Writer's Advice

[cantdog]

It reads very naturally. It has an eerie edge, too.

 

[Liar]

I tend to see the 3rd person narrator as that guy at the campfire who tells the story. If he is a boring git with no personality, the story can be however good, but it will still bore me. The narrator has a voice, a hint of core values that (s)he communicates though choice of ways to describe objects, events and people. When I write I can't help myself form letting the narrator take an active role, sometimes stepping out of the story to meta communicate with the reader. It is probably breacing all kinds of rules for regular prose, but it is a way to set a certain tone and mood.

#L

 

[Lauren Hynde]

It reads very naturally. It has an eerie edge, too.

Eerie is good.

 

[LadyJeanne]

Rosebuds do not particularly resemble assholes.

I think the masses would find "rosebuds" off-putting, too.

Pink rosebud, brown rosebud, and puckered rosebud are even worse than plain, old rosebud.

*shudder*

 

[angelicminx]

Bump for SJ!

 

[sophia jane]

Bump for SJ!

Hehe! I just found it myself. Thanks, Minx.

SJ

 

[cantdog]

SJ rocks

 

[sophia jane]

SJ rocks

What a nice threadjack.

On the topic- this is a great thread. Should definitely be archived or something to keep it handy for new writers.

SJ

 

[cantdog]

because new (or any) writers would decidedly need to hear from the likes of us.

 

[impressive]

because new (or any) writers would decidedly need to hear from the likes of us.

Damned straight!

 

[Black Tulip]

Damned straight!

Are you serious??? Not gay???



I'll give our Archiver a hint. LOL

 

[AH Thread Archiver]

Are you serious??? Not gay???



I'll give our Archiver a hint. LOL

She got it thanks, love.

This really is a thread full of gems. Cheers, Doc!

Lou

 

[Guest]

My top ten titbits for telling that tale. (Ok, yeah, I know, it's "show don't tell", but that would've fucked up my alliteration. )

1. Write what you'd want to read. If YOU get little enjoyment from writing it, what's the point? And what hope is there for the potential reader actually enjoying it? Believe in what you write and there is a very high chance the reader will believe you, too.

2. Don't force it! Go with the flow. Let the characters and the story come to life.

3. (Linked to 2.) Sod the plot! DO NOT spend hours agonising over notes and plans and character profiles and quite frankly (in my opinion) all that bollocks! Have faith in your own story-telling abilities. Have a basic story idea/scenario in your mind and just sit down and write the damn thing, and don't stop until you've told the entire tale (ok, so you might need the loo, or sleep, or food, or maybe even sex from time to time - especially if you're writing a novel, but you get my drift).

4. Just write it, dammit! Don't agonise over every word you use, and every sentence structure, just write the bloody story. Do not edit as you go; the first draft is just that. It's the time to get the story out. The second draft is where you go back and edit. And the third, which brings me to...

5. Don't over-edit. Stop tinkering with it. A story either works when you first write it, or it doesn't, and believe me, nine times out of ten it will.

6. Screw elaborate vocabulary. Call a spade a spade, or a cock a cock. Don't reach for the thesaurus when you already know which word fits best. Who cares if you've used the word cock three times in one paragraph? Don't be tempted to call it "his manhood", or "pulsating, purple-veined monster". It's a fucking cock! Or a dick, if you must. Same goes for everything, and not just sexual organs. If you are talking about a character stirring their tea, then they are using a spoon, not a "concave metal implement". Why call a cock by any other name, when you wouldn't a spoon?

7. Do not EVER feel intimidated by anyone else. We all have different life experiences, different skills, different vocabularies, different aspirations, even different levels of education (if I must go there), and one of the most important bits of advice I can give you is to write in a way that you feel comfortable. We all have valid tales to tell and we must never think "I'm not as good as him/her". You ARE good enough. For example, I don't go in for the imagery or wide and varied vocabulary that some do; I write in a very straight-forward and direct way. But, I can still tell a decent tale. I still feel valid as a writer.

8. Validate yourself. It's very tempting, I know, but don't feel the need to constantly pester people to read through your work, before plucking up the nerve to submit it to anywhere. Yes, by all means, show it to your loved one, or close friend, for a read-through, but it is YOUR story. You wrote it and you wrote it in the way you did for a reason: that's the way you wanted to write the thing, and that's the way that works for you! Believe in yourself.

9. Write a scene as you see it in your mind's eye. This is particularly important for complicated scenes (scenes involving three or more characters, scenes in a grand location, and so on). View the scene, and the actions of the characters, in your mind's eye, as if you were looking at it on a cinema screen. What can you see? What can you hear? Smell? Taste? Touch? Transfer all that into your characters and let it all come alive through them.

10. Keep it real, baby, yeah! This is especially important for the development of characters. They are real people, treat them that way. Give them a heartbeat, give them emotions, feelings, motivations, etc. Don't just write about two people fucking (while that is fun, it's not what I call a "story"). Why are they fucking? What are they feeling while they are fucking? And, make them believable and DO NOT make them do anything out of character. The reader will feel cheated, for example, if you have established that a certain character would never "take it up the wrong'un" - she's averse to it, it's something she'd never do. Then, later in the story she's on her knees going, "Oooh yeah, fuck me up the ass, big boy!" Ok, so, women change their minds, and maybe that was a slightly unrealistic example (I mean, who doesn't like a good, old fashioned butt-fuck? HA!), but you get the idea.

I could go on and on for twenty more points, but I'll give you a breather now. Just this one for luck...

11. HAVE FUN!!!!

Lou

P.S. We say "titbits" in the UK, cos we aren't prudes.

 

[Rubyb]

Your top ten (eleven) titbits rock!

You've even found a way to argue against the old saying "Too many cocks spoil the broth."

I think that anyone can use the word cock repeatedly and boldy, but for me one "pulsating, purple-veined monster" is one too many.

 

[elsol]

5. Don't over-edit. Stop tinkering with it. A story either works when you first write it, or it doesn't, and believe me, nine times out of ten it will.

If you're good, it will NEVER be good enough.

Most of the time, I just think 'It's time to move on to something new... post.'

Sincerely
ElSol

 

[Guest]

If you're good, it will NEVER be good enough.

Most of the time, I just think 'It's time to move on to something new... post.'

Sincerely
ElSol

I beg to differ. If you're good, you have a good story as a first draft (not only short stories, I mean novels, too), which only needs a little polishing during the second, and maybe third drafts. You also have faith in your own abilities, and hence your story.

I have never thought, "It will NEVER be good enough." I've thought, "Yep, I'm happy with that one... next!"

 

[dr_mabeuse]

A Word on This Advice

Remember that this advice isn't a set of rules. There are no rules in art. As soon as you say "Show don't tell", I can come up with a bunch of great stories that are all "told". Same for any "rule" here. These are nothing but techniques and insights that other writers have found useful. That's as close to rules as we can get, so there's no use arguing about whether these suggestions are always true or not. The question is whether they're useful or not.

Character:

--A character reveals him/herself by what they do, say, and think, in that order. You can tell us ad nauseum about how honest John is, but if we see him stealing from the collection plate, that's what we'll remember.

--Characters have conflicts. They're either struggling with themselves or with others or with the world outside. The conflict might be no more than fear of anal sex or wanting to get laid, but it's got to be there. Unconflicted characters are dull characters. They're the cardboard fuck-dummies of Lit.

--A good argument can be made that a story is the tale of an event that changes a character. If the character is the same at the end as he/she is at the beginning, then the story feels shallow and unsatisfying. Even a sexual encounter can change a character. the writer's job is to tell how that change came about.

--It's hard to say what makes a character attractive or interesting, but note that attractive and interesting aren't necessarily the same thing. It's nice to find a character who's attrractive, but it's also fun to run around with the devil for a while and see how he works.

--Characters with some defect or hidden pain are always more sympathetic than perfect ones. The 6'2" 190-lb hero with black hair and blue eyes who works out 4 times a week may make a great fuck-buddy, but it's doubtful that you're going to want to spend much time with a guy who makes you feel inadequate.

--One of the things I subconsciously think about when I start a story is: Do I want to spend some time following this character around? If he's that 6'2" hero, the answer is usually no. If it's a stock Lit cliche, the answer is also no. I'm really no longer interested in what happens to all the attractive young widows with adorable sons who show up every Christmas in the Lit Holiday contest, or the stuck-in-a-sexual-rut. negligee-buying wives from the Valentine's Day contests. (I seem to be in the minority on this though, as these stories always seem to win.)

--Characters are people. The same things we like and hate in people, we like and hate in characters. If your character's dull and lifeless, think of some people you know who aren't dull and lifeless and steal from them. What makes them bright and vital and interesting?

Others? What makes a good character in terms of content (what he/she is) and style (how the author shows it?)

 

[Black Tulip]

As for character, I agree that most figures in a story should have some flaw.
How can you ever identify with the perfect ... whatever?
Unless they start out as pure angels to become something more human along the way of course.

For me a story has to figure someone I'm willing to be. I want to be able to live the story in my mind. So that's what I try to do when I'm writing. Create people you can imagine yourself to be.



Does that make sense?

 

[Boota]

Character is my big thing. (Not that my Lit story shows much of what I'm talking about.) I don't feel the need to write down every little quirk and behavior of my characters into notes, but I have to absolutely know my characters inside and out. Once I've decided that one character has a particular quirk or speech pattern, I don't have to think about it anymore. It becomes natural to include it in the writing. I don't go back and think, "Bob would say this..." I just write what I already know Bob would say. Making up a character and knowing a character are two very different things.

As far as rules, I don't care for them. I write in first person a lot, so I find that I "tell" a lot. I know that is the "rule", but I don't care because telling was my intention all along. I've used all caps to denote screaming, even though I've been discouraged in doing this by some. They say it's just not supposed to be done. I don't care. My characters sometimes scream in all caps. (Internet speak is so pervasive now that I think it is becoming a little more acceptable in certain circles anyway. How long until writers start using smilies in text? LOL.) The extent of the rules I feel obligated to follow are spelling, grammar, punctuation. And even those are negotiable for the right reasons.

 

[Lauren Hynde]

If you think you're good, whether that is true or not, you'll believe that whatever you do it the right thing to do, whether that is true or not.

 

[dr_mabeuse]

Mysteries

This is something I learned that's so obvious to me now that I'm almost embarrassed to mention it. I leanred it after trying unsuccessfully to write a whodunnit story for the longest time.

The way you write a mystery is: You figure out the ending first! Once you know whodunnit, it's not that hard to sprinkle clues and red herrings throughout the story.

I actually used to try and start at the top, waiting till the end to figure out who did it. Wrong.

Elementary, really.

 

[rgraham666]

Of course, my dear Watson.

 

[Boota]

I always have the ending planned for a story before I ever put the first word on paper, regardless of genre. It might be a lack of faith in my own abilities, but I am very concerned with the idea of getting to the end of a story and having nowhere to go with it that makes sense. Then after the massive re-writes to fix it, the time I already spent working on it is virtually wasted effort.

Another thing about having the ending planned is that when it's a really good ending it keeps me driving toward it. I wrote every word in Mr. Undesirable just to get to the ending. I was so psyched to write it that I had to force myself not to just write the ending first. It's the same with my new book. I have such a clear vision of where I'm going that it keeps my focus on getting there. It helps when improvised situations arise as well, because it's easier to see connections that will work well tied to the ending.

In a nutshell, planning is very important to me. The trick is not to plan yourself bored.

 

[BlackShanglan]

Amen on the planning the ending first. Most important lesson I've learned yet.

(And Lauren is, naturally, quite right. We must be ruthless with ourselves if we wish to improve.)

 

[Black Tulip]

Amen on the planning the ending first. Most important lesson I've learned yet.
...

Exactly!