Why Does Humiliation Turm Me On?

[spartacus2000]

I don't want to pay $200.00 an hour to be psycho-analized so I thought I would ask the experts here at Lit.

Why does being humiliated by women turn me on? When I was younger I just didn't recognize it. But as I look back at experiences growing up I think I have always been turned on sexually by humiliation.

I remember hearing a song when I was a boy, I don't remember the name or much about it, but it had a line in it about a cruel women pouring water on a drowning man. I remember being very aroused by that song.

Growing up I was always attracted to girls/women that were cruel or manipulative. I enjoyed having them make me do little things for them and belittling me in front of their friends. I guess I enjoyed the attention and of course the humiliation.

Most all of my erotic fantasies involve humiliation in some form or another. Don't get me wrong, I don't want to be fixed. I enjoy my fantasies and up to this point I cannot see where they have harmed me or anyone else. I am just curious as to why this peculiarity attached itself to me?

Thanks for any feedback.

 

[chatbug]

Why does being humiliated by women turn me on? When I was younger I just didn't recognize it. But as I look back at experiences growing up I think I have always been turned on sexually by humiliation.

I remember hearing a song when I was a boy, I don't remember the name or much about it, but it had a line in it about a cruel women pouring water on a drowning man. I remember being very aroused by that song.

Just for fun I did a Google search to find the song. I found these songs just on the first two pages.

Elvis Costello, Pouring Water on a Drowning Man
John Cougar Mellencamp, Martha Say
Savannah, Heardhearted Hannah
Ruby Turner, You're Pouring Water on a Drowning Man
James Carr, Pouring Water on a Drowning Man

I have similar feelings about being humiliated by a woman. I've noticed that the younger and prettier the woman, the bitchier she can be and the more I'll allow her to humiliate me. I don't think that this is peculiar, although different men will have different levels of tolerance for humilation.

I suspect that the thought process behind enjoying humilation goes something like this. "She's a much better woman than I deserve, and she has what I want, so I have to (want to) put up with whatever shit she dishes out."

 

[Kajira Callista]

uhmmm i believe the term is a submissive masochist...if im wrong please correct me.

 

[NycCouple]

Didn't you get the memo? psychoanalysis is bullocks.

I won't proffer that I fully understand cases where people become interested in humiliation at later stages in their lives, but why is being a dominant or a submissive any different than being gay?

I believe you were born that way, there is no *reason* for you liking humiliation, you just like it, in full parallel to homosexuality. Is that hard to accept?

 

[Pure]

I suppose if a kid dropped dead at 15 you'd say that had 'no reason' also.

If you are a couple, or a member of one. I suppose you got together for 'no reason'... or were you 'born to get together'?

 

[NycCouple]

Apples and oranges.

You cannot compare tendencies or preferences that have existed from an early age to life events. It is easy to demonstrate that such tendencies (not just sexual, but also preference for some foods, games, etc.) often exist without correlation to environmental effects.

As for the examples you've brought, yes, if someone drops dead at age 15, there may be *causes* that we can understand (they had cancer, or heart failure, or the killed themselves), but there is no *reason*.

Finally, we're obviously together first and foremost due to luck - we happened to cross paths at some point in time. It would have been just as likely that we would be with others today and although we're extremely happy together, it's impossible to say how those alternatives would compare.

 

[Pure]

Hi Spartacus,

you said in part,

Growing up I was always attracted to girls/women that were cruel or manipulative. I enjoyed having them make me do little things for them and belittling me in front of their friends. I guess I enjoyed the attention and of course the humiliation.

Most all of my erotic fantasies involve humiliation in some form or another. Don't get me wrong, I don't want to be fixed. I enjoy my fantasies and up to this point I cannot see where they have harmed me or anyone else. I am just curious as to why this peculiarity attached itself to me?

Below are just my speculations, and inquiries. I do not have answers for a specific situation that I don't know.

While it's possible there's genetic predisposition (which is not quite what NYCcouple suggest), the other possibility is that besides any leanings, there were critical events. After all, what determines a great liking for freshbaked bread, or a hatred of broccoli.

Analysts make money helping to construct *sometimes* plausible explanations, but psychologists in general do acknowledge such processes as *modeling. I.e., did you see (the undergoing of) humiliation in anyone, esp. a parent, esp. a father, around you?
Did you see women, like mother, aunts, etc. being harsh (i.e., possibly sadistic) to others, esp. hubbies, or male kids.

Consider also the element of attention, which every child craves. Did attention get bestowed with putdowns or harshness, even humiliation? I.e., did people get attention, BUT always along with a putdown or demeaning event?

Also, aside from parents, there are other influences that create a kind of cycle: i.e., reading about humiliations and whacking off; that reinforces any tendencies.

As another poster mentioned, your degree of success in other modes is relevant. I.e., if a person succeeded in sexual terms with some sexy but very kind, understanding (more commonplace, in leanings) women, then that (commonplace) alternative would become more attractive. Iow, some who've gotten into deviancy have not succeeded well in 'normal' interactions, and once that process starts, it's again a vicious cycle: with less success in 'normal' sexual encounters, the person comes to lack skills (that most develop), and becomes more doubting and inept; hence turns elsewhere, esp. in fantasy.
And fantasy can be pretty satisfying.

So there are many possibilities, and definite knowledge may be elusive. One currect question, however, is, Is the deviant tendency capable of being fulfilled in an otherwise satisfying life? Or does it affect or undermine 'normal' satisfactions. In the shrinks' terms, does it affect your ability to have satisfaction in love (including orgasm) and in work (Leben und Arbeiten).

J.

PS. there is one point on which I likely agree with nyccouple, and that is the usefulness of saying "I'm just born so." This is what many gay persons say, and who the fuck knows? BUT this view--true or false-- does generally encourage self acceptance, since nothing you DID is thought to be the cause. And self acceptance is always a good thing, especially in those who are 'different' for any number of unknown reasons.

 

[NycCouple]

PS. there is one point on which I likely agree with nyccouple, and that is the usefulness of saying "I'm just born so." This is what many gay persons say, and who the fuck knows? BUT this view--true or false-- does generally encourage self acceptance, since nothing you DID is thought to be the cause. And self acceptance is always a good thing, especially in those who are 'different' for any number of unknown reasons.

That is one way of looking at it. Another way is that it removes a person's ability to feel victimized - "I am such a pervert because that's who I am, not because of my mother" could be difficult for persons to accept, which is why they might turn to a shrink.

To clarify, I do not advocate the use of innate properties as justification, but rather as explanation for many cases.

From a personal perspective, both myself and my partner can clearly remember detailed fantasies of submission from a very early age (4-6), despite the fact that we both grew up in fairly "normal" environments. I have heard the same from others, but as I said in my original post, many of us did not develop these tendencies until later in life, which I do not claim to understand.

psychoanalysis, unfortunately, is still bullocks

 

[spartacus2000]

Thanks

Wow, what great responses. I reallyappreciate all the input.

Like I said I didn't realize I had this proclivity until a few years ago but now realize that I probably have had it for most of my life.

One thing that is essential for me is that the woman humiliating me must enjoy it. In other words if the person was just angry or disgusted by it, I would't find that sexually exciting. The fact that they derive pleasure and amusement at my expense is what really tuns me on.

There were some instances that happened when I was young but I am afraid Lit would not want me to go into that here. Nothing horrible or anything, just some early episodes of D/S at a young age.

Thanks again, you guys are great!

 

[blue eyed muse]

i know i very much appreciate the feel of vulnerability and a little bit of humiliation.
i model for artists and art classes and the feel of everyone staring at/drawing my naked form makes me feel so exposed and vulnerable. it turns me on a bit.

it strips away everything but me. tis a rather freeing experience.

mayhaps thats another reason why you like it so much.

 

[arljjc]

I used to think when I was younger that it was a way of escaping real life. I know it goes way back because I remember wanting to be Cinderella until the prince came along and screwed things up.

As I get older it is something I want more and more and like you don't really know why. My wife and I tried trading roles once, I was in charge. It was no fun at all, lasted about an hour then I wanted to go back to her being the boss in all things.

She does not quite grasp the humiliation thing, hard for her to understand therefore hard for her to carry out.

 

[NycCouple]

In this context, it is probably worthwhile to note the philosophical difference between those who enjoy certain acts inflicted on them and will request or even demand these from their partners and those, who like spartacus, take pleasure in the knowledge that such activities please the partner.

I would conjecture, although I do not know the statistics, that members of the first group, who in libertine terms may actually be considered sadists rather than masochists, are quite often those who lead a vanilla life and use the services of a professional Dominatrix.

 

[Netzach]

I wouldn't conjecture, being a professional who gets a huge charge out of worrying the worms.

Ego stomping with a smile.

A lot of "client" types are really not that manipulative, they just don't have an outlet, and are willing to shortcut the grinding search...

for a chick who likes to stomp egoes and hasn't already got a worm of her own, or realizes that there's a whole world of male ego out there in need of a trained steamroller.

 

[NycCouple]

for a chick who likes to stomp egoes and hasn't already got a worm of her own, or realizes that there's a whole world of male ego out there in need of a trained steamroller.

I dunno eternity, I enjoy stomping male and female egos the same (but I dislike a hairy body, giving females a slight advantage...)

 

[Pure]

nyccouple said,

In this context, it is probably worthwhile to note the philosophical difference between those who enjoy certain acts inflicted on them and will request or even demand these from their partners and those, who like spartacus, take pleasure in the knowledge that such activities please the partner.

Fancy talk, fairly opaque. But yes, there is a difference--not sure why it's 'philosophical'-- between the likes of Sade, who both inflicted and ordered infliction on himself, and our Spartacus. Sade, we'd now call sado-masochist, or popularly, 'switch.'

Spartacus is an unknown quantity, but the alleged 'knowledge' that such activities please the partner' is fairly dubious in most situations. There is a rarity of female 'out' sadists, but an abundance of female pros who'll go through the motions.

Hence your saying: I would conjecture, although I do not know the statistics, that members of the first group, who in libertine terms may actually be considered sadists rather than masochists, are quite often those who lead a vanilla life and use the services of a professional Dominatrix.

where it's clear, seems entirely dubious. To take concrete examples, Sade himself, falling in your first group, mostly preferred pliant-type young semipros, and only in a minor way led a 'vanilla' life (wife, kid). Spartacus, though a bit of a mystery, is, imo, far more likely, for reasons above, to end up with a pro.

He would, I conjecture, 'live with' her lack of real pleasure, the same way most men 'live with' lack of a prostitute's pleasure; the fantasy in the customer's mind, and the woman's shamming being mostly adequate.

J.

PS: I don't know what 'libertine terms' are, or how they would define(or address) 'sadism', since libertines existed centuries before 'Sadism' was defined by Krafft Ebbing (19th century), and other sexologists, including Freud (early 20th), and others.

 

[DarkLadyOfDeath]

( I know this sounds contradictory... But think about it for a few minutes)

Humiliation 'n Sadism... are almost two compleately different things... one is the abuse of ones mind the other of their body to put it in more lamen terms. I can honestly Admit to being a sado-masochist myself. I draw my pleasure from the pain I experience, I have little use for "pleasure" in itself. to be blunt and put it into the most easily understood way. I can not have an orgasm without pain being inflicted and bringing me to that edge, and over it. And It's not just sex that makes me who I am. I enjoy pain.. giveing.. receiving.. witnesssing..

It began with humiliation for me too, understanding not only that I enjoyed being humiliated... but humiliateing others.. It amused me... More then anything else.. the though or the act of seeing the emotional distress in others. I enjoyed seeing the pain in it.. you seem to enjoy the simple fact of being subjigated... submitting. of your selfless giveing to another of their enjoyment. Something I would personally find no pleasure in doing, I fight such things and force those that try to beat me into submission or give up after we are both "battered and bruised".( this is why I stopped trying to be a sub..)

I suppose the whole meaning of what I'm saying is Be who you are, and try and understand that. Don't try and put labels on it.. Labels can help others to understand who you are.. But you can't explaine that unless you know who you are?...

Why are people so worried about labeling themselves?...

I know I'm a Domme Bi Bitch who's hell on wheels...

Who are you?

 

[NycCouple]

In this context, it is probably worthwhile to note the philosophical difference between those who enjoy certain acts inflicted on them and will request or even demand these from their partners and those, who like spartacus, take pleasure in the knowledge that such activities please the partner.

Fancy talk, fairly opaque. But yes, there is a difference--not sure why it's 'philosophical'-- between the likes of Sade, who both inflicted and ordered infliction on himself, and our Spartacus. Sade, we'd now call sado-masochist, or popularly, 'switch.'

That was not what I meant. De Sade in his writing repeats the theme that the masters, while they sometimes enjoy acitivies we would consider masochistic in today's terminology (e.g. the four monks eating the feces of young ladies they capture), require that everything be done to please them, while no attention is paid to the wishes of the submissives/masochists. The essence of sadism is in that perversion of relationship, taking the victim's superego out of the equation - sometimes by force in his days, by agreement today. What you now call a 'switch' has precious little to do with whether the switch is a sadist/masochist or master/slave in Sade's world (and I really have no idea what the correct terms would be - never read the English translation of any of his work, not that he even uses such terms in French much).

spartacus' (or his reflection here) is, imho, a modern day version of Sade's submissives/slaves/victims - he is a willing victim, as unwilling victims are not currently allowed, but still focuses on the master's pleasure.

In the same sense, the Pro Domme in this scenario is sometimes a victim/submissive.

Why is this "philosophical"? Because clearly the beatings he will receive feel the same, whatever role the Domme is playing

where it's clear, seems entirely dubious. To take concrete examples, Sade himself, falling in your first group, mostly preferred pliant-type young semipros, and only in a minor way led a 'vanilla' life (wife, kid).

You cannot take his behavior given the social norms of the time and project it on current social structures.

PS: I don't know what 'libertine terms' are, or how they would define(or address) 'sadism', since libertines existed centuries before 'Sadism' was defined by Krafft Ebbing (19th century), and other sexologists, including Freud (early 20th), and others. [/B]

You are correct. That was not a very accurate term to use, but clearly you are somehow insulted by my attack on psychoanalysis and therefore trying to discredit every point I make, even if inaccuracy does not obfuscate the main point.

 

[spartacus2000]

I am somewhat hesitant to inject myself in this discussion, since it is obvious that most of you know much more about this topic than I probably ever will. But having said that, I would like to add a little to what I have already said.

I don't particularly like physical pain, at least not pain being inflicted to the point where I felt I had to fight back out of some sort of self defense. I'm not sure I quite agree that being physically punished to the point where you feel you must fight back is humiliation. I would call this abuse.

The humiliation I crave and find myself fantasizing about has much more to do with a bruised ego than bruised ribs. I do, howewver, fantasize about CBT, and the pain inflicted there is certainly a major part of the humiliation. But I would not be aroused if the punishment was overly severe.

I seek more degrading less physical types of domination; i.e. ass-worship, golden showers, public humiliation, strap-ons, ect....I don't enjoy dressing like a woman, I do not find that exciting or even that humiliating, just kind of silly. Not my thing.

Thanks again to all of you, your responses are very helpful and well thought out. I didn't know there were so many Mensa membrs in Lit.

 

[Netzach]

The Submissive Pro, your Burger Your Way

I suppose a waiter is a submissive.

And an auto mechanic is a submissive.

And a lawyer is a submissive.

As is any schmuck who has to sometimes pretend to like what they are doing when they take your money but would rather be on the beach in Turks and Caicos.

But then I personally see "submissive" as a D/s SMBD orientation, not a temporary position and cetainly not one where you get paid for your efforts, usually.

 

[NycCouple]

Re: The Submissive Pro, your Burger Your Way

Seeing this as a job like any other job is fair and assists in the observation that restaurants in this country compare to those in France as real dominance compares to that offered for money

As is any schmuck who has to sometimes pretend to like what they are doing when they take your money but would rather be on the beach in Turks and Caicos.

 

[Netzach]

I would argue that restaurants in france compare to those in this country as Dominance by a good pro with real lifestyle interest compares to Dominance offered by a pro who doesn't get it.

You're still paying for those frites, pal, they happen to be better because someone cut them up by hand.

 

[Netzach]

BUT to pull this back from the giant Hijack, I would let spartacus2000 know that myriad men and women out there get off on humiliation.

I don't think every sexual proclivity has some linear and clear explanation, and I don't think psychoanalysis is complete bollocks either, as I've spent time and dough on the couch and benefitted from it, ultimately. It's true that psychoanalysis is a pretty shitty way to try and understand your sexuality, because you have to navigate the thorny thicket of the professional's hangups.

For a lot of people, men expecially, in my experience, humiliation and degredation are a means of balancing. There's a lot of power and control in every day life, you know, your typical lawyerdoctor kind of thing, or there's less professional "power" as we percieve it, but there's still a lot of stress and many stressors. I myself have found certain degrading kinds of play as a bottom to be an exceptional release, one which I rarely seek out but have on occasion. It was incredibly freeing to spend an evening in a white corset, running round on all fours, drooling, as G's rather stupid and excitable 1 year old saluki. Sometimes, this postmodern world is a bit much, and sometimes fetching your squeaky toy for an evening is the perfect balm for the soul. I digress...

but you probably get the point.

When you're degraded when you aren't tied up so much in your ego, when you feel that giddy transgressive feeling as you suddenly look down on your ego and see that it doesn't matter, I think you begin to realize self-worth based on things that are more essential, less measurtable than "I'm rich, I'm smart, I'm beautiful"

and when you find someone trusted to do the dirty deed and they collect you in their arms afterwards and say you did a good job, as my puppy handler did, you feel loveable for reasons other than your capability, your brilliance, your money, your dick, your whatever.

So I've found it to work.
'Scuse me, nother batch of frites to dunk.

 

[Limbhugger]

Short on time just now but wanted to chime in as a fellow humiliation slut. Don't confuse degradation with humiliation though.

You may also want to research this in the Library thread at the top of the forum. That's probably already been suggested.

Will try to write more about my own experiences when time allows. Just know you are not alone.

LH

 

[catalina_francisco]

Humiliation is different things to different people and often has different motivational factors. One thing for sure is those of us who enjoy it can find a multitude of experiences to live out with someone who understands and is just as willing to accommodate. Thought these threads might be of interest to you and provide some of what you seek. Have fun. :

Catalina

https://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=139178

https://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=225723

https://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=223340

https://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=203983

https://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=197682

https://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=187040

https://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=72340

https://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=202066

https://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=105924

https://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=178443

https://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=101505

 

[spartacus2000]

Once again I thank you all for your input. I am starting to learn a few things here and I am grateful.

Catalina, I really appreciate the links to other threads that you provided. I started reading through them and I think they will be very helpful.

I know I must seem lost here, using the wrong terms and all but it is all very new to me, at least the acceptance of it. Now I wish to understand it better and hopefully come to enjoy it.

Thanks again, I have a lot of reading to do.