The world is a safer place because Israel takes action and is willing to pay the price that no one else would.

[ll74]

https://www.politico.com/news/2025/...-water-reactor-state-television-says-00414190
The Israeli’s 8 hrs ago bombed an operating nuclear power plant's reactor containment building with bunker buster bombs
Radiation is spewing from the facility poisoning the environment for centuries......
Side note..... the world whined and sniveled about the Russians and zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant being attacked.
Where is the world now no one is condemning or for that matter even concerned about this. Where is the gnashing of teeth, the United nations, folks this is a blatant war crime...this shit is spewing into the air we all will eventually breathe..

Iran has continued to call from Israel's destruction, publicly without any hesitation.

They could have changed their position and have chosen not to.

Nothing about that is Israel's fault.

 

[PersonalFavors]

https://www.politico.com/news/2025/...-water-reactor-state-television-says-00414190
The Israeli’s 8 hrs ago bombed an operating nuclear power plant's reactor containment building with bunker buster bombs
Radiation is spewing from the facility poisoning the environment for centuries......
Side note..... the world whined and sniveled about the Russians and zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant being attacked.
Where is the world now no one is condemning or for that matter even concerned about this. Where is the gnashing of teeth, the United nations, folks this is a blatant war crime...this shit is spewing into the air we all will eventually breathe..

That plant is under construction. Not operating.

 

[HisArpy]

“All sides are bad” arguments are morally bankrupt. Refusing to draw distinctions between good and evil lets bad actors like Republicans and the leadership of Iran off the hook.

All sides in war are indeed bad. Saying so shouldn't ever be.

BTW, when you say your side is "good" and the other side is "evil" you're actually doing evil because you aren't following the teachings of your God who tells us to practice love and forgiveness for each other.

 

[HisArpy]

That plant is under construction. Not operating.

So Iran said.

 

[ll74]

So Iran said.

The IAEA said.

Idiot

 

[Politruk]

https://www.politico.com/news/2025/...-water-reactor-state-television-says-00414190
The Israeli’s 8 hrs ago bombed an operating nuclear power plant's reactor containment building with bunker buster bombs

I thought they didn't have bunker buster bombs -- needed to rely on the U.S. And only a B2 can deliver them.

 

[TellusMoon]

“All sides are bad” arguments are morally bankrupt. Refusing to draw distinctions between good and evil lets bad actors like Republicans and the leadership of Iran off the hook.

In mosts cases thats true.
People arent bad or good because they are arab or americans, republicans or democrata. People are bad or good or a mix of both, sometimes they do bad things, sometimes good.
People must be judge by actions. Causing a war that might lead to future wars and casualities when there were other options isnt something I can fit inside "good"

 

[cdstefi]

What's important to remember (if it hasn't been mentioned already) that it's literally existential for Israel. Not necessarily the mass murder of Palestinians on the flimsy pretext of hunting Hamas down (because that's what it is and it's horrible) but its neighbours, particularly Iran, would greatly prefer it didn't exist and would cheerfully drive every last Israeli into the sea had they the means.

You only have to look at the language Iran uses: "the Zionist state", refusing to use the country's recognised name.

In that sense I understand the warhawks' attitude. Iran is a direct threat and remains so until militarily emasculated or its fanatical fundamentalist leadership replaced with something more reasonable.

 

[BrightShinyGirl]

In mosts cases thats true.
People arent bad or good because they are arab or americans, republicans or democrata. People are bad or good or a mix of both, sometimes they do bad things, sometimes good.
People must be judge by actions. Causing a war that might lead to future wars and casualities when there were other options isnt something I can fit inside "good"

Stopping Iran from getting an atom bomb is definitely a good thing. Also bringing down the repressive regime ruling Iran would also be a good thing.

 

[BrightShinyGirl]

What's important to remember (if it hasn't been mentioned already) that it's literally existential for Israel. Not necessarily the mass murder of Palestinians on the flimsy pretext of hunting Hamas down (because that's what it is and it's horrible) but its neighbours, particularly Iran, would greatly prefer it didn't exist and would cheerfully drive every last Israeli into the sea had they the means.

You only have to look at the language Iran uses: "the Zionist state", refusing to use the country's recognised name.

In that sense I understand the warhawks' attitude. Iran is a direct threat and remains so until militarily emasculated or its fanatical fundamentalist leadership replaced with something more reasonable.

There has been no “mass murder of Palestinian civilians” by Israel, but other than that, I agree with you.

 

[cdstefi]

There has been no “mass murder of Palestinian civilians” by Israel, but other than that, I agree with you.

Well it's highly debatable and hairsplitting to call it that or collateral damage. It's a hell of a lot of collateral damage in order to root out a few thousand terrorists.

 

[BrightShinyGirl]

Well it's highly debatable and hairsplitting to call it that or collateral damage. It's a hell of a lot of collateral damage in order to root out a few thousand terrorists.

The IDF’s ratio of civilian to combatant deaths is about 1:1 which is historically low.

 

[Politruk]

The IDF’s ratio of civilian to combatant deaths is about 1:1 which is historically low.

Not in Gaza, it isn't.

 

[Politruk]

Stopping Iran from getting an atom bomb is definitely a good thing. Also bringing down the repressive regime ruling Iran would also be a good thing.

Not if it takes the U.S. to do it. We'd get into a worse quagmire than Iraq.

 

[cdstefi]

The IDF’s ratio of civilian to combatant deaths is about 1:1 which is historically low.

I don't want to fall out with you as we're on the same side in most discussions here, but how do you square that statement away with the stats here?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casua... 18 June 2025,includes 179 employees of UNRWA.

 

[Rightguide]

I thought they didn't have bunker buster bombs -- needed to rely on the U.S. And only a B2 can deliver them.

The B-2 is currently the only U.S. aircraft capable of carrying the 30,000-pound GBU-57 Massive Ordnance Penetrator (MOP). President Trump faces an extraordinarily difficult decision regarding the targeting of Iran’s Fordow Fuel Enrichment Plant, a facility buried deep within a mountain, likely beyond the effective reach of even the GBU-57. There is a very real risk the mission could fail. Years ago, a government assessment concluded that only a tactical nuclear weapon could be relied upon to destroy a site buried that deep. That weapon is most likely the B61 Mod 11, a nuclear earth-penetrator designed for precisely this kind of hardened target. The gravity of employing such a weapon, politically, militarily, and morally, may well explain the President’s deliberate delay in giving the green light.

 

[Politruk]

The B-2 is currently the only U.S. aircraft capable of carrying the 30,000-pound GBU-57 Massive Ordnance Penetrator (MOP). President Trump faces an extraordinarily difficult decision regarding the targeting of Iran’s Fordow Fuel Enrichment Plant, a facility buried deep within a mountain, likely beyond the effective reach of even the GBU-57. There is a very real risk the mission could fail. Years ago, a government assessment concluded that only a tactical nuclear weapon could be relied upon to destroy a site buried that deep. That weapon is most likely the B61 Mod 11, a nuclear earth-penetrator designed for precisely this kind of hardened target. The gravity of employing such a weapon, politically, militarily, and morally, may well explain the President’s deliberate delay in giving the green light.

I just hope the generals have made a pact to shoot Trump immediately if he ever asks for the nuclear launch codes.

 

[BrightShinyGirl]

I don't want to fall out with you as we're on the same side in most discussions here, but how do you square that statement away with the stats here?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casualties_of_the_Gaza_war#:~:text=As of 18 June 2025,includes 179 employees of UNRWA.

I'm dubious of any numbers published by the Hamas-controlled Gaza Heath Ministry. Their list of "civilian" casualties skews heavily to young men and male teenagers. Citing the debunked Lancet report calls the objectivity of the Wikipedia page into question, as well as the images of people made up to look wounded.

I don't want to fall out with you either, but too many people on the left have gotten used to casually accusing Israel of committing war crimes.

 

[rainsol]

What Israel and Ukraine haveade clear - the US has no place at the table in global diplomacy

We dont need a Bush, Clinton, Obama, O biden, or Trump...last one was Reagan. Nixon should have left China alone adn so should have Clinton

 

[cdstefi]

I'm dubious of any numbers published by the Hamas-controlled Gaza Heath Ministry. Their list of "civilian" casualties skews heavily to young men and male teenagers. Citing the debunked Lancet report calls the objectivity of the Wikipedia page into question, as well as the images of people made up to look wounded.

I don't want to fall out with you either, but too many people on the left have gotten used to casually accusing Israel of committing war crimes.

I'm pretty sure that Wiki pages that make blatantly false or unprovable claims get deep-sixed pretty quickly. Not saying every single one is 100% unbiased or accurate but what it says there ties in pretty well with my usual objective news sources (BBC, Guardian, NYT, WaPo, AP, Reuters etc)

To state that there have not been massive civilian casualties as a result of less-than-discriminate Israeli military assaults is disingenuous at best, idiotic at worst. Gaza is a fucking bombsite.

 

[RobDownSouth]

I'm pretty sure that Wiki pages that make blatantly false or unprovable claims get deep-sixed pretty quickly. Not saying every single one is 100% unbiased or accurate but what it says there ties in pretty well with my usual objective news sources (BBC, Guardian, NYT, WaPo, AP, Reuters etc)

To state that there have not been massive civilian casualties as a result of less-than-discriminate Israeli military assaults is disingenuous at best, idiotic at worst. Gaza is a fucking bombsite.

There is still quite a bit of cognitive dissonance around here vis-a-vis Gazan casualties

Saw a poll I meant to copy/paste last week that asked Israelis "Now that Gaza has been essentially defeated, who should the IDF focus on eradicating next?"

Surprisingly, Iran was not the top choice!

The top choice was......drum roll......Arab Israeli citizens!

....but you cannot call that "ethnic cleansing" or even "apartheid", becoz that fits the definition of the new 'n improved "antisemitism" putting your citizenship at risk and making you subject to deporations (FUCK the fact you were 'born here').

Here's the kicker: The demographics of the poll showed two groups strongly in favor of internal Israeli ethnic cleansing: Orthodox Jewish households and those who consider themselves "observant Jews" (i.e. those who attend Temple regularly). It would seem that Israel is quickly developing an intolerant faction of their faithful roughly equivalent to America's own evangelical bigots.

 

[Politruk]

We dont need a Bush, Clinton, Obama, O biden, or Trump...last one was Reagan.

You are an idiot.

Nixon should have left China alone adn so should have Clinton

Doubly.

 

[cdstefi]

There is still quite a bit of cognitive dissonance around here vis-a-vis Gazan casualties

Saw a poll I meant to copy/paste last week that asked Israelis "Now that Gaza has been essentially defeated, who should the IDF focus on eradicating next?"

Surprisingly, Iran was not the top choice!

The top choice was......drum roll......Arab Israeli citizens!

....but you cannot call that "ethnic cleansing" or even "apartheid", becoz that fits the definition of the new 'n improved "antisemitism" putting your citizenship at risk and making you subject to deporations (FUCK the fact you were 'born here').

Here's the kicker: The demographics of the poll showed two groups strongly in favor of internal Israeli ethnic cleansing: Orthodox Jewish households and those who consider themselves "observant Jews" (i.e. those who attend Temple regularly). It would seem that Israel is quickly developing an intolerant faction of their faithful roughly equivalent to America's own evangelical bigots.

I prefer not to get into the dirt of fundamentalist religious issues. Israeli fundamentalists (Zionists if you will) despise all Arabs/Muslims and vice versa. It's a death loop.

All this proves is that religious fundamentalism is no basis for a system of government (apologies to Monty Python). It's too entrenched in ethnic hatred and animus.

As an atheist outsider it seems pretty obvious to me that when you have two sides calling each other evil on the basis of their medieval or older books, maybe it's time to burn the books, eradicate the leaders and start over again with reasonable human beings who'd rather coexist peacefully and sensibly. Naïve I know. But hey, Jews lived alongside Muslims all over the middle East and central Asia for centuries once.

Palestine has had a fucking raw deal and Israel needs to recognise that and try to make some decent accommodation with a real two-state solution with rights and land.

Iran, the Saudis and all the other antagonists need to grow the fuck up, realise that this is the 21st century, not the 9th or whenever, and that the western world has demonstrated amply for the last couple of centuries that it doesn't have to be jihad all the time. It isn't a fucking permanent war. Religious crusades are fucking stupid.

With that, I'd happily see all the ayatollahs blown away, every last one of them, and Netanyahu imprisoned for the rest of his miserable life. None of this makes the remotest sense to any reasonable human being.

 

[TheGxForum]

I enjoy that you think this is something I have no conviction in

Virtue signal as you need princess

You're truly saving lives

How this for virtue signaling ya exposed pig lover

 

[ll74]

How this for virtue signaling ya exposed pig lover

Pretty much on par with your bullshit