Votes removed?

[TarnishedPenny]

April Fools was weird. Huge sweep that caused two stories to jump way up in score. Like .3 points for one, and .2 for another one. One of them wasn't even an April Fools sudmission.

Unless being done on an individual account, by request, it looks like all stories are swept, whether or not they are entries in an event.

 

[Zenith77]

I had a 1- bomb on a story I was tracking votes on that was kinda obvious against a background of ~50 all-5s-save-for-two-4s, and it wasn't swept. Was hoping it would be; bit irritating.

 

[alohadave]

I had a 1- bomb on a story I was tracking votes on that was kinda obvious against a background of ~50 all-5s-save-for-two-4s, and it wasn't swept. Was hoping it would be; bit irritating.

Not every 1 vote is a bomb, even if we don't like them.

 

[Zenith77]

Not every 1 vote is a bomb, even if we don't like them.

Sure.

What would you call a 1-vote that is the only vote out of ~50 votes that is not a 5, barring 2-3 others that are 4s?

An honest reflection on the quality of my writing? Presumably not.

A mis-fit based on category? Possible, though this was a chapter within a series... not to mention that as the issue lies therefore with the reader, and not the author, I'd still call that an invalid vote.

What 'legitimate' reasons are there for a 1-vote, assuming decent writing quality and correct category? Genuine question.

 

[alohadave]

What 'legitimate' reasons are there for a 1-vote, assuming decent writing quality and correct category? Genuine question.

They didn't like your story.

It's impossible to know why people vote how they do, and kind of pointless to worry about.

 

[ElectricBlue]

Unless being done on an individual account, by request, it looks like all stories are swept, whether or not they are entries in an event.

Correct. The sweeps go through the whole data file, from what I can see. Some of my oldest stories (coming up for ten years here) have score movements on occasion, as spurious votes disappear.

Whenever a contest sweep runs, my most recent stories nearly always lose a vote or two - I've usually see a one-bomb or two on every story within the first 24 hours, regardless whether the story is in a contest or anthology.

 

[TarnishedPenny]

They didn't like your story.

It's impossible to know why people vote how they do, and kind of pointless to worry about.

That’s the simplest answer, of course, and a very common one, yet it leads to a small landslide of ‘buts’.

Top of the list - I’m trying to picture myself reading all the way through a story I really dislike. I did that back in university (did anybody really enjoy Moby Dick?), but why would I waste ten minutes, let alone an hour, plodding through something I find insipid or plot-deficient when there are so many others available? If something’s not to my taste, I drop it and move on and I seriously doubt I’m that atypical. Yet, to be a legitimate comment, the one-voter must have read the whole tale. I can see hitting a 4 or even a 3, but a 1 is a clear statement: “I hated it!”

Publishing houses pay people to read submissions, some of which are inevitably poor. Students are obliged to read things they may not like. Critics have to read some trash on occasion. Here? Illogical, captain, most illogical.

Moreover, the likelihood of a 1 vote being legitimate drops with the length of the tale. An entry for a 750 word special takes a couple of minutes to read, so maybe, but with long stories? Not so much.

So, no. I see where you are coming from but IMO, 1’s are more commonly deliberate, spite-driven troll dumps than not.

I’m not losing any sleep over them; they’re just part of the game, but I don’t take them as serious, valid feedback, either.

YMMV, of course.

 

[ElectricBlue]

I had a 1- bomb on a story I was tracking votes on that was kinda obvious against a background of ~50 all-5s-save-for-two-4s, and it wasn't swept. Was hoping it would be; bit irritating.

It probably met the criteria for a legitimate vote. Just because it's a one, doesn't mean it will automatically disappear. By the same token, not every five stays, either. One-bombers and not so helpful high fives might be stupid, but the site can see what they're doing. With a little thought, so can you.

 

[ElectricBlue]

So, no. I see where you are coming from but IMO, 1’s are more commonly deliberate, spite-driven troll dumps than not.

I agree, but there would appear to be some really dedicated folk out there. We even have a few here, who say they must always finish a book once they have started reading it, even if they're not liking it, which just sounds dumb to me. Why would you continue doing something you're not enjoying? But people do.

 

[djrip]

It probably met the criteria for a legitimate vote. Just because it's a one, doesn't mean it will automatically disappear. By the same token, not every five stays, either. One-bombers and not so helpful high fives might be stupid, but the site can see what they're doing. With a little thought, so can you.

I don't really get the 5 sweeps. I mean a 5 could be illegitimate if maybe someone is using alts to give themselves a bunch of 5's from the same IP, but otherwise... I'd be annoyed if I enjoyed a story, went to the trouble of giving it a 5, and then had that swept.

I can imagine someone going through dozens of new stories every day to 1 bomb them with a few seconds on each, and it makes sense to sweep that kind of activity. But are there really people doing that with 5's? Just indiscriminately 5 bombing large numbers of stories with a few seconds on each? I have a hard time believing it.

 

[ElectricBlue]

I don't really get the 5 sweeps. I mean a 5 could be illegitimate if maybe someone is using alts to give themselves a bunch of 5's from the same IP, but otherwise... I'd be annoyed if I enjoyed a story, went to the trouble of giving it a 5, and then had that swept.

I can imagine someone going through dozens of new stories every day to 1 bomb them with a few seconds on each, and it makes sense to sweep that kind of activity. But are there really people doing that with 5's? Just indiscriminately 5 bombing large numbers of stories with a few seconds on each? I have a hard time believing it.

Years ago (before your time here, I think), contests were subject to a lot of shenanigans, including author fans being "helpful" and loading up stories with multiple high votes. I can recall some writers saying, "Please don't do that," but other writers clearly encouraged it. It was one of the reasons sweeps were introduced, I believe, to help level the playing field. It happened then, I think it still happens now, on occasion. Fans don't change that much!

 

[djrip]

Years ago (before your time here, I think), contests were subject to a lot of shenanigans, including author fans being "helpful" and loading up stories with multiple high votes. I can recall some writers saying, "Please don't do that," but other writers clearly encouraged it. It was one of the reasons sweeps were introduced, I believe, to help level the playing field. It happened then, I think it still happens now, on occasion. Fans don't change that much!

I guess for a contest that makes sense.

 

[Zenith77]

They didn't like your story.

It's impossible to know why people vote how they do, and kind of pointless to worry about.

I'm afraid I don't buy that. Besides, even if true, that's a '2', and not a '1'.

No. In this particular case - and it's one that many of us have experienced - we have a reader who has recorded a legitimate vote on a story that has an overwhelming positive response. They've understood that they need to go through the whole story or have their vote rejected, and they've done so - reading or scrolling, makes no difference - and voted 'I hate it' anyway.

It is either pre-meditated or deliberately malicious. It's not a knee-jerk reaction or a genuine response (not least because this particular story was >15k words).

Irrespective of my own personal circumstances, there is no justification for a 1-vote on any story that tracks an overwhelmingly positive response. A '2', maybe. A '3', possibly. '4's? All day long. But a '1'? That's just out to damage, and for that reason and that reason alone, it is definitively a '1-bomb'. It is not a valid vote, in the sense of it being a fair vote. But neither can you sweep every vote that doesn't fit some model, and I get that too.

The '1-bomb' discussion is as old as the forum so I'll leave it there.

There's no perfect answer, because the question isn't really about 1-bombs, it's about humans being dicks to one another. I suspect, as an issue, that may be here to stay.

 

[Lorelei907]

…and authors can request one if they feel they’re being targeted by down-voting trolls (‘one-bombing’).

Wish I’d known about that.

 

[TarnishedPenny]

As an afterthought, one of my earlier stories brought a lot of similar comments, basically that it was pretty good but they didn’t like the ending. Fair ball and I’m willing to accept their lowered response. They weren’t handing out 1s, on the other hand.

 

[TarnishedPenny]

Wish I’d known about that.

Go to any of your stories and report it using the icon at the bottom right corner of the page. You’ll get a raft of reasons, but hit Other and asks for a sweep. Usually it works. Good luck.

 

[TarnishedPenny]

I guess for a contest that makes sense.

I think there are a number of well-intentioned fans out there, ones who are just trying to support favourite authors, in or out of contests. It’s not kosher, but I’m sure it happens.

 

[ElectricBlue]

Wish I’d known about that.

Or you can wait, and you'll get the benefit of the next contest sweep that goes through. A story doesn't have to be in a contest to get swept.

 

[Lorelei907]

Go to any of your stories and report it using the icon at the bottom right corner of the page. You’ll get a raft of reasons, but hit Other and asks for a sweep. Usually it works. Good luck.

Thank you, maybe I will. I submitted a story that I put a lot of heart and soul into and felt I had a very nice story, and so say the comments on it. The day after it was released it had a score of 4.78. I was ecstatic! By the next day it dropped to the low 4.X and within a couple of days it was like 3.7 or so. I was heartbroken. I realized at that time that the comments were more important to me than the score or getting the coveted H.

It’s since come up to over 4.5 but it took almost a year or so.

 

[RejectReality]

Just because a vote survives 1, 2, 3, or a dozen sweeps doesn't mean it won't eventually go away. Some bad actors are more careful than others. Most of them either slip up eventually, or someone else doing the same thing ends up using their MO more sloppily and gets them both wiped.

As to fans, I keep repeating this over and over again. If you believe you don't have fans, you're wrong. If you have a couple of stories out with more than a handful of votes, you have fans. Once you have fans, you inevitably have at least one who is "just trying to help you out", and assumes you approve of it if you don't discourage it clearly and consistently. The sweeps are not kind to you so long as those overzealous fans are using unsophisticated methods of boosting you and dragging down those they view as your competition.

 

[TarnishedPenny]

Lorelei - A drop is sort of common after initially scoring well in my experience, but that does sound rather sharp. Good luck.

 

[alohadave]

I'm afraid I don't buy that. Besides, even if true, that's a '2', and not a '1'.

It doesn't matter if you buy it or not. 1 star is a valid vote and you don't get to dictate the criteria that voters use to vote.

 

[Zenith77]

Just because a vote survives 1, 2, 3, or a dozen sweeps doesn't mean it won't eventually go away. Some bad actors are more careful than others. Most of them either slip up eventually, or someone else doing the same thing ends up using their MO more sloppily and gets them both wiped.

As to fans, I keep repeating this over and over again. If you believe you don't have fans, you're wrong. If you have a couple of stories out with more than a handful of votes, you have fans. Once you have fans, you inevitably have at least one who is "just trying to help you out", and assumes you approve of it if you don't discourage it clearly and consistently. The sweeps are not kind to you so long as those overzealous fans are using unsophisticated methods of boosting you and dragging down those they view as your competition.

And there I'd just figured my mum had found my Lit account. Your explanation makes much more sense.

 

[Zenith77]

It doesn't matter if you buy it or not.

Hmm.

1 star is a valid vote and you don't get to dictate the criteria that voters use to vote.

Yep, I know. I even said as much in the post you just quoted.

 

[alohadave]

Hmm.

Yep, I know. I even said as much.

And then you went on to rant how it's not justifiable to vote 1 unless to bomb the story.