Will Ukraine situation lead to World War III?

[jeninflorida]

did we learn our lesson wtih Hitler ... and by that, I don't mean obama.

Putin will take and keep that part of the Ukraine, why not advance and take over the whole country?

obama isn't going to stop him, obama is a pussy

 

[renard_ruse]

did we learn our lesson wtih Hitler ... and by that, I don't mean obama.

Putin will take and keep that part of the Ukraine, why not advance and take over the whole country?

obama isn't going to stop him, obama is a pussy

The west is Hitler. The EU is trying to conquer all of eastern Europe, including Russia. They are even siding with actual neo-fascists in Kiev.

Why is the EU trying to recreate the Roman Empire, the Napoleanic Empire, and Nazi Germany? Why does it want all this territory?

 

[unregistered]

 

[Sean Renaud]

All they need are armed forces.

Not at all. If anything walking around in any other country would show you that you can conquer just as surely through culture and economics.

 

[Nuff_Said]

There was a question that started this thread - "Will Ukraine situation lead to World War 3?"
The answer is - is is already going to its end.
It started the next day after Nazi Germany capitulated, when The USA, having got a nuclear bomb, and having also made very good money on the war itself (and the USSR having got so many people dead and economy destroyed) started threatening the USSR with extermination, as it provided the opposition to capitalistic idea of making money on everything ever possible.

The only difference with all previous wars was that both countries used war-proxys, and used the nuclear arsenal to keep each other from direct firefight. And the USA used its economic power to enslave smaller countries, and it non-nuclear military power to supress any resistance.

And what it looks like from inside Russia NOW - we have already lost that fight. What is happening are just games politicians play to stay in their offices and continue their marauding of the country. Putin might seem as a tough guy in the international affairs, but his in-house politics are just that - marauding. And what makes me really scary, is that he uses his "success" in Sochi Olympics and the "shit" (I don't know how else to descrobe those events) in Ukraine to raise a wave of revanchism.
The problem of Russia here is that its too big, and has too pour nation - and thus most of them can afford only few state TV channels. So they have no alternative, but to eat Putin's shit (propaganda) and ask for more.

In two days rouble lost 25% of its value. This crisis was carefully supressed by government for a long time - so that rouble didn't lose same quared in a couple of years, but in two days.
It looks like they try to say - "Look, those westers assholes just robbed you! They did it because they hate you, because they want to do the same thing with Ukraine, our brother-nation, what they did with Yugoslavia. Mother-Russia is the next in that queue! But now we are not weak Yeltsin's Russia, but strong and mighty Putin's Russia and we can stand ot that challenge. Now stand up, people of good will, stand up for a fight!"

The fact is, that Putin learned american lesson - distract you nation from in-house problems with wars and foreign threat. And he uses it for his, and his clique benefit.

Just remember - it was clearly stated that whole Winter Olympics complex could be built with a quarter of the money that were spent on it. So that means, that 3\4 of those billions of dollars (and right from its start the costs were calculated in dollars, not in roubles) ended in someone's pocket. The same thing happens to each and every governmental project in Russia.
But don't think that it is corruption - it is as much governmental policy, as much as it is each individual desire (to find a "warm" place and make money).

I don't know how soon Russia will fall into another civil war, but this thing is in the air. If Putin doesn't keep Ukraine united, if he allowes the secession of Crimea - it will become a legitimate reason for all other national minorities - which alltogether make up to 60% of Russian people (don't miss with ethnically russian) to try the same thing.

I can be exaggerating. But I say what I FEEL today.

 

[Beco]

Like that means fuck all....we had control over some of the worlds biggest oil reserves....did we capitalize on it? Did we even pay our fucking tab with it? Did our oil prices go the fuck down 1 god damn penny? Did the citizens of the US get any fucking thing out of it but a bunch of dead kids and an insano tab to be paid to GOP/MIC interest?

FUCK NO....

Once again, why should we the people of the US give 1 wet fuckin' fart about Ukraine?

What in the fuck is in it for us? Hmmm??

Its why Russia values that area, plus all their military bases are there.....

 

[tactful]

If we're giving them, "a billion bucks" how is that going to lead to World War III, of course, if we told them they had to implement ObamaCare before they got the money, they would be a game changer.

On a side note: Obama, is working on fixing the US economy, I think he's gonna start next Tuesday.

 

[landslider2000]

It was one thing for Romney (MBA and JD Harv) to know more than Obama about foreign policy.

But even a busy housewife from Alaska knew more than Obama about Russia/Ukraine.

 

[RobDownSouth]

What in the fuck is in it for us? Hmmm??

Do you really think you're gonna get an answer?

 

[RobDownSouth]

Georgia didn't get the land back under Bush either. However I'm confident the Ukraine will get their land back, but this is effectively a situation where if everybody would simply hold hands and sing koombuhya we'd solve this one. There is literally no reason for this fight.

Perhaps Russia thinks they take a page from the Israeli playbook and keep conquered lands in violation of the Geneva Accords via....via....um, National Security!

Might makes Right, dontcha know!!

 

[BotanyBoy]

Its why Russia values that area, plus all their military bases are there.....

Why does that make America give a shit? If Russia steam rolls the Ukraine and conquers it. WHY SHOULD I CARE?

But even a busy housewife from Alaska knew more than Obama about Russia/Ukraine.

She see's him in her back yard!! hahahahaha

Do you really think you're gonna get an answer?

No because there isn't one....there is no reason the US should give 1 flying fuck about Russia<-> Ukraine strife other than getting the republican war machine more funding. And with "I'm going to end these wars and bring our troops home, you can take that to the bank!" master bullshitter in office they just might get it.

 

[KingOrfeo]

The west is Hitler. The EU is trying to conquer all of eastern Europe, including Russia. They are even siding with actual neo-fascists in Kiev.

But there are other Ukrainian neo-fascists siding with Russia, or at any rate against the West.

 

[KingOrfeo]

On a side note: Obama, is working on fixing the US economy, I think he's gonna start next Tuesday.

We'd be in much better shape now if Congress had been willing to approve twice as big a stimulus-package in 2009, like Obama asked for.

 

[BotanyBoy]

We'd be in much better shape now if Congress had been willing to approve twice as big a stimulus-package in 2009, like Obama asked for.

Why? So Bank of America Chief Executives could get a bigger bonus? HAHAHAHA dude they could have gotten a 100 TRILLION dollar stimulus you know how much the average shumck would get? 0 dollars. GM would have gotten mo' paid and the 99% would have still been stuck with the fucking tab.

 

[unregistered]

 

[trysail]

Merkel Eye for Russian Empress Shows Putin Ties Are Complex


By Patrick Donahue and Tino Andresen
March 4, 2014

(Bloomberg) German Chancellor Angela Merkel has a portrait on her desk of Russian empress Catherine the Great, the Prussian-born princess who went on to expand Russia’s territory to the west and the south, including Crimea.

As President Vladimir Putin tests Europe’s resolve during the crisis over Ukraine, Merkel’s admiration for Catherine hints at the complex ties binding Germany and Russia together that give her sway over Putin yet constrain her response.

Merkel, who once told German television that Catherine had “accomplished many things under difficult circumstances,” has telephoned with Putin at least three times in the past week alone. That diplomacy reflects her role as the key conduit between east and west.

Merkel, 59, a Russian speaker whose political career began with the end of the Cold War, has additional leverage in the conflict over Ukraine on account of her status as the leader of Russia’s biggest EU trading partner in goods. The same ties make Germany the European Union country with the most to lose from any escalation.

“The German government wants to avoid drastic EU measures or sanctions on Russia,” Fredrik Erixon, director of the European Centre for International Political Economy in Brussels, said in an interview. “The main casualties of such moves would be German companies exporting to Russia or those in Russia.”

...Merkel said that she thinks Putin is acting very rationally, he simply has a completely different view of the world, according to the official, who spoke on condition of anonymity because the call was private...

With 35 percent of German oil and gas imports coming from Russia and 6,000 German companies doing business there, Merkel is constrained even as her foreign minister threatened “consequences” over what he called Europe’s worst crisis since the Berlin Wall fell 25 years ago in November...

 

[Sean Renaud]

Why? So Bank of America Chief Executives could get a bigger bonus? HAHAHAHA dude they could have gotten a 100 TRILLION dollar stimulus you know how much the average shumck would get? 0 dollars. GM would have gotten mo' paid and the 99% would have still been stuck with the fucking tab.

We could have repeated Bush's strategy of giving the money directly to the poor if you prefered though as much as I don't like it it's probably more efficient to unfuck the rich situation and let them do what they do.

Now in the mean time we should have started breaking up those companies and putting controls into place but hey you can only ask so much of Americans.

 

[Boxlicker101]

Even after five years,

They are still blaming somebody else:

http://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/uk..._mail_job=1558507_03042014&promo_code=16A67-1

And, if you don't like that source: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/mar/4/msnbc-rachel-maddow-bush-blame-ukraine/

 

[Sean Renaud]

They are still blaming somebody else:

http://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/uk..._mail_job=1558507_03042014&promo_code=16A67-1

While I don't think Bush is at all to blame for this, I think Putin does what Putin wants and thinking we have a serious influence on him is ignorance, Bush is the gift that keeps on giving and SHOULD rightfully be blames for any of the things that were his fault at least up to the next Republican Presidency.

 

[Wrong Element]

They are still blaming somebody else:

http://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/uk..._mail_job=1558507_03042014&promo_code=16A67-1

And, if you don't like that source: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/mar/4/msnbc-rachel-maddow-bush-blame-ukraine/

It looks like Maddow was talking about the world scene in general and not specifically Ukraine.

But the moral authority of the United States to object to military incursions on overblown or even fraudulent pretexts was obviously damaged by Iraq; no serious person can believe otherwise.

 

[unregistered]

 

[Beco]

Why does that make America give a shit? If Russia steam rolls the Ukraine and conquers it. WHY SHOULD I CARE?

Oh ok, I'm just saying its why Russia wants the Ukraine and won't ever let it go....

 

[zipman]

It looks like Maddow was talking about the world scene in general and not specifically Ukraine.

But the moral authority of the United States to object to military incursions on overblown or even fraudulent pretexts was obviously damaged by Iraq; no serious person can believe otherwise.

Regardless, Russia signed a treaty and is in violation of it right now.

 

[unregistered]

 

[Boxlicker101]

While I don't think Bush is at all to blame for this, I think Putin does what Putin wants and thinking we have a serious influence on him is ignorance, Bush is the gift that keeps on giving and SHOULD rightfully be blames for any of the things that were his fault at least up to the next Republican Presidency.

If you want to play the blame game, you could go clear back to George Washington. If he hadn't done this (or if he had done this) the situation would not be that. That would be pretty tenuous, but blaming Woodrow Wilson or Harding would be much less so.