Tai Chi

[suurfer]

In a way this is true but the change in outlook/behavior/physique/health is something you seek for yourself, not for the admiration of others.

During their lifetime, people oscillate between a focus on the other or the self,
between individualism-independence and commonality-being with the other or in the world. There are variations too, depending on the person, the culture or one's stage of life.

Doesn't matter where you are at, or if you differ from your peers or your stage in life, the main thing is 'being in the flow'.

I think you're referring to people who haven't achieved internal maturity or independence, probably due to bad experiences -- a different ball game.

(Unrelated to this):
I found Anglo-Saxon philosophical and psychological sciences to be at times excessively rationalistic, puritanistic and disheartening.
Paradoxically so, since on an instrumental level they're 10 times better at promoting individual freedoms and rights.

 

[HisArpy]

During their lifetime, people oscillate between a focus on the other or the self, between individualism-independence and commonality-being with the other or in the world. There are variations too, depending on the person, the culture or one's stage of life.

Doesn't matter where you are at, or if you differ from your peers or your stage in life, the main thing is 'being in the flow'.

I think you're referring to people who haven't achieved internal maturity or independence, probably due to bad experiences -- a different ball game.

(Unrelated to this):
I found Anglo-Saxon philosophical and psychological sciences to be at times excessively rationalistic, puritanistic and disheartening.
Paradoxically so, since on an instrumental level they're 10 times better at promoting individual freedoms and rights.

I've never experienced what you talk about in your first paragraph. Since the first days I can remember, I've always known who I am and what I want. That has not changed over the course of my lifetime. the path may have changed, but the goal has never wavered.

I've always been "different" than my peer group. I am not like them and never really have been. OTOH, they are not like me either, and many of them are very glad about that.

We are all the sum of our past experiences. Some of us grow beyond it. Some of us grow in spite of it.




I cannot speak to the off topic as I am not interested enough in it to investigate its minutia.

 

[HisArpy]

Here's some motivation for all you procrastinators out there.

The full 24 form exercise:

You tube 24 form Yang Style Tai Chi

 

[HisArpy]

Another full 24 form exercise. This one is amazing.

24 form with English descriptions of the forms

 

[BlondeAmbition4RP]

So cool to have come across this thread! I'm going to start taking some lessons next week actually.

 

[HisArpy]

So cool to have come across this thread! I'm going to start taking some lessons next week actually.

Have fun.

I'm working on doing better in my forms and transitions along with controlling my breathing. Sometimes I hold my breath or hyperventilate. Which tells me I'm not internalizing the exercise enough and I need to relax more before starting. Warm up, warm up, warm up.

Once I get all that smoothed out (and get more strength and flexibility, my heel kicks aren't even close to being at hip level yet) I'll start learning the 108 form routine. Maybe late next spring since I AM getting stronger and more flexible.

Andrew Plitt has a series of U-tube videos instructing on the 108 forms. The series isn't complete (only about half done so far) but he's an amazing martial artist and teaches the forms very well.

linky to you tube vid of Andrew Plit - 108 long form, Commencing Form

 

[Conager]

Ok. Now with some intermittent practice with horrific techni<que> I watched a video. I am doing nothing like that. I am way too low, leaving out the make a ball thing. I am transfering weight and pivoting a toe to heel movement, which I did not get from the video, but because you cant shift your weight without doing so.

I'm going to begin again from the basics but I now have better strength and balance to try it. I remember the first time I tried it from the video I basically couldn't maintain any sort of position. I am right leg dominant but that's my injured leg I have difficulty standing on my right leg by itself but I'm better now just from my fumbling efforts. I'm kind of sold on the idea and I am not good at following regimins, but it's clear that the only path here is the follow exactly. You can't do it without the body positions being correct because gravity.

 

[HisArpy]

Begin with the commencing form. Get that right and then flow, emphasis on "flow" into the "double twisting motion" you need for Part The Wild Horse's Mane. (Twist right from the waist up, twist left from the pelvis down to step left.)

There's a heel pivot on the rear foot that you must do as you step left and before you part the mane. If you don't you won't have any balance when you twist left for the next step of the form to the right.

OTOH, you don't HAVE to do the heel pivot with the leading foot before you twist to "hold the ball" before parting the mane again. Rock back without moving your leading foot, twist to hold the ball, step forward and part the mane. The pivot is there in the form, but if it's too difficult, modify the form so you can continue and work on adding the heel pivot as your balance/strength improve.

The point is to do the forms as best you physically can with an eye toward always improving your fitness, balance, and technique. Think of it this way, the forms are a gauge on how fit you are AND what you need to do to improve your fitness. It is that assessment of your physical self which leads to the mental aspect as you concentrate on improving your personal harmony with your inner and outer self.

 

[HisArpy]

Ok. Now with some intermittent practice with horrific techni<que> I watched a video. I am doing nothing like that. I am way too low, leaving out the make a ball thing. I am transfering weight and pivoting a toe to heel movement, which I did not get from the video, but because you cant shift your weight without doing so.

I'm going to begin again from the basics but I now have better strength and balance to try it. I remember the first time I tried it from the video I basically couldn't maintain any sort of position. I am right leg dominant but that's my injured leg I have difficulty standing on my right leg by itself but I'm better now just from my fumbling efforts. I'm kind of sold on the idea and I am not good at following regimins, but it's clear that the only path here is the follow exactly. You can't do it without the body positions being correct because gravity.

BTW, Ian Sinclair has U tube vids of the individual 24 form Yang Style forms. He breaks them down and goes through them multiple times with explanations. They aren't perfect, but they're good enough to learn good technique from.

This is the 1st of the Part The Wild Horse's Mane form.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YF6LGZG33u0

 

[HisArpy]

Or, if you want to watch something beautiful...

Wudang 28 form video at You Tube

 

[RobDownSouth]

Cool Story Time Bro:

I was on a cross-country flight (ATL-PDX) one morning, seated comfortably in my first class seat, as befits someone in his peak earning years. The first class aisle is wider than steerage, and a guy got out of his seat and began doing his Tai Chi exercises, oblivious to everyone in the cabin. As he twirled about, he conked his head on the overhead bulkhead and collapsed in a heap in the aisle.

Nobody said or did a thing. We just left him there. The rules are different in first class.

 

[mark_j]

Question:

How compatible is this with a compromised knee?

More specifically, I have an old right knee injury (torn inner meniscus) from my extreme skiing days that, although it has healed (more or less) has left me with a somewhat weak and unstable knee. For the most part this is no problem with normal walking, light running and working. If I do anything more strenuous than that I have to wear a brace to keep my knee from popping out (this is really a pain when doing Dressage).

Anyway, I know it will help with balance and core strength (since I ain't a spring chicken anymore and I need all the help I can get to maintain that) I wonder if this will help without putting undue strain on my knees.

 

[Misshotndeep]

I have always wanted to learn this. It looks relaxing.

 

[dolf]

Tangent...
Thoughts on qigong?

 

[RobDownSouth]

Tangent...
Thoughts on qigong?

I'm likely in the minority here, but I feel they shouldn't have killed his character off at the end of the Phantom Menace.

 

[HisArpy]

Question:

How compatible is this with a compromised knee?

More specifically, I have an old right knee injury (torn inner meniscus) from my extreme skiing days that, although it has healed (more or less) has left me with a somewhat weak and unstable knee. For the most part this is no problem with normal walking, light running and working. If I do anything more strenuous than that I have to wear a brace to keep my knee from popping out (this is really a pain when doing Dressage).

Anyway, I know it will help with balance and core strength (since I ain't a spring chicken anymore and I need all the help I can get to maintain that) I wonder if this will help without putting undue strain on my knees.

I had an accident way back in my 20's that stretched the Medial Collateral Ligament and damaged both Cruciate Ligaments of my right knee. My knee will bend sideways.

I have other physical injuries to my back yet I can do this exercise program. In fact, doing this has actually helped my spine by giving me back some of the flexibility I'd lost due to deterioration and injuries.

FWIW, I'm 61 and the injuries are genetic so the changes in flexibility weren't expected. For most of my life it has always been difficult for me to bend over and touch my knees. I can now touch my shins without pain. I can twist my upper body to the left almost 45 degrees and to the right slightly less so. For me, these are HUGE changes.

The key to any exercise program when you're injured is to adjust what you do in order to remain within your physical abilities. Tai Chi is especially amenable to this. There is no such thing as "no pain no gain" in Tai Chi.

Tai Chi is primarily an "internal discipline" martial art. It can be the basis for many of the "external discipline" martial arts but that's not the focus of the forms. For me, practicing the forms allows me to evaluate myself physically and mentally. To perform the exercise better I can do other things to either build strength or flexibility as needed by working on specific body parts.

For instance, 1 of those things was that I needed more strength in my legs so I could get lower for Snake Creeps Low. What I did was stand sideways in a doorway so I could grab the doorjam to prevent falling IF I needed it. I spread my feet apart, lowered myself on one leg, shifted my weight to the other leg and stood up again using just that leg. Reverse direction and repeat 10 times.

Within a few weeks (remember I'm old) I could get a little bit lower in the forms without getting "stuck". A side benefit was that my trailing leg push off for Golden Rooster was easier. This made me feel better and be happier with myself and THAT is the whole point of Tai Chi.

I started with the Yang Style 24 form routine. I added the Wudang 28 form to the end of the yang 24 form to extend my workout time. I am now doing the Yang 24, the Wudang 28, and then a repeat of the Yang 24. It takes me about 18-20 minutes for all 3 routines. Eventually I will switch from this routine mishmash to the 108 form Yang Style routine which is about that same length of time or a bit longer to do.

To make things more difficult, I am now doing the 3 routines through all the forms with my eyes closed. G'bye balance...

 

[HisArpy]

I have always wanted to learn this. It looks relaxing.

There is nothing stopping you. Ian Sinclair has all the forms, in separate step-by-step videos, on You Tube. You can do them in your living room and you don't even need to change into workout wear. You can even do it while wearing a bathrobe. I know, I've done it.

If you browse You Tube for Tai Chi videos, you can find some remarkable ones. There's one with an older woman doing the Yang 24 and showing what all the moves are designed to do as the basis for the external martial arts.

If little old ladies can do this, and (fake) fight with the moves, you can do it too.

 

[HisArpy]

Tangent...
Thoughts on qigong?

I am not a Master/Shifu and I don't know much about QiGong other than I think the purpose of QiGong is for healing. In my undisciplined, unlearned, grasshopper level thinking, that can also be the purpose of Tai Chi; if you want it to be.

The cool part is that Quigong videos are available on You Tube. If those suit you more than Tai Chi, there's nothing stopping you from learning them.

A quick you tube search returned this video for QiGong Healing Form #1:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zD9Jjq99jqY

 

[HisArpy]

Welp, after almost a year of waffling about it, I decided to start learning the 108 form Yang style routine this morning.

I now have a lightly pulled calf muscle and my upper back/intercostal rib muscles are sore from the twisting. My Deltoids are going to hurt too. It's not that the forms are harder, it's the repetition - "push off with the left toes and step forward...", "Twist your torso left, raise your arms to shoulder height as you rotate your foot inward..." - 50 to 100 times. But, I've already mostly memorized the moves for the first 6 forms. I still have to think about them, and I sometimes get "stuck" for a moment or 2, but I can do all 6 in sequence. Only 102 more to go!

This routine feels like it's designed to be closer to the fighting forms than the other routines. Those are like ballet or dance, definitely softer and more visually artistic. This routine definitely has the underpinnings for some nasty strikes and other nastier things in it while still keeping the "it's only Tai Chi" disguise in place.

I'm learning the forms faster because I already know them. It's the order in which they're done as well as the transitions that are different. Even so, it'll probably be several months before I can do the entire form in sequence. Even then I'll have to have my cheat sheet handy. It'll be more months before I can do it without any outside assistance/cheating.

They say that under the tutelage of a Master/Shifu it takes a year and a half to 2 years for a beginner to learn the entire routine from scratch.

 

[pantalaimonlyra]

There was a qigong tai chi demonstration at a staff in-service day a few years ago. I prefer yoga, but I loved the delicate movements and moving/shifting energy is very reminiscent of a Kundalini practice. It was rad, but I never pursued it further.

 

[HisArpy]

There was a qigong tai chi demonstration at a staff in-service day a few years ago. I prefer yoga, but I loved the delicate movements and moving/shifting energy is very reminiscent of a Kundalini practice. It was rad, but I never pursued it further.

I know a guy who keeps telling me he thinks it's cool and he's going to learn it one day. After years of him telling me this he still hasn't started.

"That's cool!" is a long way from "I'm going to learn how to do that." It's only when you're ready that you'll put the first foot on the pathway. I took those first steps and now I'm ready for more. I'm so ready I have to keep myself from just running down the new path.

 

[pantalaimonlyra]

That's how I feel about my yoga practice. After 12 years, it still feels like there's so much to be excited to learn about.

 

[thør]

So, who does it?

Out trip leader forced it on us for 21 mornings on the Colorado River in the Grand Canyon. We called it Chai Tea to give her shit. But really, it was a nice start to the day.

 

[HisArpy]

Because my work schedule changes every day, I don't have any set time that I do the routine.

Which is ok because your chakras have a cycle and there's no reason you have to start at the same point in that cycle every time. Or even do all of them every time.

 

[HisArpy]

Well, I'm up to the 14th form in a week. There are only 17 forms in the first section so I'm almost done with it. Lots of repetition so there weren't a lot of "new" forms to learn. The next 3 forms aren't that difficult so I should have all of them by this weekend or so.

Once I have this section down, I'll practice it until I don't need a cheat sheet or have to think about what comes next and I just flow from one form to the next. Once I can do that, I'll move on to the next section which has 41 forms (for a total of 58 forms) in it before that section also closes.