So what would it kill us if we'd subsidized this guy's electricity?

[Le Jacquelope]

And yes, I've helped a few folks out who were in a jam like this... though we don't have temperatures like THIS here...

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090126/ap_on_re_us/frozen_indoors/print

93-year-old froze to death, owed big utility bill
Mon Jan 26, 3:32 pm ET

BAY CITY, Mich. – A 93-year-old man froze to death inside his home just days after the municipal power company restricted his use of electricity because of unpaid bills, officials said.

Marvin E. Schur died "a slow, painful death," said Kanu Virani, Oakland County's deputy chief medical examiner, who performed the autopsy.

Neighbors discovered Schur's body on Jan. 17. They said the indoor temperature was below 32 degrees at the time, The Bay City Times reported Monday.

"Hypothermia shuts the whole system down, slowly," Virani said. "It's not easy to die from hypothermia without first realizing your fingers and toes feel like they're burning."

Schur owed Bay City Electric Light & Power more than $1,000 in unpaid electric bills, Bay City Manager Robert Belleman told The Associated Press on Monday.

A city utility worker had installed a "limiter" device to restrict the use of electricity at Schur's home on Jan. 13, Belleman said. The device limits power reaching a home and blows out like a fuse if consumption rises past a set level. Power is not restored until the device is reset.

The limiter was tripped sometime between the time of installation and the discovery of Schur's body, Belleman said. He didn't know if anyone had made personal contact with Schur to explain how the device works.

Schur's body was discovered by neighbor George Pauwels Jr.

"His furnace was not running, the insides of his windows were full of ice the morning we found him," Pauwels told the newspaper.

Belleman said city workers keep the limiter on houses for 10 days, then shut off power entirely if the homeowner hasn't paid utility bills or arranged to do so.

He said Bay City Electric Light & Power's policies will be reviewed, but he didn't believe the city did anything wrong.

"I've said this before and some of my colleagues have said this: Neighbors need to keep an eye on neighbors," Belleman said. "When they think there's something wrong, they should contact the appropriate agency or city department."

Schur had no children and his wife had died several years ago.

Bay City is on Saginaw Bay, just north of the city of Saginaw in central Michigan.

___

Information from: The Bay City Times, http://www.mlive.com/bay-city

 

[NaughtyLil1]

How very sad that everyone failed this poor man (the community, the power company). Our city opened warming shelters during the cold snap and I'm pretty sure Bay City did as well. If someone had paid attention they could have gotten him into a safe environment.

 

[Le Jacquelope]

How very sad that everyone failed this poor man (the community, the power company). Our city opened warming shelters during the cold snap and I'm pretty sure Bay City did as well. If someone had paid attention they could have gotten him into a safe environment.

My view is it started with the electric company - but you're also right, everyone else failed as well.

You ignore the fact of a lack of neighborhood spirit at your very obvious peril.

 

[unregistered]

 

[Sharon_]

An extremely sad story.

Sounds like the electric company continued to supply electricity to the gentleman's home even though the bill had not been paid and obviously had not been negotiated to be paid. I'm sure they continuously contacted the home to the point of putting on this "limiter" and continued not to be paid.

What's next LT, you going to blame Von's for folks not getting the required nutritional balance?

I don't care. You don't cut off power to 93 yo people in the middle of winter.

The electric company is lucky the man has no children to sue them. I understand they can't provide free electric, but since THEY are the ones who shut the power off it was incumbent on THEM to inform authorities what they had done.

And obviously the guy did have neighbors checking since it was a neighbor who found him. I know first hand it takes next to no time for a house to cool off when there's no heat, and it doesn't take long at all for the elderly to succumb to hypothermia.

 

[unregistered]

 

[NaughtyLil1]

My view is it started with the electric company - but you're also right, everyone else failed as well.

You ignore the fact of a lack of neighborhood spirit at your very obvious peril.

It's easy to place the majority of blame on the electric company. After all, they should have known this man's situation. They have his personal information on record and should have flagged it when his account became delinquent. Morally, I think the obligation is there but I'm not so sure in other aspects. That's where the community blame comes in.

No one wants to go the extra mile.

 

[Le Jacquelope]

It's easy to place the majority of blame on the electric company. After all, they should have known this man's situation. They have his personal information on record and should have flagged it when his account became delinquent. Morally, I think the obligation is there but I'm not so sure in other aspects. That's where the community blame comes in.

No one wants to go the extra mile.

Well, someone in the community did come by his house. They just came too late.

I'm sure they came by to check out all the big 52 inch plasma TV's he bought instead of paying his bills, though. <Ishmael mode off>

 

[unregistered]

 

[Karen Kraft]

An extremely sad story.

Sounds like the electric company continued to supply electricity to the gentleman's home even though the bill had not been paid and obviously had not been negotiated to be paid. I'm sure they continuously contacted the home to the point of putting on this "limiter" and continued not to be paid.

What's next LT, you going to blame Von's for folks not getting the required nutritional balance?

Well, there's that, but also the gentleman should have used his allotment to run his heater instead of his 96-inch plasma screen, his marijuana grow lamps, and his wii stations.

 

[Le Jacquelope]

Well, there's that, but also the gentleman should have used his allotment to run his heater instead of his 96-inch plasma screen, his marijuana grow lamps, and his wii stations.

Well duck a fuck Chuck, I predicted someone would say this a mere minute or so before it happened.

 

[Karen Kraft]

Well duck a fuck Chuck, I predicted someone would say this a mere minute or so before it happened.

Well gee. Aren't you the clever one this morning?

At least I didn't go into the Ish social Darwinistic rant about people without money not having more children. That would have been rude.

Good thing.

 

[unregistered]

 

[TurdFergeson]

I thought there were laws that in the dangerously cold winter months it was illegal for the power company to shut someone off.

Guess not there.

 

[Le Jacquelope]

Well gee. Aren't you the clever one this morning?

At least I didn't go into the Ish social Darwinistic rant about people without money not having more children. That would have been rude.

Good thing.

Every time Ishmael posts his views about economics and humanity in general, a Liberal candidate for political office smiles.

 

[NaughtyLil1]

How should they have known his situation?

What personal info other than your address do you give the electric co.???

I'm not being mean, just real.

Oh, the extra mile was community.

They have all the pertinent info (birthdate, ss#). I know it's unrealistic to expect them to babysit their consumers. I just wish they could devise a system to keep a watchful eye on our elderly.

 

[Karen Kraft]

I thought there were laws that in the dangerously cold winter months it was illegal for the power company to shut someone off.

Guess not there.

Alright, alright. A serious moment (I'm going back to bed anyway):

In most places I know of (not that I have taken a pole recently). [ sorry ].....

They DO indeed have emergency programs for people who cannot afford to pay for essential utilities. There are several programs in major cities and in smaller towns as well. The other side of that same coin is when it gets too hot -- so hot that it is life-threatening to the old, very young, and the sick. When I was in Texas a few years back, the local town I was in sent out a request, coordinated with Wal-Mart - - TV ads and large store posters encouraged people to donate $10 at the end of their check-out rituals to purchase box fans. Each $10 bought a fan and some bottled water. Volunteers then took the fans and water to people in the community who might be at risk due to the temperature. If the people did not have electricity to operate the fans, the city saw to it that such was provided on a temporary basis.

But the point is that these things are community based, not individually based. One doubts that the community made a decision to let this old guy die because he couldn't pay his juice bill. He fell through the cracks. That has more to do with the organization in the community than a cold hearted (NPI) attitude toward the old man. No?

 

[TurdFergeson]

Alright, alright. A serious moment (I'm going back to bed anyway):

In most places I know of (not that I have taken a pole recently). [ sorry ].....

They DO indeed have emergency programs for people who cannot afford to pay for essential utilities. There are several programs in major cities and in smaller towns as well. The other side of that same coin is when it gets too hot -- so hot that it is life-threatening to the old, very young, and the sick. When I was in Texas a few years back, the local town I was in sent out a request, coordinated with Wal-Mart - - TV ads and large store posters encouraged people to donate $10 at the end of their check-out rituals to purchase box fans. Each $10 bought a fan and some bottled water. Volunteers then took the fans and water to people in the community who might be at risk due to the temperature. If the people did not have electricity to operate the fans, the city saw to it that such was provided on a temporary basis.

But the point is that these things are community based, not individually based. One doubts that the community made a decision to let this old guy die because he couldn't pay his juice bill. He fell through the cracks. That has more to do with the organization in the community than a cold hearted (NPI) attitude toward the old man. No?

I don't know. They put a limit switch on his meter and he froze to death.

Bottom line.



*shiver* pretty cold hearted thing to do...

 

[unregistered]

 

[Karen Kraft]

I don't know. They put a limit switch on his meter and he froze to death.

Bottom line.



*shiver* pretty cold hearted thing to do...

Sure it is.

But let's sort this out. Was it a public utility or Edison?

Was the gentleman part of any social service program? Was one available? Were there any outreach programs to let him know what might be available to him?

The story needs more details before we need to jump to conclusions that extend beyond the immediate tragedy of his particular situation.

 

[unregistered]

 

[TurdFergeson]

Sure it is.

But let's sort this out. Was it a public utility or Edison?

Was the gentleman part of any social service program? Was one available? Were there any outreach programs to let him know what might be available to him?

The story needs more details before we need to jump to conclusions that extend beyond the immediate tragedy of his particular situation.

Who jumped to any conclusions? They turned his power off and he froze to death. Everything else, while still relevent, I agree, is still secondary to those 2 main facts.

 

[Le Jacquelope]

Who jumped to any conclusions? They turned his power off and he froze to death. Everything else, while still relevent, I agree, is still secondary to those 2 main facts.

It turns out the guy was a World War II veteran.

He beat the Nazis but couldn't beat capitalism...

 

[MechaBlade]

So I guess he didn't have a gas heater.

 

[RedHeadedGlory]

There was a piece on my local news (here in Mich) last night about the "limiter" box. I'm basing this on memory, so my apologies if my info is off.

According to what they showed the idea was to have something that provided at least minimal electricity instead of just shutting someone off. It would be enough to run basic things like heat, lights and refridgerator.

If you go over the limit amount it shuts down (kinda like a breaker shutting off). The idea being you then unplug whatever isn't necessary, then go outside to the box, hit a reset button and it comes right back on (again, kinda like resetting a breaker or fuse box).

Apparently the concern (why few companies use them) was that older people with limited mobility and memory would either forget how to do the reset, or not be able to get to the boxes to do so.

From what I've seen on it, the company never showed the guy how to use it in the first place.

I'm not sure if this guy really needed to be subsidized on heating thouugh. I guess when the cops entered the house there was cash laying around. It seems like he was having dementia and no one was checking on him, which is another problem in and of itself.