Insecurities related to girlfriends past d/s

[MastersDelight]

MastersDelight, good advice! I've have to print these responses off. Might help me straighten my head out if I start getting uncomfortable with things. At least I can give a level headed response.

I guess it's not the done thing for a dom to show insecurity, lol.

You're allowed to have feelings. Insecurity included, I mean, you're human. It's all in how you deal with it. Talk with her, confide in her and she'll feel comfortable to do the same. Wallowing isn't very becoming.

 

[DivingJoy]

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[KinkyGuy1]

>It is likely that she has never had this done to her. If she had >abusive bastards as her Doms before no one thought to try >to establish if she had a limit on how many time she can >orgasm.

Well, I think she has had long sessions with her ex. He was a sadist though, so it was probably more in sub space than orgasms!

>On top of that if she does not want to continue she always >has a safe word.

She doesn't like using it, feels she's letting her partner down!

>The point here being that YOU decide what is going to >happen. She might tell you she would like this or that but it is >Doms decision on what to do. D/s not much about co->decision making point of being given power over someone is >that you exercise this power by taking decision. This is the >power exchange.

I get what you are saying however I suspect past experiences have made her more wary!

>>> I told her she had to say how hard she wanted to be flogged /spanked

>If you are asking her what she wants and then give it to her >then and there you are not taking responsibility over her. You >are likely making her unhappy. She does not want that kind >of decisions - most likely.

>She wants you to decide. You alone. Taking into account her >desire but still taking decision and ignoring her will if you >chose to.[/QUOTE]

Hmm, when i've pushed on when she's not so up for it, I can tell she's not enjoying it, if you know what I mean.

She needs to be up for it or I doubt it's going to have the desired effect. The thing is, I'm not able to tell because she doesn't tell me. I have to guess & I haven't known her long enough to instinctively know yet.

I don't enjoy it myself so much if I think she's not enjoying it!

 

[KinkyGuy1]

Awesome idiom.

>>> I guess it's not the done thing for a dom to show insecurity, lol.

Not so much. For sub to show insecurity then yes.

Well, i've probably lost some respect then.

We get on very well, even now, but the sex was far more intense in the beginning. She doesn't seem as keen these days. In fact, last night she was brushing my hands away from her breasts. I ignored this & grabbed them anyway. She also resisted lying on her back. She did have several orgasms after that, so maybe her pushing my hands away was her way of challenging me. She cuddled up to me tight which is always a nice way to sleep .

I am learning as I go along here!

 

[DivingJoy]

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[CutieMouse]

Well, i've probably lost some respect then. Not great!

This meme that dominants aren't allowed feelings, insecurities, struggles, bad days, etc is idiocy, and IMO built on fantasy.

Are you still dominant if you have a shit day at working don't feel like making more decisions when you get home?

Are you still dominant if you delegate? (You [pyl] choose what we do on date night.)

Are you still dominant if you pet dies and you're devistated?

Are you still dominant if you get the flu? Downsized? Lose a ton of &$ in the stock market? Disvover the house needs a new roof?

Dominants and submissives are still people, and relationships are still relationships.

 

[KinkyGuy1]

Can I ask, how did you learn, or did you instinctively know what to do?

I have plenty of common sense although she seems reluctant to give me feedback after. Maybe I need to instruct her to give me the feedback.

I have one more advice for you and it is I believe far more important then was I told you before:

READ about BDSM you should really learn more about this lifestyle. You can hurt her really badly without meaning to. You should understand this world much more then you currently do. It is fairly obvious you need much more education. You should put some real effort into this.

This forum will not resolve your problems.

Educate yourself it will quickly become obvious where the problem areas are.

You can find advice on reading material in this forum.

 

[KinkyGuy1]

Thanks Cutiemouse, I think that I needed to hear that.

 

[DivingJoy]

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[DivingJoy]

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[Collar_N_Cuffs]

I am not sure you get bdsm, Dom and grovelling - not happening

To the OP in regards to this statement.

This is not always true. If you are living the lifestyle 24/7, obviously don't grovel. Think of this as stopping in the middle of a scene and groveling, it just doesn't work. Incongruent. That much is true.

However, if you are only dominant in the bedroom and you want to worship her and grovel in your "spare time", so to speak, then please feel free. Especially if you think it would further your relationship. There's no reason why you can't follow your instincts and work in a little time to be yourself along with the D/s.

I had a relationship where I identified as the sub for sexual activities, but the rest of the time he worshipped at my feet. There's nothing wrong with that

Good luck, and keep communicating and BE YOURSELF!

 

[CutieMouse]

Well, i've probably lost some respect then.

We get on very well, even now, but the sex was far more intense in the beginning. She doesn't seem as keen these days. In fact, last night she was brushing my hands away from her breasts. I ignored this & grabbed them anyway. She also resisted lying on her back. She did have several orgasms after that, so maybe her pushing my hands away was her way of challenging me. She cuddled up to me tight which is always a nice way to sleep .

I am learning as I go along here!

Around here (my relationship), we operate on the principle of "enthusiastic consent"...

Maybe her breasts were tender because of hormones.
Maybe she had a previous bad experience with being grabbed.
Maybe laying on her back is uncomfortable, or more vulnerable than she likes.
Maybe you're focusing on "ZOMG has done kinky stuff! " and haven't considered/asked how much of it was consensual.

You've spent a lot of time focusing on her past (whore was the word I believe you used), but you've also suggested things that imply she may "shut down" in sexual situations. In other words... orgasm does not automatically = enjoyment.

You've said she has a hard time talking about kink/debriefing after/etc... my personal standard is to only do kink with people mature enough to communicate their wants, needs and boundaries. Which means she gets zero points for not using her words; you get zero points for forcing an activity (breast play) she was attempting to stop.

 

[KayceeCharles]

I think there's a misunderstanding here...

>>there's that risk that she could take a shine to someone else, someone more dominant & leave. I also fear that by not doing some of the stuff that she used to do, she will be tempted to seek it elsewhere.

That's not how D/s relationships work. Submissives don't just suddenly switch Doms because this Dom is MORE dominant than the old one.

But to explain that, I'll have to explain the submissive mindset, as a pure outsider (but with an interest in psychology). Those of you who are in the scene, please correct me if I go off the rails here.

Part of submissiveness is "willingness to please". You heard of the cliche: there are pleasers, and there are controllers. In very gross stereotypical way, pleasers want to satisfy others before they satisfy themselves, while controllers are the opposite, they want to control their circumstances and how others perceive them.

Society does NOT want us to be submissive. Society want us to go after what we want, dominate and control as much resources as possible.

Submissives are focused on others rather than themselves. Submissives take pleasure from pleasing others, in a certain sense. It is in their nature. And you can help a submissive be happy by letting her please you, in a way she's comfortable with.

Obviously, such tendencies and focus can be abused. That sounds like what her previous lovers did to her.

There are moments where anyone will have to be self-focused... for self-preservation. One can only bend over so far before they they decide they had enough. That's one reason why subs leave. (reason 1) (But it's also possible that their self-preservation was broken due to abuse, that's dangerous)

The other reason (reason 2) is they are not getting to be submissive enough to satisfy their urges. Which seems to be most of your fears, that you're not dominant enough.

But this is where your misunderstanding comes in. Your job, to be her lover, is to allow her room to express her submissiveness, on HER terms. You don't always need to be dominant / boss her around to do that. In fact, if you overdo it or do it wrong, you can end up driving her away (see reason 1).

Your job is to be WORTHY of HER TRUST in you to cherish that trust and not abuse it (unlike her previous lovers)

I know this sounds very... metaphysical. But you'll have to help her make you understand how to best bring out and express her submissiveness on her terms, and how you can encourage that to satisfy her innermost needs. It's NOT always sex-related.

In fact, I like to raise a possible scenario... Maybe she's NOT really submissive, but were "trained" into it by two abusive pretend doms. Her lack of after-briefing and her lack of expression on what she desires is a red flag, IMHO. And she seems she rather like the idea of being a regular GF, rather than a submissive. She referred to her past experiences because that's all she had to refer to.

You should NOT judge what she did by your standards. Ask her or read her body language on whether she ENJOYED doing those parties or other activities, no matter what your feelings are. You'll basically have to compile a dossier on her. Your job, as her lover, is to discover what she likes, and within your capability and willingness, deliver what she likes and help her enjoy.

 

[MastersDelight]

Thank you KC for saying it in a way I've been trying to convey but couldn't .

To add to that, she needs to be willing to fill you in on how she would like to serve you. If she can't or is unwilling, issues will arise. You aren't a mind reader.

If subs all flocked to the Domliest Dom there would be one person with all the subs while others were left in the dust.

 

[KinkyGuy1]

Around here (my relationship), we operate on the principle of "enthusiastic consent"...

Maybe her breasts were tender because of hormones.
Maybe she had a previous bad experience with being grabbed.
Maybe laying on her back is uncomfortable, or more vulnerable than she likes.
Maybe you're focusing on "ZOMG has done kinky stuff! " and haven't considered/asked how much of it was consensual.

You've spent a lot of time focusing on her past (whore was the word I believe you used), but you've also suggested things that imply she may "shut down" in sexual situations. In other words... orgasm does not automatically = enjoyment.

You've said she has a hard time talking about kink/debriefing after/etc... my personal standard is to only do kink with people mature enough to communicate their wants, needs and boundaries. Which means she gets zero points for not using her words; you get zero points for forcing an activity (breast play) she was attempting to stop.

She likes none consent too, I.e., being forced to do tasks she doesn't want to do, nothing extreme though. It would take time & we would Absolutely have to negotiate that one!

As regards to the breast play thing, all she had to do is tell me they were sensitive. She's not done that, push my hand away before, so I may have assumed incorrectly that she was playing at resisting. I will ask her anyway

Thanks

 

[cookiecat]

When it comes down to it, a relationship is just a relationship. Whether it's got the D/s attached to it just adds another layer but ultimately, you're two people who like each other and want to be together.

A couple other people said this already - her past is her past. All of her experiences brought her here to you. She's currently choosing to be with you. Unless her past has done some damage to her psyche, let that stuff go. Don't let your insecurity be a self fulfilling prophecy.

I dated a dominant whose ex was a fetish model. She was gorgeous. I'm kinda cute but... I was so intimidated by her looks, it seeped in to our relationship. I compared myself to her all the time. We broke up for a bunch of reasons but this was a big one. He got really tired of telling me she was his ex for a reason and he was with ME!

Back to the relationship stuff.... I was just having this conversation with some Lit girlfriends this morning. We realized we each had these relationships where after all the really awesome kinky dominant sex, orgasm, arousal sparkly new stuff wasn't as shiny it occurred to us we didn't really click with the other person!!

Oh wait, you like dogs? I love cats! You like country western music? I love death metal! You're a pagan? I'm a right wing Christian! You're a vegan? I love ribs!! You're credit rating is 480? Oh, that's a hard limit for me You're voting for Trump? Wait, what?!?

A relationship is just a relationship. You take out the garbage, pay bills, have kids (or not), do holidays with family, clean the bathroom, yada yada. When you choose to add the D and the s to it -- it's just another part of the relationship you talk about.

All the talk about trust, love, pleasing others, pleasing her, torturing her, abusive past... it's all part of the relationship you're choosing to build. Don't overthink this.

 

[MastersDelight]

She likes none consent too, I.e., being forced to do tasks she doesn't want to do, nothing extreme though. It would take time & we would Absolutely have to negotiate that one!

As regards to the breast play thing, all she had to do is tell me they were sensitive. She's not done that, push my hand away before, so I may have assumed incorrectly that she was playing at resisting. I will ask her anyway

Thanks

There's a difference between CONSENSUAL non consent. And just plain non consent. If she doesn't flat out say "I really like it when you make me do things I don't really want to do", you don't have consent. Example:

"I hate anal but I really like it when you tie me up and force butt stuff on me". Huston we are a go! That's consent!

"I hate anal". You proceed to tie her up and mess with her butt anyway. WRONG non consensual!

It sounds like the Doms she was with before we're more like the latter example. You don't want to be them.

 

[KinkyGuy1]

Thanks KC, you've struck a cord there. I think she is naturally submissive & initially when she offered to do things for me, I always said it's OK, I can do it myself.

Now, if she offers to do something, I let her most of the time, unless it's moving something heavy or a man job, lol.

She one picked up all our luggage & tried to carry it in the house. Well, I couldn't let her do that.

I need to get a grip & I think what you said has helped me see that it's not all about the sex, it's her. She does like to submit during sex though, she likes to be spanked etc I know this, she has told me some things.

She also likes the d/s play to be unexpected & unplanned sometimes as she thinks it's sexier. I can't possibly predict when I'm supposed to know though, not at this early stage anyhow!
I guess that I know when she's not that up for it, so maybe try & stop if it doesn't feel right.

 

[Primalex]

I am not a bad person

Most people don't start their day with the intention to be a bad person.

Just last night I expressed my displeasure at these private parties, it disgusted me, the thought of my partner being in some sort of orgy.

You are allowed to feel whatever you want (as you really have no choice about it), but you have to find the right way to express it - which means "OMG, you've been such a whore??! That's disgusting." is not an acceptable choice for a long term relationship. If you don't like the image of her fucking other people, it's fine to say that. But then you can't expect total honesty again, but have to live with the fact that you will get the censored version from there on. You can't have the cake and eat it, too.

How do I accept her past & let it go?

You cannot accept or not accept the past. You have to accept your feelings about it. Then you have to make the decision that your feelings about the past will not interfere with your current relationship. The past was not good enough, therefore you are the ultimate winner - unless you do something stupid.

I don't want to get married, have kids then end up breaking up, it would be gutting.

I think your perception about relationships is slightly broken. You cannot assume that if you live happily together for 3 years you will not break up 3 years later. Marriage and kids is (in my opinion) the result of a working relationship - not vice versa. "I need this relationship to work, because I want kids." is a bad approach. The question is only how much time you need to figure out if this relationship "works" - and which steps are necessary to determine this or which issues prevent doing the next steps. "I'm not buying a car, because I don't know if I will have a car accident and a car accident might seriously affect my life." is some dumb reasoning (unless you are 78 years old with Parkinson).

 

[Bramblethorn]

You've said she has a hard time talking about kink/debriefing after/etc... my personal standard is to only do kink with people mature enough to communicate their wants, needs and boundaries. Which means she gets zero points for not using her words; you get zero points for forcing an activity (breast play) she was attempting to stop.

this this this this this. For everybody's sake.

 

[KinkyGuy1]

Most people don't start their day with the intention to be a bad person.



You are allowed to feel whatever you want (as you really have no choice about it), but you have to find the right way to express it - which means "OMG, you've been such a whore??! That's disgusting." is not an acceptable choice for a long term relationship. If you don't like the image of her fucking other people, it's fine to say that. But then you can't expect total honesty again, but have to live with the fact that you will get the censored version from there on. You can't have the cake and eat it, too.



You cannot accept or not accept the past. You have to accept your feelings about it. Then you have to make the decision that your feelings about the past will not interfere with your current relationship. The past was not good enough, therefore you are the ultimate winner - unless you do something stupid.



I think your perception about relationships is slightly broken. You cannot assume that if you live happily together for 3 years you will not break up 3 years later. Marriage and kids is (in my opinion) the result of a working relationship - not vice versa. "I need this relationship to work, because I want kids." is a bad approach. The question is only how much time you need to figure out if this relationship "works" - and which steps are necessary to determine this or which issues prevent doing the next steps. "I'm not buying a car, because I don't know if I will have a car accident and a car accident might seriously affect my life." is some dumb reasoning (unless you are 78 years old with Parkinson).

The relationship is working in every respect, just my hang ups on the past I suppose. I will have to learn to accept those feelings of discomfort. Afterall, what you said is quite right. She is with me now & I should be glad of that. I am glad of that. I do love her because she's witty, funny, affectionate, thoughtful, sexy & sensible most of the time, lol.

I might have to make the private parties a hard limit for me until such time as I feel comfortable with it, if ever.

I felt that I should get involved in the kink scene, for her sake, but I'm clearly not ready for that yet. Perhaps feeling that I should has made me think about what it would be like & how am I going to cope with that? It's sort of put pressure on myself unecessarily & made me get worked up over it, thinking about her past & trying to fit in with what she might like .
I will wait till I feel more confident. Baby steps...

 

[ToPleaseHim]

Awesome idiom.

>>> I guess it's not the done thing for a dom to show insecurity, lol.

Not so much. For sub to show insecurity then yes.

Dominants are human, too, and absolutely allowed to have and show insecurity. When I think of some of the desires my Dominant partners and friends have shared with me, I am honored that they trusted me enough to share and be open. Expressing dark, deviant, and sometimes depraved fantasies can make one feel incredibly vulnerable.

 

[KayceeCharles]

You may want to buy a book or two on how to top and how to bottom.

I think there's the Topping Book and the Bottoming book on Amazon, if only to understand her mindset better.

Back to D/s psychology...

Part of a dom's duty is to read the sub's body language to determine their mental state. Some of the more extreme D/s relationships involves what's sometimes known as subspace (not Star Trek), where the submssive enters a sort of trance state via intense/erotic interactions with the dom, that left the submissive TOTALLY vulnerable, but the experience is such heightened due to brain chemicals that it's like a prolonged orgasm, where every sensation is magnified. Inexperienced doms sometimes accidentally forcing the sub into subspace, end up injuring the sub or allowed the sub to be injured due to inadequate monitoring.

This is why true non-consensual contact, or lack of communication before and after the session is VERBOTEN in mature D/s relationships. As many have pointed out, we are not mind readers. D/s developed safety mechanisms like safeword, traffic light, the ball drop, etc. to stop the interaction when it's no longer safe. It's both for your sake... and hers.

As many others explained, you forcing the breast play is BAD D/s etiquette. You don't know if she's really resisting because she really can't stand it, or she's just trying to "top you from the bottom" (i.e. goad you into a certain action). You forcing the issue by continue to play with her breasts can be interpreted by her as her own decision about her own body's pain response is wrong. This is can be dangerous to the sub in the long-run.

You should ask her her condition. A typical system is known as the traffic light system. Green is go ahead, yellow is proceed with caution, and red is "stop!" You have to ask her for her status periodically, until you can read her body and face directly. (THAT is also a part of dom's duty). When she waved your hands away from her breasts, you should have asked for the light, and figure a different way to play with her if she did not want to continue.

Obviously, you have to spot the "lying sub" as well, for some subs are so... "pliant" they will sacrifice their own self-preservation instincts to satisfy their dom. They may give a yellow even though they're really at red. But that's advanced Dom'ing topic, and since you don't seem to be into heavy pain play (an assumption on my part) this probably does not apply.

In the present, just don't do it when they start to show signs of resistance. It's supposed to be fun, after all. Switch to something else.

 

[KayceeCharles]

She one picked up all our luggage & tried to carry it in the house. Well, I couldn't let her do that.

In that case, order her to take a particular one (probably a lighter one).

Don't worry about her prior D/s. You need to get her to open up on HOW she'd like to serve you. You can try all sorts of things and see which oen she will or won't do, but that takes time. Hearing her past experiences can help if you quit being so judgemental about it.

Dom'ing is NOT about having an ego size of Texas. Dom'ing is accepting power and trust, and as the cliche goes, with great power comes great responsibility.

 

[MastersDelight]

You may want to buy a book or two on how to top and how to bottom.

I think there's the Topping Book and the Bottoming book on Amazon, if only to understand her mindset better.

Back to D/s psychology...

Part of a dom's duty is to read the sub's body language to determine their mental state. Some of the more extreme D/s relationships involves what's sometimes known as subspace (not Star Trek), where the submssive enters a sort of trance state via intense/erotic interactions with the dom, that left the submissive TOTALLY vulnerable, but the experience is such heightened due to brain chemicals that it's like a prolonged orgasm, where every sensation is magnified. Inexperienced doms sometimes accidentally forcing the sub into subspace, end up injuring the sub or allowed the sub to be injured due to inadequate monitoring.

This is why true non-consensual contact, or lack of communication before and after the session is VERBOTEN in mature D/s relationships. As many have pointed out, we are not mind readers. D/s developed safety mechanisms like safeword, traffic light, the ball drop, etc. to stop the interaction when it's no longer safe. It's both for your sake... and hers.

As many others explained, you forcing the breast play is BAD D/s etiquette. You don't know if she's really resisting because she really can't stand it, or she's just trying to "top you from the bottom" (i.e. goad you into a certain action). You forcing the issue by continue to play with her breasts can be interpreted by her as her own decision about her own body's pain response is wrong. This is can be dangerous to the sub in the long-run.

You should ask her her condition. A typical system is known as the traffic light system. Green is go ahead, yellow is proceed with caution, and red is "stop!" You have to ask her for her status periodically, until you can read her body and face directly. (THAT is also a part of dom's duty). When she waved your hands away from her breasts, you should have asked for the light, and figure a different way to play with her if she did not want to continue.

Obviously, you have to spot the "lying sub" as well, for some subs are so... "pliant" they will sacrifice their own self-preservation instincts to satisfy their dom. They may give a yellow even though they're really at red. But that's advanced Dom'ing topic, and since you don't seem to be into heavy pain play (an assumption on my part) this probably does not apply.

In the present, just don't do it when they start to show signs of resistance. It's supposed to be fun, after all. Switch to something else.

SO MUCH THIS THIS THIS!