Is I/T the only category where characters constantly cross and redraw lines?

[8letters]

I'm an I/T writer and reader. In a lot of my stories, I have the two main characters constantly crossing lines in their relationship, drawing new lines, and then crossing the new lines. For example, in Dad's Bowling Night with Mom, the first crossing of the line is when the mom lets the son rub her bottom. New line is drawn. The son then convinces her to let him practice kissing with her. New line is drawn. And so on until they are fucking. It's a common thing to do in I/T stories.

Do other categories have stories that do this? Maybe First Time?

 

[lustychimera]

Healthy BDSM? No.

Unhealthy? Yes.

 

[SimonDoom]

I think they do. I write stories in I/T, so I know exactly what you are talking about, and I play around with "lines" all the time--edging up close to them, stepping over them, creating new lines, and then stepping over those as well. My "Hot Mom" chapter series was all about pushing and stepping over new boundaries with each chapter.

It can be done, and is done, in other categories as well. For instance, in another favorite category of mine, Exhibitionism and Voyeur. A woman will cross one boundary of exhibitionism, and then in the next episode go a little further and cross another boundary, until the exhibitionism becomes more and more bold and outrageous. Same thing with Fetish.

Not everybody is this way, but I personally find the concept of lines/boundaries very titillating and arousing, and from what I can see readers do too. It's a phenomenon that isn't confined to any particular category.

 

[intim8]

The son then convinces her to let him practice kissing with her. New line is drawn. And so on until they are fucking.

That sounds like just the standard progression applied to a situation where maybe the lines are more taboo than other lines.

I wouid think every genre has versions of those lines typical to it, or at least common.

E&V: someone would never take their clothes off other than in the bedroom or shower -> they're running around the town square completely naked. Or -> they got locked out of their house/apartment/hotel room naked.

First time: girl has a hymen (a very literal physical line), then that line is erased.

Group: They will only have sex with their partner -> they're doing a dare in a strip poker game/hot tub, or they're willing to let someone they trust join them just once, until it becomes a regular thing or with more people.

Etc. It seems that half the stories on this site across categories are about people crossing and redrawing their lines. Am I missing something?

 

[intim8]

Not everybody is this way, but I personally find the concept of lines/boundaries very titillating and arousing

Yeah, it's one of the main types of central conflict in stories here. And the tension is exciting.

 

[TheRedChamber]

It's what I'd call an escalation story. Things start simple and vanilla and then ramp up with each scene taking things a little bit further. And generally, you can do it with pretty much any of the themes on the site. If your story is always 'let's do this' - 'yes, that sounds wonderful' there's not going to be much dramatic tension. So lines are needed so it's exciting when they're crossed.

 

[AwkwardlySet]

Healthy BDSM? No.

Unhealthy? Yes.

I was going to mention D/s stories. I don't think I agree with your point there, though. "Healthy" D/s, the way I see it, has that line crossing quite often in the stories. It's often part of the seduction and not something that's actually being forced on the sub. It's the possibility to say no to that line-crossing in the future what makes the D/s relationship healthy, in my opinion. I am of course talking about stories only as I haven't got the faintest idea how such relationships work in reality.

 

[HeyAll]

Lesbian and loving wives.

I've always felt that taboo/lesbian/loving wives are the easiest stories to make hot. The taboo is already built in. Much of the work is done. Then to a lesser degree you have things like boss/employee or teacher/student. If you write Erotic Coupling where two people are equal, it's difficult to make it hot.

 

[OverconfidentSarcasm]

I'm an I/T writer and reader. In a lot of my stories, I have the two main characters constantly crossing lines in their relationship, drawing new lines, and then crossing the new lines. For example, in Dad's Bowling Night with Mom, the first crossing of the line is when the mom lets the son rub her bottom. New line is drawn. The son then convinces her to let him practice kissing with her. New line is drawn. And so on until they are fucking. It's a common thing to do in I/T stories.

Do other categories have stories that do this? Maybe First Time?

Yes, but outside the I/T category, the exact same progression path is called "flirting". Like in the real world when a relationship develops from platonic to romantic to sexual.

 

[intim8]

outside the I/T category, the exact same progression path is called "flirting

Do you mean that flirting only becomes line crossing in I/T? Or are you saying that flirting is also an example of crossing lines and redrawing them?

 

[lustychimera]

I was going to mention D/s stories. I don't think I agree with your point there, though. "Healthy" D/s, the way I see it, has that line crossing quite often in the stories. It's often part of the seduction and not something that's actually being forced on the sub. It's the possibility to say no to that line-crossing in the future what makes the D/s relationship healthy, in my opinion. I am of course talking about stories only as I haven't got the faintest idea how such relationships work in reality.

I'm not really into that scene other than what I've seen on forums and such, but from what I've heard, it sounds like in a healthy D/s relationship, there's a ton of communication, moreso than a more vanilla one in order to keep the abuse pretend.

Like I've heard people involved in that scene talk about putting up something like an activity board with things they both want to try. Kinda wild to think about.

I do disagree pretty strongly that just having the option to say no makes it consensual. Abusive relationships tend to be very manipulative. If you set a boundary and someone intentionally crosses it to fuck with you, then manipulates you into thinking that's what you wanted all along, that's a fucked up thing.

I think it's fine to explore that in a fictional setting. I mean, I've got a very dark and certainly depraved D/s story. But it's very much an abusive relationship.

Presenting that line crossing in its most idyllic setting really hides the nitty gritty reality of what's going on, but at its heart, it doesn't change what it is just because it's fictional.

 

[OverconfidentSarcasm]

Do you mean that flirting only becomes line crossing in I/T? Or are you saying that flirting is also an example of crossing lines and redrawing them?

I meant that, in most of the stories I read in I/T, it only seems like they're constantly crossing lines because of the taboo nature. If the characters whose romance I'm reading about weren't related, nobody would bat an eye about them becoming closer, eventually holding hands, kissing, sleeping next to each other, and, ultimately, sleeping with each other. If they weren't related, other characters may even express their exhaustion with how long it takes them. It's only because the characters aren't supposed to do any of these things, while simultaneously finding themselves unable to restrain themselves, that lines are drawn.

 

[8letters]

Yes, but outside the I/T category, the exact same progression path is called "flirting". Like in the real world when a relationship develops from platonic to romantic to sexual.

In my experience, couples who are transitioning from platonic to romantic to sexual don't make hard lines. They don't say, "We are only going to do kissing and touching forever." They say, "We're only going to do kissing and touching today, but we hope to do much more in the future."

LW
I can see what @HeyAll is suggesting - that a wife in a LW story makes a hard line with a male friend that they are only going to do kissing and touching forever, and then later decides to move beyond that line. I haven't read many LW stories, and none of the ones I've read are like that.

Lesbian
I could see stories where one character doesn't want to accept that she's sexually attracted to women, so she'll make the hard line that she's only going to kiss and touch with her female friend and then later decides to move beyond that line. The few Lesbian stories I've read haven't had that.

E&V
My impression is that we are talking about the main character making and then breaking their own lines. That's somewhat like what I'm talking about.

 

[AwkwardlySet]

I'm not really into that scene other than what I've seen on forums and such, but from what I've heard, it sounds like in a healthy D/s relationship, there's a ton of communication, moreso than a more vanilla one in order to keep the abuse pretend.

Like I've heard people involved in that scene talk about putting up something like an activity board with things they both want to try. Kinda wild to think about.

I've seen something along the same lines being mentioned in other threads when it comes to real-life D/s relationships. Yet stories are different. The lines are different, the setup is different. I believe that stories that involve both a healthy and realistic D/s relationship would be... boring.

 

[lustychimera]

I've seen something along the same lines being mentioned in other threads when it comes to real-life D/s relationships. Yet stories are different. The lines are different, the setup is different. I believe that stories that involve both a healthy and realistic D/s relationship would be... boring.

I agree with the last part. The stories are just another means to play pretend. If a fake story about abuse is wrong then certainly acting out fake abuse in real life is wrong. Doesn't seem like someone could just pick one and say the other is bad.

I disagree that stories are different. Just because it's fictional doesn't change what it is. It's playing pretend, but the definition of the words still apply.

Like if there was a story where some crazy lady locked a dude up in her basement, that'd still be kidnapping--even if the worldbuilding was set up so that was perfectly legal and normal in their world. It doesn't change our standards reading it. It only changes the perspective of the characters in the story. And again, i don't think a story like that is inherently wrong. It's just an extension of that fake D/s game except with a story that pretends it's real rather than whips in the bedroom.

 

[Britva415]

Surprised nobody has mentioned NonCon yet.

 

[Rob_Royale]

I think pretty much any story with a slow seduction would feature this.

 

[SimonDoom]

Surprised nobody has mentioned NonCon yet.

It's an interesting issue. I think of NonCon as more of an either/or category, but that might be because I haven't read as many of those stories. With EV, there are definitely degrees of exhibitionism. But are there degrees of non-con? I'm not familiar with stories that explore increasing degrees of non-con the same way EV stories do.

Doesn't mean it can't happen; I'm just not familiar with it and am curious about it.

 

[Britva415]

are there degrees of non-con?

With regard specifically to the way NonCon is formulated on Lit, due to the rules, the line has to be crossed or it wouldn't be NonCon, and the line has to be re-set, or it wouldn't be publishable here.

And it can happen in increments, like OP was talking about, but it's like the one category here where this dynamic can't be absent.

 

[John_Vandermeer]

What makes longer NC/R stories work is indeed the crossing of further and further lines. The horror of the victim that thinks things can’t get worse for them, yet they do.

 

[Abbafan]

I think that kind of thing goes on a lot with people who are devoutly religious.

Mormons are rumored to do things like "soaking" and "ATM'ing", which they rationalize is not actual sex. I've seen some videos by ex-Mormons who say that those things absolutely happen. I'd guess in a lot of cases it does turn to full sex. "We've already gone this far and we're getting married eventually anyway, so..."