Submissive/Slave Haven

[intothewoods]

YES Gig i agree that you attach to a PYL/pyl in a BDSM relationship quicker and love grows stronger cause of the power exchange and trust that is built and your relationship is built on communication

The reason you attach to a bdsm relationship more quickly is that you probably didn't meet through a knitting group. At least one of the initial common denominators is sexual preference, a sexual kink, that involves power and/or pain. Because we're in risky territory, our community and this lifestyle encourages a lot of communication about sex and s&m upfront. And if you start having sex with that person and playing with pain quickly, then you've got that communication plus all of the chemicals your body is releasing as a result of the sex and play. That is all heady stuff, and I think it's natural to feel intensely a hell of a lot more quickly than you would in a vanilla relationship.

I think it's important to be aware of what's going on in a level-headed sort of way.

 

[catalina_francisco]

Thank you i don't know what is wrong....i hope it passes soon

pet

Without knowing you and your situation more intimately, I would not try and work out what is happening for you right now. What I will say though is to not be so hard on yourself, you are human. In all honesty, this problem is not that uncommon and IME nearly all, if not all pyl's go through this at some time or another, often more than once. It is not a reflection of your realness, nor is it a sign you are not a submissive, it just happens. Also IME, those who go through it, do get back to where they are more familiar, responding in the way they are used to. Is it possible to talk to your PYL about how you are feeling in the hope they may be able to help, if only by listening and knowing there is a problem and you do not feel happy about it? Hard as it is, try not to pressure yourself as that can become counter-productive, and definately avoid comparing yourself unfavorably to others.

Catalina

 

[fishercat]

The reason you attach to a bdsm relationship more quickly is that you probably didn't meet through a knitting group. At least one of the initial common denominators is sexual preference, a sexual kink, that involves power and/or pain. Because we're in risky territory, our community and this lifestyle encourages a lot of communication about sex and s&m upfront. And if you start having sex with that person and playing with pain quickly, then you've got that communication plus all of the chemicals your body is releasing as a result of the sex and play. That is all heady stuff, and I think it's natural to feel intensely a hell of a lot more quickly than you would in a vanilla relationship.

I think it's important to be aware of what's going on in a level-headed sort of way.

Wow, this speaks to where I am and the questions I have right now in a big way. I'm finally meeting a Dom in person this Saturday, and I keep questioning how things are going. Almost all our communication has been about our sexual interests and D/s experience, which is something I'm still not used to. It makes me question my feelings because they're not based on much actual knowledge of who he is, his goals, values, likes, dislikes. And I wonder whether if we turn out to like each other on a vanilla level as well, if things won't just start moving faster emotionally than I can handle. It's kind of scary, but a good kind of scary.

 

[the_pet]

Without knowing you and your situation more intimately, I would not try and work out what is happening for you right now. What I will say though is to not be so hard on yourself, you are human. In all honesty, this problem is not that uncommon and IME nearly all, if not all pyl's go through this at some time or another, often more than once. It is not a reflection of your realness, nor is it a sign you are not a submissive, it just happens. Also IME, those who go through it, do get back to where they are more familiar, responding in the way they are used to. Is it possible to talk to your PYL about how you are feeling in the hope they may be able to help, if only by listening and knowing there is a problem and you do not feel happy about it? Hard as it is, try not to pressure yourself as that can become counter-productive, and definately avoid comparing yourself unfavorably to others.

Catalina

Good Point Thank you

pet

 

[fishercat]

Well, I haven't actually requested advice here before, but then again I am just now getting close to dipping a toe in the waters. Actually it's more like I'm still in the "trying on swimsuits" phase.

Anyway, I met a Dom for lunch today. We'd only been emailing/chatting/phoning for about two weeks. We met in a safe place, equally distant for us both (he's 1 1/2 hours from me). The brief recap: we met in the parking lot, made out, went inside, barely ate, chatted, sat next to each other and could not stop touching each other, went outside, made out like crazy people, froze our butts off. Finally he offered to have us sit in his truck, which I did not do. I told him I promised some people I'd obey the safety rules. So we made out some more, then he saw me to my car and we parted ways. Don't worry, there were tons of people in the lot. Actually, I'm not used to PDA and was kind of embarrassed, but not embarrassed enough to stop!

I like this guy. I felt safe with him. He was easy to talk to, and easy to be touched by. That's not often true for me. He knows my lack of experience, and so checked me often to see if I was okay, if I was nervous or anything. He was more assertive/aggressive sexually than any man I've been around before, but he was gentle and cautious not to scare me. For anyone who hasn't figured it out, I'm *really* inexperienced.

So, assuming he wants to see me again, I'm needing to think about a couple things, and could use some advice. Or maybe feedback on what I've already figured out.

He currently has two women he calls play partners, one of whom is married. I didn't know until today, but he was upfront about it. He actually volunteered the information. He says he is looking for a relationship, and I did say that I could not be just a play partner, or be with someone who was seeing other subs as play partners on a continuing basis. He didn't say he was poly, and I got the impression he's just between LTRs. So we kind of agreed to see where things between us lead.

I'm not sure if there is anything else in the above situation that I should be thinking about or concerned about, so would like to know.

My more immediate question is that I'm trying to figure out exactly how dominant he is, and how dominant I need him to be. He's never been 24/7, and that's okay with me. He seems to be letting me lead the way, which leaves me something between curious and uncomfortable. On the other hand, he's probably right to leave me plenty of control, as I'm pretty skittish. I guess I'm wondering if he's just into sex, and wants that, and is using the Dom tag to find women who will give him what he wants.

Please understand, I know I should listen to my gut, but I have no experience, and no instincts. I'm also prone to over-analyzing and thinking the worst. I think it's my way of keeping my heart safe; just assume the worst will happen and back off before a risk is taken. Oh, and I know I hardly know this guy, but even if I never hear from him again, I'm guessing that I'll have the same questions again next time. Sorry for the rambling. All free advice will be accepted, and considered worth more than I pay for it.

 

[catalina_francisco]

All free advice will be accepted, and considered worth more than I pay for it.

Bit late for me to get too much into all you spoke about, but on the question about wanting to be sure he is into it for more than sex I would suggest spending time together without sex at this stage. I know it isn't easy, but basically it gives you time to get to know each other better without the physical interfering with your feelings or radar AND if he is just out for sex, he isn't likely to want to wait and spend too much time before getting down to it, especially with the distance factor involved. Sex does not have to be part of D/s and/or play, so it is quite OK to experience it without being sexually involved. If all goes well and he seems genuine, then when you feel comfortable and sure of it being something you want to continue, you can take the next step and become more intimate sexually.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3186/2336398082_00c27e4203_s.jpg Catalina

 

[fishercat]

Bit late for me to get too much into all you spoke about, but on the question about wanting to be sure he is into it for more than sex I would suggest spending time together without sex at this stage. I know it isn't easy, but basically it gives you time to get to know each other better without the physical interfering with your feelings or radar AND if he is just out for sex, he isn't likely to want to wait and spend too much time before getting down to it, especially with the distance factor involved. Sex does not have to be part of D/s and/or play, so it is quite OK to experience it without being sexually involved. If all goes well and he seems genuine, then when you feel comfortable and sure of it being something you want to continue, you can take the next step and become more intimate sexually.

That makes sense, particularly waiting so the physical doesn't interfere with my feelings or radar. I would like to get a better sense of him as a Dom before getting more intimate sexually, and I think we can do that.

Thanks for your thoughts!

 

[sexycaz22]

Wow, this speaks to where I am and the questions I have right now in a big way. I'm finally meeting a Dom in person this Saturday, and I keep questioning how things are going. Almost all our communication has been about our sexual interests and D/s experience, which is something I'm still not used to. It makes me question my feelings because they're not based on much actual knowledge of who he is, his goals, values, likes, dislikes. And I wonder whether if we turn out to like each other on a vanilla level as well, if things won't just start moving faster emotionally than I can handle. It's kind of scary, but a good kind of scary.

Thank you, fishercat, for expressing how you felt before meeting your PYL.

I am currently feeling like this, actually with meeting my guy on Tuesday. Every time we talk on MSN, all we seem is to talk about our BDSM interests and things like that. We did talk about other things, but the BDSM seemed to be the major topic in conversation.

I know what I want out of this budding friendship, and I could see where it might lead to, but I am not too sure about what HE wants from me, what he see in the future in terms of where our friendship/relationship might lead to. I know I have to ask him but at the same time, I am a little scared that if I ask this too soon, I might lose him. I feel a connection with him, at least on MSN, but will the connection be there when we finally meet, face-to-face? I certainly hope so!

Anyway, thank you, fishercat, because I am glad to see that I am not the only one who is feeling like that before meeting in real-life.

 

[fishercat]

I am currently feeling like this, actually with meeting my guy on Tuesday. Every time we talk on MSN, all we seem is to talk about our BDSM interests and things like that. We did talk about other things, but the BDSM seemed to be the major topic in conversation.

I know what I want out of this budding friendship, and I could see where it might lead to, but I am not too sure about what HE wants from me, what he see in the future in terms of where our friendship/relationship might lead to. I know I have to ask him but at the same time, I am a little scared that if I ask this too soon, I might lose him. I feel a connection with him, at least on MSN, but will the connection be there when we finally meet, face-to-face? I certainly hope so!

It does seem like everything is kind of ass backwards, doesn't it? The guy I'm talking with has experience, and so not only talked BDSM interests, but was checking to see just how much my limits might limit him from doing things he already enjoys. So we started with the more extreme talk and moved to the lighter stuff. We're just cracking the surface of who we are as day-to-day people. It's totally the opposite of how I would normally expect a relationship to be built. So it feels strange.

And yeah, bringing up the "where is this going in the future" stuff is scary. I've tried to be vague, as in, just stating that I feel I need it to be a long-term, monogamous relationship, but that I'm willing to wait and see where things go. Some guys get scared off by that I guess. Hopefully if you're upfront as to possible eventualities, but not pushing it in terms of speed, he'll be cool with it.

I'm glad you're meeting this guy. Good luck, and make sure you give us the details!

 

[sexycaz22]

It does seem like everything is kind of ass backwards, doesn't it? The guy I'm talking with has experience, and so not only talked BDSM interests, but was checking to see just how much my limits might limit him from doing things he already enjoys. So we started with the more extreme talk and moved to the lighter stuff. We're just cracking the surface of who we are as day-to-day people. It's totally the opposite of how I would normally expect a relationship to be built. So it feels strange.

And yeah, bringing up the "where is this going in the future" stuff is scary. I've tried to be vague, as in, just stating that I feel I need it to be a long-term, monogamous relationship, but that I'm willing to wait and see where things go. Some guys get scared off by that I guess. Hopefully if you're upfront as to possible eventualities, but not pushing it in terms of speed, he'll be cool with it.

I'm glad you're meeting this guy. Good luck, and make sure you give us the details!

Yep, the back wards route! *laughs* the funny thing is, whenever I talk with PYLs online, its the usual route, talking about hobbies, work etc, but with pyls, its the other way around! *scratches head* lol still, I certainly will be back with the details of how it will go, I have mentioned it in one of my threads; the first dates & BDSM checklists, I will be posting in that one for how the date went.

Thank you, fishercat for wishing me well with the date.

 

[fishercat]

Help!

Hey, I'm back with an update on Mr. First Date, and a serious question. I apologize now for the long, rambling nature of this post.

After a few emails today, the last one I sent him had this section: "
Yes, I will tell you when I am ready. [to submit] And we'll discuss limits, and all that fun stuff. But first I'll have gotten to a point where I can trust you as a man and as a Dominant.

So to that end, I'm thinking, how about we go out again? Do something fun. Neck like teenagers (someplace warmer this time). See if we get along; enjoy each other just as people. And in the meantime call, chat and email, and learn all we can. Give me time to develop the trust factor that I need to submit. Give us both time to see if the relationship thing is there, underneath the chemistry."

This was his reply (in part): "Trust is not something that majically occurs. It is built over time through intimacy, growth,pleasure and contact. No amount of dialogue builds trust. Do not in any way feel I am pushing you here. If you feel this way, then we are not a proper match.

You are interested in me as I in you and I know you are ready. I believe you are using as a crutch your inexperience and forgetting the desires you have. Get in touch with your needs and let them direct you.

Once we are together that first time, your growth will be easier and less restrictive. I know this. You are resisting, and I understand, it is natural. But at this point I ask you to look inside yourself to see if being a submissive to a dom is something you truly want or just want to fantasize about."

We've been in touch for a week and met for lunch once. I'm asking for more time to know and trust him as a person, and he appears to be saying that trust comes after risk, as in submitting to him.

I feel it's important to be honest with myself, and ask if I agree with him, or if as he suggests it's possible I don't really want to be dominated. I've been wrestling with this all afternoon, but I can't agree with him, not entirely.

I want to be around him in other settings, to talk with him more, to talk about boring, everyday things. I don't want to submit first and figure out if I actually like him as a person, much less love him, later on. It would be different if I just wanted a casual shagging. But I take submitting to someone seriously. I can't do that and then undo it.

I guess my question is, am I being unreasonable in asking for more time to get to know him? Am I dragging my feet, or using my inexperience as a crutch? Or is he just looking for sex and using D/s as a tool?

All advice valued. PMs accepted, if you wish to use that method. Thanks.

 

[HottieMama]

am I being unreasonable in asking for more time to get to know him? Am I dragging my feet, or using my inexperience as a crutch? Or is he just looking for sex and using D/s as a tool?

No, you are not being unreasonable. If you don't know who he is as a man, how can you ever respect him as a Dominant???? Asking for another meeting is basic, easy, and IMO something he should easily accomodate if he is in it for the long-term.

If it were me i would be very wary of him based on that last email.

 

[Daddy2mylilgirl]

Opinion from a reformed HNG

This was his reply (in part): "Trust is not something that majically occurs. It is built over time through intimacy, growth,pleasure and contact. No amount of dialogue builds trust.

"intimacy, growth, pleasure and contact." a.k.a. Let's have sex so we can build trust.

I don't know if it's just me but something about misspelling magically bothers me too.

Do not in any way feel I am pushing you here. If you feel this way, then we are not a proper match.

a.k.a. Have sex with me or I'm breaking this off.

If it were me i would be very wary of him based on that last email.

Me too. Sorry.

 

[fishercat]

No, you are not being unreasonable. If you don't know who he is as a man, how can you ever respect him as a Dominant???? Asking for another meeting is basic, easy, and IMO something he should easily accomodate if he is in it for the long-term.

If it were me i would be very wary of him based on that last email.

Yeah. I'm not so much wary as disappointed. There was chemistry, and much kissing, but that was all.

"intimacy, growth, pleasure and contact." a.k.a. Let's have sex so we can build trust.

I don't know if it's just me but something about misspelling magically bothers me too.

...

a.k.a. Have sex with me or I'm breaking this off.

...

Me too. Sorry.

Thanks. I'm sorry too. I don't quite trust my instincts yet, so it's nice to see them validated. And yeah, misspellings drive me wild too.

I guess my view is that trust is a beautiful edifice that sits on a foundation of knowledge of each other. I want the foundation first, then we work on building the trust, brick by brick. This guy just seems to want to climb to the top of the tower and ring hte bell.

Thanks to you both!

 

[HottieMama]

For me, getting the foundation is what builds the trust. It is a wonderful thing to look into someone's eyes and be able to tell them in all sincerity, "i trust you completely. i know you will not harm me."

 

[catalina_francisco]

This was his reply (in part): "Trust is not something that majically occurs. It is built over time through intimacy, growth,pleasure and contact. No amount of dialogue builds trust. Do not in any way feel I am pushing you here. If you feel this way, then we are not a proper match.

You are interested in me as I in you and I know you are ready. I believe you are using as a crutch your inexperience and forgetting the desires you have. Get in touch with your needs and let them direct you.

Once we are together that first time, your growth will be easier and less restrictive. I know this. You are resisting, and I understand, it is natural. But at this point I ask you to look inside yourself to see if being a submissive to a dom is something you truly want or just want to fantasize about."

The parts I bolded stand out for me as not only classic lines used by those trying to undermine a submissives confidence to get you into bed, and are a tool used to make you feel insecure, foolish, intimidated, and like you might be missing a great opportunity if you let him slip away. IOW, he is not what I would class as a good PYL and yes, IMHO is just trying to get you to have sex. He says nothing to build you up, gain trust, or make you feel comfortable...any slight compliment he gives you is followed by a put down and questioning of your realism, or an ultimatum type statement. A week of communicating is certainly not usually enough to build that trust, especially when he has told you he has other partners...nor does it help you gauge if you are both looking for the same thing in a relationship. It is your decision, but I would give him a miss or at least tread very lightly and slowly which it sounds as if he is not going to give you the chance to do.

Catalina

 

[nh23]

Hey, I'm back with an update on Mr. First Date, and a serious question. I apologize now for the long, rambling nature of this post.

After a few emails today, the last one I sent him had this section: "
Yes, I will tell you when I am ready. [to submit] And we'll discuss limits, and all that fun stuff. But first I'll have gotten to a point where I can trust you as a man and as a Dominant.

So to that end, I'm thinking, how about we go out again? Do something fun. Neck like teenagers (someplace warmer this time). See if we get along; enjoy each other just as people. And in the meantime call, chat and email, and learn all we can. Give me time to develop the trust factor that I need to submit. Give us both time to see if the relationship thing is there, underneath the chemistry."

This was his reply (in part): "Trust is not something that majically occurs. It is built over time through intimacy, growth,pleasure and contact. No amount of dialogue builds trust. Do not in any way feel I am pushing you here. If you feel this way, then we are not a proper match.

You are interested in me as I in you and I know you are ready. I believe you are using as a crutch your inexperience and forgetting the desires you have. Get in touch with your needs and let them direct you.

Once we are together that first time, your growth will be easier and less restrictive. I know this. You are resisting, and I understand, it is natural. But at this point I ask you to look inside yourself to see if being a submissive to a dom is something you truly want or just want to fantasize about."

We've been in touch for a week and met for lunch once. I'm asking for more time to know and trust him as a person, and he appears to be saying that trust comes after risk, as in submitting to him.

I feel it's important to be honest with myself, and ask if I agree with him, or if as he suggests it's possible I don't really want to be dominated. I've been wrestling with this all afternoon, but I can't agree with him, not entirely.

I want to be around him in other settings, to talk with him more, to talk about boring, everyday things. I don't want to submit first and figure out if I actually like him as a person, much less love him, later on. It would be different if I just wanted a casual shagging. But I take submitting to someone seriously. I can't do that and then undo it.

I guess my question is, am I being unreasonable in asking for more time to get to know him? Am I dragging my feet, or using my inexperience as a crutch? Or is he just looking for sex and using D/s as a tool?

All advice valued. PMs accepted, if you wish to use that method. Thanks.

The part I put in red sets off alarms in my head. Kinda like when someone says if you were a real submissive you would do this..just my thoughts.

 

[fishercat]

For me, getting the foundation is what builds the trust. It is a wonderful thing to look into someone's eyes and be able to tell them in all sincerity, "i trust you completely. i know you will not harm me."

Yes, that's more clearly what I wanted to say. It's kind of intertwined. I can't trust you until I know you to some extent. Once the foundation is laid, enough trust exists to start on building the trust inself, and to me that's when the submission comes in. Not at the beginning.

Thanks for this, and the PMs!

 

[fishercat]

The parts I bolded stand out for me as not only classic lines used by those trying to undermine a submissives confidence to get you into bed, and are a tool used to make you feel insecure, foolish, intimidated, and like you might be missing a great opportunity if you let him slip away. IOW, he is not what I would class as a good PYL and yes, IMHO is just trying to get you to have sex. He says nothing to build you up, gain trust, or make you feel comfortable...any slight compliment he gives you is followed by a put down and questioning of your realism, or an ultimatum type statement. A week of communicating is certainly not usually enough to build that trust, especially when he has told you he has other partners...nor does it help you gauge if you are both looking for the same thing in a relationship. It is your decision, but I would give him a miss or at least tread very lightly and slowly which it sounds as if he is not going to give you the chance to do.

You know, I didn't really see the put down and questioning until you pointed it out. The funny thing is, he found out I was insecure about my weight, and has been so complimentary about my looks. Now I almost wonder if that was a hook for him. I showed myself to be vulnerable, maybe he used it to get me interested. And he probably thought I'd be too needy to say no to his demands. When I sent the last email, asking for time to get together, I think now he kind of bullied me.

Thanks for pointing this out. I'm gathering my thoughts to answer him, and I know now what the answer is.

 

[BiBunny]

On one hand, fishercat, I have concerns similar to those of the three or four people who posted before me. On the other hand, I'm not sure.

In your first post about this guy, you talked about how you wanted to see demonstrations of Domliness from him. Most Dom/mes don't tend to go around throwing their Domliness at people who haven't agreed to submit to them. It's a matter of consent. Then, you say that you'll let him know when you're ready, which is fine, of course. But if he knows you want him to be dominant toward you, but you're not willing to be submissive to him yet, then it may be possible that he's confused about the mixed signals.

As a switch, I can tell you that there are just as many flaky subs as flaky Doms. I'm not saying that you're one of these subs, but you have to sort of look at it from his point of view. If I had a sub coming to me saying "I want you to show me your dominance," but not willing to work with me, my do-me bottom radar would be going off. And there's nothing more annoying to me than a Princess Sub. I'm absolutely not saying that's what you are, but maybe that's the kind of vibe you're inadvertently giving off. A D/s relationship is a give-and-take for both parties, not an "I'll-Sit-Back-And-Let-You-Do-All-The-Work-While-I-Reap-All-The-Benefits" situation. If I were him, I'd probably be wary, too.

So I'm really not sure what to tell you. I'm not saying any of these things to make you feel bad, and if you are making the man feel this way, I don't think you mean to. But it's definitely something Dom/mes notice, especially when dealing with inexperienced subs. Too often, they DO get caught up in the fantasy of the way they think it should be and neglect to deal with the reality of how it's really going to be. Either way, I wish you the best of luck.

 

[fishercat]

The part I put in red sets off alarms in my head. Kinda like when someone says if you were a real submissive you would do this..just my thoughts.

Me too. Hearing everyone's thoughts has made it clear. I have a gut response when I'm questioned that I take what the person says seriously, and do a kind of self examination. I feel like I have to in order to be honest with them and myself. And in this case I've done due diligence, I've done a reality check with the Lit crew, and I think he's the one found lacking.

Thanks for adding your voice!

 

[fishercat]

On one hand, fishercat, I have concerns similar to those of the three or four people who posted before me. On the other hand, I'm not sure.

In your first post about this guy, you talked about how you wanted to see demonstrations of Domliness from him. Most Dom/mes don't tend to go around throwing their Domliness at people who haven't agreed to submit to them. It's a matter of consent. Then, you say that you'll let him know when you're ready, which is fine, of course. But if he knows you want him to be dominant toward you, but you're not willing to be submissive to him yet, then it may be possible that he's confused about the mixed signals.

As a switch, I can tell you that there are just as many flaky subs as flaky Doms. I'm not saying that you're one of these subs, but you have to sort of look at it from his point of view. If I had a sub coming to me saying "I want you to show me your dominance," but not willing to work with me, my do-me bottom radar would be going off. And there's nothing more annoying to me than a Princess Sub. I'm absolutely not saying that's what you are, but maybe that's the kind of vibe you're inadvertently giving off. A D/s relationship is a give-and-take for both parties, not an "I'll-Sit-Back-And-Let-You-Do-All-The-Work-While-I-Reap-All-The-Benefits" situation. If I were him, I'd probably be wary, too.

So I'm really not sure what to tell you. I'm not saying any of these things to make you feel bad, and if you are making the man feel this way, I don't think you mean to. But it's definitely something Dom/mes notice, especially when dealing with inexperienced subs. Too often, they DO get caught up in the fantasy of the way they think it should be and neglect to deal with the reality of how it's really going to be. Either way, I wish you the best of luck.

Thanks BiBunny! Always good to hear another point of view.

Here's the thing. I've never asked him to be more Dominant with me, or show me his Dom side. I think my post was actually in my head in response to my suspicion that he's looking for sex wearing a Dom suit, not looking to Dom. (if that makes any sense) In actuality, most of our contact hasn't been very constructive in terms of either learning about each other as people or PYL/pyl. He's been very focused on the sexual, to the exclusion of almost everything else.

It is possible that I've sent mixed signals, and I'll ask him about that. The most I remember having said is when I have asked him to describe how he would dominate me, once we were ready for that. I was trying to find out more about him as a Dom. His style, his thought processes. But maybe he decided I needed a bit of a push, and it came out in a way that seemed more pushy than domly.

I do think that asking me to submit after one week and one meet is too much, but I'm not much of a risk-taker, and I'm not wanting casual play. It bothers me that he is saying, essentially, submit or say goodbye. But then again, if he likes to move this fast, he's right, we're not a good match.

Thanks again for responding! Your posts always make me think, and I like that.

 

[Daddy2mylilgirl]

On one hand, fishercat, I have concerns similar to those of the three or four people who posted before me. On the other hand, I'm not sure.

In your first post about this guy, you talked about how you wanted to see demonstrations of Domliness from him. Most Dom/mes don't tend to go around throwing their Domliness at people who haven't agreed to submit to them. It's a matter of consent. Then, you say that you'll let him know when you're ready, which is fine, of course. But if he knows you want him to be dominant toward you, but you're not willing to be submissive to him yet, then it may be possible that he's confused about the mixed signals.

As a switch, I can tell you that there are just as many flaky subs as flaky Doms. I'm not saying that you're one of these subs, but you have to sort of look at it from his point of view. If I had a sub coming to me saying "I want you to show me your dominance," but not willing to work with me, my do-me bottom radar would be going off. And there's nothing more annoying to me than a Princess Sub. I'm absolutely not saying that's what you are, but maybe that's the kind of vibe you're inadvertently giving off. A D/s relationship is a give-and-take for both parties, not an "I'll-Sit-Back-And-Let-You-Do-All-The-Work-While-I-Reap-All-The-Benefits" situation. If I were him, I'd probably be wary, too.

So I'm really not sure what to tell you. I'm not saying any of these things to make you feel bad, and if you are making the man feel this way, I don't think you mean to. But it's definitely something Dom/mes notice, especially when dealing with inexperienced subs. Too often, they DO get caught up in the fantasy of the way they think it should be and neglect to deal with the reality of how it's really going to be. Either way, I wish you the best of luck.

I can see your point.

But isn't it the Dom/mes responsibility to take control of the relationship, especially if they are experienced and the sub is inexperienced, and say let's slow down and build trust and respect first?

To me it seems like she wants to slow things down and build that trust between them and all he wants is to have sex and have her submit.

 

[BiBunny]

Thanks BiBunny! Always good to hear another point of view.

Here's the thing. I've never asked him to be more Dominant with me, or show me his Dom side. I think my post was actually in my head in response to my suspicion that he's looking for sex wearing a Dom suit, not looking to Dom. (if that makes any sense) In actuality, most of our contact hasn't been very constructive in terms of either learning about each other as people or PYL/pyl. He's been very focused on the sexual, to the exclusion of almost everything else.

It is possible that I've sent mixed signals, and I'll ask him about that. The most I remember having said is when I have asked him to describe how he would dominate me, once we were ready for that. I was trying to find out more about him as a Dom. His style, his thought processes. But maybe he decided I needed a bit of a push, and it came out in a way that seemed more pushy than domly.

I do think that asking me to submit after one week and one meet is too much, but I'm not much of a risk-taker, and I'm not wanting casual play. It bothers me that he is saying, essentially, submit or say goodbye. But then again, if he likes to move this fast, he's right, we're not a good match.

Thanks again for responding! Your posts always make me think, and I like that.

You're welcome. Like I said, I don't think you're really doing anything wrong, but I thought I might offer a reason that he's thinking the way he is. I'm not in his head, though, so I don't know for sure.

I can see your point.

But isn't it the Dom/mes responsibility to take control of the relationship, especially if they are experienced and the sub is inexperienced, and say let's slow down and build trust and respect first?

To me it seems like she wants to slow things down and build that trust between them and all he wants is to have sex and have her submit.

In my opinion, BOTH parties are equally responsible for the relationship and where it goes. I don't think experience or inexperience has anything to do with that. I don't think the Dom/me is any more responsible just because he/she is the Dom/me.

If I were fishercat, I'd just say, "Look, stop talking about sex for a minute, and let's talk about trust. I know trust doesn't happen overnight. Let's be friends, get to know each other, etc. Then, we can decide if we want to go further."

If she's sending out mixed signals, I can understand why he might be confused. I've dealt with enough newbie subs who don't know what the hell they want but still want to get involved in a relationship that I'm kind of wary of that kind of thing. It's the whole "You don't need a Dom/me; you need a vacation!" idea. I'm not saying fishercat is doing this at all because I have no idea what kind of interactions she's had with him other than what she's posted here. I was just pointing out another perspective on the issue.

 

[Daddy2mylilgirl]

In my opinion, BOTH parties are equally responsible for the relationship and where it goes. I don't think experience or inexperience has anything to do with that. I don't think the Dom/me is any more responsible just because he/she is the Dom/me.

If I were fishercat, I'd just say, "Look, stop talking about sex for a minute, and let's talk about trust. I know trust doesn't happen overnight. Let's be friends, get to know each other, etc. Then, we can decide if we want to go further."

If she's sending out mixed signals, I can understand why he might be confused. I've dealt with enough newbie subs who don't know what the hell they want but still want to get involved in a relationship that I'm kind of wary of that kind of thing. It's the whole "You don't need a Dom/me; you need a vacation!" idea. I'm not saying fishercat is doing this at all because I have no idea what kind of interactions she's had with him other than what she's posted here. I was just pointing out another perspective on the issue.

Oh I don't disagree with you. Just trying to make interesting conversation.

I guess personally I would take on more of the responsibility or at least feel like I should even though I know it is equal.