Someone want to explain "Social Justice" to me?

[Sean Renaud]

I believe the most correct thing you stated was what worked in "your" country.

Perhaps this in "my" country have a different view and would like those who enjoy living here to do, at least a little bit, and keep this country as great as it once was.

Giving things away for nothing (or in the case of the now majority......taking things away from others and giving to those who have less for nothing) never inspires anything but another hand out.

If someone wants the benefits of living in this country....they need to get up and help....not beg.

Look no farther than this to understand why upward mobility in the US is suffering so badly.

 

[RobDownSouth]

I believe the most correct thing you stated was what worked in "your" country.

Perhaps this in "my" country have a different view and would like those who enjoy living here to do, at least a little bit, and keep this country as great as it once was.

Giving things away for nothing (or in the case of the now majority......taking things away from others and giving to those who have less for nothing) never inspires anything but another hand out.

If someone wants the benefits of living in this country....they need to get up and help....not beg.

Remind me again, how much does your family receive in Social Security Survivor benefits each month?

 

[unregistered]

 

[PoppingTom]

Giving things away for nothing (or in the case of the now majority......taking things away from others and giving to those who have less for nothing) never inspires anything but another hand out.

How can you talk about inspiration, when your everyday life is more of a survival fight?

 

[Fushi]

To me, it's not looking for hand outs or taking from the rich etc etc. It's simply giving everyone an equal shot at success, regardless of how and to what status they were born. Of course there are success stories of people pulling themselves up by their bootstraps, but how can we make it possible for MORE people to do so, with greater chances and success.

 

[julybaby04]

How can you talk about inspiration, when your everyday life is more of a survival fight?

Because I am inspired to do better and do what I can to make that happen.......not waiting for someone to make it better for me.

 

[julybaby04]

Look no farther than this to understand why upward mobility in the US is suffering so badly.

Why? Because I don't believe in handouts?

Many feel this way. If someone is capable of working...they should. If they absolutely can't....whole different topic.

 

[PoppingTom]

Because I am inspired to do better and do what I can to make that happen.......not waiting for someone to make it better for me.

You still talk like you're not livin in a society.

 

[BotanyBoy]

It means taking a look at what causes advantages and disadvantages for people

#1 cause of disproportionate wealth? Corporate welfare....the top 10% of the country wouldn't have anywhere near the wealth they do if the gov hadn't given it to them.

You've got socialism in the states, I think.....

More of a corporate oligarchy/Democracy bullshit hybrid actually....the corporations hold all the money, the people hold all the votes and we go back and forth through to gov trying to fuck each other at every turn possible.

I
To those who actually understand the role of social justice in a free market economy, Ish is making a fool of himself by lording over the dummies who don't.

I agree with most of what you said but this makes no sense.

If you do not allow business to rise with their success and fall with their failures then you do not have a capitalist, fair, nor free market system. "Social Justice" nullifies every single bit of that free market/capitalism talk.

I'm not saying it's a horrible thing....I'm just saying "Social justice" is the antithesis of capitalism/free market. Can't have both at the same time.

 

[StephenHawking]

No precise definition for social justice exists.

Societies are too varied and perspectives are largely subjective.

I question whether sociology is really a science.

 

[julybaby04]

To me, it's not looking for hand outs or taking from the rich etc etc. It's simply giving everyone an equal shot at success, regardless of how and to what status they were born. Of course there are success stories of people pulling themselves up by their bootstraps, but how can we make it possible for MORE people to do so, with greater chances and success.

People can do this because they live in this country where to OPPORTUNITY to work hard and succeed is there. There are no guarantees in life....but there are always opportunities to try, and yes, sometimes fail.....but we learn in our failures just as we celebrate in our successes.

Every person in the country has the opportunity to an education....all free (well, at the expense of the taxpayer). If a person chooses to squander that opportunity, that is their fault. If they do not take school seriously and drop out, or just plain fail, that is their own fault. They can, however, see the education for what it is, a chance to better themselves and give themselves a good chance at a bright future.

One cannot legislate a person's desire to make themselves succeed....nor can it assure that even with the opportunities that people have available every single day, that people will choose to take them.

If a person has no drive in them, has no desire to do anything beyond the basic of what it takes to live....and knowing that they can do nothing and get paid for it.......one cannot change their lack of caring. (no matter how much others "Care" or "Want Better For Them".....

It comes down to the personal desire and views of each individual as to how successful they can be.

 

[julybaby04]

You still talk like you're not livin in a society.

I am living in a society...but I make decisions that affect my family and do things that will, hopefully benefit all of us.

I am not waiting for the government to decide how to take care of us....I am trying to do it on my own.

 

[bigkahuna9]

To me, it's not looking for hand outs or taking from the rich etc etc. It's simply giving everyone an equal shot at success, regardless of how and to what status they were born. Of course there are success stories of people pulling themselves up by their bootstraps, but how can we make it possible for MORE people to do so, with greater chances and success.

Get the fuck out of the way so they can. The government and its massive debt and deficits are the biggest barrier to success in the country by far.This includes wasteful spending and welfare.

Welfare gives millions money in all its various forms, ( welfare, foodstamps, free housing,ADC, free lunch, free phones etc) cause the government to need to steal more and more money for those who earn their own keep.

Those people who get welfare are never forced to provide for themselves and there are far fewer people who can start and build businesses because of the massive debt and regulations and fewer loans available. This kills the job market and makes these peopole a bunch of lazy parasites who are slowly killing the host.

 

[RobDownSouth]

I am living in a society...but I make decisions that affect my family and do things that will, hopefully benefit all of us.

I am not waiting for the government to decide how to take care of us....I am trying to do it on my own.

How very bootstrappy of you.

I'll ask you nicely once again, how much does your family receive in Social Security Survivor benefits each month?

 

[PoppingTom]

If you do not allow business to rise with their success and fall with their failures then you do not have a capitalist, fair, nor free market system. "Social Justice" nullifies every single bit of that free market/capitalism talk.

I'm not saying it's a horrible thing....I'm just saying "Social justice" is the antithesis of capitalism/free market. Can't have both at the same time.

I don't think that your so-called free market is free from any guvment influence. No market in the world is, I think.

Capitalism can work even under heavy conditions. I don't say that "social justice" is a solution. It's part of the inner political struggle. Having too few of it is equally bad like having too much of it.

 

[Lancecastor]

I agree with most of what you said but this makes no sense.

If you do not allow business to rise with their success and fall with their failures then you do not have a capitalist, fair, nor free market system. "Social Justice" nullifies every single bit of that free market/capitalism talk.

I'm not saying it's a horrible thing....I'm just saying "Social justice" is the antithesis of capitalism/free market. Can't have both at the same time.

You are wrong.

Every industrialized nation is a blend of free market capitalism and social democracy.

 

[StephenHawking]

People can do this because they live in this country where to OPPORTUNITY to work hard and succeed is there. There are no guarantees in life....but there are always opportunities to try, and yes, sometimes fail.....but we learn in our failures just as we celebrate in our successes.

Every person in the country has the opportunity to an education....all free (well, at the expense of the taxpayer). If a person chooses to squander that opportunity, that is their fault. If they do not take school seriously and drop out, or just plain fail, that is their own fault. They can, however, see the education for what it is, a chance to better themselves and give themselves a good chance at a bright future.

One cannot legislate a person's desire to make themselves succeed....nor can it assure that even with the opportunities that people have available every single day, that people will choose to take them.

If a person has no drive in them, has no desire to do anything beyond the basic of what it takes to live....and knowing that they can do nothing and get paid for it.......one cannot change their lack of caring. (no matter how much others "Care" or "Want Better For Them".....

It comes down to the personal desire and views of each individual as to how successful they can be.

What about individuals that are deprived of this worldview due to their economic and social upbringing?

Children can be easily damaged.

If they grow in a world where education, opportunity and self worth are not valued the probability of success diminishes.

How to avoid a "lack of caring" attitude that is ingrained into individuals from the crib and is no fault of their own?

 

[Fushi]

Get the fuck out of the way so they can. The government and its massive debt and deficits are the biggest barrier to success in the country by far.This includes wasteful spending and welfare.

Welfare gives millions money in all its various forms, ( welfare, foodstamps, free housing,ADC, free lunch, free phones etc) cause the government to need to steal more and more money for those who earn their own keep.

Those people who get welfare are never forced to provide for themselves and there are far fewer people who can start and build businesses because of the massive debt and regulations and fewer loans available. This kills the job market and makes these peopole a bunch of lazy parasites who are slowly killing the host.

I'm not talking about welfare or giving people money to live, I'm talking about increasing education standards and spending. The more educated a population is, the more capable they are economically.

 

[StephenHawking]

I'm not talking about welfare or giving people money to live, I'm talking about increasing education standards and spending. The more educated a population is, the more capable they are economically.

The equation is circuitous.

Consider, the largest portion of K-12 education in American is funded by community property tax. If the neighborhood is horrible, say East Oakland, so are the schools. Naturally, people living in Palo Alto are adverse to seeing any of their tax dollars go toward helping education in East Oakland.

 

[BotanyBoy]

You are wrong.

Every industrialized nation is a blend of free market capitalism and social democracy.

If you do not allow the rise and fall of a company to be determined entirely by the business/consumer relationship then you do not have free market capitalism, it's just that simple.

Having social justice then saying you also have a free market is like saying one owns a free slave....it doesn't make any sense. You either have free market capitalism or you have the government taking from the successful and giving to the fail boat...can't have it both ways just like you can't own a free slave.

I don't think that your so-called free market is free from any guvment influence. No market in the world is, I think.

Capitalism can work even under heavy conditions. I don't say that "social justice" is a solution. It's part of the inner political struggle. Having too few of it is equally bad like having too much of it.

Reasonable...but we need to quit calling it free market capitalism and just call it what it is, socialism. Only problem with american socialism is that we have it backwards....here we take from the poor and give to the rich, not the other way around.

 

[PoppingTom]

I am living in a society...but I make decisions that affect my family and do things that will, hopefully benefit all of us.

I am not waiting for the government to decide how to take care of us....I am trying to do it on my own.

I understand that very well, as I never lived any other way. I had my bad times and breakdowns, too, but I never took money from the state. I payed my debts back, instead of declaring private insolvency, which would have been much much cheaper.

But, despite that, I realized how I benefit from those lazybones. I've got my dream job, because lazybones found payment too low. I've got a higher income, because lazybones were going ill easily, as 100% payment continues, and I had to do their job - and been paid for....

 

[Lancecastor]

If you do not allow the rise and fall of a company to be determined entirely by the business/consumer relationship then you do not have free market capitalism, it's just that simple.

Thanks for filling us in. All the best.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Thanks for filling us in. All the best.

http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instances/250x250/27634263.jpg

 

[PoppingTom]

Reasonable...but we need to quit calling it free market capitalism and just call it what it is, socialism. Only problem with american socialism is that we have it backwards....here we take from the poor and give to the rich, not the other way around.

...and you still got people who think that the other way around is a dead sin.

 

[BotanyBoy]

...and you still got people who think that the other way around is a dead sin.

Because they have been convinced and brainwashed into thinking those the government has given all the money to did it the good old fashioned free market way, innovation, good business practices, investing, building an in demand product for the consumer etc.....which is a pile of shit.

That is where the corporate oligarchy comes in....consumers no longer get to decide if they will let a shitty business keep fucking them. If we stop buying their products/services they just send the gov to come take the money from us.