Bert_Fegg]

I did not intend to lecture you Bert - however you opened that line of reasoning yourself by holding up the UK system as proof that my concerns are invalid. You were essentially sitting in a glass house throwing stones. The UK is a bad analogy for the US for a lot of reasons, but the most visible difference is the status of the government.

If it seems like I'm repeating myself sometimes, it might be because people keep throwing the same arguments at me. Sorry about that - but there are only so many different ways to skin a cat...

Yeah - I remarked on the advantages of socialised healthcare versus a profit-driven privately owned system and you utterly destroyed my argument with a rant about CCTV - Sorry - my mistake, when I said utterly destroyed my argument, what I meant to say was dodged the issue by lobbing non-sequiturs around

Also - you're not repeating yourself. First your argument was all about the effect of birth control on your insurance premium - when it was pointed out that providing birth control was a cheaper option than dealing with unwanted pregnancies, then it became about personal responsibility - christ knows where we are now - the point is your position changes - the only thing constant about it is you don't want women to be able to access any kind of subsidised birth control.

 

[Bert_Fegg]

Saw this and it got a grin - seemed apt for the thread...

http://thecomicnews.com/images/edtoons/2005/1123/morningafter/01.gif

 

[IrezumiKiss]

Yeah - I remarked on the advantages of socialised healthcare versus a profit-driven privately owned system and you utterly destroyed my argument with a rant about CCTV - Sorry - my mistake, when I said utterly destroyed my argument, what I meant to say was dodged the issue by lobbing non-sequiturs around

Also - you're not repeating yourself. First your argument was all about the effect of birth control on your insurance premium - when it was pointed out that providing birth control was a cheaper option than dealing with unwanted pregnancies, then it became about personal responsibility - christ knows where we are now - the point is your position changes - the only thing constant about it is you don't want women to be able to access any kind of subsidised birth control.

http://stream1.gifsoup.com/view/964540/soap-wig-snatch-o.gif

http://stream1.gifsoup.com/view1/3959754/hel-gets-wig-snatched-o.gif

http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m6v868FGPw1qil395o1_500.gif

…aaaaaand THAT is how you snatch a motherfucker's wig.

womp womp

 

[StrangeLife]

Yeah - I remarked on the advantages of socialised healthcare versus a profit-driven privately owned system and you utterly destroyed my argument with a rant about CCTV - Sorry - my mistake, when I said utterly destroyed my argument, what I meant to say was dodged the issue by lobbing non-sequiturs around

Also - you're not repeating yourself. First your argument was all about the effect of birth control on your insurance premium - when it was pointed out that providing birth control was a cheaper option than dealing with unwanted pregnancies, then it became about personal responsibility - christ knows where we are now - the point is your position changes - the only thing constant about it is you don't want women to be able to access any kind of subsidised birth control.

Not quite Bert. Let me recap...

You countered my argument that centrally subsidised (and thus controlled) birth control could be the first step onto a slippery slope directing us towards a system of fertility control, with the argument that "the UK have had subsidised birth control for a long time and no such thing has happened". And that is true - but it has happened to you guys in another area. It's just so that your politicians were more interested in being peeping Toms than controlling your breeding. In the US it could easily be the other way around.

And this is just one reason among many why this is a bad idea. First and foremost.....

I don't want to pay other people for having sex

... unless I'm invited to a threesome... get to watch.... or at least get some racy action-pictures...

 

[Lorilei]

Shaddup, Blob.

 

[Sean]

Not quite Bert. Let me recap...

You countered my argument that centrally subsidised (and thus controlled) birth control could be the first step onto a slippery slope directing us towards a system of fertility control, with the argument that "the UK have had subsidised birth control for a long time and no such thing has happened". And that is true - but it has happened to you guys in another area. It's just so that your politicians were more interested in being peeping Toms than controlling your breeding. In the US it could easily be the other way around.

And this is just one reason among many why this is a bad idea. First and foremost.....

I don't want to pay other people for having sex

... unless I'm invited to a threesome... get to watch.... or at least get some racy action-pictures...

Apart from the fact that over 90% of the cctv cameras in Britain are nothing to do with the government, they're private companies. But don't let the facts get in the way of whatever bullshit point you think you're making.

 

[IrezumiKiss]

Shaddup, Blob.

http://oldcatman-xxx.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/hysterical-laugh.gif

 

[warrior queen]

Perhaps we should set up internment camps for women - irresponsible bundles of emotional wekness and sexually out of control creatures that they are - and force them to breed a child for every act of sexual congress they engage in.
These could be funded entirely by the women and their families, ensuring that no child born is left to contend with any poverty or deprivation.
Men, of course, would be free to come and go as they wished - making themselves available for these women to satisfy their wicked sexual desires, without the encumberance of either unwanted children or insurance premiums that would [naturally] increase as these men found themselves saddled with female offspring that in our current world might require some form of birth control.

Win/win all round.


Oh, wait..... hold up a second..... maybe that wouldn't work after all.
In fact, forget everything I wrote up there.

Maybe we should all just pay the dollar or two extra required per month to allow women freedom of choice?
Ya think that'd work?

 

[eyer]

Apart from the fact that over 90% of the cctv cameras in Britain are nothing to do with the government, they're private companies. But don't let the facts get in the way of whatever bullshit point you think you're making.

The GCHQ called...

...but I can't actually tell you what they said because they were laughing so friggin' hard.

 

[Sean]

The GCHQ called...

...but I can't actually tell you what they said because they were laughing so friggin' hard.

And that has what to do with cctv cameras? Or are you just throwing out non sequiturs in some desperate attempt to seem relevant?

 

[eyer]

And that has what to do with cctv cameras? Or are you just throwing out non sequiturs in some desperate attempt to seem relevant?

Hold the phone, dude...

...they're still laughing.

 

[Sean]

Hold the phone, dude...

...they're still laughing.

Yeah, that's what I thought. Run along, eeyore, 'bout time for another personality change, isn't it? This one appears to be a little past its sell by date.

 

[Phelia]

Yeah - Don't know why I added that - I wasn't trying to derail the debate - I think the point I had in mind, but didn't make, is that socialised healthcare is the most cost-effective option, given that SL professes to be motivated by cost.

Do you think if you and I were to squabble we might get boobs that way?

Oh, your point was completely valid, and I don't think you were derailing the conversation. I know I've been the stay-on-topic police in here, which is totally ridiculous, because one of my favorite things to do is bound into every thread on this board and start talking about crazy shit like robot-unicorns and am generally supportive of all things distracting. I'm just trying to keep the focus narrow in this thread so people can't wriggle out of debating the facts by trying to change the subject to things that really aren't relevant, like their opinions on "secular beliefs" or late-term abortion or whether or not they want to pay for recreational sex. Obfuscation is one of their only tactics, and it ain't gwyn fly in here. FGB and StrangeLife, I see you motherfuckers and your deflection bullshit.

Also, the cost-saving argument has been hashed out here ad absurdum, and the morons simply won't budge. They'll deny the numbers and scream the sky is falling. If THIS thread is making you please that you live in the UK, you ain't seen nothin' yet.

Spoken like a true Taliban member. You ought to go live in one of those countries, you know, where women have no rights or protections. Let me ask you this. Do you have daughters? When they are in secure relationships and working on their careers, don't you think they ought to have the right to plan their family so it makes sense for their timeline? Most likely their husbands would agree that saving for a home before having a baby is the right thing to do. Of course, birth control is instrumental for making those right choices. As a society, a majority of people support that kind of choice when considering how many people in this country use birth control. Yet you have the audacity to suggest those rights are a joke. They are not. They are what created a generation of financially secure women who got to choose when to have their baby. Like me. I was a decade into my career, college educated and a homeowner when I started a family. Because I had the control over my reproductive system to do that.

This isn't even about public funding or private insurance options for birth control. This is about a generation of old white fucknuts like you trying to strip us of our rights and the ability to manage our bodies as we see fit. And we aren't going to let you get away with that. Ever.

Also, in true Phelia fashion, Fuck you.

Preach, mama!

"Who gave women their reproductive rights," ugh.

Follow-up questions: FGB, who gave you the right not to be punched in the dick, by me? Was it god?

Guess what, fucko. It was a society that values human rights, and SURPRISE SURPRISE, women are humans.

That birth control is for recreational sex is certainly the reason why Hobby Lobby and others don't want to pay for birth control is certainly true, but it isn't about the money. (Hence viagra vs bc is not a relevant comparison.) The real goal is to bring back extreme consequences to casual sex in order to bolster the family unit back to the days preceding feminism.

Prior to birth control and abortions being readily available, women had to be very choosy about their sexual partners. They had to guard their eggs if you will, not get knocked up by a loser. (This is why women are naturally hypergamous.) A single mom would be destitute, hence the "shot gun wedding" of the past when a couple experienced an unplanned wedding. This may have worked against the personal happiness of the woman and man involved, but no doubt the family unit was stronger back then. Family was more important than personal happiness and personal pleasure.

Fast forward to BC and abortions being readily available and the removal of life-altering consequences. Women do not have to be nearly as choosy about their sexual partners. There is no stigma to being a single mom (plus The State picks up the financial slack now either with welfare or forcing the male to pay) despite the fact that children do not do nearly as well being raised by a single mom as compared to a two parent household. Personal happiness trumps all now, which is why people will get a divorce out of boredom. Men in their 20s and 30s don't commit to women as readily because sex is easy and cheap - gone are the days in which sex was exchanged for commitment - which is why marriage rates are on the decline.

All of this is to say that Hobby Lobby's stance is one of what is annoyingly called "slut shaming"... I am not saying that I agree with them, but I do see their point. They want to go back to the days in which women thought long and hard about who they were going to fuck, and assessed men by more than how sexually appealing he is. Because if you got pregnant, your life was screwed. And since 20% of the single men out there are having 80% of the casual sex, lots of "regular" guys are being left out in the cold. Lack of contraception would bring the regular guys back into the game.

I can follow your argument, but this is completely speculative, and it doesn't really apply in this situation at all. Hobby Lobby is still covering the majority of options for female contraception. This is about:

a) Extending the rights of corporations and protecting religious belief at the expense of individual liberties and broader public interest and

b) The butthurt conservatives trying to chip away at the ACA.

Fuck you...

...and your old white fucknut opinion!

Eyer!!! You said "fuck" without quotes! You're going to helllllllllllll!

BULLSHITT!

Ha! You should be so lucky

Family planning is deciding to have or not to have babies...BRFORE you get pregnant.

Clint said it best some thing like...Don't piss down my back and tell me it's raining!

What you want to do is kill them after they are conceived.

What you are really after is wanting people like me to agree with you and let you alone in the crusade to murder these children before they are born.

NOT GOING TO FUCKING HAPPEN.

Why not just go down the Hospital nursery with a machete and kill off a few dozen? The only difference is a few hours or minutes between the two.

Fucking Hypocrites.

Oh...Yeah. And me and my "Taliban" brothers will and many of those have died to insure you have the right and freedom to disagree with me.

Hey Captain Dumbass, this thread is about access to contraceptives.

Want less abortions? Great. Give women birth control.

Something to consider...

http://www.mccl.org/Page.aspx?pid=400

Something for you to consider...

I don't want to pay other people for having sex

You've said that a million times already. The point that everyone has repeatedly made and you have failed to address is that it just doesn't work, morally or pragmatically, in the real world. You have not made a compelling a case otherwise, and you have not addressed the glaring holes in your logic and continue to double down on what you want and how you think things should be. Great. The rest of us are dealing in reality, thanks.

Stop shouting the same thing over and over again and just shut up. You made your point. It's incredibly bad. You haven't convinced a single person that you're not a fucking idiot. Actually, Vetteman seemed to agree with you, but he also claims that slavery was a good thing for black people, so that's probably not something that will work in your favor.

 

[Lorilei]

Oh, your point was completely valid, and I don't think you were derailing the conversation. I know I've been the stay-on-topic police in here, which is totally ridiculous, because one of my favorite things to do is bound into every thread on this board and start talking about crazy shit like robot-unicorns and am generally supportive of all things distracting. I'm just trying to keep the focus narrow in this thread so people can't wriggle out of debating the facts by trying to change the subject to things that really aren't relevant, like their opinions on "secular beliefs" or late-term abortion or whether or not they want to pay for recreational sex. Obfuscation is one of their only tactics, and it ain't gwyn fly in here. FGB and StrangeLife, I see you motherfuckers and your deflection bullshit.

Also, the cost-saving argument has been hashed out here ad absurdum, and the morons simply won't budge. They'll deny the numbers and scream the sky is falling. If THIS thread is making you please that you live in the UK, you ain't seen nothin' yet.



Preach, mama!

"Who gave women their reproductive rights," ugh.

Follow-up questions: FGB, who gave you the right not to be punched in the dick, by me? Was it god?

Guess what, fucko. It was a society that values human rights, and SURPRISE SURPRISE, women are humans.



I can follow your argument, but this is completely speculative, and it doesn't really apply in this situation at all. Hobby Lobby is still covering the majority of options for female contraception. This is about:

a) Extending the rights of corporations and protecting religious belief at the expense of individual liberties and broader public interest and

b) The butthurt conservatives trying to chip away at the ACA.



Eyer!!! You said "fuck" without quotes! You're going to helllllllllllll!



Hey Captain Dumbass, this thread is about access to contraceptives.

Want less abortions? Great. Give women birth control.



Something for you to consider...



You've said that a million times already. The point that everyone has repeatedly made and you have failed to address is that it just doesn't work, morally or pragmatically, in the real world. You have not made a compelling a case otherwise, and you have not addressed the glaring holes in your logic and continue to double down on what you want and how you think things should be. Great. The rest of us are dealing in reality, thanks.

Stop shouting the same thing over and over again and just shut up. You made your point. It's incredibly bad. You haven't convinced a single person that you're not a fucking idiot. Actually, Vetteman seemed to agree with you, but he also claims that slavery was a good thing for black people, so that's probably not something that will work in your favor.

Is it just me, or does StrangeLife = Blobfish? http://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?t=826760&highlight="sandra+fluke"

 

[StrangeLife]

Apart from the fact that over 90% of the cctv cameras in Britain are nothing to do with the government, they're private companies. But don't let the facts get in the way of whatever bullshit point you think you're making.

When I got the tour of Westminster Councils CCTV Central - that was in 2012 - I was told 80%. But it makes little difference because they works closely together and law enforcement get feeds and warnings from the private cameras. Of course they don't cost the British taxpayer a dime... or penny... which is good.

This does lead to another concern though. With law enforcements increasing reliance on CCTV how cool is it that private companies get to "pre-filter" 80% of the footage before the police gets it? That's a pretty powerful position to be in...

 

[Sean]

When I got the tour of Westminster Councils CCTV Central - that was in 2012 - I was told 80%. But it makes little difference because they works closely together and law enforcement get feeds and warnings from the private cameras. Of course they don't cost the British taxpayer a dime... or penny... which is good.

This does lead to another concern though. With law enforcements increasing reliance on CCTV how cool is it that private companies get to "pre-filter" 80% of the footage before the police gets it? That's a pretty powerful position to be in...

So every time you're shown to be a lying cunt, you just move the goal posts?

 

[islandman]

So every time you're shown to be a lying cunt, you just move the goal posts?

Welcome to Lit., n00b.

 

[FGB]

Phelia;55667050"

Follow-up questions: FGB, who gave you the right not to be punched in the dick, by me? Was it god?

If we are ever at a Littogether at the same place and time may I be so forward as to suggest you take no such action.

While some things sound bold on the computer in real life they can get you hurt.

I am an easy going,peaceful man and I would be very sorry about what happened to you next.

 

[Phelia]

Is it just me, or does StrangeLife = Blobfish? http://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?t=826760&highlight="sandra+fluke"

Blob said some silly things that I absolutely did not agree with, but he was much smarter and a much better speller than StrangeLife. Credit where credit is due I don't think he'll be coming back to lit.

Also, for what it's worth, I did get to know the boy behind the fish a bit, and I really liked what I saw. There was a good heart there. It doesn't excuse anything he said or his 20-year-old Libertarian non-logic, but there was certainly more to him than gelatinous layers of goo.

 

[Phelia]

Phelia;55667050"

Follow-up questions: FGB, who gave you the right not to be punched in the dick, by me? Was it god?

If we are ever at a Littogether at the same place and time may I be so forward as to suggest you take no such action.

While some things sound bold on the computer in real life they can get you hurt.

I am an easy going,peaceful man and I would be very sorry about what happened to you next.

Lolololol! Thanks for the warning, shitty Steven Seagal, but I'm not really all that worried about it.

 

[StrangeLife]

Stop shouting the same thing over and over again and just shut up. You made your point. It's incredibly bad. You haven't convinced a single person that you're not a fucking idiot...

I know Phelia.

It's sad that I am so unconvincing that even when I speak the obvious truth, I still can't convince anybody. I can just imagine how much worse it would have been if I was wrong!

http://s27.postimg.org/777pv90i7/684_59a8c19ad602c5d5b3149cef52540c113.gif

Is it just me, or does StrangeLife = Blobfish?

I sincerely hope it is just you, my fair lady.

Blobfish????

If I had the energy and multitasking abilities needed for managing more than one identity, surely I could do better than "Blobfish."
I mean, seriously - exactly how much cybersex do you attract with a nick like that?

Nope - I would rather choose something like...

RuggedHardbodyHunkBeefcakeSixpackEverhard4711

 

[Lorilei]

Blob said some silly things that I absolutely did not agree with, but he was much smarter and a much better speller than StrangeLife. Credit where credit is due I don't think he'll be coming back to lit.

Also, for what it's worth, I did get to know the boy behind the fish a bit, and I really liked what I saw. There was a good heart there. It doesn't excuse anything he said or his 20-year-old Libertarian non-logic, but there was certainly more to him that gelatinous layers of goo.

Well, hell.

 

[StrangeLife]

So every time you're shown to be a lying cunt, you just move the goal posts?

Wrong genital Sean. And apparently I didn't move much with anybody....

...but he was much smarter and a much better speller than StrangeLife.

You are never going to let me forget that I spelled "fallopian tubes" wrong, are you?

 

[Sean]

Wrong genital Sean. And apparently I didn't move much with anybody....

No, you're a cunt.

 

[Bry1313]

Shouldn't everyone on this board love birth control?