The Great Vowel Shift

[oggbashan]

Should we discuss The Great Vowel Shift or how many of us say Tomayto or Tomahto?

How many of you misuse "ye" when writing about historical times? e.g. "Ye Olde Book Shoppe"

Are the rules for the possessive and abbreviation apostrophes now redundant?

Or should this thread be threadjacked?

Og

 

[matriarch]

Should we discuss The Great Vowel Shift or how many of us say Tomayto or Tomahto? This is a discussion we don't have in this house any more.......I use one, the wife uses the other.

How many of you misuse "ye" when writing about historical times? e.g. "Ye Olde Book Shoppe"

Are the rules for the possessive and abbreviation apostrophes now redundant? NOOOOOO. This is one of my biggest bug bears in the work that is given to me to type up. Grammar, punctuation and spelling. Grrrrrrrrrrr.

Or should this thread be threadjacked? Why should we change a winning recipe?


~Mat~

 

[SlickTony]

Should we discuss The Great Vowel Shift or how many of us say Tomayto or Tomahto?

How many of you misuse "ye" when writing about historical times? e.g. "Ye Olde Book Shoppe"

Are the rules for the possessive and abbreviation apostrophes now redundant?

Or should this thread be threadjacked?

Og

1. I say tomayto
2. I can't remember the last time I used "ye" in that context. My period pieces don't go that far back.
3. No.
4. No, carry on.

 

[TheeGoatPig]

I hate tomahto and potahtoe...

I have an old-English Thee in my name

 

[matriarch]

I hate tomahto and potahtoe...

I have an old-English Thee in my name

Best not come to UK then, 'cos that's how we pronounce 'tomahto'. 'Potato' is said the same way as you guys. 'Po-tay-to'.

On the other foot, I hate 'se-meye'.....it's semee (semi); I hate v-eye-tamin......it's vitamin. It isn't 'baysil' it's 'b-a-sil'. It's not 'ore-gano', it's 'o-ree-gar-no'.

 

[oggbashan]

I have an old-English Thee in my name

To me, your name reads "You - GoatPig".

The "Ye" in "Ye Olde" is a misunderstanding of the OE thorn. It should be pronounced "The Old".

It doesn't irritate me as much as misplaced apostrophes - "Pear's, Apple's" etc or "its" when "it is" is meant.

Og

 

[neonlyte]

Best not come to UK then, 'cos that's how we pronounce 'tomahto'. 'Potato' is said the same way as you guys. 'Po-tay-to'.

On the other foot, I hate 'se-meye'.....it's semee (semi); I hate v-eye-tamin......it's vitamin. It isn't 'baysil' it's 'b-a-sil'. It's not 'ore-gano', it's 'o-ree-gar-no'.

Now you've made me hungry

I'm just getting the hang of possessives and abbreviation 's... let's keep 'em.

 

[Elianna]

Best not come to UK then, 'cos that's how we pronounce 'tomahto'. 'Potato' is said the same way as you guys. 'Po-tay-to'.

On the other foot, I hate 'se-meye'.....it's semee (semi); I hate v-eye-tamin......it's vitamin. It isn't 'baysil' it's 'b-a-sil'. It's not 'ore-gano', it's 'o-ree-gar-no'.

I find it interesting to look in the dictionaries that use IPA and then American dictionaries. According to Oxford and Webster most people don't say things correctly (British, American, otherwise)

Oregano: if you spoke Italian the accent is on the 2nd to last syllable. O-re- GAH-no, or so they teach in diction class. But I say or-ay-ga-no.

I've actually never used "ye" in anything. People who can't use apostrophes drive me nuts. You know the one that gets me:

Futon's for sale. AHHHHHHH!!!!!!! (play Pshycho knife scene music please!)

 

[TheeGoatPig]

To me, your name reads "You - GoatPig".

Works for me.

 

[oggbashan]

The Great Vowel Shift - Wiki version or BBC version

Og

 

[sr71plt]

So, throwing a bomb into the garden, how do you think "forte" is pronounced (as in "growing kumquats isn't my forte")?

 

[oggbashan]

So, throwing a bomb into the garden, how do you think "forte" is pronounced (as in "growing kumquats isn't my forte")?

It depends on where you are, or whether you think it is still a French word.

I pronounce it something like: for-tay

Og

 

[neonlyte]

So, throwing a bomb into the garden, how do you think "forte" is pronounced (as in "growing kumquats isn't my forte")?

forte = four-tay *shrug* that's how I say it.

 

[TheeGoatPig]

My sister looked it up the other year. It's pronounced "Fort".

and when I am dealing with fencing I don't say "touche". I just say "touch". I'm not French after all

 

[SlickTony]

It doesn't irritate me as much as misplaced apostrophes - "Pear's, Apple's" etc or "its" when "it is" is meant.

Og

Tell me about it! I've often wished that all apostrophes (not apostrophe's) could be confiscated and only issued to people who could demonstrate they knew how to use them.

 

[sr71plt]

Yeah (after those two postings on forte), that's what I thought. It's pronounced three different ways, apparently (fort, fortay, fortee)--and so widely that the dictionaries have given up and done a "who cares" on it.

But its origin in the French is the kicker. The purests pronouce it "fort" precisely because the French drop that last "e" in pronunciation.

 

[glynndah]

Those oddly place quotation marks bother me, too. There was a sign on a nearby park which read: Land "donated" by Fred Jones. I often wondered if blackmail or extortion was somehow involved.

I say uh -reg- uh- no.

 

[Stella_Omega]

Should we discuss The Great Vowel Shift or how many of us say Tomayto or Tomahto?

How many of you misuse "ye" when writing about historical times? e.g. "Ye Olde Book Shoppe"

Are the rules for the possessive and abbreviation apostrophes now redundant?

Or should this thread be threadjacked?

Og

In order;

I propose a compromise; Tomehto.

I use "ye" in its correct historical context; 20th century renaissance faires.

The rules for apostrophes will never be redundant,

*searches for a willing woman to denude*

 

[SlickTony]

Those oddly place quotation marks bother me, too. There was a sign on a nearby park which read: Land "donated" by Fred Jones. I often wondered if blackmail or extortion was somehow involved.

I say uh -reg- uh- no.

My incarcerated friend is way, way too prone to use unnecessary quotes, and ordinarily this would bother me, but since he doesn't belong to me and I'm not his editor, and he writes excellent letters in every other respect, I cut him some slack. However, if he were to get into writing for its own sake and ask me to do any editing for him, it would be like Dr. Jekyll changing into Mr. Hyde, the way I'd come down on those quotes.

 

[TE999]

In the lyrics of Ira Gershwin:

"You say po-ta-to, I say po-tah-to
You say to-may-to, I say to-mah-to
Po-ta-to, po-tah-to
To-may-to, to-mah-to
Lets call the whole thing off.."

Mis- or lack of -use of apostrophes is a bugaboo of mine as well.

(George wrote the music BTW)

 

[michchick98]

In the lyrics of Ira Gershwin:

"You say po-ta-to, I say po-tah-to
You say to-may-to, I say to-mah-to
Po-ta-to, po-tah-to
To-may-to, to-mah-to
Lets call the whole thing off.."

Mis- or lack of -use of apostrophes is a bugaboo of mine as well.

(George wrote the music BTW)

I'm not fond of the misuse of apostrophes or quotation marks. I've caught myself using both wrong in the past and so has my editor, thankfully the errors were fixed before I submitted my story....at least I think we caught most of them.

What bugs me also is the use of y'all. I'm not fond of that contraction to begin with but there are people who use it (in speech, not in writing) way too damn much, especially when talking to only ONE person. I may be a plus sized woman, but I am not a y'all.

 

[snap1415]

On the "subject" of quotation marks:
http://quotation-marks.blogspot.com/

 

[glynndah]

On the "subject" of quotation marks:
http://quotation-marks.blogspot.com/

Oh, my! I really "liked" those. "Thank" you so much for providing the link.

 

[Elianna]

Yeah (after those two postings on forte), that's what I thought. It's pronounced three different ways, apparently (fort, fortay, fortee)--and so widely that the dictionaries have given up and done a "who cares" on it.

But its origin in the French is the kicker. The purests pronouce it "fort" precisely because the French drop that last "e" in pronunciation.

I don't know if it originated in French. I know that it is a common marking in music which because of the Italian Renaissance most music is still notated in Italian. Therefore it would be pronounced

Fortay (without the awful Southern dipthong that sounds ayeeuh)

I agree in French it's Fort. However, commonly Forte in music and also in the connotation means strength. You play strongly or loudly. Means exactly the same thing in French, too. Therefore, I guess we should say it is probably Latin in origin since it's common to two romance languages. In Latin it would also be pronounced Fortay.

 

[snap1415]

Oh, my! I really "liked" those. "Thank" you so much for providing the link.

"Your" welcome.